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FPSC Classic Product Chat / [LOCKED] half life remake?

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wizard of id
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 08:24
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Quote: "Roger Wilco: I never claimed to be better at level design than anyone and I am sure that Wiz is better at 3D level design that I am - which I also clearly stated. The discussion wasn't on that subject anyway (it was about the Source engine and its downfalls) and I never posted my info to prove anything on my 3D level design expertise. Wiz simply asked for it so I answered strait up. No more, no less."


Quote: "In regards to the "who's better"-debate; no offense, but I must say that mobile phone games pale in comparsion to the level designs Wizard has shown us the past couple of years, and it also proves that a person outside of the industry may very well have the experience and feel for designing. Sure, working with big game companies might grant you experiences in teamwork, pushing to meet deadlines, etc. It doesn't automatically make you better than everyone else at what you´re doing, though."


I'm staying out of this one.But I must add that I lolled when I saw
the post about mobile games and decided to stay out of it before I get really stuck into Scurvy Lobster and pick him apart or him me
who knows...

And yes some people believe source engines sucks others believe even with it faults is better than most

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Scurvy Lobster
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 11:27 Edited at: 28th Jun 2009 11:42
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Source is a very capable engine and great games have been made with it but as I stated earlier the tools for the engine are not exactly user friendly and slow down your development process. Hammer as a world editor is ok at best compared to the competition (it hasn't had any real updates for years) and then there's the whole story on the need for loads of command line tools and scripting even to get basic importing working. When talking about Source it is important to know the difference between "Source" the engine and its tools set. Since tools are what makes a game development process work (in my opinion) I dislike the Source engine. You can't really avoid them

If you are making a HL2 mod with only HL2 assets then Source is a fine choice - the best choice obviously. If you want to make something special that is unrelated to HL and with custom content then I highly suggest you look elsewhere. UT3 engine looks like it has nice and modern tools but I have no firsthand experience with that engine. There is however a reason why UT3 engine is used for pretty much any AAA level game (including the BioShock, Gears of War and Mass Effect series) today in the game industry compared to the Source engine that is practically only being used by Valve itself. Several of the few non-Valve games made with Source were released years ago.

To sum it all up: Source is great (and overall better than FPSC, no doubt on that) - but there are game engines far greater out there. Source was cool back in 2004 when HL2 was released. Today most people should look elsewhere for a game engine.

btw. One of my favorite games of all time, Portal, was made with Source. I mean it when I say it can be used to make great games

Running my latest game superbly on FPSC and Project Blue Mod.
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Deathead
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 11:47
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Quote: "(including the BioShock, Gears of War and Mass Effect series) "

Yeah, UT3 is a great engine. But bare in mind UT3 came out 2006, whereas Source came out in 2003, and also UT3 itself is a brand new completely re-written engine, source however is just a very heavily modified version of GoldSrc.

The best thing about UT3, is that it's practically idiot proof, you can import objects easily, create shaders using a node to node basis, and it gives you a very smooth and easy to use cinematic creator, which can be altered to make pretty much anything.



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seth zer0
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 12:23 Edited at: 28th Jun 2009 12:25
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Unreal engine 3 wins end of dissuasion....lol let go back to fps creator/X10 now sense that what every one has here(not saying no one has anything else..)

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Aertic
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 14:06 Edited at: 28th Jun 2009 14:07
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Quote: "Unreal engine 3 wins end of dissuasion"



Cry-Engine 2 is truly the beast of gaming!
/Realism Fan Boy...

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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 17:32
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To sum up FPSC X9 is totally capable of re producing HL1 in the right hands.

HL2 raised the bar a lot and FPSC X10 might not be able to make games of that standard yet but is a much better development tool than is provided with Source.

Seeing as very few people have their own games company with tons of people to throw at a project I would much rather be able to make a very good game with FPSC X10 by myself than nothing with Source.

FPSC X9 and X10 are very competitive engines and for the price are the best you can get. The fact you can make something with FPSC that is even comparable with AAA £250,000 game engines is a miracle.

If Source or UE3 had such great tools you would see indie developed demos coming out on forums like we do here but you don't. Their only usable by teams of programmers and professionals which is the angle you need to consider when talking about how incredible FPSC is.
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RedneckRambo
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 20:41
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Quote: "To sum up FPSC X9 is totally capable of re producing HL1 in the right hands."

It might be possible with an entire developing team. It certainly isn't "totally capable" as Nomad puts it. But there is a very slight chance it could be done. It definitely will not make anything above that though.

The price for FPSC is fantastic. That does not make it a good engine though. It just makes it well worth its cost.
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Roger Wilco
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 22:50
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Quote: "The price for FPSC is fantastic. That does not make it a good engine though. It just makes it well worth its cost."


Well said.
It's a decent engine with a nice, easy-to-use map editor. The lightmapper can be tweaked to produce some very impressive results.

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 23:24
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Agreed, but many of the environments in HL1 are too big to be reproduced...especially the intro, or Xen...

"Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day. Give a man a fishing rod, and he'll break it up into firewood...or swap it for a fish."
-Frankie Boyle, on Mock the Week
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Roger Wilco
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 23:35
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Yeah. The levels would have to be split up into segments by levels, and the resulting loading times would most likely be unbearable...

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Coach Shogun 20
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 23:42
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@Matuka:If you're going graphics-wise, then yes Cryengine 2 wins. Tools, I've heard are easy to use as well. However, if you're going by performance, forget it. Crysis takes a powerful (more powerful then most casual gamers own) rig to run on a decent level. That's why most devs go for UT3 instead, plus the price is massive I've heard. Cryengine 3 would be a better choice for a developer, once its out, since it provides support for console ports and is highly optimized.

(I love how this one topic has about 15 unrelated, subtopics going on here. lol)

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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 28th Jun 2009 23:47
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@Roger wilco

Yeh, the thing about HL1 was that it was fluid, with minimal loading times, (or at least, for me), and that's impossible in FPSC...

Like I said, check out Black Mesa Source.

"Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day. Give a man a fishing rod, and he'll break it up into firewood...or swap it for a fish."
-Frankie Boyle, on Mock the Week
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dark coder
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 17:42
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Quote: "To sum up FPSC X9 is totally capable of re producing HL1 in the right hands."


Evidence?

Quote: "HL2 raised the bar a lot and FPSC X10 might not be able to make games of that standard yet but is a much better development tool than is provided with Source."


Better tools? What, evidence?

Quote: "FPSC X9 and X10 are very competitive engines and for the price are the best you can get. The fact you can make something with FPSC that is even comparable with AAA £250,000 game engines is a miracle."


Fact??? If you consider a Ferrari to be comparable to a Morris Miner without any wheels then yes.

Quote: "If Source or UE3 had such great tools you would see indie developed demos coming out on forums like we do here but you don't. Their only usable by teams of programmers and professionals which is the angle you need to consider when talking about how incredible FPSC is."


Ever heard of a mod? There are extensive amounts of mods for probably all AAA game engines used for games like HL2, UT3, Crysis etc. Small teams and even lone developers manage to produce great work some of the time and I wouldn't consider the distinction between FPSC/X10 dev and modding such aforementioned games to be very big.

All of your posts just scream FPSC fanboy and are filled with so much conjecture and baseless claims that I doubt your posts even make sense to you. If you think FPSC can make HL1 or better then show us, simply saying it can doesn't mean squat.

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Opposing force
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 18:08
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FPSC cannot recreate Half Life unless you do some serious modding to the source code. Even if you do all that you've got to ask yourself, is it really worth spending so much time doing it? The Gold Source engine may be over over 10 years old but it is still more versatile than FPS Creator. You can literally make any type of game using this engine with a lot of additional programming. For a start, Half Life's AI is a lot better than FPS Creator's AI. You just don't get the same gaming experience when you play a game made in FPSC. Also, Half Life is full of so many scripted events that FPSC would struggle to mimic. The tram ride at the beginning could possibly be done in FPSC if you use a Tram model following a waypoint but that's just a small part of the wider challenge. Half Life also has Particles, gibs, hitboxes, scripted weapons, water etc. One day, this might all be possible in FPSC, who knows.
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wizard of id
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 19:02
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Quote: "Also, Half Life is full of so many scripted events that FPSC would struggle to mimic. The tram ride at the beginning could possibly be done in FPSC if you use a Tram model following a waypoint but that's just a small part of the wider challenge. Half Life also has Particles, gibs, hitboxes, scripted weapons, water etc. One day, this might all be possible in FPSC, who knows."


About the tram level will all be possible with Airmod SE I can't say more than that but that the new added feature will make it possible and it is seriously simple as you can pause for a given time moving up and down on the tram tracks with ease and the best part it will only be a single script...

There are more features that will allow this to happen but I can't say any thing about what the new features are what they do as these are my Beta license agreement for testing Airmod Se

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djmaster
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 19:21
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The tram can be easily done,set the platform script to your tram model and disabling collision for the rails and you are set.

[href]http://chargedstudios.netne.net/index.htm[href]
"Im British you muppet!"-Psycho
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Aaagreen
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 19:55
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Dynamic objects have box collision, so it would be impossible to have the moving tram as one entity.


http://www.moddb.com/mods/torn
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 20:48 Edited at: 29th Jun 2009 20:49
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Particles are possible with Airmod, I haven't told anyone yet, but try using the BloodSpurt scripting command. If you change the decal, and set it an an invisible box set tol be a character, it works...

I used it to make a plasma venting effect, by having it spawn the Sprite Pack One PlasmaBall...

-=EDIT=-

With Ply's Mod, you can remove player collision, I'm sure with a fair amount of scripting, the tram'd be possible...

"Give a man a fish, and he'll eat for a day. Give a man a fishing rod, and he'll break it up into firewood...or swap it for a fish."
-Frankie Boyle, on Mock the Week
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Aaagreen
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 20:53
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You could separate the tram in to meshes that all follow the same waypoint. If the models fit eachother perfectly then you'll have a working tram.


http://www.moddb.com/mods/torn
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djmaster
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Posted: 29th Jun 2009 20:55
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Yep,exactly.Im planning a HL2/CRYSIS inspired project with big city so keep a look on the Work in Progress board.How will I do it? Making my own lowpoly models and Project Blue.

[href]http://chargedstudios.netne.net/index.htm[href]
"Im British you muppet!"-Psycho
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ASTECH
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Posted: 30th Jun 2009 16:57
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Quote: "FPSC is not capable of creating a game like Half Life 1 leave alone anything more advanced."


WRONG.

You guys just love bashing FPSC don't you?

Similar Xen and the intro to the game, CAN be pulled off.
You have to learn how to "elevate and curve". That's a great
tactic to making great use of the FPSC grid. Not, I'm not saying its a bright idea to try and go all out and do those two sections... but shoot. One could easily mock the The Black Mesa sections of the game, NO DOUBT. So, don't just mock the game and
say it can't to anything like Half-Life 1. Because you are wrong.
And, it doesn't take very skilled people to pull it off. You just
need a little resource and a big imagination.

-Indestructible-

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Benjamin
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Posted: 30th Jun 2009 17:11 Edited at: 30th Jun 2009 17:12
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Quote: "Because you are wrong."

Unless you can prove it, we won't believe it.

Multisync - TCP Server/Client Multiplayer Plugin (DBP/DBCe)
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Aertic
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Posted: 30th Jun 2009 18:05
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@Aztek,
Your right unlike others of whom are bashing FPSCreator are completely wrong, FPSCreator does not require skill, only imagination and resources that'll help aid(Friends & Family)...

@Benjamin,
Concured...

If you're gonna call BS, post a link to prove it(Or something that'll prove it... x3).

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wizard of id
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Posted: 30th Jun 2009 19:19
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Quote: "Your right unlike others of whom are bashing FPSCreator are completely wrong, FPSCreator does not require skill, only imagination and resources that'll help aid(Friends & Family)..."


Quote: "FPSCreator does not require skill"
Yip if you are going to create the same 4 x 4 room with no light mapping and then asking what are entities and what do they do ....

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djmaster
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 11:03
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Making Half Life is completely possible in FPSC with some help from a mod like Project Blue.THE END.

[href]http://chargedstudios.netne.net/index.htm[href]
"Im British you muppet!"-Psycho
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Mr Bigglesworth
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 20:12 Edited at: 1st Jul 2009 20:17
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I believe you can make parts of half-life 1 in FPSC, things like the creature in the blast pit, it can't see it can only hear. Another thing is the flying helicopter that drops off troops every 1-2 minutes in the outside level. While parts of hl1 is recreatable in FPSC, some are not, without a mod that is. If you modded the source code yourself, and added more features and functionality, or you completely rewrite the source from scratch, you could make hl1 or hl2 for that matter, you could make anything, it just how you mod the source. But, in stock FPSC not all of hl1 is possible, but some parts are.

Quote: "Making Half Life is completely possible in FPSC with some help from a mod like Project Blue.THE END."


In a way, project blue would do miracles with outdoor environments, and large amounts of enemys, while ply's mod would be useful for scripting. In stock FPSC, I can't see all of hl1 possible, only parts, while with a mod, more is possible. But if you created your own mod which adds features like more AI commands, script commands for AI to not only see but hear as well, particle effects, water, and more general functionality, you could remake hl1.

Quote: Is there something wrong with having a personal opinion?

Only in a forum where people are gonna tear you apart for the fun of it.
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 20:45
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Quote: "things like the creature in the blast pit, it can't see it can only hear. Another thing is the flying helicopter that drops off troops every 1-2 minutes in the outside level."


There are actually script commands like NOISEHEARD that use hearing for AI...

The helicopter would also be quite easy to do...

If we're all God's Children, then what's so special about Jesus?
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djmaster
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 20:48
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So I dont see why cant it be recreated.Please stop the sillyness as its official:

HALF LIFE RECREATION IS POSSIBLE IN FPSC WITH SOURCE MODIFICATION!

[href]http://chargedstudios.netne.net/index.htm[href]
"Im British you muppet!"-Psycho
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Benjamin
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 21:34 Edited at: 1st Jul 2009 21:39
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Quote: "HALF LIFE RECREATION IS POSSIBLE IN FPSC WITH SOURCE MODIFICATION!"

Of course, if you do enough 'modification' to completely rewrite every aspect of the engine, then any game is possible. But we're not talking about that, we're talking about the standard un-modified version.

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dark coder
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 21:49
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But if it requires source modification to do, then it isn't possible in FPSC. Counting source modification as still being FPSC is stupid because there's almost no limit to what you can change, I could rewrite so much of the code that all it does is monitor my CPU temperature. Does this mean FPSC can do this? Of course not, it just means I'm capable of coding this and I started off using the FPSC source.

It's like saying that your car can fly to the moon, you then strip out all the parts so only the glove box is left and you add a space shuttle and the rockets to it and still call it your original car.

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djmaster
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 22:02
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You can even recreate it Project Blue which is limited to what it has.

[href]http://chargedstudios.netne.net/index.htm[href]
"Im British you muppet!"-Psycho
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CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 1st Jul 2009 22:24
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Go on then, prove it, make a wip thread, it's the only way to end this argument...

If we're all God's Children, then what's so special about Jesus?
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Gibba gobba
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2009 01:52 Edited at: 30th Aug 2017 21:30
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Mr Bigglesworth
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2009 03:05
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This thread is becoming a pointless rant.

Quote: Is there something wrong with having a personal opinion?

Only in a forum where people are gonna tear you apart for the fun of it.
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djmaster
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2009 09:11
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CoffeGruns: I cant do it cause im not that advanced but I believe someone like Kravenwolf could do it,or rolfy.

[href]http://chargedstudios.netne.net/index.htm[href]
"Im British you muppet!"-Psycho
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Scurvy Lobster
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2009 11:04
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But then again: who cares about making a game that has already been made back in '99? Pretty pointless to begin with

Oh yes, this has really off-tracked

Running my latest game superbly on FPSC and Project Blue Mod.
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Mr Bigglesworth
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Posted: 2nd Jul 2009 22:47
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Why remake a famous game when you could create your own?

Quote: Is there something wrong with having a personal opinion?

Only in a forum where people are gonna tear you apart for the fun of it.
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