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Geek Culture / Programming Woes

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Dave J
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 15:48
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Looking over the newbie forum got me thinking about what really troubled me when I was learning to program. It's quite funny to think back and go, "Woah, I can't believe I didn't know how to do that!".

For me, when I was learning my first language (Visual Basic at age 11) - I basically went through 3 months of it staying as far as I could from variables, the whole concept confused the hell out of me. However, I eventually found this one very short paragraph that explained it really well and suddenly they're my new best friend, hehe. The next problem for me was Pointers/Referencing in C++, the problem here was that I knew what they did but I couldn't in my life think of any use for them because I never really created a program that required it. Finally DarkBASIC's memblocks also confused me, I think the reason I stayed away from them was because I was messing with the system's memory and thought I could do some serious damage to my computer lol. Makes me wonder what kind of silly things I'll be afraid to learn next.

Anyway, getting to the point of this post, I'm really interested to know if anyone else had problems similar to these where they'd go through months staying away from a particular command because they didn't understand it? Or was I just really, really stupid? lol.
"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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Kanzure
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 16:31
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Nope, your just really really stupid

(j/k)

I went through the months just learning everything I could, mostly reading guides when I needed a certain command and etc..I gotta say though, that once I learned Web Languages (HTML/PHP/MySQL) the host-only type languages were a breeze. I went from PHP to Perl, and had fun their for a while, then went onto ... uhhh..well I forget ^^...but at one point I turned to Java, and ugh, im stil getting over it ..But C/C++ was great for me Pointers got me confused too, I have 3 books, and I read all the pointer stuff...and then I finally learned it :p

I have a tendency to work FAST, not wanting to waste 3 months of my life learning a simple computer language ... to me, thats a total waste.....

~Morph/Kanzure
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 16:33
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Sorry, but I grabbed the whole concept of variables and arrays and memblocks straight away. I don't know about pointers, I think I used them in VB but I don't know if that was what they were called. I had trouble with triganometry though, I only really grasped it when I started using it with DB. It's DB coding related so it might count.

cuRant PRogekt: a three-de map editer
Why the hell'd you ask me for crying out loud!?!
Athelon XP 1400 Plus - Nvidia Geforce MX400 - 256mb RAM
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Dave J
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 16:34 Edited at: 19th Jul 2003 16:36
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VB doesn't have pointers or at least I haven't heard of them and I know basically everything VB

I guess the real problem for me was that I didn't have a set course or procedure of learning things. I.e. I didn't have an ordered group of tutorials to get me started and through everything, instead I basically just picked up what I could from source code I downloaded lol.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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Kanzure
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 16:36
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I easily got variables because of my l33t math skills Arrays took about 1 book to learn / get it through my head, and pointers - ugh - like I said .. 3 books...

~Morph/Kanzure
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Dave J
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 16:46
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lol I don't see how variables are related to Math.

Arrays were actually really easy for me because their usefulness easily clicked when I learned about the For loop and how much time it can save. That's a personal fault of mine I think, if I don't understand what it can be used for or why you'd want it then I don't remember it and will never use it myself (even if I do come across a situation where it may be useful). lol, I'm a strange person.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 16:59
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Could you explain pointers? I want to know what they are. Anyway this is kind of how my VB code went...

adoRS.movefirst
while not adoRS.EOF
for each fldloop in adoRS.fields
debug.print fldloop
next fldloop
adoRS.movenext
wend

That is when dealing with fields in recordsets from databases. I thought that adoRS.movenext moved a pointer along ?

cuRant PRogekt: a three-de map editer
Why the hell'd you ask me for crying out loud!?!
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Kanzure
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 17:11
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Quote: "lol I don't see how variables are related to Math.

Arrays were actually really easy for me because their usefulness easily clicked when I learned about the For loop and how much time it can save. That's a personal fault of mine I think, if I don't understand what it can be used for or why you'd want it then I don't remember it and will never use it myself (even if I do come across a situation where it may be useful). lol, I'm a strange person."


Variables are in algebra. If your able to comprehend that in algebra letters/words can hold values, then your all set for variables.

Same with me, if I don't know how to use a command, its pointless unless I have a strange occourance of originality

~Morph/Kanzure
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Dave J
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 17:24
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Ahh, I never actually made that connection before. Despite programming on my TI-BASIC and using the algebraic characters in formulae as variables I never really considered them to be similar lol.

Quote: "Could you explain pointers? I want to know what they are"

Pointers are basically variables that hold a memory address. So if you accessed a pointer then you'd be accessing an address like: 0x18245e4, however if you dereferenced it then you could access the actual value held within that memory address which could be something more meaningful like "15". I think the 'movenext' in your example is just moving to the next cell in the table.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 17:39
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Yeah, it's moving to the next record in the recordset that I have loaded. I think it's similar to pointers as 'movenext' moves to the next memory slot in the recordset, it's kind of like moving to the next pointer I guess.

cuRant PRogekt: a three-de map editer
Why the hell'd you ask me for crying out loud!?!
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MikeS
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 19:41
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Lol, took me about a week to learn how to use functions with dbp.Well, it's my first language anyway .Usually I spend about an hour a day coding with dbp, and hour 3D
modeling/texturing/animating, 30minutes learning c++, and finally 15-30 minutes learning web languages. These times vary, on weekdays, and weekends, but I've pretty much set up a nice schedule for this summer, to increase productivity in my work.



Yellow:Wanna publish my game microsoft, cuz i no u rich so...Can I have my bag of money now?
Microsoft: *snicker* Tip of the month-Microsoft will never(probebly) publish your game.
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Kanzure
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 20:34
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Oh my, I don't even bother making a schedule - whatever I feel like doing I do

~Morph/Kanzure
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Rob K
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 21:31
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I remember when I first started Windows programming (with Delphi 1.x), I didn't know how to declare variables, so I stored all my string information in hidden text boxes all over the form.


BLUE GUI Plugin: http://blue.robert-knight.net
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MikeS
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 21:50
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Isn't it interesting how we all sorta tried to use another method that would make things even more complicated, then learning the proper way? I've done that so many times, it makes me laugh.



Yellow:Wanna publish my game microsoft, cuz i no u rich so...Can I have my bag of money now?
Microsoft: *snicker* Tip of the month-Microsoft will never(probebly) publish your game.
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Mattman
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 21:51
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Data and Read. Could never understand 'em. 2 Days ago i figuired 'em out!

---Mattman
DID YOU KNOW THAT ???
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Kanzure
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Posted: 19th Jul 2003 22:20
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Alot of times I do something a crappy way, only to find 2 months later a better way. By that time I'm too lazy to go in and fix it =\...

~Morph/Kanzure
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Dave J
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Posted: 20th Jul 2003 03:11
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Quote: "Oh my, I don't even bother making a schedule - whatever I feel like doing I do "

Same here, sometimes I'll program in Perl for 3 days straight then stop and won't do it again for weeks.

Quote: "I didn't know how to declare variables, so I stored all my string information in hidden text boxes all over the form.
"

Yeah, that's what I did as well lol!

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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andrew11
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Posted: 20th Jul 2003 04:24
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I used QBASIC before DB. I knew about arrays, variables, data, functions, and all the BASIC commands (well, for the most part). I learned completely from the built in help files, until I got to more advanced stuff.

"All programmers are playwrites and all computers are lousy actors" -Anon
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the_winch
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Posted: 20th Jul 2003 05:22
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Quote: "I remember when I first started Windows programming (with Delphi 1.x), I didn't know how to declare variables, so I stored all my string information in hidden text boxes all over the form."


I remember not knowing how to do global variables and using the same method when I first started oddly enough in delphi as well.
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adr
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Posted: 21st Jul 2003 18:48 Edited at: 21st Jul 2003 18:51
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too spooky

I didn't know how to declare variables, so I stored all my string information in hidden text boxes all over the form.
-------------------------------------
Yeah, that's what I did as well lol!

I did that as well. We were taught Delphi in 6th form too! (when I say taught, I mean given a book) ...

EDIT : forgot why I was gonna post in the first place... err - parameterised functions - they made my heat hurt for a while; "You mean this variable is now in that function? But why has its name changed?... What the hell do you mean 'passed by reference?'"

Bender:Blackmail’s such an ugly word. I prefer extortion. The x makes it sound cool.
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Ian T
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Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 03:01
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'However, I eventually found this one very short paragraph that explained it really well and suddenly they're my new best friend, hehe.'

That's what Arrays were like with me. Variables were the first concept of programming I grasped, before even how commands worked-- the very first thing I ever learned

--Mouse

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Xander
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Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 06:52
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Variables were easy, so were arrays, things like that. Nothing was really to hard for me. I still don't get memblocks though. Never looked into them. I'm sure if I looked at an example I would get it right away. Just too lazy.

My first game I tried to make was in QBasic. I really wanted to make a racing game. I remember that. I spent a couple weeks using lines, points, and fill commands to make a picture of a car. That is all the farther I got. I was about 10 years old. Didn't really get programming yet. I just wanted to be like my older brother so I tried making a game.

Then I tried Visual Basic. Totally confused me. Thought I would never program again

A couple years later I found out about Metal Basic for Macintosh. Made a couple games, Pong, an action arcade game that I spent 3 years on. Never quite finished it. No story line in the game.

Then I found Dark Basic. Yeah!!! Used the free demo for a month to convert Gadget Pong to Windows to give to my friends. I could not understand the sync stuff, so it didn't work on my friends computers, only mine because mine was slower.

A year later (this February) I finally bought Dark Basic, redid my Gadget Pong game (you can see it on Retro Games).

Now I am waiting for Dark Basic Pro to appear in my mailbox

Oops. I guess I didn't need to say all that. Oh well. I am not going to delete it all now. That would be a waste of time

Xander
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Kanzure
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Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 06:59
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Bolt, you think thats a waste of time?

Quote: "Okay, its a long list, but hey I like to brag ;. It all started back when I was a n00b...way back...

It all started in 2000, maybe 1999. At that time I was a pokémon freak newbie. I had no knowaladge of the internet, and what computers could really do. I had a GameBoy Color, a Nintendo 64, and GameSharks for both. It all started when I wanted more cheats for my GameShark on my GameBoy Color for my Pokemon Yellow game (maybe Red). So, what I did is I checked the manual, and I found that I can go to a website (I was thinking what the hell is that?!) to get more cheats. And so I did, and got some help from my parents. I didn't really go to the main gameshark website, but instead I ended up at the GameShark UBB. I didn't have a clue what a message board was, but yet I regestered and posted a few topics, and replied a few times. Soon enough I knew what a message board was and I knew alot of the people on the board. I made great friends their. Soon enough, I wanted to talk more with the people, and I learned of AOL Instant Messanger. I downloaded it somehow, and registered a screen name (CodeMaster007x2). I only had about 5 buddies from the board, but hey, I was a super newbie at the time pretty much. And then it hit me. I wanted my own website and mostly a message board! Being the n00b I was, I went straight to ezBoard where some of the members at the UBB had their message boards. I registered on ezBoard and got up my own board. I posted for a staff, and I got a good 2 people to help me out with it. Thats about when I started to learn very basic HTML. I had help from some people at that time, and I studied the HTML they put into the board for me. It was like a "wow..this guy knows some HTML" as if HTML was like a holy language, and even the people who knew it didn't know a tad about tables. So, once I learned a bit of HTML, it was summer time (2001). I went to this camp that taught alot about HTML and was able to make a website. A real one. (Of course, I copied 60% of the code of a site I really liked at the time.) And that was pretty much the end of my newbie days. After that, I got hosted at a place called CustomBB, which had php support. I didn't know what PHP was, but I learned it fast. After a while, I met this guy at a new school who knew about as much as me on the computer. Now, at that time, being in the grade I was, knowing as much about the computer as I did was very very rare. So after a while, me and my new best friend (currently owner of TeamRPG.net) we decided to make a new website. This one would be the best. Hahha..whatever. Anyways, we stole a layout from an old deleted website called Riachu's Power Plant, and I turned it into an Anime Site. Thats about how I learned good stuff about tables. Months and another summer pass, and I turn the site into an Anime RPG site. By a few weeks into the new school year, the site had about 130 members on it. I felt pretty good. On the side of my web development, I was learning many languages such as Perl, C, C++, and some very nice basic languages. I was pretty happy with it. Then, it came to me. A massive flood of newbies wanting to know how to create a site like mine. I decided instead of helping them with their own site, to code a portal system for absolute newbies. I called it mPort Normal Edition. A few months later I make MultiCode Software at http://multicode.net and I make that the home of mPort. I code alot more onto it, and make mPort Gold. It grew sorta popular, but not as much as my Anime site. At this time, I was spending so much time on mPort Gold, that the anime site grew dead. After a long long time, I deleted it. It was never seen again. In it's place I put another RPG, one I call The Fakémon Factory Online RPG. In this RPG, you can register and start off with a pokémon/fakémon and play around, training the monsters as you go along. The reason why I deleted the Anime site, is because I was starting to slowly fade out of the webdesinging. MultiCode was becoming dead too, and even the new fakémon site was dead-ish. So that pushed me intirely out of the webdesign, and I picked up more about microprocessors and microcontrollers. That brings me up to right about now, and I have absolutly no idea why I have a new site up. I feel its more of my retreat from the great big web development industry, more of an escape to express my self and share my knowladge of progeramming.... ( http://www.multi2k.net/kanzure )
"


now *thats* what I call a waste of time

~Morph/Kanzure
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Xander
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 05:37
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Holy Cow! Who wrote that? Pokemon? Never got into that. Just Magic, Yo-Yoing, Hacky Sack and some other hobbies. I still like to yo-yo once in a while, I still hacky sack with my friends at school, and I still have all my Magic cards (except the ones I sold to get money for a video card and Dark Basic Classic

Oops, kind of off topic

Hey! This kind of looks like me >
...except I have hair. Just the glasses are the same.

Oh yeah, um programming woes. Hmm. I still haven't looked at memblocks yet...

Xander
Bolt of Bolt Software Productions
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Mattman
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 05:48
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i bought enhance but rarely use memblocks. As a mattere of fact, i only used it to see what they do

---Mattman
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Kanzure
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 05:53
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I wrote it ! Talk about wasting time, eh?

~Morph/Kanzure
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