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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / DBP for machinima

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Steverino
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Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 05:05
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Is anyone using DB for machinima? "Machinima" is the questionably-spelled term for using game engines to make scripted, non-interactive real-time movies.

I've been snooping around http://www.machinima.com lately, and it seems like for all the work that goes into getting the Quake or Half-Life engine to do something it wasn't really designed for, it would be a lot easier to simply write your movies as a Dark Basic program. You'd have total control. Plus, that way you can distribute it as MyMovie.exe, and folks don't need to have a particular game installed just to watch it. Only DirectX, which basically everyone has already. Machinima.com is full of blurry little quicktimes (that are still 25 MB downloads) because that's the only way a reasonable percentage of the audience can see the stuff!

I have two modest suggestions:

1) The next competition should be to see who can use DB to make the best machinima movie, and

2) The Game Creators (formerly DBS) are uniquely positioned to produce a full-featured Machinima Production Studio. I gather that this is something of a Holy Grail in machinima circles, and I think it could potentially be a product of much wider appeal than the First Person Shooter Creator mentioned in Newsletter 7.
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Shadow Robert
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Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 07:09
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personally i think the whole art known as "Machinima" is just questionable really.
especially as the meaning has changed around 10x in the past decade... Machinima 10years ago was a process in which you used to create movie animations using effects which could be translated and blended into the gameplay. (FFXI movies a good example)
then it became a case of skeletal animation scripted features and ingame cutscenes...

now its just... oh forget it i give up on whatever the hell they wanna call it.

7th Day Project was originally a Game Engine based Movie (technically the description of Machinima you've just given) ... however it was dubbed a RTCG (RealTime Computer Generated) Movie.
the only difference between my RealTime engine which became known as Luma and the LumaRender Engine is that one uses realtime tricks and effects, whereas the other uses the processor&gpu to be non specific allowing it to work on ALL systems but slower.

There is no difference between scripting it for the realtime engine or for the render engine ... they both produce almost identical results which can be tweaked.
The only REAL difference is the Luma Engine requires specific hardware and alot of power to run ... the Luma Render Engine does not, it'll export to any system (and on any system) to be viewed back in a video format of compilation.

personally i think all the term of Machinima is really a pure waste of time and effort.

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Steverino
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Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 15:28
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The idea of being able to sit at your computer and make a movie seems just as compelling as being able to make your own game. The fact that the machinima scene currently seems a little pretentious and inept doesn't take away from the appeal of that basic concept.

I would think a tool that made machinima easy would find an audience. While my commercial instincts should probably not be trusted, I've heard that the people behind The Sims are thinking of adding a machinima feature, and if anyone can identify a viable market, it's them.

It's like Orson Welles said after making Citizen Kane at age 25, "A movie studio is the best toy a boy ever had."

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BatVink
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Joined: 4th Apr 2003
Location: Gods own County, UK
Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 20:33
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I'm using DB for a machinima style project. The commercial use came first, the idea rolled out afterwards.

I'll update you with details if and when it gets to the next step. I have the AI system coded. The camera and it's movement is coded, and this is the bit that the whole system hangs around. Most people see the camera as just a screen, my machinima "engine" will use the camera to the max.

Thanks in advance.
All the Best,
StevieVee
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 23:03
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well TR is made for Machinima and infact alot of levele develops use it all the time to script out the ingame cutscene as you generally have a cutscene thing for information in level then you go onto creating an entire world and animation just for a cutscene in an non-interactive section.

but really when you get into it like the Machinima people want you to, just seems like a waste of time over a pre-rendered movie.
although i like the idea of being able to view a movie at any given angle (which was one of the original 7dp concepts) ... alot of those people believe that it should be all prescripted.

so what the difference between that and a prerender is the system you need to run and the level of detail your machine can handle - kinda makes it seem moot no?

though TheSims with cutscene scripters would be cool i love that series

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lcfcfan
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Location: North East, UK
Posted: 22nd Jul 2003 23:17
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mmmm steverino i like the sound of that might have a go at making my own dbp movie!

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wednesday
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 04:52
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I personally don't think machinima is a waste of time, and it may well be a forerunner of how movies are made in the future.

Lucasfilm apparently use the unreal engine to help prototype scenes from their movies.

In any case the gap between real-time and pre-rendered artwork is diminishing, although it's impossible to tell at this point in time whether they will eventually converge.

I don't think the idea of having the audience control camera angles is a wise idea, though. One of the best things about Citizen Kane was the impeccably controlled composition, in my opinion.
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indi
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 06:29
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I have ten placable camera waypoints for in game movie flybys, thats about the extent of DT having any machima

http://www.lunarpixel.com
http://www.lunarpixel.com/dt/
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Steverino
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 08:14
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I'm glad to hear there's some interest at least.

If anyone does happen to churn out a DBP-made movie in the next month and a half, there's the Machinima Film Festival 2003 in New York in late October. Entry deadline: September 15. It costs ten bucks to enter, but hey, you could win a statuette!

I'd like to see someone try this just to show those guys what DBP can do. lcfcfan?

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ZomBfied
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2003 21:34
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I always thought Machinema just meant "movie using a real time engine on a pc" In other words, not pre-rendered. I would love to do that if only I had more time...

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