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Work in Progress / PonyCraft : Tainted Skies

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Fallout3fan
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Posted: 16th Aug 2012 06:07
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Sorry I was gone for a while. Am I still the role of Keen Eye?

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,0~U -Well I do say, its been quite a fancy forum for
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 16th Aug 2012 12:02
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First I would like to say, I think I would judge it better with a textured object you're going to use as it'll be more representation of how it'll look in game, however here are my answers.

1) Do you like/dislike the parallax mapping (and why)

As an effect I like it and I think it makes the object appear less flat, which is an improvement on it.

2) Do you like/dislike the cartoon outlines (and why)

On that particular object I think it looks good, but with more realistic textures, it still may work. It'd suit the style of the game at least.

3) Do you like/dislike the oilified textures (and why)

Not sure what the oiled effect is on there, but if it's what's making the object a bit more noisy, then maybe not.

4) Do you like/dislike the bloom (glowy effect) (and why)

Bloom/glowy effects work on certain objects and scenes, I think it could create a blurry experience, esepcially if over done (I think your scene looks a little blurry). Personally? I would prefer HDR.

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Dar13
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Posted: 16th Aug 2012 16:35
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Quote: "1) Do you like/dislike the parallax mapping (and why)"

I like the effect it gives, but what's the performance with multiple objects?

Quote: "2) Do you like/dislike the cartoon outlines (and why)"

I think it'll definitely create a distinctive style, but in the picture's it's apparent that you are trying to hide the original texture instead of complementing it.

Quote: "3) Do you like/dislike the oilified textures (and why)"

What oilified textures?

Quote: "4) Do you like/dislike the bloom (glowy effect) (and why)"

I'm of the same opinion as our Forum President.

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TheComet
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Posted: 20th Aug 2012 10:59
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Thanks a lot for the feedback guys! We'll show you the effect on some finished models as soon as they're done.

Another update on my side regarding scripts:

- Scripts
--> Compile scripts to byte code
--> Byte code interpreter

--> Dynamic registers to store values in
----> Bind script variables to registers
----> Integer registers
----> Float registers
----> String registers
----> Write register content to open file
----> Read register content from open file
----> Move register to register

--> Conditional commands in scripts (if/endif)
----> operators: < / > / =
----> boolean: and / or / xor

--> "goto" command with user defined labels
--> Counter loop (for...next)
--> event functions (called from the program to the scripts)

Almost there!

TheComet

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Sergey K
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Posted: 20th Aug 2012 17:06
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@ TheComet; how about making a brand new languange and thats it?
i could make the compiler

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swissolo
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Posted: 20th Aug 2012 19:25
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Quote: "Thanks a lot for the feedback guys! We'll show you the effect on some finished models as soon as they're done."

Well for now I'll tell you... I feel like the outline is a good effect, but I don't know that it's really being applied properly. Assuming you want the game to look like the show, you want the outline to be a slightly darker shade of the primary color used to represent that object. Also, for the most part, I think the outline is only used on the ponies themselves...

The parallax can be good, but the majority of the mlp world is very flat in appearance, so if you plan to use it I would only use it to highlight a few key elements. (I don't really feel like you need it at all, but I suppose it can be beneficial) I'm not really sure what the toon effect is doing, but the bloom could be a very cool addition as long as it wasn't very sensitive. (we don't want the whole screen to glow!) I would suggest an extra texture to define the glow/shinyness (or you could do it like the source engine and use the normal map's alpha channel ) Anyways, nice work!

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TheComet
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Posted: 20th Aug 2012 19:40 Edited at: 20th Aug 2012 19:40
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Thanks Swiss! We are aiming for a much darker style because most of our story is pretty dark, and so is the combat. It's hard to convert something so colourful and fun into something serious and gloomy...

Quote: "@ TheComet; how about making a brand new languange and thats it?
i could make the compiler"


Already done both of those. I shall call it... Ponyscript! The power of equine logic at your fingertips.

TheComet

"if you don't understand recursion than you probably don't understand recursion." ~Jerico2day
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swissolo
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Posted: 20th Aug 2012 20:10 Edited at: 20th Aug 2012 20:11
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Quote: "Thanks Swiss! We are aiming for a much darker style because most of our story is pretty dark, and so is the combat. It's hard to convert something so colourful and fun into something serious and gloomy..."

link

In that case why not drench your world with water? Maybe grab some Everfree images for inspiration?

Also, it might actually be a quite clever idea to only use the outline on the units to focus the attention on them. Maybe not, but you could adjust the outline thickness to differentiate things throughout the game world.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 22nd Aug 2012 17:22
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I was thinking something along those lines, because ideally we want units to stand out in some way. Perhaps a slightly emissive outline shader, that can be seen through other meshes? Left4Dead style?
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Dar13
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Posted: 23rd Aug 2012 16:43
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Quote: "Perhaps a slightly emissive outline shader, that can be seen through other meshes?"

That would help with units being behind buildings, but it might get distracting if it's visible all the time.

I'm following this project closely, even though I'm no brony.

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TheComet
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Posted: 30th Aug 2012 15:44
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Yeah, there's still a lot of experimenting to do regarding the style. We've settled on a wacky style (you'll notice the lamp post and the house isn't straight but crooked, that's what everything is going to look like).

Quote: "I'm following this project closely, even though I'm no brony."


We'll just see about that!


@ all

I'm glad to announce that the scripting engine is complete! What does this mean? Well, the scripting engine is what defines PonyCraft. It's the ground upon which we can build everything else, so I'm glad it's finally done.

Let's get technical!


What does it support?

-Ability to call every core function the game engine has.
-Variables! Floats, integers and strings to be exact (also, there's no limit to how many you can make)
-For...Next loops
-While...EndWhile loops
-Full file manipulation powers! This is used to save/load data from the hard drive (Scary fact: You can theoretically format drive C:\)
-if...endif statements (very useful for non linear story lines for example)
--> Supports operations: "and", "or", "xor", "=", "<", ">"
-Events
--> User defined events
--> Triggered events by the game engine itself (game engine can actually call a section of your script when something happens)

Other features?

-Easy to track down scripting errors in the debug log
-Scripts are compiled to byte-code (they run very fast)

Food for Thought

-Notepad SUCKS, so perhaps having some kind of minimalistic scripting IDE would be beneficial?
-Implement a level editor into the game engine that can export to scripts? Should make it easier to produce scripts for everyone.

What the hay is TheComet up to now?

I am rewriting the GUI system, my initial idea for it was flawed and proved to be unstable when binding certain elements to units.

Another update

Since notepad sucks so much I gave another editor a go. After toying around with it a bit I got it to highlight and autocomplete pony code (is that the real name for that now?). The editor will be included in the download when the game is released.



TheComet

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Dar13
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Posted: 31st Aug 2012 00:34
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Quote: "-Notepad SUCKS, so perhaps having some kind of minimalistic scripting IDE would be beneficial?"

Notepad++, with a custom syntax highlighter.

I'm curious, why did you decide to create your own embedded scripting language instead of using an already existing one(Lua,Python,Lisp(?))?Purely for the experience?

Quote: "--> Triggered events by the game engine itself (game engine can actually call a section of your script when something happens)"

Ooohhh, callbacks! Cool!!

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TheComet
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Posted: 31st Aug 2012 10:07
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Quote: "I'm curious, why did you decide to create your own embedded scripting language instead of using an already existing one(Lua,Python,Lisp(?))?Purely for the experience?"


In retrospect I suppose it was pretty silly of me to even attempt it.

*Prepare for intense TheComet rambling*

It all started with the project "Open Source Shooter" a year ago. That was the first time I played around with the idea of having an in-game console. Back then it was pretty limited and it didn't really give you much control over the game.

I started building on the idea as time progressed. "Light Ship" was the next big game I made that rested on an underlying console. That's when I noticed that since the console is able to process single commands entered by the user, I could theoretically stream a text file of commands through it. The game "Light Ship" now has a script editor in the level editor.

There were a few other projects that never saw the light of the internet, all of them playing around with the console.

PonyCraft is now the icing on the cake of that idea with the compiler and interpreter completed.

So you see, it was a process that was stretched over a long period of time, and it just kind of "happened" with me tweaking it here and there. I considered using lua at some point, I even downloaded it and played around with it a bit, but I feel my scripts are just as good as the lua plugin, and I didn't want to get dirty with thousands of lines of code and replace my scripting code with lua's, it would just be a waste of time. So there you have it.

Quote: "Notepad++, with a custom syntax highlighter."


Yep, that was the solution.

TheComet

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Dar13
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Posted: 31st Aug 2012 13:32
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@TheComet
I funnily enough went through a similar progression, but with Lua. In one project I used it as a simple configuration file, the next I had some basic scripts, and now I have full scripts that have close to full integration into the main engine code.

The only thing that I'm not particularly impressed with is the pony-bias that the scripting language exhibits.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 31st Aug 2012 16:19
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We''ll have you singing along to Winter Wrap Up before the end.
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TheComet
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Posted: 31st Aug 2012 17:30
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Quote: "@TheComet
I funnily enough went through a similar progression, but with Lua. In one project I used it as a simple configuration file, the next I had some basic scripts, and now I have full scripts that have close to full integration into the main engine code."


And it's an awesome way of doing it! I love how it gives you full power over the engine. Good to see you've taken the same approach.

Quote: "We''ll have you singing along to Winter Wrap Up before the end. "


50 bucks he's already youtube'd it.

TheComet

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New World Order
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Posted: 31st Aug 2012 18:09
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Quote: "The only thing that I'm not particularly impressed with is the pony-bias that the scripting language exhibits."

Never heard anyone complain about the reptilian bias of Python
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Dar13
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Posted: 1st Sep 2012 07:38
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Quote: "Never heard anyone complain about the reptilian bias of Python"

Fair enough.

Quote: "50 bucks he's already youtube'd it."

Cough up, I've done no such thing.

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TheComet
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Posted: 1st Sep 2012 16:12 Edited at: 1st Sep 2012 22:44
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Very technical updates lately, I know.

This one is about the new debug log I just finished. The one before this was just a plain text file and very messy, making it hard to track down bugs in the code. The updated version outputs HTML files with some nice javascript features for folding information.

Now that I have scripts implemented, the debug log also takes care of compilation information, making it easy to track down syntax errors and other faulty things in your scripts. If the script fails to compile (like the third one in the debug log), it additionally outputs a "memory dump" of the script's byte-code and registers.

You can click on the blue bars to reveal more information. Here's an example:

http://0xff.avxc.net/AlccarionsMelon/DebugLog.html

Quote: "Cough up, I've done no such thing."


Of course you haven't.

Damn, I went and looked at your youtube history, but it seems you've been inactive since the 16. July 2012. Perhaps you logged out or something as to hide it?

TheComet

"if you don't understand recursion than you probably don't understand recursion." ~Jerico2day
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TheComet
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Posted: 1st Sep 2012 22:40 Edited at: 1st Sep 2012 22:43
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Due to popular demand on my forum...

http://0xff.avxc.net/AlccarionsMelon/DebugLog1.html

TheComet

"if you don't understand recursion than you probably don't understand recursion." ~Jerico2day
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Dar13
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2012 16:13
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Quote: "Damn, I went and looked at your youtube history, but it seems you've been inactive since the 16. July 2012. Perhaps you logged out or something as to hide it?"

I'm not that devious, though that's a good idea.

That debug log is pretty dang cool. I just use an external console and re-routed std::cout and std::cin to it so I can use it as a log if I want. Your log is much prettier than mine.

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TheComet
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Posted: 5th Sep 2012 13:46
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Thanks. I just read about how to re-route std::cout in my C++ book, I think I'm falling in love with the language. Where has it been all my life?

@ All

I'm programming the pre-network code as we speak. It's a technique used in all RTS games where you create a client and server inside the engine, but the connection is hard-wired. Below is the diagram for the server section (maths class was boring today, hehe):



All actions are queued in a buffer (Command Queue) and time stamped to show when said command was issued. The client then goes ahead and extracts data from the command queue (not shown in the diagram above. This is also timer controlled, so the client knows exactly when which command was issued, and can re-create what the server did.

This sets me up so I can expand the game to multiplayer capabilities when I need to.

I'm aware that there haven't been any graphical updates for ages (except for concept art and models), but hang in there.

TheComet

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Dar13
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Posted: 5th Sep 2012 15:37
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Quote: "Thanks. I just read about how to re-route std::cout in my C++ book, I think I'm falling in love with the language. Where has it been all my life? "

Waiting for you to leave DBP-world.
C++ is a wonderful yet dangerous language to use, because it gives you so much control over everything. The C++11 stuff is really awesome, especially the lambda functions.

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 6th Sep 2012 14:10
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I love C++ but it sometimes makes me cry by coming up with errors yet I do not know why they're there. Like with classes and DGDK, one minute they're working perfectly and the next it says "NO!" yet the code hasn't changed. :S I should probably follow some C++ tutorials at some point.

Quote: "I'm programming the pre-network code as we speak. It's a technique used in all RTS games where you create a client and server inside the engine, but the connection is hard-wired. Below is the diagram for the server section (maths class was boring today, hehe):"


Nice, seems like you're planning it out quite carefully. The structure there seems to make sense. This project seems to be getting more and more professional, but then I suspect you want to do it right. With the scripting interface and everything are you going to make PonyCraft moddable?

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TheComet
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Posted: 6th Sep 2012 14:56
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Thanks sepp!

Quote: "The C++11 stuff is really awesome, especially the lambda functions."


I'll have to check that out at some point.

Quote: "With the scripting interface and everything are you going to make PonyCraft moddable?"


That's the plan, yes. I figured with a fandom as big as this one it would be beneficial to give them full control of it. It'll be interesting to see what people come up with when we release it. A friend of mine already told me that he wanted to make his own campaign called "Dogs of ****".

Quote: "I love C++ but it sometimes makes me cry by coming up with errors yet I do not know why they're there. Like with classes and DGDK, one minute they're working perfectly and the next it says "NO!" yet the code hasn't changed. :S I should probably follow some C++ tutorials at some point."


C++ can be a bitch when it comes to using correct data types. When things like that happen I tend to go for a walk in the forest, it's really refreshing.

TheComet

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Dar13
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Posted: 6th Sep 2012 19:21 Edited at: 7th Sep 2012 04:13
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Quote: "C++ can be a bitch when it comes to using correct data types. When things like that happen I tend to go for a walk in the forest, it's really refreshing."

I've never really had that problem. And I do some really funky stuff with void pointers occasionally(because VS2010 doesn't have variadic arguments).

Quote: "I love C++ but it sometimes makes me cry by coming up with errors yet I do not know why they're there. Like with classes and DGDK, one minute they're working perfectly and the next it says "NO!" yet the code hasn't changed. :S I should probably follow some C++ tutorials at some point."

Classes can be tricky, especially when you start doing multiple inheritance and polymorphism.

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 6th Sep 2012 22:30
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Quote: "C++ can be a bitch when it comes to using correct data types. When things like that happen I tend to go for a walk in the forest, it's really refreshing.
"


I'll bear that in mind next time. Sometimes you think you've made absolute sense of something, it works perfectly, then it breaks for no apparrent reason I'm clueless why. I know it's me and my lack of C++ knowledge and not C++ itself, but I swear it does it on purpose.

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Ashingda 27
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Posted: 8th Sep 2012 12:03
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Wow you sure got some nice animation with those ponies. If you dont mind what are they made and animated with?

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TheComet
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Posted: 10th Sep 2012 14:29 Edited at: 10th Sep 2012 14:30
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Quote: "but I swear it does it on purpose. "


You're right! I looked into the source code of MinGW and found this:



Quote: "Wow you sure got some nice animation with those ponies. If you dont mind what are they made and animated with?"


Thank you! The ponies were made in 3DS Max and were animated in Maya by a user named Biomech.

@ all

I've completed almost all of the diagram above. It's really all about prioritising the execution of things so it slots together nicely.

In order for multiplayer to work I'll have to find a way to synchronise the game loops of all of the computers so everyone runs at the exact same speed. There's a huge problem with this though, did you know that Intel processors process floats differently than AMD processors? Yep, so there's a fair chance the inaccuracies are going to create a snowball effect and destroy everything.

I was thinking of making the host of the game have the final say in everything, so something wrong may happen on one of the clients, but it is detected and corrected by the host.

All of this is making my head hurt.

TheComet

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Sergey K
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Posted: 10th Sep 2012 14:45
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Quote: "Thank you! The ponies were made in 3DS Max and were animated in Maya by a user named Biomech"

too bad that biomech not entering anymore to this forum >_<

and i hope you success with your multiplayer. althought it doesnt sounds too hard

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TheComet
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Posted: 12th Sep 2012 01:05 Edited at: 12th Sep 2012 01:06
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Thanks.

Progress has been made on the interior of Twilight's library. Still very much a WIP, but check it out anyway:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/15704324/MLP/library_render3.png

TheComet

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Sergey K
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Posted: 12th Sep 2012 19:30
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this looks like 3dmax render engine.
i wonder how its gonna look inside dbp engine + that shader effect we made.

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New World Order
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Posted: 12th Sep 2012 20:37
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it's blender, actually, but you are correct, it's rendered^^ ... so yeah, I'm also kinda wondering how it will look in-game
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AmbulanceGames
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This actually looks pretty good, despite the fact I don't really get the Pony appeal at all...should make a Superjail RTS! Alright, anyway great work.
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TheComet
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Posted: 16th Sep 2012 11:38 Edited at: 16th Sep 2012 11:42
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Just got back from a Brony meetup in Olten, Switzerland. I was able to give a presentation on PonyCraft : Tainted SKies there. Unfortunately my bloody camera stopped filming at exactly 10 minutes in, so the rest of the presentation and Q&A at the end is all lost.

It's not much, but here is the beginning of the presentation:



Also, you wouldn't believe how much money we spent on pizzas! xD Here's a screenshot of the order we placed : http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/396483_4162559716690_1028409871_n.jpg

432 Swiss Francs is about 360 Euros. The empty cardboard boxes were stacked on top of each other in the end, and the resulting tower was large enough to touch the roof of the room.

And here are some pictures (click to enlarge for the full 12 Megapixels):

















Was a hell lot of fun. ^^

TheComet

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 20th Sep 2012 16:52
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Media update on the houses for the first mission.
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Sergey K
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nice village. looks pretty good!
as an experienced programmer, i see a problem here.
the camera viewport is from above, and the ponies are mostly on the ground.
but you wont be able to see the ponies cuz of the buildings and the roofs.

so i suggesting here is to split all those houses as different objects AND also split each house into two parts, the floor and the roof. so once the camera is looking on the pony that in between a houses, let the roof of the house be faded.

i hope i didnt explained too complicated

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Dar13
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Quote: "so i suggesting here is to split all those houses as different objects AND also split each house into two parts, the floor and the roof. so once the camera is looking on the pony that in between a houses, let the roof of the house be faded."

Quote: "Perhaps a slightly emissive outline shader, that can be seen through other meshes? Left4Dead style?"

I think the emissive shader would be simpler to implement in the game. Age of Empires did something similar where the outlines for the units were shown when an object was in front of them.

You can kind of see what I mean in this link(linked because of image size).

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TheComet
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2012 00:04
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Here's the newest concept art! We're working on tainted ponies right now, I can't say anymore than that.

Here's a timelapse video:



Here are some images:





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TheComet
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2012 00:06
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I decided to colour the interface light blue instead of green, it feels better:



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Dar13
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2012 05:55
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I definitely like the blue color better. I'm not sure how you're doing the UI colors, but could it be possible to have several different choices of the UI color? Similar to how Fallout 3 allows multiple different colors for the PipBoy interface.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 25th Sep 2012 01:46
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I doubt it would be impossible. In fact, I bet it's something fairly easy to implement.

Comet's taking a time-out 'til the end of the month, in order to catch up on schoolwork. Our modellers are still working away, but we might not have anything visual to show in a little while. Not vaporware, just nothing we can show publicly at this time.
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The Nerevar
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Posted: 25th Sep 2012 02:22
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Wow, seems like production on this game is really coming along! It's a pretty, and unique game. Good job.

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TheComet
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Posted: 28th Sep 2012 10:04
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Working on pegasi now. New model from Darth Biomech, all credits go to him.



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Sergey K
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Posted: 28th Sep 2012 10:18
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i see lots of art, models and stories, but no game play
did you made a payable demo already?

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TheComet
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Posted: 28th Sep 2012 16:07
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Don't worry, it's being worked on all the time. I have just been doing so many deep core changes that no one would understand, so I decided not to bother with updates until I start working on the graphics again. If you're interested you can check out the changelog:



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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 28th Sep 2012 18:04
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Yeah, much of the work had been to story and gameplay elements, as well as deep coding that isn't too exciting and can't be represented visually.

I understand that Alex has many of the core components down, anyway.
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RUCCUS
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Posted: 29th Sep 2012 03:18
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You should consider either making the material on the pony's eyes specular so that the eyeball shine occurs via the rendering engine, or duplicate the eyeballs, scale them up a tiny bit, and texture these larger-scaled eyeballs with a transparent texture just containing the eyeball shine. Both of these methods will result in the shine staying in a fixed position while the eyeballs rotate around.
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 29th Sep 2012 14:44
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That's a good point. We're aiming to have specular, so I imagine we can set them to high specular on the eyes with a low falloff.

These models will be used in-game, and given the perspective, eye detail so somewhat unnecessary.
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mr Handy
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2012 09:10 Edited at: 2nd Oct 2012 09:11
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Nice project! When I can play the demo?

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