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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / The Ultimate Shader Thread 2.0

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Peter H
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Posted: 15th Apr 2005 00:02
i just can't wait till we get a new computer (tax returns anyone?) with a graphics card that can support shaders

that bloom effect is exactly what i've been looking for

"We make the worst games in the universe."

that dude
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Posted: 20th Apr 2005 13:19 Edited at: 20th Apr 2005 13:20
does anyone have a replacement bump mapper effect instead of the one in dark basic?

http://www.nuclearglory.com/?u=fearik = sweet as hell collision system. easy on that leather thing in your back pocket too.
the left side of my head isn't bigger, the right side is just smaller
Cian Rice
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Posted: 22nd Apr 2005 11:34
Sorry, I meant the Bloom Shader. My graphics card does support atleast, thats what I've been told and what I found but I could be wrong, it's an ATI Raden 9200.

dj blackdragon3710
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Posted: 23rd Apr 2005 05:41
I had to download the latest update for my card to work. You could try that if you haven't already.

It has been said that the body is a slave to the mind. Only the mind knows no freedom.
Raven
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Posted: 24th Apr 2005 22:58
Quote: "Sorry, I meant the Bloom Shader. My graphics card does support atleast, thats what I've been told and what I found but I could be wrong, it's an ATI Raden 9200."


It should support it just fine.
E-mail me the Shader in Question and your MSN, and I'll sort it out for you. Probably a compatibility error rather than capability.
Cian Rice
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Posted: 25th Apr 2005 10:27
Okay I'll do that tomorrow.

My msn is animeblood@gmail.com

Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 29th Apr 2005 06:14
Quote: "does anyone have a replacement bump mapper effect instead of the one in dark basic?"


You read ANY of this thread?

More tea Vicar?
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 29th Apr 2005 08:15 Edited at: 29th Apr 2005 08:20
@Anime Blood
ATI Raden 9200 only has up to PS1.4 it dose not have SM2.0 support (well as far as i know)


anyway,
i have not been working on shaders for the past 1 /2 weeks and got back on to my attempt at pixel+cubelighting yesterday, and found a big prob , is there a max amount of textures that you can use in a shader file cus i cant have any more than 8 textures or dbp will crash. so there are only 4 light with this shader(need basetext ,normltext ,cubenorlizer, pointlighttext, and 4 cubelight textures = 8 textuers over all) i did want to have up to 8 light but need an extra 4 cube textures for the individual cubelightng. but for some reason i can have as many as i like when useing the shaders texture(load effect " ",1,1 - insted of load effect " ",1,0). any way you can now do spot lighting or disco lighting all in real time. just load a dx9 cube image and set the texture flag to 2(5.8 users only)

ps1.4 users only
[href] http://users.cjb.net/evo-stuff/pixel lighting.zip [/href]
humm not leting me hotlink , copy and past job

( im still looking for free web hosting )

also,

ill be updateing my hdr shader with tonemapping and ill have a go at adding in star filltering too(duno about this one it looks odd in the hdr lighting demos iv seen and will take up like 6-12 passes to get right = slowdown). also ill try and get it to adjust to the diffrent types of brightness levels you looking at(in real life if you look at a dark area then look at a bright light(torch or someing) your eyes will flood with light thats what i want to archive).

also have a go at depth of field after iv done the above of course. its not that hard to do really , just make the scene twice and use fogging or multiple plaines to get the correct depth on the second area. colour the 2nd scene black use white foging or multiple ghosted plaines so where the foging is brighrer thats where we show the blurey camera img more(obvously make the blur img in adv). then we can controll the depth by controling the distance of the fog. easy. accept for the big slow downs. some one else should have a go at this cus i wont start on this for a bit to come.

shadow mapping or volumes will come later on or before the hdr update , but have a problem with shadow volume atm du to stencebuffer not working , so i need to add the quads (bit that goes in between the split polygones) in my self some how (most likely thro the shader this will cause big slow downs but should still work faster than dbp shadows)
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 30th Apr 2005 08:06 Edited at: 30th Apr 2005 08:08
lol looks like the the sever resets arfter you get to 655k

so you have to download ninja matt cube normalizer here:
http://homepages.nildram.co.uk/~moonrise/matt/NormalCube.zip
and place it in the texture folder.

download the main file here first -------------------->

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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 30th Apr 2005 08:16
I think the file is corrupted :S.

More tea Vicar?
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 30th Apr 2005 09:09 Edited at: 30th Apr 2005 09:11
@Hamish McHaggis
duno whats up then works ok for me..

download this first and extract it to destop or some where:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/xt/xt_apollo_download.php?i=554668

download ninja matt cube normalizer extract and place the cube texture in the "pixel lighting/texture" folder.

http://homepages.nildram.co.uk/~moonrise/matt/NormalCube.zip

u must have dbp v5.8 for the cube maps and sm1.4

im sorry if it dose not work i jsut cant find any good free web hosting sites.

should look like this ..

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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 30th Apr 2005 20:50 Edited at: 30th Apr 2005 20:59
I mean't this one...

[href]http://users.cjb.net/evo-stuff/pixel lighting.zip [/href]

Hmm, with the other files, I run it and the multi-coloured disco lighting looks good, but none of the other lights work at all. It's just the coloured lights moving around. My card supports pixel and vertex shaders 2.0, so there shouldn't be a problem :S.

More tea Vicar?
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 1st May 2005 00:31 Edited at: 1st May 2005 00:42
so only one light is working (light 4 the one with the disco thinge)? need more info post a secreen if you can and tell me you gfx card , it might be the blending that causing the prob, i can only test it on my computer any one else tryed it yet with the same prob?

dose this shader have the same issue with more than one light ?
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/xt/xt_apollo_download.php?i=544626
(diffrent shader to the pixel one)
Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 1st May 2005 04:54
That demo just quits straight away. Attached is a picture of what is happening, but as I said before, it's just the multicoloured lights that work.

More tea Vicar?

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EVOLVED0
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Posted: 1st May 2005 06:11 Edited at: 1st May 2005 06:18
ok the problem might be that im textureing the other 3 lights with no cube light images.

so try this , extract and overight the existing pixel lighting file:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/xt/xt_apollo_download.php?i=555245

(no cube normalizer in this file btw as its like 1.5mb)

also thats odd with the other example quiting straight away

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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 2nd May 2005 04:57
Nice one . This is soooo sweet. Though it'll be good to get an optimised version . Not really much use at 40fps.

More tea Vicar?
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 2nd May 2005 06:53
unfortunetly the only optimization that i can do would be to take out the specular shine or normal mapping altogether. glad it works nun the less.
Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 2nd May 2005 21:18
Well, by optimization I just mean whatever you were planning to do next . I realise you can't get the same effect at much higher speeds. Can't expect something from nothing.

More tea Vicar?
that dude
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Posted: 3rd May 2005 02:54
Quote: "You read ANY of this thread?
"

yes, and i could not find a simple bump mapper. all i want is simple bump mapping; not normal mapping or anything else, just plain bump mapping.

http://www.nuclearglory.com/?u=fearik = sweet as hell collision system. easy on that leather thing in your back pocket too.
the left side of my head isn't bigger, the right side is just smaller
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 3rd May 2005 07:36
the very basic of bumpmapping is normal mapping.. or are you just looking for halo(1) style stuff that gets effect by the camera and not a light source.
Raven
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Posted: 3rd May 2005 10:57
Quote: "the very basic of bumpmapping is normal mapping.. or are you just looking for halo(1) style stuff that gets effect by the camera and not a light source"


Bump Mapping offsets based on a height image.
Normal Mapping creates a depth length based on a vector image.

The techniques achieve very different results.

that dude, I could direct you to a few sites that explain how to achieve it yourself. it isn't exactly a complex thing to do.

Your signature has been erased by a mod. Please resize it to under 600x120. Thanks!
that dude
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Posted: 8th May 2005 06:31
Quote: "that dude, I could direct you to a few sites that explain how to achieve it yourself. it isn't exactly a complex thing to do."

that would be great. i dont want an effect that is going to use a huge amount of fps up, i just want an effect that will make it look like there is more than just a texture on the objects.

http://www.nuclearglory.com/?u=fearik = sweet as hell collision system. easy on that leather thing in your back pocket too.
the left side of my head isn't bigger, the right side is just smaller
Raven
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Posted: 10th May 2005 12:30
http://www.cs.wpi.edu/~matt/courses/cs563/talks/bump/bumpmap.html
http://freespace.virgin.net/hugo.elias/graphics/x_polybm.htm (recommend this one as it's bloody straight forward)
http://opengl.nutty.org/opengl.html (opengl source)

they should help explain how to do it

it is quite easy to do, all you have to remember are the lessons from that second site.. you can do it using the dbp memblocks and altering the texture. always make sure to keep the base texture in-tact and them copy across the altered texture to the models texture.

if i have time (which i don't right now) i'll code it up in dbp.

http://www.nvidia.co.uk/page/pg_20030224978930.html

oh and that is a handy page for people who want to use terminology.
look it up FIRST there, then you can spout off you know what it means :p

[ Liandri Corporation / Chief Software Architect ]
Sergey K
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Posted: 20th May 2005 23:57
i wonderingm, what pixel shader i got? i have 9200 radeon

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Raven
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Posted: 21st May 2005 10:49
Get Maximum Pixel Shader Version()
Get Maximum Vertex Shader Version()

PS 1.3 comes out 1.29x something. but I doubt that'll affect you.

Sergey K
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Posted: 21st May 2005 23:07
check the Attachment;

so i getting from here that Pixel Shader is 1.3 or 1.4?
and Vertex Shader is 1.1 right? so what i can do with it? anyone have .fx files that supports my Graphic card?

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Ninja Matt
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Posted: 22nd May 2005 00:47
The Radeon 9200 should support PS 1.4 and VS 1.1, which looks to be just what you've got there! As far as I can tell, pretty much all the shaders posted here (definitely all of mine - I still haven't made the jump to PS 2.0) should work with your card.

Download some and give them a whirl!
Raven
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Posted: 22nd May 2005 05:07
Wonder why 1.4 is comming out like that, I'd wish to hell Lee would add an /fp:precision and /fp:fast to the dbpro file.

I don't care what anyone says, I want my floating points to be what I expect them to be.

After all the cuffle in the original 'Ultimate Shader Thread', and every saying I was wrong about the 9200 NOT supporting 2.0 I'd come to assume (given i've never owned one) that it did support it.

Typical that after all the arguments are over I find out I was right all along.
Not sure which Shaders in this thread are 1.4/1.1 given quite a few people have complained at not being able to run them using Radeon 9200 cards.

If you come across a shader that doesn't work on your card, link it for me and I'll re-write so it does.

Sergey K
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Posted: 22nd May 2005 06:39
how do u make them? using rander monkey (whatever it calls) or something?

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BLINX123
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Posted: 24th May 2005 02:14
Hi to you all. Is it possible to implement some DirectX 8.1 Shaders
into Dark Basic Pro applications. Because I really love DirectX 8
and DirectX 9 with its new HLSL technology only sucks,sorry about that.
BLINX123
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Posted: 24th May 2005 02:18
Hi to you all. Is it possible to implement some DirectX 8.1 Shaders
into Dark Basic Pro applications. Because I really love DirectX 8
and DirectX 9 with its new HLSL technology only sucks,sorry about that.
Sephnroth
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Posted: 25th May 2005 05:04
Hey all. I'm trying to get a self shadowing shader working from the nvidia website. This is the shader:



When i try to set effect after loading it, it says the effect doesnt exist and quits out. I'm guessing the loading fails. I guess it needs to be modified for use in dbp? (I will ultimatly be using with darksdk but im testing stuff in dbp 5.8 for now because shaders dont work in the sdk) but I dont even know where to begin..

Anyone fancy taking a look at it please? If something did need changing it would be nice if you say what you changed so I wont have to bug anyone next time a shader needs converting and just do it myself ^^

Thanks

[07:16:59-pm] « Sephnroth » you were dreaming about lee...
[07:17:13-pm] « Mouse » stfu
[07:17:22-pm] « Mouse » he was hanging himself lol
Raven
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Posted: 25th May 2005 07:50
Quote: "Because I really love DirectX 8
and DirectX 9 with its new HLSL technology only sucks,sorry about that. "


new HLSL Technology?
HLSL was implimented in ver8.1 .. hardly new, nor does it suck as it provides a C-Syntax for programming shaders which is easier to edit, view, and understand than ASM. Especially as each card now has optimisers that allow HLSL Shaders to be optimised per card, and not require any rewriting based on per-card features.

Anyway, I'm sure if you actually check the help you can find out DB/Ps support.

Sephoroth, the problem with the Shader above is it relies on Scripting.. a feature that was added as part of DXSAS, and unfortunately something that DB/P has yet to get. It has been promised in ver1.6.0. In order to get it to work correctly it'll effectively need to be completely rewritten.

Sephnroth
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Posted: 25th May 2005 20:42
hmm, well that blows :/ Which part of it is the scripting? IE, how can i identify shaders that use scripting and avoid them like the plague? :/

When you say "it has been promised in ver1.6.0" - 1.6.0 of what? Thats not a dbp patch number or a dx number (well, actually it is, but not a version i would care to run XD) so who promised it and it what? Basically, is darkbasic pro waiting for an update to dx9 to get this scripting support or is it something the TGC developers would have to add manually?

Thanks for your time ^^ Bet all the shaders I like the look of will end up using this scripting thing now.

[07:16:59-pm] « Sephnroth » you were dreaming about lee...
[07:17:13-pm] « Mouse » stfu
[07:17:22-pm] « Mouse » he was hanging himself lol
CuCuMBeR
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Posted: 27th May 2005 18:15
For those having problems generating normal maps
here is a greyscale to normal map generator in the attachment.

Usage:
Take any texture you want and convert it to greyscale via any photo edit program you have.(i suggest a bmp file)

Put the "hmap2nmap.exe", and the greyscale photo file into directory "c:/"

Click Start->Run and type the following
c:/hmap2nmap.exe "yourGreyScaleTextureName.bmp" 16 "AnyNameYouWant.bmp"
(16 is a value of the normals power, and 16 is a nice value)

There you have your normal map in directory "c:/"

CuCuMBeR

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CuCuMBeR
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Posted: 31st May 2005 05:04 Edited at: 31st May 2005 20:32
hi guys, its been a pleasure to learn about these shader stuff on this part of the forums especially ninja guy and all the others sharing their info, however its way too crowded with tooo much information sometimes, cant we just keep it more simple and just share shaders, or info on how to make shaders only?
(if we cant, the hell with you )
Thank you and regards
Richard Davey
Retired Moderator
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Posted: 31st May 2005 20:35
Spurious thread crap removed

(sorry Jess that included your post as it made no sense with the rest of the junk removed)

I don't care so much about keeping it on-topic, that isn't why I deleted the messages, I did it to keep it FLAME free. This thread is useful, keep it that way.

Two Worlds and in Between
Hot Metal and Methedrine
dj blackdragon3710
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2005 03:24
Thank you Rich .

<<<<<Used to be "djblackdragon" with being registered in January, 2003, no matter what it says on the left<<<<<
Mike Inel
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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 16:20
Just wondering... I'm still a beginner, but, how do you program an hlsl? Do I need to learn C/C++? Any tutorials like "HLSL for dummies"?

Zone of the Enders: the second runner + Armored Core Nexus + Front Mission 4 = My current project (heheh)
Morcilla
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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 20:27 Edited at: 6th Jun 2005 20:28
@Mach, try these books,

"Real-Time Shader Programming"
http://www.directx.com/shader/rtsp/index.htm
by Ron Fosner
Morgan Kaufmann Publishers

"ShaderX2: Shader Programming Tips & Tricks with DirectX 9"
http://www.shaderx2.com
by Wolfgang F. Engel
Wordware Publishing

They are not for dummies, my advice: Read, read and read.
There's a long way to the top if you want to shader-rock

You don't need to learn C/C++, you can start with DBPro.
Mike Inel
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Posted: 7th Jun 2005 08:38
Thanks! I'll be studying it now and try to buy the books.

Zone of the Enders: the second runner + Armored Core Nexus + Front Mission 4 = My current project (heheh)
Atreides
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Posted: 8th Jun 2005 20:22
Err.. that's a very good tuto. May I translate it in French and put it on the Games Creator Network please ? (http://www.games-creators.org)

The sleeper must awaken !
dj blackdragon3710
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Posted: 9th Jun 2005 11:07
They came out with shader X3 too . Another good one is "shaders for game programmers and artist's". good books.

<<<<<Used to be "djblackdragon" with being registered in January, 2003, no matter what it says on the left<<<<<
Sephnroth
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Posted: 1st Jul 2005 02:56
can anyone recommend a good "shiney thang" shader? I have a game where the levels are made up of primitives. Its not nessiary but i was thinking how it could possiably made to look just a little nicer and i figured maybe just a simple bit of shine here and there would be nice, nothing major - the simpler the better because then i can use it on more objects at once

recommendations?

[07:16:59-pm] « Sephnroth » you were dreaming about lee...
[07:17:13-pm] « Mouse » stfu
[07:17:22-pm] « Mouse » he was hanging himself lol
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2005 20:06
quick water demo.

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Cpt Caveman
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 08:40
I think thats the best water example Ive seen with DBPro ever, very nice work and thank you
EVOLVED0
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Posted: 4th Jul 2005 04:02 Edited at: 4th Jul 2005 04:05
Unforuntly it dose not give off true reflectons altho to me it looks ok, but to do HL2 reflections i need to make the whole scene twice. make a plain and set the reflective objects zfunction to greater ( cant do this in dbp ), so atm its a bit cheep...

screenshot:

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wh1sp3r
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Posted: 6th Jul 2005 22:39
oh, shader rulez

PS: Real programmers aren't afraid of math!.

☺☺ AthlonXP 2500+, Ati Radeon 9600 128MB, dualDDR 512MB 400Mhz CL3.0, SB LIVE!, monitor 19" ☺☺
Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 8th Jul 2005 19:52 Edited at: 8th Jul 2005 20:04
I'm gonna bag that water shader .

And the prices of those books are extortionate. £35 for both of them on Amazon! They are only $10 used from the US, but shipping costs a further $10. Are they really worth that much???

More tea Vicar?
The Wendigo
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Posted: 15th Jul 2005 06:07
EVOLVED, I very much like your water shader! That is indeed the best water I've ever seen in DBP. Giving you credit ofcourse, could I use the shader in the Strata Works Pretest? Email at the address in my sig (which is a bit encrypted ).


Home of DOOP, Strata Works, and Seva. djpeterson83@_!@hotmail.com

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