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Mike Johnson
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 14:27


Dark Occlusion is a real-time occlusion culling library for DarkBASIC Professional. It will exclude objects that are not visible for the camera because they are obscured by other objects. This way, less polygons have to be rendered and your game will run at a much faster speed. There is no need to pre-calculate anything, everything is setup and calculated in real-time.

For more details please see http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2311
Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 15:16 Edited at: 10th Jan 2013 14:06
LATEST VERSION: 1.0.3


KNOWN BUGS
- ...

CHANGELOG
1.0.3:

1.0.2:

1.0.1:



3DWS Converter
There is a converter available to convert your 3DWS maps so they can be used with Dark Occlusion.
Download: https://forumfiles.thegamecreators.com/download/2312420

To load your map use the following snippet:


Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 15:19 Edited at: 29th Feb 2012 14:20
Reserved

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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 15:32
I've just tried the demo and it's very impressive. It's certainly on my to buy list, however before I buy:

Is this system compatiable with Dark Imposters and Blitzwerks Terrain? As together the three would be very powerful but it would be annoying to have to write seperate culling routines.

http://jimjamsgames.yolasite.com
Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 15:44
I haven't tested it with Dark Imposters or Blitzwerks Terrain. But I think Blitzwerks Terrain shouldn't give any problems. Dark Imposters might cause problems, it all depends on how Dark Imposters works, wich I don't know.
It will only cause problems if Dark Imposters includes objects that were excluded by Dark Occlusion.

MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 17:12 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 17:13
Hmm how long before this pops out and price¿

EDIT

nvm...

Ched80
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 17:18
Glad to see this finally released! Great work Max.

Scurvy Lobster
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 17:33
FPS Creator could surely use this for outdoor scenes.

I would gladly pay to have that option.

MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 17:57
I have a question... what if I created something in 3D World Studio... one giant map with buildings and so on... will this work for those limbs? [I dunno if it even does create limbs but I would guess so]

if so I shall purchase immediately!

Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 18:56 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 18:59
It all depends on how 3D World Studio exports. I do not own 3D World Studio, so I will just explain it with the things I do own.
Carthography Shop exports all the objects as seperate limbs. If 3D World Studio does the same thing you can easily setup the object in only a few lines.
If 3D World Studio does the same thing as Mapscape, combining objects with the same texture, it will be pretty useless to setup the exported object.
If the objects are combined you have a large chance that one of the objects is visible, resulting in all the objects with the same texture to be visible.
edit
I did a little research and 3D World Studio does export limbs, it just isn't clear if it combines any.
If it doesn't you can use this to setup the entie map:


MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 19:02 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 19:14
So can I link a test map export here and you try it out¿

EDIT

if I place my order now can someone approve it tonight¿ PLEASE¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡

MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 19:15 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 19:17
Bugger should have bumped that edit...

EDIT

Sorry

Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 19:21
@MrValentine

If you send me a test map I will test if it works

Olby
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 19:31
Quote: "I did a little research and 3D World Studio does export limbs, it just isn't clear if it combines any.
If it doesn't you can use this to setup the entie map:"

3D World Studio combines all objects with the same texture upon export. In fact Mapscape (written by Evolved) has an option that does export every single object as separate limb in DBO object.

ACER Aspire 5920G: Core2Duo 2.2GHZ, 2GB, GeForce 8600M GT 1280MB, Windows Vista Ultimate SP1, PureBasic 4.60 + PureGDK 2.0
Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 19:40
Quote: "In fact Mapscape (written by Evolved) has an option that does export every single object as separate limb in DBO object"

Good to know

Quote: "3D World Studio combines all objects with the same texture upon export."

Too bad 3DWS doesn't have that option.
If I have any time tomorrow I will try to make a converter to break the combined limbs into single limbs.

MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 20:35 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 20:36
Here is that test map

I used two textures out of DBpro sorry but I have no textures whatsoever at present... I still need to make some... 3DWS does not allow you to redistribute its textures...

so if theyre using different textures then it should export multiple limbs?

Please find a workaround for this if its an issue and distribute it with or for DO users would be a massive bonus...

Please let me know the result of the test using this map...

would love to have bought it today...

EDIT

Oh yeah I exported to .dbo format but I might use .x as well so

Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 20:52
@MrValentine

I have tested the map, it contains roughly 2 limbs, the terrain and the walls. So this wouldn't work in combination with Dark Occlusion.
But it shouldn't be too hard to make a workaround, I will start working on it tomorrow.

MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 21:00
Hmm...

I also had an issue running the demo on a single core [ya I know] system... its win7-32... at first I got missing MAVCR.100.dll missing... downloaded from web... and then got an error message saying the application was not designed for windows...

works fine on my main rig... win7-64 8gig ram... NV 9800GT

this single core rig got an upgrade yesterday NV430GT but im pointing at the lack of multi core... I could be wrong... will try downloading the working copy from my pc in case it was a download error...

Please look into the 3DWS issue but umm by walls you mean the whole blocks?... theyre one solid entity...

Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 21:04 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 21:05
Quote: "Please look into the 3DWS issue but umm by walls you mean the whole blocks?"

yes, the blocks

I have fully tested Dark Occlusion on single core systems, I even added a balance system to balance the amount of cpu used between your game and Dark Occlusion.
You might want to try it again with the attached dll's in the same folder as your exe.
I had some issues with these before too.

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MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 21:12 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 22:05
I have those already but will try to replace the ones I have... it asked for MSVCR.100.dll

I downloaded it via dll files.com webby

EDIT

Can you find your local copy of MSVCR.100.dll and add it here? I am not sure whats wrong

EDIT

SITREP

My bad eyes... its MSVCR 100.dll not MSVCR.100.dll

I copied mine over from my office rig to my home erm pc thing... and got it working... down side was I had to manually copy the three dll's over to System32... my concern is... how would I get a customer to do the same?

Also I noticed [I had to use 100 objects] with even just 100 objects there was no optimisation whatsoever in fact with DO turned off I got better frame rates... so there is a bottleneck for where and when the benefits kick in if that makes sense...

if you wish I will post up the specs here [I am not surprised anyway as this being a pc which was given to me... and its using an certain cpu make lol and its single core and a bit dated... circa~2005 so I think you can figure out a bench mark for the minimum specs? as it would seem dated cpu's may also be a factor here...

I could post up a video for this too recorded by my phone though... as something recording the screen would just kill it lol... also this thing has little ram 1GB only of I think DDR1 across 2 sticks...

argh heres the cpu AMD ATHLON 64 3700+ 2.2GHZ [stupidly long names]

EDIT

I am not concerned with this pc as I would most likely, come my major project later this year... will have a much better development rig at home... perhaps even a laptop [eugh]... I might even just buy a cheap modern laptop with just dual core pentium chipset... as this would allow me to have a base low end system to design for... however one should not rule out single core chips these are sadly quite widespread even today... however the question is... should we have a base GHZ? 3.00+? [single core] I may have a 3.4GHZ Pentium 4 [Should be Single Core] system within my reach to test on actually [brother's rig which I buuilt for him was my old cpu hes got a 440 GT though ^^ I chose it for him and upgraded his PSU too... meh] Anyway my biggest concern now is erm mainly with 3DWS but also this MCVCR 100 thing... it could just be to do with the cpu but I had it in the same folder and it failed to work but works if one copies to the system32 folder... hmm

Max P
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 22:07 Edited at: 31st Jan 2012 22:10
Quote: "Also I noticed [I had to use 100 objects] with even just 100 objects there was no optimisation whatsoever in fact with DO turned off I got better frame rates"

Which framerates did you get?

I have tested Dark Occlusion on 4 different pc's.
On the newer multicore pc's it works great.
On the older pc's (single core) I had the same results, turning Dark Occlusion on/off didn't really matter. With it turned off it was unplayable and with Dark Occlusion on it was still unplayable, altough it was a little faster.
But there has to be a minimum where the calculations take more time then a full render, I guess you found it

edit
For the dll's: If there are more people with this problem I will see if they can be included in the installer.

MrValentine
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Posted: 31st Jan 2012 22:23 Edited at: 1st Feb 2012 13:14
urm found it? you mean minimum single core GHZ?

Will try to get some time on my brothers system [not an easy thing... especially when I will ned to install DX9c..]

anyhoo...

AMD ATHLON 3700+ 2.20GHZ [Single COre
1GB DDR1 RAM
NVIDIA 430GT [Clearly not an issue here] GPU
WINDOWS 7 32-bit ULTIMATE

so erm I must say it eventually crashes when I continuously flip from DO on and off...

with DO turned off a peak average of 44-45
with DO turned on a peak average of 22-23

and if I flip back well... lets just say its not pretty...

I think I will need to find the minimum single core cpu speed... hopefully 3.4 will do it... good thing about that system is I can underclock it so I will also try to remember to try 3.2 ghz and 3.0 ghz and 2.8 ghz... just to be scientifically accurate... bear in mind... a P4 is MUCH older than an ATHLON 64 3700+ would be funny to see it just being the core speed affecting this area...

I am more than happy to help with this and if the 3DWS debockle gets sorted out I would also gladly buy it in the morning [fingers crossed it gets processed the same day ^^

I spoke with Lee recently regarding breaking up large .X files into pieces but I think this would [by means of limbs] kind of fit the bill

Thank you for being so engaged in this its a nice feeling and made my day

EDIT

Waiting patiently

[Wondering if getting Dark Imposters and Dark Occlusion at the same time is a good idea...]

MrValentine
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 15:51
Sorry to double post but wanted to let everyone know I just placed my order for DO... I just can not wait to get my hands on it... now can someone please pinch someones arm to process the order? I understand its not like a nuclear base where the red light flashes when an order comes in ^^

Yet my help with 3DWS still stands I await your response Max

Max P
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 17:31 Edited at: 1st Feb 2012 17:31
@MrValentine
The 3DWS converter is almost ready
it will probaly be finished by tomorrow.
there are 3 types of objects in a 3dws map: bspwalls, brushes and terrains.
The bspwalls are working now (see screenshot), still need to do the brushes and terrains, but they use the same method to seperate the objects so it won't take long.



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trogdor
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 17:33
When trying to compile and run the demos I get

Variable 'range' name is not valid inside
Dark Occlusion\Dark_Occlusion\Main.dba

Last night I lay in bed looking up at the stars in the sky and I thought to myself, where the heck is the ceiling.
MrValentine
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 17:40 Edited at: 1st Feb 2012 17:43
@ Max P

Now I just need someone to approve my order... woooo

I appreciate the work your doing... how will the 3DWS converter be distributed?

[Urm hoping the converter is free for all DO owners]

EDIT

Also... wow you really manipulated that map hehe... is the map huge in respect of usual map sizes? I just tried to place objects in the extent of the 3DWS region where it draws a grid... also I wanted to test HUGE map loading and difference in loading times across computers for DBPro as a project I wish to begin this year really requires me to be able to create a single HUGE map and have it completely traversable without having to have loading screens... anyhoo.. I hope DO does the trick for me as the only alternative for me is to do some lengthy chunking of maps and realligning... I promise to share details once I have the basis map laid out DO will allow me to begin work sooner than later I hope

Max P
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 17:49
@trogdor
Do you have the Multijoy plugin installed? Resourcefull figured out that it has a command called range. DarkBASIC doesn't allow you to have a function and variable with the same name. I will send you a file with all the range variables replaced.
It will be fixed in the next update.

@MrValentine
It will be a simple exe where you can drop your file on, for free

trogdor
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 18:08
@Max P
Yes I do, and thanks for the quick response.

Last night I lay in bed looking up at the stars in the sky and I thought to myself, where the heck is the ceiling.
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 18:12
@MrValentine
Can you make a new map with more different shapes?
I need to test if everything works.

MrValentine
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 18:14
Quote: "It will be a simple exe where you can drop your file on, for free "


Thank you... urm I expect you will explain more about it soon right?

[My guess is it will break down the model to sperate and prepare to be ready for DO to make use of?]

Max P
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 18:20
It will break the model apart and rebuild it so you can load as you would before. It just has a few extra limbs. I will explain everything when it is finished, including an example, just need a map now so I can test

MrValentine
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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 18:34 Edited at: 1st Feb 2012 18:43
hmm... sadly I just got that map which I created quickly in a painful manner on an ancient laptop...

urm... I doubt I could put one together right now as about to go home to a slow pc but if I can I will put something together tonight when I get home... if that helps...

I need to make placeholder textures will see what I can use >.<

EDIT

Quote: "@MrValentine
Can you make a new map with more different shapes?
I need to test if everything works."


Just saw this in my emails...

Will work on it as soon as I get back home so I should have something to you by say... 8 or 9 pm [GMT] [3 hours from now]

EDIT

HaHa you wrote that as I was typing mine no wonder

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Posted: 1st Feb 2012 20:06 Edited at: 2nd Feb 2012 14:01
MEGAMAP

took less time than I thought...

Hope it fits the bill...

EDIT

HMM I need to say for one... I am using again textures from DBPro media folder...

I created the house as a prefab then imported it onto a new terain and umm well... I dont know if grouping within the editor would affect anything when exported but anyway some are ggrouped in the editor and some are not...

Hope this gets us somewhere... and my order still needs approving

EDIT

Order Aprroved and downloading shortly Will try that code mentioned above as well as waiting for the app your making Max I will try my new megamap...

MrValentine
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Posted: 2nd Feb 2012 15:18 Edited at: 2nd Feb 2012 15:28
First issue found
Level of Detail does not work...

it just crashes... checked for files all where they need to be...
any help? no error message to mention...

EDIT

Nevermind... ran it as administrator and it worked... this would be an issue I think... as end users can not be asked to do it

Any help here?

EDIT

the Properties DBA file states 'Using level of detail' at the top ^^ you must have been tired when writing that one out...

EDIT

So I also have to copy the entire DO folder into every project? I think there is a sticky system in Synergy right? which allows this to be done automatically?

Max P
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Posted: 2nd Feb 2012 15:45
Quote: "So I also have to copy the entire DO folder into every project?"

Yup, you have to. It includes more then only code
I don't really know what the editor can do, the only thing I use is the part where you type your code

Quote: "the Properties DBA file states 'Using level of detail' at the top"

I'll fix it in the next update
Also found 'set the object to be static' in the dynamic objects example.

Quote: "Nevermind... ran it as administrator and it worked..."

Do the other examples also need administrator?

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Posted: 2nd Feb 2012 15:54 Edited at: 2nd Feb 2012 17:39
no just the one need admin rights...

any news on the tool?

I replicated the Simple Scene and tried loading my megamap.dbo but nothing...

will try loading it independently in DBPro and see if that works...

I see so I wonder if I copied it correctly

EDIT

The Array issue is proving an issue...

I did notice DO 's independent exe does not exit or end correctly even if I set DO_END() did i miss something with it running I can not start another app and it consumes a lot of power and urm is there a way to fix this issue?

I loaded my megamap and it runs at average 170fps not had chance to load it using DO it just stays black... and then when it goes blue I can not see anything... wireframe on as well... hoping that 3DWS map ripper of yours works... any progress?

EDIT

OK I think i got it... DO client takes a short while to deinit... but how to use the two? I think in the help files you need to show where some commands go in the respect of DO:SYNC:LOOP

[Preferably in the sequence:
DO
SYNC
LOOP
DOES IT GO HERE?]

MrValentine
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 15:56
Max?

Quote: "The bspwalls are working now (see screenshot), still need to do the brushes and terrains, but they use the same method to seperate the objects so it won't take long."




Noticed that bit just now

Red Eye
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 17:08
Great job on this one Max!

Looks great!

Cheers,

Max P
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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 18:05 Edited at: 3rd Feb 2012 18:05
@MrValentine
The Dark Occlusion client closes after 30 seconds. The OC_End sometimes works and sometimes it doesn't. I will take a look at it.
OC_End() should be used when ending your program.
OC_DeInit() should be used if you just want to end Dark Occlusion and keeping your game running.
When calling OC_DeInit() your program will freeze for a while, cause it needs to delete all objects and memory that is in use.
If you look in the examples you can see how to use most of the commands.
You megamap won't work now because Dark Occlusion takes the entire limb, wich goes across the entire map, as one object. It creates a bounding model around it, so you are inside the bounds/object almost all the time.
Still working on the converter...

@Red Eye
Thanks

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Posted: 3rd Feb 2012 18:12
Mega thanks Max once I can convert my models I can create some amazing showcases which I welcome you to use simply by asking when I make them

Max P
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 10:50 Edited at: 4th Feb 2012 15:08
The 3DWS converter is finished.
Just drag your file(s) on the exe(attached) and it will convert your map.

To load your map use the following snippet:
edit - see first post

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MrValentine
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 10:54
Max remind me to make you a virtual birthday cake
(sadly only the candles you can see will be generated ^^)

Will try this very shortly thanks a million...

Did you test it on my megamap?

Max P
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 10:54 Edited at: 4th Feb 2012 10:54
Screenshot of MrValentine's megamap (from inside a house):


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Max P
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 10:59 Edited at: 4th Feb 2012 11:00
Quote: "Did you test it on my megamap?"

Yup, see screenshot in the post above.

The megamap took about 15 minutes to convert, the first one about 3 seconds.
It doesn't take up much of your pc's speed, so you can easily do other things while it is converting (well... on my laptop it doesn't )

MrValentine
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 11:04 Edited at: 4th Feb 2012 11:06
So once I convert the models It creates a new more optimised model correct?

You sir are a star!!!

EDIT

I shall send off my models to be converted on my main rig ^^ hmm I wonder if there is a file size limit and whether I should make a conversion server

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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 12:40 Edited at: 4th Feb 2012 13:00
is
Quote: "find free object()"
from matrix utils?

EDIT

Quote: " pos = instr(lower$(properties$), lower$(findname$))"


this flags up too

EDIT

I have STYX but umm... will try to work out what syntax its flagging up...

EDIT

I placed
Quote: " pos = instr(lower$(properties$), lower$(findname$),0)"


Then
Quote: " if endPos = 0 then endPos = fast len(properties$)"

flagged up - I can not use fast ... I think again this is something out of something like matrixutils...

I created a simple replacement for the find next but umm can you confirm if this uses matrixutils?

Max P
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 13:07
instr, find free object and mid$ are from the matrix1 utils.
I will make some functions to replace them.

MrValentine
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 13:10
thank you... as i wish to avoid it for the time being ... on pause for now [me I mean... sigh... though eagerly anticipating your update

Max P
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 14:36
the import function is updated, it shouldn't contain any plugin functions now (see first post for snippet).

MrValentine
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Posted: 4th Feb 2012 14:41 Edited at: 4th Feb 2012 14:58
AMAZING will try it shortly...

EDIT

Quote: " value$ = substr$(properties$, pos + fast len(findname$)+1, endPos - pos + 1)"


this flags up

EDIT

Is it still using fast from matrixutils?

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