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Program Announcements / Dbpro project editor and compiler

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the_winch
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 01:27
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It basically just has the ability to edit .dbpro and compile projects.

It's written in visual basic 4.0 and all the routines are in a module file so if you want to see how it works and you don't have vb just open the .bas file in notepad.

It also has the added bonus that it fixes the problem of step through mode not working in patch 5 for people who want to use step through mode.

Future versions will have better media file adding than the standard ide which is mostly the reason I made it.

All you people that said they would make an ide if they knew how to work the compiler you have no excuse no go and make one

Download here
http://winch.8bit.co.uk/db/proedit.htm

You can do what you want with the source/exe but make sure you bakup your projects before you use it just in case.
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Mattman
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 05:53
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.bas files can be read by DarkEDIT btw (just wanted to chime in)

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing --- A new brand of Racing --- Only from Nightwatch Studios
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TDK_Man
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 11:44
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Could be interesting - I'll take a look!

This is what I have at the moment...



TDK

MatEdit Pro Info & Progress Reports: http://www.matedit.com
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Rob K
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 16:18
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@TDK_Man

What tool are you using for syntax highlighting or is it a custom component?

In addition, what language is it written in?

Given the unfortunate situation with RGT, I think it would be nice to have a new, open source editor, probably written in VB as most of us seem to have a copy.

Can you possibly change the window system for a tabs one in yours or list the windows as tabs at the top, as from using the Blitz IDE, I find that a far easier way to navigate between documents than using a window.


BLUE GUI Plugin: http://blue.robert-knight.net
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Hubdule
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 16:33
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It seems that everybody posts some screens of their IDE these days Here are my two screens to look at:



and

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Preston C
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 17:14
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Quote: "Given the unfortunate situation with RGT, I think it would be nice to have a new, open source editor, probably written in VB as most of us seem to have a copy.
"


...

NOOOOOOOOO!!!! I'M ALONE!!!

Yep, dont have a copy of visual basic. Where could I get one? I wouldnt mind learning Visual Basic, the more languages I attempt to learn, the better

@Hubdule: Coolest IDE i've seen yet, but whats with the duck buttons?
Considering the dark basic pyramid, how bout some egyptian like buttons? That'd look cool.

Well, great to know that once I get Dark Basic Pro, I'll have plenty of things to look forward to (U5, new IDE, etc)



Hell Begins September 2nd at 7:30 AM. Yep, schools starting soon.
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Mattman
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 17:48
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I started to learn VB, i hated it!!!

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing --- A new brand of Racing --- Only from Nightwatch Studios
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David T
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 22:11
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I started to learn VB, i hated it!!!

Why? When you know basic vb sort of clicks into place. The OOP nature of it is great.

Theres no place like 127.0.0.1
There are 10 people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Bus station = where bus stops. Train station = where train stops. Workstation = ?
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Mattman
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 22:13
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Well, I hated the visual part of it, i like standerd programing.

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing --- A new brand of Racing --- Only from Nightwatch Studios
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David T
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Posted: 30th Aug 2003 22:45 Edited at: 30th Aug 2003 22:47
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The visual part was awful? That's the bit I find best - no fiddling trying to copy windows function when you can just draw a button and away we go

Here's my go. Only been at it a few hours. It may be simple but it compiles which is more than I deserve




However it's this I like:



Theres no place like 127.0.0.1
There are 10 people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Bus station = where bus stops. Train station = where train stops. Workstation = ?
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the_winch
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Posted: 31st Aug 2003 03:31
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Good to see there are a few ide alternatives in the making.
Perhaps now we can have an ide that is up to the standard of the rest of the language.

I updated it a little and you can now add and remove media from projects more easerly than with the ide.
http://winch.8bit.co.uk/db/proedit.htm
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Mattman
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Posted: 31st Aug 2003 03:56
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I just started Java and i learned more about OOP and it is making sense, that would have helped to.

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing --- A new brand of Racing --- Only from Nightwatch Studios
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Dave J
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Posted: 31st Aug 2003 07:47
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Beautiful David, that's exactly what I wanted to see

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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David T
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Posted: 31st Aug 2003 18:57
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Thanks exeat. I decided to go with a more neutral colour scheme rather than the slighly gaudy birght blue ones nad so I settled on dark blue for keywords, no embolden.

I've updated it too, added tabs, mdi and the like.

I'll start another topic if I show any more screens.

Theres no place like 127.0.0.1
There are 10 people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Bus station = where bus stops. Train station = where train stops. Workstation = ?
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Dostej
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Posted: 4th Sep 2003 11:21
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Is there any doc about what u have to pass to the compiler to make an ide?

www.dbpro.ionichost.com
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David T
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Posted: 4th Sep 2003 21:03
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jus tthe path of a .dbpro file, that's all I think.

type this is and compile:

print cl$() : `not sure - I think it's cl$()
wait key

then replace dbpcompiler.exe (backup!) with your exe and compile nad voila your command line params.

Theres no place like 127.0.0.1
There are 10 people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Bus station = where bus stops. Train station = where train stops. Workstation = ?
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 5th Sep 2003 06:41
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lol... 1001 DBPro Editors are being developed, question is are any going to actually be any good.
over at PureBasic they have the same kinda thing, funny thing is the classic PureBasic IDE is still the most preffered

i think really what has to happen with all of these IDEs being developed is rather than thinking about what would be nice and the visuals, actually find out from the users what is wanted.

because personally i use a copy of Ciyanna i made in C++ like a year ago, isn't as complex as MSIDE but is pretty close in setup which i personally find nice to use - but other users might not.
It would be an idea to get some text versions out there before you start adding all the 6,000 bells and whilsts to find out if people like the layout, what they'd like to see improved, and such.

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BlackStone
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Posted: 5th Sep 2003 08:47
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You dont want to start with Visual Basic, there are better languages. Try Delphi, I use delphi 5 with most of my non-darkbasic coding.

Or you could always start with Java, free IDE and you can easily find help for commands if you search the Sun page right.

java.sun.com

trust me, no vb.

-Does Asberger Syndrome make a genious or is it coincidence that geniouses have Asberger?
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Mattman
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Posted: 5th Sep 2003 16:29
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vb stinks! i hate it hate it hate it! im learning Java and flash now

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing --- A new brand of Racing --- Only from Nightwatch Studios

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the_winch
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Posted: 5th Sep 2003 23:21
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I much prefer delphi to visual basic. I only used vb for this as it is very simple for everybody to see what it does. It would be pointless doing it in c++ as not so many people would be able to understand it plus writeing vb programs is quick.

It would be fairly simple to expand on the code to make a simple ide but I get bored too quickly and tend to move on to other projects before I finish.

@ raven If you already have a working alternative why don't you release it? A lot of people would be gratefull for an alternative to the standard ide.

Right now I think I might move on to a pre-processor type program that will intercept the source before the compiler and tell you if it contains any undeclaired variables.
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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 7th Sep 2003 08:26
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Quote: "raven If you already have a working alternative why don't you release it? A lot of people would be gratefull for an alternative to the standard ide."


it was a personal present, from me to me
sides no one who tested it liked it much "too much like msvc++" i kept hearing... you guys seem to have the Editor situation well under control anyway, i keep my editor personal you all have shiney new editors.

tell ya what though, if no one actually releases thier editors within the next month i'll upload and make my personal editor available to everyone.
its nothing fancy though, just made it cause i couldn'y figure out howto make a plugin for MSDev98 lol

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CloseToPerfect
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Posted: 7th Sep 2003 09:39
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Here's the one I use, I like the folder tabs, but it's not a ide just a editor as thats all I need simple and sweet. I love multiple files being open at the same time.

CTP

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David T
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Posted: 7th Sep 2003 15:28
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Quote: "vb stinks! i hate it hate it hate it! im learning Java and flash now"



VB does not stink. Your VB skills stink.

Theres no place like 127.0.0.1
There are 10 people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Bus station = where bus stops. Train station = where train stops. Workstation = ?
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Dave J
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Posted: 7th Sep 2003 16:47
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VB is about the easiest language you can come across, I would even go as far as to say it's much easier then DBP. How hard is it to stick a couple buttons on the form and then have VB write 90% of the code for you?

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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David T
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Posted: 7th Sep 2003 16:50
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Quote: "VB is about the easiest language you can come across, I would even go as far as to say it's much easier then DBP. How hard is it to stick a couple buttons on the form and then have VB write 90% of the code for you?"


You're right, VB is very easy. In terms of app development it's much easier than DBP.

Theres no place like 127.0.0.1
There are 10 people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't
Bus station = where bus stops. Train station = where train stops. Workstation = ?
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Mattman
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Posted: 7th Sep 2003 17:02 Edited at: 7th Sep 2003 17:03
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vb in my opinion is a horrible language.

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing --- A new brand of Racing --- Only from Nightwatch Studios
"hey, it's tomorrow" --- Hamish
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BlackStone
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Posted: 8th Sep 2003 08:14
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Quote: "VB is about the easiest language you can come across, I would even go as far as to say it's much easier then DBP. How hard is it to stick a couple buttons on the form and then have VB write 90% of the code for you?"


Its just that, it's the easiest language you can come across. I tried to port over a database program for a company to a new access database and VB wasn't very willing to let me execute half the database commands we were using.

As for making games, yeah vb has it's own personal direct-x library but thats because it's Microsoft.

I do like the visual editors myself though but delphi and many other ide's have the same deal, which is why I use NetBeans for my java programming.

-Does Asberger Syndrome make a genious or is it coincidence that geniouses have Asberger?
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Guyon
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Posted: 11th Sep 2003 08:31 Edited at: 11th Sep 2003 08:33
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BlackStone,

After I learned VB. I found out about Delphi and really liked it. I hardly even touch VB anymore.

I also bought builder last year but strangely enough, I think Delphi is faster than builder.


Thanks guys for working on a better IDE!!!!!
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Dave J
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Posted: 11th Sep 2003 09:49
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I have Delphi 6 which looks just like VB 3.0 so I never really explored into it much but if I ever have a spare holiday and am looking for something to do I might try it out some more.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 11th Sep 2003 22:22
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I think a really good feature is to have an option to store variables (such as frame rate) in the program to a text file, and have them available in the IDE after execution. It'd make it a lot easier.

Brains are for idiots.

Athelon XP 1400 Plus - Nvidia Geforce MX400 - 256mb RAM
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ZomBfied
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Posted: 12th Sep 2003 01:14
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VB kicks ass. I have never heard a supportable reason to think otherwise. For dev time it rules, for ease of use and debugging there's nothing like it and as far as final exe speed there's really not much if any disadvantage there.

The only thing I can think of that's wrong with it is you are stuck with windows.
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Dreamora
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Posted: 13th Sep 2003 15:31
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and you are stuck with the VB Runtime files which are needed

Speed depends on the Version:

V5 is much slower than VC++
V6 is getting near to VC++ in most cases
VB.NET is similar as VC.NET, they have the same compiler
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Hubdule
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Posted: 13th Sep 2003 19:18
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Most Windows versions include the VB6 runtimes and you can't tell me that you want to use Win95 with DBPro

And even if you include the needed runtimes for VB6 then your package is 1MB bigger. If you use .NET you have to inlude around 40MB runtimes for current WinX versions. As for the speed if it: You should say that all .Net languages have the same (slow) speed with its "managed" code
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Dave J
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Posted: 15th Sep 2003 16:32
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Quote: "and you are stuck with the VB Runtime files which are needed "

You can include just the OCX files that you used, which is usually only the standard COMCTL32.OCX - only 500kb. This saves having to include the whole runtime download.

As Hubdule said though, VB.Net is a little different and you need a 40MB .NET Framework for it to run any .Net program. What makes this worse is that small apps which is what VB is most used for, don't usually take up more then a meg.

If anyone finds a solution to this .Net problem I'd love to hear it, because it's really a pain in the ass. I wish there was a way to just include nescessary files like VB6.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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Dreamora
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Install Win2k3 server *gggg*
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Shadow Robert
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personally i find VB just alittle too much... sorry but C with the WinAPI is far easier for me, if i need to visually create the resources then Visual C++

as for speed, myself and puffy ran some speed tests between Visual C++ 6.0 and 7.0 against Visual Basic 6.0 and 7.0 using the DirectX APIs ... in both cases Visual C++ was over 3,000fps faster, this was on pretty fast machines but still - when you break it down thats an increase of 300%.
Visual C# was certainly alot faster than Visual Basic, however still was very lacking in speed comparied to Visual C++

its the OOP overhangs, C++ really isn't a truely OOP language ... although it has the upgrade of OO over C, it still isn't a TRUE OO platform like Visual Basic 7.0 or Visual C# 1.0
And Visual Basic 5.0 and 6.0 are really just a joke when it comes to almost anything ... they're application developers they have DirectX support NOT to create games, but because WindowsME/Windows2000/WindowsXP/Windows Server 200x ALL use DirectX as the primary hardware layers. Which means if you want access to all of the systems resources particularly media based you NEED DirectX.

anyone who wants to develop games or 3d development packages with anything other than C/C++/Pascal using OpenGL or DirectX really needs thier head examined because the overhead in the other language is just too great and will cut off alot of topend speed which is nessisary for alot of operations.

just imagine if someone suggest developing HL2 in Visual Basic, after the programmers got up off the floor i'm sure they'll try and explain to you why its just not a sane option.

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Hubdule
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Posted: 17th Sep 2003 10:00 Edited at: 17th Sep 2003 10:03
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@Dreamflower ... come on. 1.A normal home user won't buy W2003Server 2. Don't tell me you bought it for 650€ ! 3. The .Net Framework is only interesting with upcomming windows versions but not yet (maybe only if you do a commercial piece of sw where you include the framework on the CD !!!) 4. We're talking about "hobby" game programming so don't expect someone to have W2003Server !!!

@Raven ... VB6 is definitly slower then VC++ 6, don't think there's such a difference in V7 of both. But who cares about speed of VB progs. as the majority of users have PC's from 1000MHz upwards. The time of slower 500MHz machines is over (if you think of games on PC and also games programming). For a simple app it shouldn't make that much difference if it runs on a 800MHz or a 2100MHz CPU. The program would always be faster then you can type

VB6 is not too bad for making games but I don't think that you'll see any commercial game production made with VB6. Oh and btw you can't compare HL2 made with VB6 and Cxxx as the current version (with all details on) is only meant for highend machines So you'll need a rather new gfx card to enjoy the game.

But back to VB for using it to create an editor. I think it's possibble with a well thought out framework and some extensions to create a nice editor for DBPro. And in the end it doesn't make a difference what you used to create it as long as it works well (some use VB, others C++ and others Visual Fox Pro ) Can't understand why there are so many people moaning about an editor made with VB as it's just another programming language. Can't hear all the debates anymore about "This is better than that and mine is faster then yours." What really counts is the result and sorry that I say that. Currently we haven't seen anything from Dreamflower nor from Raven so can't say if this debate is just hot air and nothing more. (No I don't want to start another debate about "I know everything and I don't need to prove anything")
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WoW is WOW
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Posted: 17th Sep 2003 11:02
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I want to make my own editor, but I don't know vb!
I'm wondering, if I could use DBP
RPG_Freak
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Preston C
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Posted: 18th Sep 2003 02:20
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Yeah, you can make an editor in Dark Basic Pro, it would just be Video Ram Innefficient, and wouldn't really be recommended for anyone with a video card with less than 128MB ram.


Dark Basic Pro has arived! I can feel the power!
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Dave J
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Posted: 18th Sep 2003 11:16
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Quote: "just imagine if someone suggest developing HL2 in Visual Basic, after the programmers got up off the floor i'm sure they'll try and explain to you why its just not a sane option."


That's because VB is aimed at software development, not games development. Those 3 gazillion FPS don't matter in the case of a windows app.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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WoW is WOW
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Posted: 18th Sep 2003 11:37
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how do i learn vb
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Dave J
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Posted: 18th Sep 2003 14:59
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Buy a book, find some tutorials, however you want.

"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
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