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Work in Progress / Project: DarkTOPIA - DarkLINK

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Powersoft
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Posted: 10th Oct 2004 21:05
Hows it going ? any news on a new beta



BTW great work your doing


Scorched Turf --> Project Thread
CattleRustler
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Posted: 10th Oct 2004 22:43
we were quit close to a release of this program when everything sort of stopped dead. I wanted to replace the floating windows gui with a more set-in gui done in dbp, to give the whole thing a cleaner/tighter look and feel. Jimmy took the job and wrote an awesome gui that was 100% on spec. Only problem, it doesn't work on all video cards for some reason - and thats where we stand. I have been pestering Jimmy to fix it or alter it so we can get it working on all cards but he's sort of left me (us) high and dry. I am not blaming him actually, I made the decision to use his work, against some other peoples better judgement, so the fault is mine. I thought back when Jimmy showed me what he could do, and I asked him "Seriously, all kidding asided, are you going to do this and see it thru until it is done" I believed him when he said "Yes". Well now its 4 weeks later and still no GUI. Thanks Jimbo.

I will be posting a thread for a new gui designer to take Jimmy's place, possibly taking what he's done already and fixing it, or recreating its intended functionality from scratch. It will be up to them.

I've been loyal to a fault, and I have devoted much time and effort to this project. Its time to move forward and get this going again. Like I said when this first got started "I refuse to let this project die".

stay tuned.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Wiggett
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Posted: 10th Oct 2004 23:01
sounds a bit bad, have you spoken to jimmy in this time or has he gone in communicado? (is that the right lingo?)

CattleRustler
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Posted: 11th Oct 2004 00:16
I've busted his balls about it. Doesn't seem to care one way or the other. I am very disappointed.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Powersoft
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Posted: 11th Oct 2004 03:58
well i will have a go if you want. . . tell me what you want and we can talk. . .

do you have MSN?


Scorched Turf --> Project Thread
Philip
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Posted: 11th Oct 2004 04:13
Cattle, these things happen. Presumably someone can take up where Jimmy left off? How about Mnem?

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 11th Oct 2004 11:58 Edited at: 11th Oct 2004 15:43
Power, we'll talk more when I post the official thread - thanks

Phil, Mnem is busy on the server aspect of this project and, although talented, I am not sure his dbp skills fit this call of duty - nor do mine. If they do (or if anyone else on this team's skills do - then f'ing speak up )


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Wiggett
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Posted: 11th Oct 2004 12:18
i cant code a gui. just thought i'd add that.

Kentaree
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Posted: 12th Oct 2004 03:09
CR, are you looking for a continuation of Jimmy's GUI, or one written from scratch? As long as there's necessary media there, I can have a look at it if you want.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 12th Oct 2004 09:04
YES! would you want to take over this aspect of the project for us?
I can give you what I have from Jimmy, and you can do with it as you see fit. I have no problem with you doing it from scratch or using his and fixing it, as long as it follows spec.

thanks
let me know
CR


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Kentaree
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Posted: 13th Oct 2004 05:59
Cool

Can you e-mail the spec, and what you currently have for it to me?

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Philip
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Posted: 13th Oct 2004 07:52
Yes. Give Kent everything and ask him to help.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 13th Oct 2004 14:12
I will send first thing tomr...

(eyes closing)



DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 14th Oct 2004 08:18
Looks like TOPIA is back. Kent is yet again the hero of the hour.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 14th Oct 2004 09:59
I sent kent the stuff this morn, havent heard back yet - but mnem did and I have yet to speak to him

(maximizes CRIRC... oh mnem?)


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 14th Oct 2004 23:13
Right, got your e-mail, have yet to look at it as I stayed in town last night, and am in college as I speak. When I get the chance I'll log on to irc and talk to you about it.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 15th Oct 2004 01:20



DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
PowerSoft
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Posted: 15th Oct 2004 04:26



Quote: "Power, we'll talk more when I post the official thread - thanks "



Create? Play? YOU Decide
CattleRustler
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Posted: 15th Oct 2004 05:48
*** PROGRESS REPORT ***

I am happy to say that DarkTOPIA has come back from the brink, and is now revived and healthy once again Here is what is going on:

-Kentaree: has taken over GUI duties from that other guy, and is currently working on a new version. He hopes to have something for us to test by this sunday.

-Mnemonix: is currently recoding the server app, which we knew at some point would need doing to make it more flexible and robust.

-Cattle: Once I have something from Kentaree I can begin adding the finalizing touches to the client (yes it was that far along internally)

-MikeS: I don't know where he's at with 3D world etc

-Exeat: Luckily his work was done way earlier and this whole fiasco hasnt affected him. Depending on what scheme Mnemonix adopts for data security we may call on him for dll work. Not sure, but I don't think its likely that we'll need to bother him, as he is working on a compo project from what I last heard.

-DavidT: From what I last heard, is standing by ready to take the lead for our web site development including web registration, and a yet to be discussed Avatar submission area.

Thanks to those who have supported and encouraged this project over the past few months. We hope to deliver a kick ass fun place to explore and hang out in. Stay tuned.

Thanks from,
TeamTOPIA & Official Contributors


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Dave J
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Posted: 16th Oct 2004 21:22
Nah, turned out I didn't even have enough time to enter the compo , my final exams start in about a week and I don't want to screw them up at all (as they basically determine my future ), however, once I've finished them, I'll have nothing to do for months. Hoorah!


"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
CattleRustler
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 06:20 Edited at: 20th Oct 2004 06:22
UPDATE

Kentaree has revamped the GUI originally written by Jimmy and has got it working nicely on both high-end and lower-end video cards. Since its a mixture of Jimmy's and Kentaree's code they are both being credited accordingly. Now that I have a working version of a gui I can begin fitting it into the latest version of the DT client.

Hopefully I will have something within a couple of days.

CR


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 07:19
We're all waiting expectantly.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Wiggett
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 21:06
CattleRustler
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Posted: 23rd Oct 2004 02:21 Edited at: 23rd Oct 2004 02:25
UPDATE

Despite my IDE woes and constant crashing, and needing to switch to a better ide (like Blue IDE) I have managed to link the GUI facade in with the DarkLINK 3d system. Nothing grand as of yet but it runs. One thing I have noticed is that the added processing has slowed 3d to a crawl (which was anticipated when we first started, and was the reason behind offloading the the text based chat and user status displays to the c++ dll gui).

Brace yourselves, but I am experimenting with a RADICAL new design for the DT client, and it is a departure from anything I have tried before - It may end up being a sick meld of the best of 2 worlds and may considerably enhance this project.

stay tuned ...


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 24th Oct 2004 00:50
CR, one way in which you might speed up the current GUI is if you got a dll to get direct access to images via a pointer, so you can ditch all the speed intensive image commands.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 24th Oct 2004 03:41
I think Im ditching the gui altogether, or experimenting with such. First tests were successful. This project may now need a 3d dbp developer who is interested in designing a scripting system for the 3d movement system. I can explain more when I know more.

CR


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Ilya
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Posted: 24th Oct 2004 05:52
Sure. I can make a waypoint thingy. What excatly do you need to do?

The default editor is fine.

Quote: "I've seen the word programming and I'm not sure what it means. Anybody please explain?"
Mytho
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Posted: 24th Oct 2004 07:21
how exactly are you planning on working your web registration?

I tried.
CattleRustler
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Posted: 24th Oct 2004 11:26
load web page
enter nick and password
upload media
see if its accepted
joy

how else?


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CattleRustler
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 00:38
OK - Back to original GUI. Fixing it up and getting messaging to work properly. Here's an early screenie....




DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Mnemonix
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 00:45
Very nice. This is the incentive to complete the project. Which we will complete or I will go on a mad killing spree.

The 3d chat is coming...
Rights For Traffic Cones!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 01:27
oh, rest assured, it will be completed, one way or another.
when is a different issue, entirely


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 01:20
Well, just so as you know, your deadline is Xmas.

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
Ilya
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 01:42 Edited at: 31st Oct 2004 01:59
Why's it pink?

Quote: "I've seen the word programming and I'm not sure what it means. Anybody please explain?"


Quote: "We shouldn't sacrifice the truth to preserve "balance"."
CattleRustler
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 01:52 Edited at: 31st Oct 2004 10:53
its not pink, its purple. if its pink on your monitor you need a new monitor or check the color balancing


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 31st Oct 2004 10:51 Edited at: 31st Oct 2004 10:52
Thanks Ilya.

UPDATE
-Hooked the tcp data into the gui and all is swell (font is a lil small but whatever). The chat and user lists seem to be working properly
-Coded some of the pivot arrows for clickability, again swell. The rest of them will be done by tomorrow.
-Sped up the travel variable to account for the newly slowed dbp app due to the massively processed front end. Seems to hold at about 120 FPS so its not too bad.
-made some slight moderations to the external apps: Settings Manager & Media Manager, all with that is fine, just some tweaks.

UPCOMING - ASAP
-Get web site up and rolling in beta form. needs to accept and store nick/password registrations. (DavidT was last going to be coding this aspect...I need to reaffirm this.)
-Server needs to link to web DB and use that data to allow/disallow logins to DT server, as well as set user privelage status.
-Server needs concept of zoning implemented into its core logic.

(a billion other things)

stay tuned


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 01:41
some testing with mnem...



a lil slow on the fps(), not sure whats up with that.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Mnemonix
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 01:43 Edited at: 1st Nov 2004 01:44
Here is my screeny from the same online session.



The 3d chat is coming...
Rights For Traffic Cones!

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Zero Blitzt
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 01:48
cheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesexy


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Kentaree
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 02:12
CR, how are you handling the text to sprite stuff at the moment, have you changed it at all?

Looks very good by the way, good work , although I think the colour might need a bit of changing

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Preston C
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 02:16
Looking good CR, and I must say that GUI is inspirational!

Cheers,
Preston


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Philip
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 02:34
Personally I'm looking forward to the next beta test. Hopefully I won't get trapped in a wall this time!

Philip

What do you mean, bears aren't supposed to wear hats and a tie? P3.2ghz / 1 gig / GeForce FX 5900 128meg / WinXP home
CattleRustler
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 03:53 Edited at: 1st Nov 2004 04:01
heh. Thanks guys.

Kent, I havent changed anything in the gui code, I just hooked the functions into my main client code and added the hot clickable areas of the gui (arrows, buttons) to be checked by the main loop. This system is quite slow however. If I rem out RUNGUI() I get 120 fps, 60 fps with it running and me only connected client, less than 20 fps the minute mnem connected and we started moving around. Is there anything we can do to optimize the gui code?

EDIT: Let me state that the GUI is by Jimmy & Kentaree. I have tweaked it a bit graphically for color and will be adding some buttons. Speaking of which, Jimmy, what font did you use originally? I need to add some buttons but I dont know what font you used. If you see my disconnect button the font is Arial-Small Caps but it doesnt match the original. Thanks for any info.

Edit 2: Just noticed something, if you look at the 2 screens mnem and I took those shots at about the same time... Now look at the distance discrepancy between our views - theres the out-of-sync issue for all to see. Its things like that that make me wanna break stuff


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Kentaree
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 04:26
Well, there's extensive use of the get image command, which, as you can see, is horribly slow. You might want to look into if you can use a dll for writing to an image directly, which should already speed things up a lot. I also think some of the drawing is happening every loop, which is unnecessary, I'm having a look at how I can optimise that at the moment.

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Kentaree
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 04:27
Actually, going back to the Windows GUI idea, wouldn't you be able to construct a GUI like that with a dll, dock the DBP window in it, and then skin the window to look like what you currently have? Just an idea...

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 05:22
I already did that using VB.NET and ZKAT's DBPVBNET Toolkit. Works a charm...but...You can pass data between vbnet and dbp exe via memory address but this would require a scripting system for the dbp client portion and you can only pass numeric data, and only to one bucket at a time... I am all over the place with this project at the moment, constantly thinking up different design ideas etc. Now aside from the gui issues, I am re-questioning the whole movement system (Point And Click), its prone to errors regarding positional data because of all of the interpolation thats done, which is a direct consequence of our design based on trying to keep the server data amounts to an absolute minimum. I would much rather have a straight forward FPS style movement system using the arrow keys, but this would pump too much data at the server, even with limiting. Sort of a catch 22 as we could be golden but the server bandwidth is the issue, OR , we can keep data within limits but get an out-of-sync issue which can be the death of any project.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Philip
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 21:15
I still don't understand why you can't just fling vector information about. Thats not enough info to kill the server surely? Especially if you implement time limited movement by only updating the data every, say, 40th of a second?

I'm probably being thick in which case ignore me.

Philip

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Mussi
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 21:52 Edited at: 1st Nov 2004 21:54
Quote: "Especially if you implement time limited movement by only updating the data every, say, 40th of a second?"


40th of a second... you crazy bear .

Every 20th of a second would mean you send data every 50ms, now lets say you send about 13bytes per 50ms, that means you send 260bytes a second.

If you do it server-client based you'd get something like this:
Server recieves numberOfPlayer*260bytes per second
Server sends numberOfPlayers*(numberOfPlayers-1)*260byes to the clients.
Lets say you have 30 clients playing, you'd need a server with atleast 220,8984375 KiloBytes upload, not very likely .

If you do it peer-2-peer based you'd get something like this:
Every client recieves (numberOfPlayers-1)*260bytes per second.
Every client sends (numberOfPlayers-1)*260bytes per second.
Lets say you have 30 clients playing, every client would need atleast 7,36328125 KiloBytes of upload, this should be no problem for the broedband users, but I'm guessing there are still a lot of people that use 56k on this forum .



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CattleRustler
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 22:47
Mussi hit the nail on the head. I am implementing a FPS style movement system with a message limiter of 2 messages per sec whil moving (holding arrow keys). Also the message will be well less than 260 bytes, well less. And we also have some other infrastructure nicities in the works...




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Mussi
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Posted: 1st Nov 2004 23:08 Edited at: 1st Nov 2004 23:09
Quote: "Also the message will be well less than 260 bytes, well less."


I think you didn't read my post well , if you did, then how are you planning to make the messages less than 13bytes(for movement that is)? or did you mean per second?



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