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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / DarkBasic Pro Sucks on Vista

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Mage
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 22:09
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I've been writing software with DarkBasic Pro for quite a while now, and managed to get pretty far along.

I started way back in DBC with a Geforce 5200, and lately I've running a GeForce 6800 with DBP.

All under Windows XP.

So when I got a Geforce 8800gt I decided, lets install Vista64. Installed the drivers, installed DX9. Runs beautifully on my computer, and was surprised so do DX9 games.

So I compile a DBP program. And in a scene where I would have been getting a steady 100fps under Windows XP, with a card two generations old... I was now getting... 4fps.

Did I follow the instructions? Every one. Did I download the latest drivers? Yup. Did I turn off all those fancy Vista features? certainly did.

When there's 5 fps drop, you could say well the codes not as streamlined... When there's 10fps, well more system overhead. When you lose 9/10 of your performance there's something pretty big going wrong.

Game Creators,
Please fix the Vista performance bug.

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IanM
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 22:18
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Short, to the point, and not really very useful at all. It'd be more useful if you let us know where the problems are. Are you grabbing images? Deleting objects? Hiding instead of excluding? Something else?

Only you have the code for your game, so only you can add the checks to your code that will spot the performance bottlenecks.

[b]Utility plug-ins collection (updated 01/06/08) and
http://www.matrix1.demon.co.uk
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Silvester
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 22:20
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I never had this problem, so its most likely your RAM and proccesor that are being too busy handling Vista.
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IanM
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 22:28
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Or it could be Vista64 - at this point we can only guess.

[b]Utility plug-ins collection (updated 01/06/08) and
http://www.matrix1.demon.co.uk
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Mistrel
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 22:43
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Or post an executable for us to run.

I ran PureGDK (DBP 6.7) with Vista 32-bit and a GeForce 8400 and everything was smooth. It was slower than XP but nothing like what you are describing.

http://3dfolio.com
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Mage
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 22:55 Edited at: 1st Jun 2008 23:00
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The extra delay per frame occurs during the Sync, or FastSync. I've tried both. I've also disabled all extra shaders to no avail. I also tried switching from Full Screen Windowed mode to FullScreen Mode.

"I never had this problem, so its most likely your RAM and proccesor that are being too busy handling Vista. "
2 Cores@3GHZ, one has Project exe at 100% the other core is at 0%. No other apps running.
Ram 2GB with over 1Gb Free. DDR800mhz Dual Channel.

"Are you grabbing images? Deleting objects? Hiding instead of excluding?"
Excluding Objects Outside of Frame. No screen grabs.

Same Code from XP to Vista no changes.


Update: Switched back to XP.

Same code. Performance problem gone. Framerates are more than double that of original WindowsXP rates. Go figure.

edit: I'll try and get a build posted within a day.

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Scorpyo
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 23:47
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you sure you had installed "Vista" DX 10 drivers for your graphic card?
Or
you had DX9 dlls required by your "XP" DBP program available in Vista?
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Mage
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 23:54 Edited at: 1st Jun 2008 23:55
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"you sure you had installed "Vista" DX 10 drivers for your graphic card?"

Under Vista, there was a message stating that DirectX9 was required, and the program didn't launch. Then I installed the latest DirectX redist. and the problem was gone, the game loaded.

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GatorHex
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Posted: 2nd Jun 2008 01:35 Edited at: 2nd Jun 2008 01:47
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I don't have problems.

Are you sure sure you have DBP, nvidia drivers and directx all on the latest versions?

there was a version of DBP a little while back that had a culling bug and the default dx9 driver that comes with vista is very old.

DinoHunter (still no nVidia compo voucher!), CPU/GPU Benchmark, DarkFish Encryption DLL, War MMOG (WIP), 3D Model Viewer
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Penfold
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Posted: 2nd Jun 2008 10:55
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Mine works fine on VISTA too, the only problem I have is that I have to agree to do everything and anything, still haven't figured out how to turn user account control off yet. It takes more mouse clicks to copy a file from one place in my projects to another than it does to create a DB program (ie >7 clicks )

'Ooh 'eck chief'...'crumbs'
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Jeff032
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Posted: 2nd Jun 2008 20:34
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Quote: "(ie >7 clicks )"


Obviously you must be doing something wrong

To a non protected folder such as the Desktop: 1
1. Drag the file

To a protected folder such as Program Files: 3
1. Drag the file
2. Administrator Permission
3. UAC



I have no problems with DarkBASIC Pro on Vista.

For those of you that receive the UAC notification when launching DBPro (probably from the IDE upgrade), and everytime you try to "unblock" the editor from Properties it just resets itself - move editor.exe to the Desktop, then click "Unblock", then move it back. Worked for me.

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Mage
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 02:32 Edited at: 24th Oct 2011 06:21
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Attached here is source code about 13000 lines of it.
You aren't going to be able to run this since you don't have the game content. Also it would be unrealistic to expect anyone read through it.

My Issue is not that Vista can't run DBP programs. It's that there is a much steeper performance drop as the screen is more greatly populated.

This isn't a question of using old tricks like exclude object, no square roots, not deleting objects, etc. This is simply a situation where the exact same code (where more than 50'000 polys are on the screen and objects are animating) performs great in XP and at a >50% loss in Vista.

Newest drivers, latest patch, Directx patched, same compiled EXE.

This isn't the first time I've seen this. I noticed the same thing on a different computer months back:
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=116610&b=1

The same behavior occurs in a new project where I might place a couple hundred animating objects onto the screen. The Vista computer drops performance at a faster rate.

I suspect that a lot of you who are using Vista and saying it runs great on Vista, are right. But your XP performance is probably double that. No? Uncap your framerate and check again.

I would quickly blame this on nVidia's drivers. However, other DX9 apps don't have this problem.

And thanks for your time..

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GatorHex
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 03:51 Edited at: 3rd Jun 2008 04:03
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Try my simple DBP benchmark tool and see if it's the same.

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=101716&b=5

Here we have a million polygons moving on Vista 64 just using a single 2.5ghz core.



DinoHunter (still no nVidia compo voucher!), CPU/GPU Benchmark, DarkFish Encryption DLL, War MMOG (WIP), 3D Model Viewer
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Penfold
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 12:06
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Quote: "Quote: "(ie >7 clicks )"

Obviously you must be doing something wrong

To a non protected folder such as the Desktop: 1
1. Drag the file

To a protected folder such as Program Files: 3
1. Drag the file
2. Administrator Permission
3. UAC"


I generally use adjust button to copy n paste .. protected folders suck. Just want to turn it off. Mainly because when programs want to save they don't have wirite permission and the the save fails.

@gatorhex off topic has your Tank MMo been taken offline?

'Ooh 'eck chief'...'crumbs'
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GatorHex
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 16:35 Edited at: 3rd Jun 2008 16:39
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Yeah its offline now. The tank MMO was just for my uni project. The gits only scored it 60% even though every other student said it was the best game they'd seen come out of Bolton university! Put me off game programming I've been making web services instead.

http://www.kumkie.com/war/screenshots/screenshots.htm

DinoHunter (still no nVidia compo voucher!), CPU/GPU Benchmark, DarkFish Encryption DLL, War MMOG (WIP), 3D Model Viewer
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Benjamin
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 16:45
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Quote: "Put me off game programming I've been making web services instead."

Maybe the lacking punctuation in your write-up contributed to your lacking score.

Multisync - TCP Server/Client Multiplayer Plugin (DBP/DBCe)
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GatorHex
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 16:57 Edited at: 3rd Jun 2008 17:09
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Nah, I'm just sloppy on forums. My grade average was well over 70% i think I got screwed by some dodgy goings on in their MSc department.

Take my advice avoid this university as it was voted one of the worst and not just by me! [href]Bolton University is Britain's third worst, says Sunday Times[/href]

I've applied for several jobs at the university and surprise, surprise didn't get any of them. Makes me wonder if they value their own qualifications or wether the certificate is a worthless piece of paper!

DinoHunter (still no nVidia compo voucher!), CPU/GPU Benchmark, DarkFish Encryption DLL, War MMOG (WIP), 3D Model Viewer
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darkend
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Posted: 6th Jun 2008 21:51
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i have vista and no problems for me

if life is hell wat is heven
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Indicium
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 21:25
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its not that dbpro sucks on vista

Vista sucks
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Omega gamer 89
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 21:31
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Quote: "DarkBasic Pro Sucks on Vista"

No. It doesn't I've been running DBPro on vista for several months now. It works fine.

If the good lord had intended us to go outside or have a social life, he wouldn't have invented the internet.
www.threeswordsproductions.com
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TinTin
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 22:04
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Yeah I agree with the Vista Sucks idea DBP's not perfect but at least it doesn't constantly tell you that you need Administraitor rights to perform an action, even when you are the Administrator (infuriating) grrrrrrrr!!!!

Go Create...

Cyberspace was becoming overcrowded and slummy so I decided to move. These nice chaps gave me a lift.
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Jeff Miller
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 02:24
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With Vista Home Premium I get a problem that I never had with XP. Often when I make a boo-boo in coding in DBP and then run the program, Vista intercepts it before the IDE has a chance to bounce it and give me some meaningful error message. The Vista popup politely explains that it had to stop the program for my protection and indicates that Windows is trying to find a solution. It doesn't find a solution and vanishes, but I get dumped directly back to the coding sheet in the IDE so I don't get the type of error message that helps direct me to my boo-boo. I think it closes the program before the IDE gets it's shot at explaining what it thinks is the problem.

Vista also gives my phony error messages. I've become fond of using Ian M's matrix utilities, so I consult the help file from Windows Explorer. Vista sometimes gives me a message that there is no such URL, which is hard to believe since I just clicked it, then the browser fortunately ignores the message and opens up the helpfile as if nothing had happened.
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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 21:37
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there is some commands of dbp that are crapp on vista like draw box command is really slow compared to when on xp.
an editor i made before i switched to vista used alot of draw box command and worked fluidly on xp.
but when i then wanted to continou on it in vista ,suddenly only got 5 fps and that was an editor in true 2d ?
but i love vista now when i have got the gripps of it and never wants to go back
only crapp is when buying some games that was released before vista as mostly they dont run because of some copyprotection bugg.
startforce games work as they have an patch to download but not others.
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