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Dark GDK / Loading .bsp files

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Gimiz
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Posted: 16th Dec 2007 19:19
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Hi there, I'm using dark GDK with vc++ 2008 and, from a sample code, would like to open a .bsp file from a video game.. So I included the bsp file in a pk3 file, it opens well, but it's all black! I think it's a texture problem, does anyone know how to include it in the pk3? (the bsp file comes from a Source game from Valve)
Thanks
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CattleRustler
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Posted: 16th Dec 2007 19:58
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sounds like youre missing the wad file
iirc the wad needs to be in the pk3 file

My DBP plugins page is now hosted [href]here[/href]
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A1 Programmer
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Posted: 17th Dec 2007 03:35
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While we're on this topic... Where does one start with building a pk3 at all?
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dbGamerX
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Posted: 17th Dec 2007 04:02
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You need to use a Quake map editor. I do not know where to find one though.

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CattleRustler
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Posted: 17th Dec 2007 12:38
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look for Valve Hammer Editor 3.4

My DBP plugins page is now hosted [href]here[/href]
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aersixb9
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Posted: 17th Dec 2007 15:57
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Just to totally threadjack this topic, how do collisions work when loading a .bsp file in darkGDK? (That is to say, collisions between say, the player and a wall?)
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jason p sage
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Posted: 17th Dec 2007 16:22
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@aersixb9 - I heard it works poorly and I was advised against bsp. This made me think that BSP (in darkbasic anyway) is problematic.... Like falling through floors etc.

@Gimiz - As for textures - did you get the Wad thing working Yet? You still having a problem? Does BSP work ok for you? (my "Jury" is still out.)


http://www.jasonpetersage.com/?PAGE=ironinfantry&SECTION=ironinfantry
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CattleRustler
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Posted: 18th Dec 2007 00:14
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personally i never needed to use a wad file or a pk3. I used a tool named Wally to extract the texture files from the wad being used in hammer, and copied the files to the game's exe folder, then when loading the bsp iirc I passed an empty string to the pk3 file arg.

collision used to work, then it broke as dbp was updated - now I think it partially works lol.

bsp's are ok but you may be better off using x or dbo, and a good collision plugin like sparky's, or one of the physics engines.

My DBP plugins page is now hosted [href]here[/href]
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dbGamerX
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Posted: 18th Dec 2007 01:06
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@aersixb9: Collision from a BSP does not work in DGDK or open source game engines like Irrlicht or Ogre. I highly disagree on using PK3 maps because the most of the flexibility is lost.

By using a DarkBasic Object, you have no doubt that the map isn't completely integrated. In fact, I'm thinking of purchasing FPS Creator 10. (Sorry for hijacking the thread but) FPS Creator does work with the current version of Dark GDK, right?

For collision, try Sparky's collision detection DLL. Newton or DarkPhysics for physics

dbGamerX

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aersixb9
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Posted: 18th Dec 2007 02:59
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FPS creator would be cool - I could do the inside of my spaceships in it (does it support dynamic level maps that are generated by code? Or would I need 1 map per spaceship hull type...and then you could "Board" another person's space ship, and take their stuff or their ship! And possibly duel with space weapons.

How tricky is FPS Creator? How powerful is it? Does it have a c-like scripting language? Does anyone want to model for me? (Heh) I'm taking a Maya class next semester at a local junior college, that should teach me to model, hopefully...and I'm a decent programmer in c-like languages and to a lesser extent basic like languages (they're all the same really - with variables and functions...and ifs and whiles)

Anyways, I think I'm off topic, so I'll hit post now.

But first a haiku:
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dbGamerX
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Posted: 18th Dec 2007 12:56 Edited at: 18th Dec 2007 12:56
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The main reason I want FPS creator is because I can make maps with it... not FPS games (though I could make some) That'd be cool.. Reminds me of Halo when you said alien invasion..

Back to topic: PK3 files are ready made, but you can make equivalent or better graphical maps (depending on your skill) using FPS Creator 10 and still have complete compatibility with Dark GDK.

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jason p sage
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Posted: 18th Dec 2007 15:21
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I'm curious how hard it would be to make a Direct.X to NEW KIND OF BSP Converter - and format that would actually Work. It is a sound priniciple - and REALLY (in theory) should cut down drawn poly - with its occlusion culling (right Term?) for when poly's not visiable to camera (Like Adjacent room behind a closed door) are simply not drawn at all. Hmm...


http://www.jasonpetersage.com/?PAGE=ironinfantry&SECTION=ironinfantry
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aersixb9
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Posted: 18th Dec 2007 16:36
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If you're going to start over, why not use a different optimization strategy than BSP?
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sadsack
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Posted: 19th Dec 2007 00:36
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No lights in Direct.X , dbo far better.
renny
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Movian
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Posted: 13th Mar 2008 14:29 Edited at: 13th Mar 2008 14:46
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Are there any free programs that can be used to create dbo maps ?
(just forked out some money for another peice of software that i required for the project i am starting up). As i am on a limited budget, (hence why i am using dark gdk with 2008 express to begin with !!) or am i going to be forces to use bsp maps ?
or find a map designer who allready has the software required ... ? (if the naswer is yes count this as me asking for one ! feel free to contact me)
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monotonic
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Posted: 13th Mar 2008 17:40
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Off the top of my head, I can't think of any map editing programs that are free although I'm sure there is a few knocking around the forums.


Oh.. there is one at http://www.blitzbasic.com/Products/maplet.php ( blitzbasic site ), this is pretty nifty little map editor. It supports lightmapping, but only exports b3D, and X files, and of course X files do not support lightmaps and B3D files cannot be loaded into DBP/GDK.

I'm not sure what the licensing is in regards to using it for DBP/GDK as opposed to B3D, but it may be worth a look?

Much good work is lost for the lack of a little more.
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jinzai
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 00:00 Edited at: 14th Mar 2008 00:01
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bsp to X and back has been tried and it does not work. Quark is totally free, as is Q3Radiant, and I think Hammer is free, too. That's 3 free bsp editors/exporters.

bsp collision works perfectly in dbpro, I assume it does in gdk, as well. Look at the commands, and use the methods outlined in the fps tutorial. It works for the camera, and whatever meshes you make for it, up to 24, I think.

You can use any zip utility to make a pk3 file, including DBPro itself. You must duplicate the directory structure exactly in the pk3 file, and include all of the textures where the bsp file says they are. If it is from Valve, include all of it.
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monotonic
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 00:23 Edited at: 14th Mar 2008 00:25
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Having said that the only advantage to using BSP is the automatic portal occlusion, the collisions can be taken care of by sparky's raycasting system or a physics system like someone mentioned earlier.

However the cons of using BSP far out weight the pros.

So, don't do it!


Quote: "bsp to X and back has been tried and it does not work."


Huh.... X->BSP->X why would someone do that anyway?

Much good work is lost for the lack of a little more.
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jinzai
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 03:02
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Huh, yourself. Let me be clearer. There have been attempts to make an X file to bsp converter. There have been attempts to make a bsp to X file converter. I know of no such converter that works in either direction.

You don't like bsps. That is your opinion, which is fine. It is also fine that you state it; now we all know (again). This post is not asking you to promote that opinion, or that plug-in, the poster asked for help fixing their problem. Your post does not address that, actually. Perhaps you could help the issue first, then promote your agenda?
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monotonic
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 03:18
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lol , I didn't realise I had an agenda nor did I realise that I was promoting any opinion (AGAIN). I was simply giving my advice (whether the best or not!) as to what I think he/she should do.

And in my last post, I asked a perfectly reasonable question directed towards yourself, which I guess you wrongly took as a personal attack.

*goes and HUHs HIMSELF to sleep*

Much good work is lost for the lack of a little more.
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jinzai
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 03:31
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No, I didn't take it personally. The trouble I have is that you have left off of helping, and are beginning to promote abandoning the bsp format. It is not just your post, either. The posts began helpful, and then...
This question of using bsps gets asked every few weeks, and it always turns into the same thing because people don't tend to use bsps. They are complex, but they work as well as any other solution, including using dbo files and third party collision detection. It is fine to use whatever works, but let's get this working before offering alternative solutions that were not asked for in the first place.

I use bsps along with AT, and X models. They all have their use.

I would like to see the poster's question answered to their satisfaction, that's all. Once that's done, its all fair game, imo.
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monotonic
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 03:46
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Cool, you have a point.

Much good work is lost for the lack of a little more.
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Movian
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 18:52
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SO getting back on track - if i want free i have to use X or Bsp
but if i want total integration i have to buy either FPS creator or world editor and create a dbo file ?
however collision detection for bsp's can be catered for using Sparky's


did i miss anything or am i wrong on any of these comfirmation points ?
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jinzai
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 19:30
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The bsp collision is handled natively in DBPro for the camera and the objects/the world geometry after you set up the collision meshes for them.

Collision between objects is not handled automatically. I have not been able to get object to object collision working using native DBPro...that is where I think the misconception lies. You would not fall through the floor (bsp geometry), but you could run through another player, or other object that is not part of the bsp geometry proper.

The FPS tutorial included with DBPro is broken, but the latest upgrade fixes it. I think that tutorial is a source of trouble, too. I went through it myself when evaluating DBPro. I just made it work, then I used Quark to make a map, and I was running around a bsp map that I had made in the first hour, or so. That was a major selling point for me.

Other than that, I'd say you were on track.
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Movian
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 20:47 Edited at: 14th Mar 2008 21:01
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ok so if the collision is handled nativly in DBPro is it handled Nativly in GDK ?

and can i ask how i would go about setting up collision Meshes for a BSP file ? also if i was to create a bsp map in say valve hammer editor (3.4 )
how would GDK handle the Camera enteties and spawn enteties etc (or is that simply a half-life thing?)

sorry if it feals like im flogging a dead horse, but i want to esnure i pick the correct ocourse of action before i start my project (and end up spending hours of wastd time becosue it doesn't do somthing im expecting)
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jinzai
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Posted: 14th Mar 2008 23:08 Edited at: 14th Mar 2008 23:17
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The entities are a different matter. I don't see any support for them in DBPro anyway. They are simply a very long string that is delimited by curly braces, iirc.

The commands should be there in GDK, as well. In DBPro, they are in the WORLD commands. Basically, you set bsp collision on, you set a camera using set bsp camera, or set bsp camera collision, you set an object's collision with set bsp object collision The meshes have a threshhold and a radius. I will try to get you what I use in my DBPro project that uses bsps, and I will edit this post with that. Hang on a tic.

set bsp camera 0
set bsp camera collision 1, 0, 1.0, 0
set bsp object collision 2, playerobject, 1.0, 0

The parameters are the bsp collision mesh index, object/camera number, radius, response.

About wasting time, you could also structure your code to allow loading, unloading and reloading using map types. That way, you can use many different map types. I use bsp, AT and X so far, and it works great because I started off with that in mind.
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