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Work in Progress / Project: DarkTOPIA - DarkLINK

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HZence
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Posted: 24th Aug 2004 09:55
Screenshots?


Ausukusa :: Programmer/Storyboard Assistant
CattleRustler
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Posted: 24th Aug 2004 10:25
nothing worth posting yet, been very busy on the internals. MikeS & Exeat, if you see this thread, not only is PAC working superbly - I was able to work out the time-slicing issue and I am coding that in as we speak. All is good and we are back on track

Screenies soon guys, soon


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Mind Storm 101
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Posted: 24th Aug 2004 13:19
Does soon mean now? Cause if it does then... HURRAY!!!

Quote: "nothing worth posting yet"

WE'LL TELL YOU IF ITS NOT WORTHY YOU INSOLENT SWINE!

"Think what you like, You'll all be mine in the end."

[href]www.DotBinary.dbspot.com[/href]
CattleRustler
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Posted: 24th Aug 2004 21:20
well I am working with test media, while developing the client app. I am using the DarkTOPIA station and cubes textured with our forum avatars as the in-world avatars MikeS has all of the media so if he wants to post some examples then he will - I dont now what state readiness it is in.

When we have some nice screenies we will post a WIP DarkTOPIA thread, which is different from this DarkLINK thread - which is specific to the client app.


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CattleRustler
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 04:04 Edited at: 25th Aug 2004 04:58
Well today has been very productive so far! Point And click System is working smoothly and I was able to incorporate a nice time-slicing system for all rendered clients - mnem and I just tested and all seems well. This paves the way for a small public beta very soon!

screen shots:
Mnemonix from my POV

Me from Mnem's POV


STAY TUNED


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Powersoft
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 04:11
well done CR

(+ everyone else involved)


Scorched Turf --> Project Thread
CattleRustler
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 04:15
nothing possible without the team effort:
Mnemonix
MikeS
Exeat

and yours truly

Kudos gentlemen - we have only just begun


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Mnemonix
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 04:46
It shall be glorious when it is complete . Hopefully by the end of September it will be done. I think we started in mid July so thats not bad going.

The 3d chat is coming...
In the meantime, come in the IRC. Ask me for details!!.
Peter H
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 05:29
are you going to keep the avatars like that?

"We make the worst games in the universe."
Kentaree
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 05:42
I agree with Peter_H, they're a bit high poly aren't they?

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Peter H
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 06:02
heh...

"We make the worst games in the universe."
CattleRustler
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Posted: 25th Aug 2004 07:25
heh, no everyone will supply their own cool avatars



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CattleRustler
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 06:21
In preparation for a limited public beta demo of DarkTOPIA I would urge people to have their texture bitmaps ready - all it needs to be is a simple texture map for a cube using your TGC forum avatar. The cube avatar will be provided. I dont know exactly when this demo will occur but I would expect within the next couple of days. Whenever it occurs it will be somewhat small and the official team and the offical contributors all have first go + however many spots we decide. We will keep you notified.

Speaking of official contibutors, here's a quick mention:
Eoin - Dedicated Server
Philip - DBP Vector Math guru
ZKAT8IT - Media Manager
Megaton - 3D Textures/Modelling
Kentaree - mySQL/Web Programming
Jimmy - Testing/QA/resident h4x0rz

Many thanks to these people for their ongoing hard work
If I have inadvertently forgot someone please let me know

so first beta will include Mnemonix, MikeS, Exeat, and myself plus the six above, so thats 10. We havent decided on a cap yet but I would imagine we are going to need at least 5-10 more people.

I will post here when more details are available - thanks


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Manticore Night
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 06:24
PICK ME, PICK ME!!!

It's amazing how much TV has raised us. (Bart Simpson)
Newbie Brogo
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 08:47
Oh, common, why am I not on that list? Lemme add myself.

Eoin - Dedicated Server
Philip - DBP Vector Math guru
ZKAT8IT - Media Manager
Megaton - 3D Textures/Modelling
Kentaree - mySQL/Web Programming
Jimmy - Testing/QA/resident h4x0rz
Newbie Brogo - Cat Supply / Morale Support

Common, don't you remember my cats that gave morale support? Mmmff...

TravisP
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 08:52
I can be of much more help

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Good thing everyone here is a figment of my imagination.

Manticore Night
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 14:35
Manticore Night- Threatens to kill creators if not added.

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DarkSin
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 15:40
Looks interesting... send an email my way if you are ever in the need for another tester.


walaber
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 15:47
nice screenies

will the avatars eventually be user-supplied? and will they support animation? I'd like to make myself a fun little avatar once the program is in full beta

Go Go Gadget DBPRO!

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 21:08 Edited at: 26th Aug 2004 21:58
the links to earlier clients are no longer valid, and neither is the text only client version. I will be fixing a gui issue today and then we should be ready for the group demo

Walaber, Yes see MikeS' thread in general forum - the model specs are there. I think its linked within a few posts of the beginning of this thread.

More to come...


EDIT: Update* gui/pac bug is now fixed thanks to Exeat and the win32API - one step closer


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Philip
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Posted: 26th Aug 2004 22:41 Edited at: 26th Aug 2004 22:44
I'm now reading this thread on a daily basis because, since Cattle wrote to me, and I've spoken to Mnem on MSN, I've become interested in it. (Previously I didn't even know it existed!)

In terms of the movement issue which was mentioned on the previous page, how exactly are you moving the avatars each loop? Are you using the move object command?

If so, would a better alternative be just to fling the avatar's X, Y and Z worldspace position at the server (and other clients) each loop and then let them reposition the avatar locally by a position object command?

The disadvantage to this is that I don't know what this method does to any animation which is running on the object.

Cheers

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Rye
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Posted: 27th Aug 2004 05:59
There will need to be some kind of predictive movement, if the position is sent every loop then thats what 60 times a sec (guess) so there may be lag if everyone does this. Also it might look jerky.
CattleRustler
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Posted: 27th Aug 2004 06:15
Phil,

Heh, flinging messages every loop would be an insane amount of data! I had to time-slice all objects by doing the following: Each client exe that is running holds a dynamic Remote Client UDT Array. Those udt's contain buckets for all of the remote clients data that the local client would need:



the last three items RotRem,MovRem, and Ang are whats used during movement. When a client clicks a point on the floor your function returns the new angle, pumped into frcAng. Then the pick distance is placed in MovRem, and RotRem uses a version of what frcAng has but it has been processed into a total number of "steps" as opposed to absolute angle facings. Once the local client has this data in place
it is sent to the server who sends it to all other clients. So now in my main loop I process myself and remote clients simultaneously by altering their angles and positions by a constant speed (float value) until the values are zero (or nearly zero) but the trick being they only get processed once per loop, not continually until their value is empty.

This method produces smooth, simultaneous movement and encompasses a clients total rotation and foward movement all in one small message to the server - which was key

I am sure I could explain this better but that would take me hours
but to answer the original question about whats being used as far as the ultimate dbp function calls, those would be TURN OBJECT LEFT/RIGHT, and MOVE OBJECT. They work well for this incrementally time-sliced system.

We had four on there yetserday and everyone was moving and talking, and there was no lag or local hiccups whatsoever - and my fps stayed in the 400 range the whole time.

Would love to chat more - come to Lightning.Chattingaway.com
Port 6667, and then do /JOIN #DarkBasic


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Philip
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Posted: 27th Aug 2004 08:34
Aaah I follow.

You know, if you are using a flat floor (presumably on the cardinal X/Z plane?) and you want to do away with the somewhat slow pick distance command, I could run up for you a slightly quicker trig/vector method of returning the distance to the point on the floor?

I'll come to your website soon but I can't do tonight as I've just got back from my weekly evening badminton. Tomorrow I'm going to a party so thats out as well. Hopefully on Saturday...

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 27th Aug 2004 10:21
thanks for the offer on the pick thing but for now everything seems fine speed wise so I will jot that down for later if we need it - thanks very much

the address I gave before was not web, it was an IRC server address where a bunch of us DBP knuckleheads chat in realtime.

Hope to see you there
Thanks again
CR


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Philip
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Posted: 27th Aug 2004 22:28
Ok. I don't normally do this but given I have become generally interested in this project, I issue a general invitation to the effect that I'll be happy to help out with any other Vector maths type issues that you'd like a hand with.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Mnemonix
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Posted: 27th Aug 2004 22:37
er. i got a question. Will our PAC system work with sloped surfaces?

The 3d chat is coming...
In the meantime, come in the IRC. Ask me for details!!.
CattleRustler
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Posted: 28th Aug 2004 00:16 Edited at: 28th Aug 2004 00:17
Yes.
But for now we are only operating on the X/Z plane, and rotating about the Y axis. I can easily add in X rotation to be able to pan the POV up or down but I am in no hurry for that as I am trying to finish up the core infrastructure, as you well know

Philip thanks, thats mighty bear-like of you


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Philip
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Posted: 28th Aug 2004 01:08
Yep, my function will work regardless of the world's geometry.

If you ultimately wanted to have much more randomized geometry than using the cardinal X/Z plane as a flat floor, i.e. having hills and bumps, etc., then it would be simplicity itself to replace the camera's rotation around the world's cardinal Y axis with rotation around the camera's local Y axis. Wolf's free ezrotate plugin can do this easily.

But this sounds to me like enhancements for the future - I think you guys are all very wise in working on the core functionality first.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Mnemonix
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Posted: 28th Aug 2004 06:23
Yea, your probably right.

The 3d chat is coming...
In the meantime, come in the IRC. Ask me for details!!.
Damokles
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Posted: 29th Aug 2004 17:22
I was wondering :
1) Will there be only a server for DB-users ? or or will it be available for anyone ?
(you should really do one envirronement for girls ... I know a few, who would join)
2) I know this has been asked before (but not answerd) : will there be speaking-bubbles ?
3) Will we be able to do other things than move and talk ?

- Mind the gap -
Powersoft
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Posted: 29th Aug 2004 17:47
CR have you remembered my generous offer?


Scorched Turf --> Project Thread
CattleRustler
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Posted: 29th Aug 2004 23:23
Quote: "1) Will there be only a server for DB-users ? or or will it be available for anyone ? (you should really do one envirronement for girls ... I know a few, who would join)"


Its geared towards this commiunity so I guess it will be mostly all DB people, but I guess theoretically anyone could join in - we havent pondered the advantages/disadvantages of keeping it DB people only. As far as a girls only version, thats most likely not going to happen - nor do I see why it should?

Quote: "2) I know this has been asked before (but not answerd) : will there be speaking-bubbles ?"


Nope, no speaking bubbles in the plans yet. Right now the text chat scrolls in the bottom left side of the screen. We plan on having the server do zoning, where people are sectioned off based on their current zone - the chat will be only for people in the same zone. It could get kind of crazy if your trying to have a conversation with 2 other people but the messages of 100 other people were intermingled.

Quote: "3) Will we be able to do other things than move and talk ?"


That is the ultimate hope - but things will be added as we move forward, right now we want to get the thing released with moving and talking, which is all working fine and dandy

Quote: "CR have you remembered my generous offer?"


You mean the "$300 up front, and $300 later, if you are part of the first limited public demo" offer? Sure, I remember


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA - September 2004
Zone Chicken
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Posted: 30th Aug 2004 00:05 Edited at: 30th Aug 2004 00:19
Your zones idea would be great to keep the confusion level down, it would be cool to add a pager system in although this might be a bit much, you could have a semi transparent pager dispay fairly small on the top left, and add a command in like /users that shows who's on the server.

1 = cattlerustler
2 = powersoft
3 = damokles

then enter there number from the users list in the chat box and send the message to that users pager for people that are not in range of the chat window.

like
[1 hey whats up ]

Dunno how big you plan on having the enviroment but it could be usefull if it was to be large. If the enviroments are small then this would be pointless.
CattleRustler
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Posted: 30th Aug 2004 00:46
our server protocol incorporates Private Messaging although there is more work to be done to the gui if we want to incorporate it. If we do, it wont be part of any initial release

thanks for the suggestions, keep em coming


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA - September 2004
Damokles
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Posted: 30th Aug 2004 03:28
Quote: "As far as a girls only version, thats most likely not going to happen"

Sorry, my bad. I didn't mean a girl version. I meant a chat programm that suits to both genders.
I was mostly thinking about two servers : one for this community and another for TEH WORLD !, that way DarkBASIC may get some new users, when people see what can be done with it (for free)

I'm really eager to see the beta.
... if only I could model

- Mind the gap -
CattleRustler
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Posted: 30th Aug 2004 04:29
oh.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA - September 2004
CattleRustler
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:02
LIMITED PUBLIC BETA - FRIDAY SEPTEMBER 3 - TIME T.B.A....
(All stated times are in US/EDT)

Ok, we have reached the point of needing to have a limited public beta of the DarkTOPIA Client/Server system, before the bells and whistles start getting added for official release. We are hoping to have 15 simultaneous users for the test. No time has been officially decided, but to try and accomodate Australia, UK, and US we are shooting for around 6PM US/EDT (11pm UK, 8am Sept 4 Aus) but this is tentative. We will have 15 slots total, 9 of which are filled by official team members and official contributors, 6 (maybe more) to be filled by those of you responding to this post. We will choose 6+ users out of those who respond by 3PM US/EDT Fridat Sept 3. We need to have the final list by that time as to allow last minute media uploads and to prepare the server for restrictive login.

Current slot-holders:
CattleRustler, Mnemonix, MikeS, Exeat, Jimmy, Kentaree, Mouse, Philip, ZKAT8IT, Megaton, and Eoin.

6-9 slots free...
(this is not a first post - first served basis)
I will post the official time sometime tomr, well in advance

So, wanna join the fun? Post here.

Thanks,
TeamTOPIA


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA - September 2004
Ilya
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:09 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2004 12:09
I'll join!!!
(I mean participate in the demo.)
Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:10
Sounds like FUN! I be in

Do I have full h4x permission?


http://www.dbspot.com/ - Free website hosting. Fast and reliable... probably.
TravisP
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:11
ill join if you want see how dial up works on it

Good thing everyone here is a figment of my imagination.

PiratSS
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:11
I'd love to join if there is an open space

Eric T
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:17
bling bling... he old me to post here... so yeah

Specs: AMD 64bit 3200+, Gigabyte GA-K8NS Pro motherboard, ATI Radeon 9600XT 128mb, 120GB Maxtor 7200RPM, 17 inch flat screen, and 1.5 MBIT

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Thoth Onegan
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:32 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2004 12:42
Yay! Finally a beta!

Ill test hopefully (as long as its not when I'm at school). (CDT)

EDIT> Just saw the estimated time, no problem lol.

I seek the Codemaster Talon.
Ilya
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:36 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2004 12:37
So when's the demo going to be out?
(6+ people should post by tommorow)
(EDIT: They already did. NVM)
CattleRustler
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 12:42 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2004 12:43
Quote: "6-9 slots free...
(this is not a first post - first served basis)
I will post the official time sometime tomr, well in advance"


everyone intersted please post, we will decide at 3pm tomr


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA - September 2004
Mind Storm 101
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 13:22
Meh, Why not.

"Think what you like, You'll all be mine in the end."

http://www.DotBinary.dbspot.com
Manticore Night
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 13:44
ME, ME ,ME!!!

It's amazing how much TV has raised us. (Bart Simpson)
JoelJ
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 14:13
MEMEMEMEMEMEMEME, you know you want to :0

RougeCat
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2004 14:19
I want to join too. Me plzz!!!

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