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Dark GDK / Little survey

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Xarshi
18
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Joined: 25th Dec 2005
Location: Ohio
Posted: 6th Dec 2007 23:51
How many of you have dual core or quad core processors? Because I personally have a quad core and am adding multi-threading capabilities to my physx gdk thing. I just want to know how many of you actually would use dual threads for physics.

WC Physics - PhysX wrapper for Dark GDK.
david w
18
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Joined: 18th Dec 2005
Location: U.S.A. Michigan
Posted: 7th Dec 2007 00:13
I have a dual core. Do they even make single core anymore. And if they do why? I havent seen a single core in a store for awhile.
CattleRustler
Retired Moderator
21
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Joined: 8th Aug 2003
Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 7th Dec 2007 00:30 Edited at: 7th Dec 2007 00:31
we have reached the limits of the heat that the ever increasing cpu clock speeds produce. it was no longer safe to keep increasing the single core and dual core (1st gen, like mine) clock speeds, so they went to a true multi core platform (dual core Duo's and Quads) and lowered the clock speeds to a safe efficient range at or about 2.8ghz, all made possible by smaller engineering in the NM scale. More cpu instructions, in the same time but with less heat. everything is now, and forever will be, multi cored.

My DBP plugins page is now hosted [href]here[/href]
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 7th Dec 2007 19:53
SunDawg
19
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Joined: 21st Dec 2004
Location: Massachusetts
Posted: 9th Dec 2007 05:42
I have a dual-core laptop, and my desktop is quad-core.
aersixb9
16
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Joined: 29th Nov 2007
Location:
Posted: 9th Dec 2007 22:29
I have a p4 2.4 ghz single core processor!
RoarLee
16
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Joined: 9th Dec 2007
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Posted: 9th Dec 2007 22:49
I have a single core work laptop. My desktop is dual core.
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 10th Dec 2007 16:46
I usually use my regular p4 - Single Core I believe. BTW - IBM came out with a chip that runs cooler for multi-core processors - using light as the "Bus" to allow different "cores" to talk to each other - reducing heat significantly!

Fiber Optic CPU's!!!!! WOW - 11 years before we see em - USA Dept. of Defense helped fund the "Research" - Supposedly - this means that literal SUPERCOMPUTERS could be run in a desktop - because having 8, 16, 24, 32 cores now isn't such a energy drain I guess.

They said "Super Computers in a desktop" etc. in the article... who knows - I'm not using one thats for sure!

aersixb9
16
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Joined: 29th Nov 2007
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Posted: 10th Dec 2007 16:50
Kind of off topic, but is there such a thing as a dual dual core cpu? Or a dual quad core? Sort of like how they had dual single core and quad single core computers?
James Bondo
17
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Joined: 12th Nov 2006
Location: Denmark
Posted: 10th Dec 2007 18:40 Edited at: 10th Dec 2007 18:40
Yes. I got a friend who has got 2x quad core cpu's in his system and i know there is a motherboard which supports 4x quad core cpu's, but expensive as hell.

Using Dark GDK.NET
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 10th Dec 2007 19:07
Gervais
20
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Joined: 11th Mar 2004
Location: Canada
Posted: 11th Dec 2007 16:36
I have a laptop Dual core and desktop quad core
CattleRustler
Retired Moderator
21
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Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 11th Dec 2007 17:21
my cpu is first gen dual core - hyper threading

Intel P4 3.2 Ghz Socket LGA 775. The OS considers it "dual core". but the newer dual cores are faster. Intel and AMD are working on Quad cores and above

My DBP plugins page is now hosted [href]here[/href]
Xarshi
18
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Joined: 25th Dec 2005
Location: Ohio
Posted: 14th Dec 2007 21:27
hah, ok, so not many people have quad cores.

WC Physics - PhysX wrapper for Dark GDK.
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 14th Dec 2007 22:09
I've been wanting one - but - it pretty much means needing a FRESH Box - New SATA drives - New Top-of-the-line Video Card - hopefully NVidea is still the way to go um.... yeah - plus - I have an OEM Windows XP thingy - and I DO NOT want to go Vista - Vista=Issues - but the long and short of it is it costs alot to go Quad-Core. Kind of hard to justify - for faster gaming. I can use what I have for programming (My Trade) - and upgrading to make games faster - well - won't go over well as a responsible purchase It's not like I just want a video card - or just a hardrive - we are a talking at least a 2500USD for something I'd even bother to feel "Excited" enough to want to install everything from scratch etc.

CattleRustler
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Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 14th Dec 2007 22:13
luckily all my parts, minus the mobo, cpu, mem and case are top snuff (sata drives, nvidia 8800 GTS) so at some point soon I may build a new machine, but no Vista

My DBP plugins page is now hosted [href]here[/href]
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 15th Dec 2007 02:19 Edited at: 15th Dec 2007 02:20
My curiosity peaked when I heard about the new "SuperComputer" chips are taking shape now at IBM - paid for by USA Dept. of Defense. They use light to make different "Core's" work together coolers - less energy - and therefore putting a bunch on one chip would mean a super computer - imagine having 32 processors on one "Chip"

[edit]I bet it'd still be slow with Vista[/edit]

The Mayflower
16
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Joined: 17th Dec 2007
Location: Plymouth, Massachusetts
Posted: 18th Dec 2007 00:59
I got a cell lol
Xarshi
18
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Joined: 25th Dec 2005
Location: Ohio
Posted: 22nd Dec 2007 22:19
@Jason - Idk what all the complaint about vista is honestly. I have had no problems with vista over xp. Vista, for me at least, has been an all around better experience than xp. Then again, I have it set to windows classic theme and turned UAC off so it doesn't even act like vista except for dx10 and all that...

WC Physics - PhysX wrapper for Dark GDK.
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 23rd Dec 2007 00:22
Maybe that is the trick: UAC off.

At work - I've seen someone take two laptops - put them on the network - share a folder, then try to connect to it from other laptop - No Dice - could see it - could not Access - even after giving "Everyone" Access.

This was my first actual run in with it. That coupled with all I read online - and how Microsoft has added all these Content System - which slow down Network Access and things like that - the Program file Folder now read only - the Registry HACKS so a Program can WRITE to the Registry - but when run again - it reads a different value - because Microsoft decided to do it that way now... I hear reports of it being slower than XP - and this is likely from unnecessary bloat.

Frankly - I don't have much hands on - but to have to pay $400 for a FULL BLOWN version - well - that's nuts - coupled with the kinds of Stuff microsoft has done (even undone now) like you change a network card and your system goes offline in 3 days - Sorry - I REALLY don't like the idea that Microsoft can arbitraily keep me from my own data: e.g. Some Network magic and Bang - I can't use my system.

Nope - No fault of TGC - I'm seriously looking at Linux Open GL and stuff - just to get off Microsoft. I'll use Microsoft at work for clients etc... but for myself - I think I'm REALLY close to throwing in the towel.

Xarshi
18
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Joined: 25th Dec 2005
Location: Ohio
Posted: 23rd Dec 2007 01:07
@Jason - hah, well, I have an onboard network card and I have not put a new one in, so idk about that personally. But yeah, when I turned UAC off, I could access the program files directory. It was annoying at first though, because even with giving permission to UAC it wouldn't let me access the directory. Which was really annoying.

WC Physics - PhysX wrapper for Dark GDK.
Gervais
20
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Joined: 11th Mar 2004
Location: Canada
Posted: 24th Dec 2007 13:57
If you have Norton 360 on check you fierwall seting i did have the same problem and it was Norton that was blocking evrything from coming in or out then evry one blame the os we should look deaper some time
tempicek
16
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Joined: 27th Nov 2007
Location: Prague
Posted: 27th Dec 2007 11:43
Quote: "How many of you have dual core or quad core processors? Because I personally have a quad core and am adding multi-threading capabilities to my physx gdk thing. I just want to know how many of you actually would use dual threads for physics."


It makes no sense to ask here on these forums, because the user base is different than your target. You can use Valve's survey to check out for the hardware which is being used on Steam. However even this perfect information source can fail you if you are writing games for different target. You shouldn't consider much to be granted for any casual/indie game user. Multicore systems are spread over the market, but the majority of users have (and will have for next few years) single core machines!

Besides this, you can always get some performance gain using properly designed multithreading even on systems with single hardware thread.

Quote: "turned UAC off"


You should not do that. The UAC as is designed in Vista is the most important step forward for the windows platform and the only problem it bears is that many programs are crappy and programmers are stupid (or lazy to read documentation, which is the same). You can raise the access level for any particular application if you need that, but you should run the system as a common user as like as *nix systems do - it's a way safer and it is shame that this came so late on windows platform.
FERSIS
18
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Joined: 17th May 2006
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Posted: 27th Dec 2007 12:35
i have a Core 2 Duo 2GHZ.
CattleRustler is right from now on , every CPU will be multicore.
(Being CELL the best example)
Cheers
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 27th Dec 2007 16:56
Quote: "even on systems with single hardware thread"
if you mean regular single core CPU - with a single CPU on the mother board total... I disagree. Every single Task Switch causes quite a bit of overhead - enough where a multi-plexor on a single Core Processor - on a mother board with only that one CPU - will ALWAYS outperform the same identical functionality of said multiplexor - using multiple threads.

tempicek
16
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Joined: 27th Nov 2007
Location: Prague
Posted: 28th Dec 2007 11:24
Quote: "if you mean regular single core CPU - with a single CPU on the mother board total... I disagree."


I mean one single core CPU on a bord, which *does not* support mutiple hardware threads. And I must insist on what I said.
Of course, if there were only one job to do which were poorly paralelizable (strong dependency between successive instructions), you would be right. However, mostly this is not the case.

The problem is that you are simplifying the computer to CPU only, not taking in account other core stages or even peripherals. For example if you have one job which needs a lot of access to main memory, its processing time can be severely jotted by memory latencies. A task switching has a big overhead, but you can hide it behind these latencies. Actually, you can hide other code (thread) execution behind it. That becomes even more significant when accessing out of core devices.
So while it is true that it needs more instructions to do two tasks in parallel than it would take doing them sequentially, it is *not* true, that doing these tasks in parallel necessarily takes more time! And that's the important fact. And it is even more important for games, which are running in exclusive mode where you can manage threads to utilize most of the processing power of the target machine.
jason p sage
17
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Joined: 10th Jun 2007
Location: Ellington, CT USA
Posted: 28th Dec 2007 13:27
Sounds correct. Especially when you toss in the latency of storage devices etc.

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