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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / GG's AT Blend Shader problem (Probably windows 8's fault!)

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Mobiius
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Posted: 21st Mar 2013 22:38
Hello, sorry to drag a thread back from the dead but I have a problem with one of Green Gandalf's AT shader demos located here

I'm using windows 8, and when I run this project....... nothing happens. It compiles fine, but the .exe will not run at all. Not even a pop up and close. It doesn't even show in task manager.

Has anyone experianced this issue before? Can anyone else run the project fine?

I'll explain why I'm using this shader in case someone can direct me to a newer, better version sonewhere.


I creating an update to my 3D Bang Bang game, and I'd like it to feature procedural terrain generation. (I just discovered Scorched 3D today, and my game MUST be better than it is!) This requires a shader to texture the terrain depending on it's height and what not. This shader does what i want, but it won't run. Any ideas?

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Mobiius
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Posted: 23rd Mar 2013 14:27
No-one.

Now I'm sad. lol

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BMacZero
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Posted: 27th Mar 2013 02:23
Well, it runs for me on 7. No experience with 8 here. I'm assuming you've tried the old Run as Administrator/Compatibility Mode tricks? You should check on your antivirus as well - it seems like fairly standard DB code, but maybe one of the DB DLLs it's including is tipping the AV. Do all your other DB projects run fine? If you try including the code in a working project, does it break?

Mobiius
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Posted: 27th Mar 2013 21:09
It worked for me on windows 7, it's windows 8 I have a problem with. And yes, setting administrator mode and compatibility mode does nothing. I'm also having this issue on another of my own projects from years ago, which is doing the same thing.

Also, a lot of plugins I'm using don't work under windows 8 either. D3D for one. (off the top of my head) This means that NONE of my old projects will work in windows 8. And that's a bad thing.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 29th Mar 2013 14:51
Having just returned from the dead I'll take a quick look.

I can't test W8 but I can check the code to see if there's a clue there. It may be something to do with the shader version used or some other DirectX incompatibility.

Do other DBPro shader demos work OK? If so, could you upload a simple example of a shader which works and I'll see if I can spot the problem.
Mobiius
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Posted: 30th Mar 2013 12:16
I'll have a look later on today, as I'm currently at work.

Thanks in advance.

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]
Mobiius
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Posted: 30th Mar 2013 13:43 Edited at: 30th Mar 2013 13:45
This code works, and uses shaders. But it looks like almost anything else I try and run which uses plugins or shaders doesn't work.



I'll do some more checking and see if I can produce a list of problematic plugins, but this is the only program which uses shaders I've managed to get to run. Most programs just don't start at all, (no errors) and some crash with the program has stopped error.

I've attached the source and my compiled exe file. Have a looksy and see if the exe will run for you.

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]

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Mobiius
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Posted: 31st Mar 2013 19:03
Excuse the triple post, but I think I know what the issue is. If I run the code but omit all advanced terrain bits, then it works. (I just created a quick do : Sync : Loop : End then remmed the rest of the code out.)

Even if the code is never executed, just being there will prevent the program from starting.

Either the AT plugin is corrupted, (which is unlikely as I've updated at least once and still had the same issue)
Or the AT plugin hates windows 8 as much as I do.

So, could this shader be made to work with Blitz Terrain? (At least that works!)

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]
Mobiius
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 19:24
I've just started having issues with the Matrix 1 plugins giving me a weird error, which I fixed by moving my TGC folder out of program files, and into the root of C:. This hasn't fixed my AT issue though.

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
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Chris Tate
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 19:31
Trust me, there are a lot of game developers having problems with windows 8; I'm sure Microsoft will make some changes or people are just going to stick with Windows 7 to play games.

Mobiius
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 19:37
I wish I could afford to roll back to windows 7. At least in my old job I had an MSDN subscription, which they took off me when I left.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2013 12:46
Sorry I haven't got back to you about this - been busy with domestic stuff . Will try to look at this later today.

Tried your demo from a couple of posts back and as far as I can tell it works - except the light rather than the camera seems to orbit the planet. That was on Vista though - will check W7 later.
Mobiius
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2013 14:03
That demo works, as do other shaders I've tried. The issue appears to be the advanced terrain plugin. As soon as I include any advanced terrain commands I get this issue.

Is there A way I can use this shader with blitz terrain?

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]
Green Gandalf
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2013 14:45
Interesting. Are you saying the AT commands won't work even without a shader? That AT demo of mine used some of IanM's Matrix1 commands. Are you sure that's not the issue?

If AT itself is the problem then I've some other code which creates a tiled, i.e. limbed, terrain similar to AT but without the weird side issues.

I haven't used blitz terrain so I'm not sure whether there are any pitfalls to watch out for. I'd expect the main things to watch out for are the FVF vertex components and what the shader expects them to be. But I imagine it should be possible to edit the shader to allow it to work with BT's FVF structure.
Mobiius
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2013 16:45 Edited at: 2nd Apr 2013 16:45
It could be IanM's plugins then. I'll admit I never read through the code fully, I just hit compile.

I've just had a mess about with your code and trimmed the code down to this..

With the vector command commented out, I get the error: "Failed to load DLL (3: AdvancedTerrain.dll)"
With the vector command active, the program fails to run.

Perplexing.

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2013 12:51
Certainly sounds like an Advanced Terrain issue. Have you checked to see whether that DLL is actually present? I'd expect a different message if that were the case though.

It should be in the Compiler/plugins-licensed folder.

Sounds like an issue that ought to be reported somewhere. Is there a Windows 8 compatibility thread yet?
Mobiius
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2013 18:16
It's definitely there, I've checked. I don't think there is a windows 8 compatibility thread yet. I'll start one as it certainly looks like Advanced Terrain won't work with Windows 8. (Will anyone care though since Blitz Terrain is much better anyway? lol)

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2013 21:40
Quote: "Will anyone care though since Blitz Terrain is much better anyway?"


Probably not. I use my own code for creating terrains now.

Actually that's not quite fair. Newcomers to DBPro and programming probably find the builtin AT commands useful - just as I did till I learnt how to do it better so the issue should be flagged somewhere if others have the same issue.

The AT issue should probably be a bug report in the first instance - unless it's a quirk of your set-up (and a bug report should soon prompt others to check for you). I can't test it with W8 yet myself unfortunately.

I'm not sure where's the best place for a W8 compatibility thread - same as the W7 one I suppose.
Mobiius
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Posted: 3rd Apr 2013 22:20
I created one so if it's the wrong place I'm sure someone will move it for me.

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 4th Apr 2013 19:51
I guess this is fixed now (from your W8 compatibility thread).
Mobiius
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Posted: 4th Apr 2013 20:35
Yeah, had to shoot off to work so didn't have time to update all the millions of various threads I've created fro the same issues. lol

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 4th Apr 2013 20:51
Mobiius
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Posted: 4th Apr 2013 21:06
Cheers for everyone's help. (And I like your shader GG, now do I change my terrain engine for a third time just so I can use it??? Probably, yes! )

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 4th Apr 2013 21:18 Edited at: 4th Apr 2013 21:20
The terrain doesn't need to be Advanced Terrain - just the same vertex structure and info. AT has some annoying quirks (i.e. odd edge effects and somewhat unpredictable sizing) which is why I've stopped using it.

Just shout if you need help getting the shader working on your terrains - or simply press the door bell button on my coffin .
Mobiius
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Posted: 4th Apr 2013 22:54
Hey, if you can get it working with Blitz Terrain I'll be over the moon! lol

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]
Green Gandalf
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Posted: 5th Apr 2013 01:21
Have you checked through the main BlitzTerrain thread? I've just done a quick browse and noticed this message:

See the list of bugs to fix

I don't have a recent version of BT so can't test the shader system easily. Perhaps you could knock up a simple demo and see what happens?
Mobiius
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Posted: 5th Apr 2013 19:33
Perhaps I could. I'll give it a go later on today, shouldn't be too hard... (he says )

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
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Mobiius
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Posted: 5th Apr 2013 22:38


It kinda works. Need to mess with the textures but it seems to work.





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See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]
Green Gandalf
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Posted: 5th Apr 2013 23:29
Well, that seems to be that. Thanks for reporting back.

Any more issues with it?
Mobiius
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Posted: 5th Apr 2013 23:38
Not really, just gotta figure out how to get the terrain setup with the right variables to make it all look good.

I do have one question though, how do I increase the texture scale. I need to make very large terrains and want the textures to be repeated many many times. Will a simple scale object texture work for each texture stage, or does it need to be done in the shader?

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]
Jeff Miller
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Posted: 6th Apr 2013 00:32
If it helps, I can't run the demo in Windows 8 either, but the symptoms are different. Using Codesurge as the editor, I am getting an error message that the program cannot run because I am missing d3dx9_35.dll. I've been creating plenty of programs in DBPro on this computer and not encountered such a message before.
Green Gandalf
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Posted: 6th Apr 2013 11:38 Edited at: 6th Apr 2013 11:50
@Jeff Miller

There seems to be no consistency in which d3dx9 version is required by the various plug-ins - I guess it all depends which was the latest version the plug-in author had when they compiled the plug-in. I believe updating DX9 to the current version (see DirectX part of following post DBPro release details for details) ensures you have all the previous versions. In the SysWOW64 folder on this machine, for example, I have d3dx9_24.dll through to d3dx9_42.dll dated Feb 2005 and Sep 2009 respectively (note to self: is it really that long since I updated DX9?).

@Mobiius

I'll check the texture scaling thing and report back - it should be a simple matter of changing a shader constant but you never know.

Edit

Here's the relevant variable in the shader:



To change that just use something like



(health warning: untested - still waiting for breakfast ).
Mobiius
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Posted: 7th Apr 2013 13:59
Thanks for that GG, I was going to look myself but was at work so didn't have the time.

I live for video games! (And beers, and football, and cars!)
See what I live for here: [url]http:\\www.TeamDefiant.co.uk[/url]

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