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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / how many lines of code does a fantastic game need?

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Programmer Dave
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 11:44
how many lines of code does a fantastic game need? Would 40,000 lines of code be excellent??
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Rob K
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 11:54
You could certainly do a pretty good game inside of 40,000 lines, and it depends on the type of game. I believe that StarWraith had about 100,000 lines.

But this value is not set in stone - you cannot say

X Lines of code = Great Game

It doesn't work like that. You are not going to make money out of DB fast, lets leave it at that.

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Programmer Dave
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 11:58
How manly lines do you think GTA 4 had?

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UberTuba
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 11:59
Hyper-kart was 700, and that wasn't a great game, so u need more.

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Rob K
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 12:24
GTA 4 probably had at least 500,000 lines. That was created with a huge team of software engineers, artists, musicians and so on though.

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BatVink
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 12:39 Edited at: 7th Jun 2003 12:39
It all depends on how good you are at coding, and what defines a good game.

If you have an innovative idea that everyone likes, you could write a game that is considered fantastic in very few lines of code.

On the other hand, you could write a Final Fantasy game in several hundred thousand lines of code, and completely miss the mark.

It depends on a whole host of other factors, such as how much animation is coded, and how much is embedded in the models.

Personally, I spend a lot of time writing reusable code and functionality. I think it makes my results better and more flexible, but the amount of code is far less.

Thanks in advance.
All the Best,
StevieVee
LoKiDeCaT
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 13:17
Short answer: As many as it needs.

Long answer: depends on the game. if you have a simple Galaga type game that's fun but uses only scrolling ship that blasts things.. then.. it's not super complicated.

If you have a game that's dynamic, has AI, storyline, conditions, etc.. it can range quiet high.

Four Towers was a little over 3,000 lines of code. And it wasn't too refined.

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squids
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 13:47
Didnt Black & White have like 2Million or something crazy like that ?

.Arf..
Rob K
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 13:49
I wouldn't be surprised.

Time and again though, the type of game which seems to be done best with these kind of languages are simple platformers or puzzle games.

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Andy Igoe
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Posted: 7th Jun 2003 16:42
Line of Code = x% of quality.

It doesn't work like that.


Most of my small DBPro projects have between 5-15 thousand lines of code. However I could compress that to 3-5 thousand if I was concerned about the length of the code (but as length of code purely equals readability of it - I don't do this).

Well Written Code = Readable
Badly Written Code = Hard to Debug

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 00:32
Quote: "Didnt Black & White have like 2Million or something crazy like that ?"


try around 200,000 ... but remember it has script learning Ai, so you start with a base of 200,000 - after a 5hr game you'll end up with an extra 100,000. My current game is upto 58,000,000 (have fun figuring out how long i've been playing B&W for lol)

as for the original question, how long is a peice of string?

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ConsoleBoy164
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 00:45
a piece of string is twice as long as half of its length!

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Rob K
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 00:49
@Raven

Are you sure its only 200K for the base code? - I think it is far more - there has to be a lot of code just to write / parse the AI scripting code if that is the case.

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aprilfan
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 01:23
How the hell does a program code itself like that?!? I mean I knew that it did I have the game after all but holy great coding batman! Does anyone know how I could get me some of that? Wow AI that just gets smarter and smarter and more refined and remembers if's, then's, and or's... Does anyone know how the great folks at Lionhead did it?

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Andy Igoe
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 07:03
Quote: " Wow AI that just gets smarter and smarter and more refined and remembers if's, then's, and or's... "


Artificial Intelligence will never understand a circumstance or concept that it wasn't originally programmed to identify, therefor it isn't really getting more refined, it is just considering more weighting data before making each heuristical step (decision).

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 10:34
Remember most of B&W Rob are actually other libraries... for example the graphics were DirectX 8.0 and they relied ALOT on the builtin functions - the worlds were Terrain Patchs builtin LOD, the animations were Bink, infact the only thing which was really coded was the Ai Scripter & Interaction.

that aside alot of games don't use that many lines of actual code, remember unlike in basic in C you can use code sections over and over as objects - this does save one hell of alot of code. Quake2 for example was only a matter of 30,000 lines whereas Quake was 65,000 ... the complexity doesn't weigh in general balance, because i could create an Image Blending routine with say 70lines of code in DBP - someone like GuyS could probably achieve achieve in around 45lines.

That isn't to say that GuyS would be any faster or better, he can just code more compactly - best example would probably be a game i coded for Rose, i coded a game nothing fancy ended up around 120lines of code i think, my youngest brother rewrote the entire game and used around 450lines of code ... but his game was far more responsive and a damn'd sight faster. However was a bitch to debug because of his style of coding - the point is in the end the actual number of lines doesn't = what can be achieved. Everyone programs differently, whether it is smaller, bigger, compact or elongated in the end what code is actually there doesn't matter - its how it has been used

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kfoong
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 11:37
well said raven!

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Solidz Snake
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 12:21
my answer: 20 lines of codes.

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Ian T
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 21:39
A great program needs one line:

print "Hello World" : wait key : end

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Dr OcCuLt
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 22:18
this is the easy way to have a game in one line


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Ian T
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Posted: 8th Jun 2003 23:11
LOL! Too true!

And sell it for $50 as the Official Expansion Pack!

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Nilrem
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Posted: 9th Jun 2003 00:37
Already done that...

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