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Dark Physics & Dark A.I. & Dark Dynamix / [darkphysic] model car won't work in darkphysic demo code

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leo877
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 06:11 Edited at: 21st Feb 2011 18:11
hello. i model a car in blender. the body is the parent and the wheels are child.

EDIT 5. FEB 21 this post is for help using blender and darkphysic but the techniques should be the same in other 3d programs, i tihnk.

from what i have learn on my errors and help from those who contribute here is that: the axis sytem is weird. in DBP/DP is the the Y axis goes up in down. as in BLENDER the Z axis goes up and down. i hope this tip can save you some time and furstation. i not to sure about other 3d programs, so if use something else then BLENDER can you post the axis system setup.

also the X axis has to go threw the center of tire.

i have attach of pic about the axis sytem. PIC.A shows defualt setup in blender. Z axis is going up/down, Y axis goes left/right.

pic.B shows how i setup the axis to work for dbp/dp. Z axis going left/right, Y axis going up/down.


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leo877
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 06:23 Edited at: 26th Sep 2010 11:29
heres my model i use in program.



edit 9-26


delete first car model


LBFN
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 07:01 Edited at: 20th Sep 2010 15:30
There seems to be something wrong with the model itself. It crashed my computer when I ran it. I loaded it into MilkShape and this is what it looks like:



Computers do exactly what you tell them.........don't you hate that sometimes?

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Eminent
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 19:22
It looks way too high poly to me.


HowDo
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Posted: 20th Sep 2010 20:45 Edited at: 20th Sep 2010 20:47
well it seem your car is not seated on the x y z center and is about 20 30 + in the air, also your wheels centers are to one side of your car and not were you see them, this could be why you cannot seem to get it to go.

can make code run and have use darkvehiclesettingup program I wrote to get the wheels and height of chassis and the numbers you have seem to be the same as the code generates so its not that.

the rotate limb 2,0,0,-90,0, is only need if your car has been made and laid out the same way the beach buggy, otherwise its not needed.

So try re positioning your model in blender and trying again, load in the beach buggy and you'll see how that's been laid out and positioned.

Dark Physics makes any hot drink go cold.
leo877
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Posted: 21st Sep 2010 06:02
@lfb.. never use milkshape.. but i load the car body in frgmotion and it look okays.. had to delete wheels or it wouldn't load,(pass the vectors limit).

@ eminent..i guess that mite be it....gonna scrap it and redo it as low ploy i can get....but i thought dbpro can handle high ploy models. back to the drawing board.

@howdo...as soon i can get time from work i do what u recomend...i also found that program u wrote about assign limbs to the wheel coomand for dark physic. nice program. when i use my c8 model every looks and runs fine but when i prees the j key to test drive. i get that error pic from my first post.


thank you guys for hints, suggestions, critism. i hope i can get it going. i spent about a month modeling my car. fisrt attempt in blender.


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LBFN
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Posted: 21st Sep 2010 06:50 Edited at: 21st Sep 2010 07:09
Normally, .x files that load into DBPro will also load into Milkshape okay. I ran your program with the model and my computer crashed. When the model would not load into Milkshape properly, I took it that the model itself is the problem.

I have a car model that I know works with DBP and DP. I will use it with your code and see what happens. I'll edit my post when I'm done.

EDIT: Even with my car that I know works (tried it again to be sure), it crashed. The code is suspect also.

Good luck with it.

LB

Computers do exactly what you tell them.........don't you hate that sometimes?
leo877
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2010 05:36 Edited at: 24th Sep 2010 03:01
i got a new error message. can any one tell me or explain what it means. i reinstall dark phsyci and usee it origional code.
HOWDO i haven't tired ur seggustion. getting on it tomorrow on my day off. i post my result. i hope i don't have 2 redo my model. i did tried the buggy in blender. the 3ds one load but not .x file woldn't load. also when i do load the 3ds, the whell are not attach to the model.



@LFBN


can u try your model agian with the origional code i re-edit in my first post.

the first code had my changes the second one is from darkphysic infomation. i also found HOWDO link http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&b=30&t=144632&p=0

@howdo


is there something wrong in your first line of code after i copy it from your program





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LBFN
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2010 16:10
Quote: "@LFBN
can u try your model agian with the origional code i re-edit in my first post"


I tried it (and with adjustments to the wheel limbs) and it worked (the car showed up on screen anyway). I also had to change the way the camera followed as it was way too close.

Computers do exactly what you tell them.........don't you hate that sometimes?
leo877
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Posted: 24th Sep 2010 01:47 Edited at: 24th Sep 2010 05:55
well i did what howdo recomend, but nothing going good for me, more trail and error. i gonna redo model over.

have some question:

1? in easy terms what are a limbs on model, for example on my car model would the body and tires would each be limbs.

2? for limbs would they each need bone, do the bones need to be seperate or parenting and child with each other. or does the limbs need to be parenting and child with each other.

3? how do i put images with in my post instead of using the view button on the bottum in the post.

thanks for any info.



edit: sept 23
@ LBFN or anyone else

okay pic 1 shows what i am asking a bout question 1.

are the limb equal to each object, ie, tire = limb, car body = limb. in other words would i have five limbs all together.

pic 2 shows what i am asking a bout question 2.
for limbs would they each need bone, do the bones need to be seperate or parenting and child with each other. or does the limbs need to be parenting and child with each other.


in dark physic, does your model have to have bones, parent and child relationship or just need limbs.

@LBFNthanks for asnwering my question about loading pics did the first method but i gonna try the second one after i find a site for pics. what i was asking.


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LBFN
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Posted: 24th Sep 2010 02:15
Quote: "1? in easy terms what are a limbs on model, for example on my car model would the body and tires would each be limbs."

For my model, I have what I call a root limb, which the vertices of main body of the car are assigned. I then make child limbs of the four wheels separately each from this root limb.

Quote: "2? for limbs would they each need bone, do the bones need to be seperate or parenting and child with each other. or does the limbs need to be parenting and child with each other."

Look at my other answer. The vertices of the main body should be assigned to the root limb. You make child limbs to each of the four wheels separately, all coming from the root limb. (i.e. root limb to the RF wheel, root limb to the LR wheel, etc.)

Quote: "? how do i put images with in my post instead of using the view button on the bottum in the post."


What works best for me is to attach the file to a post (using the file uploader applet). After it is posted, I go back into it and click on the VIEW button to get the web address for the pic. I then go back in and edit my post, pasting the web address of the pic, highlighting it with the cursor and then clicking the IMAGE button.

As an alternative, you could post a pic on a file server, like mediafire (or whatever), grabbing the link to the pic and pasting it into your post and clicking the IMAGE button.

Computers do exactly what you tell them.........don't you hate that sometimes?
leo877
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Posted: 26th Sep 2010 11:26 Edited at: 27th Sep 2010 00:47
okay made a litt;e progress.. i scrap first model and made another one thats less ploy and scrap the wheels. i did manager to load my car model but i get these results were the reals move funny.


heres the excalt code i using....




if u need road2 itinside the darkphysic folder. i have post the new model.


anyone know why the wheels move funny.


edit2 delete funny models wheels


LBFN
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Posted: 26th Sep 2010 16:15
Okay, got this one to load and at least work. The suspension spring setting is way too high at 100 - set it to 1.0 or something like that (at least for now). The direction for the wheels should all be 0 (you have limbs 3 and 6 set to 1 currently). In your modeling program, center the limb for each of the wheels so that it is dead-center of the wheel. It looks like it is set incorrectly and is causing the wheels to orbit like they are.

Hope this helps,

LB

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 27th Sep 2010 00:43 Edited at: 27th Sep 2010 00:46
@lbfn

thanks for thoses tips..did what you said but when i export from blender using kira blender or regular export from blender. but everytime i try changing the xport options, my wheels keep spining like coin spinning on a table.

use the code from above and heres the new model.


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LBFN
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Posted: 27th Sep 2010 06:51
I have re-rigged the car (tried to get yours to work, but it just wouldn't work just right). I also made a few edits to your code. The car is not textured as I did not see where you posted it. Anyway, the car moves pretty well and the tires rotate correctly (those tires are way too high poly btw, but the model overall is great. I'm sure it will be cool when it is textured.

The revised code:



The c3LBFN.x model is attached. Check it out and see if this is what you are looking for.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.

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leo877
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Posted: 28th Sep 2010 04:57
@lbfn

thanks for helping, and adjusting the model. i just want to know if theres way to scale the model in fragmotion.
why does your model look like small like a micro machine. is there any way to make it bigger.

you said you ahve to re rigged my model. did have to put bones. becuse i didn't put bones but did a parent to child relationship.


LBFN
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Posted: 28th Sep 2010 05:16
You're welcome.

I don't know about scaling it up in FragMotion, as I do not have it. I exported it at 5X and have attached the model. You can scale it up in DBP, but you may have to make adjustments when you create the car body and may have to adjust the wheel positions.

Yes, I did rig the model and assigned vertices to bones. I know I couldn't get yours to work right no matter what I did, so I figured I could at least get something working for you.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.

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leo877
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Posted: 29th Sep 2010 08:43 Edited at: 29th Sep 2010 08:52
@lbfn

thanks again. its my mistake thinking you use fragmotion. now you mention that you use milkshap. do you use any other 3d program. the new model is great,but it to big and no you don't have to re-scale it. i was missing around with the code and figure out how to move camera and got a good respond.

i want to figure out what i am doing wrong and not be a lazy coder and having other members doing the work for me.

reading your responds on what you did to my model makes me see why my mine didn't work. in yours you said you add bones and when i did mine. i didn't have bones so i gonna try that.

you also metion about you couldn't find textures is because i haven't made one yet. this model is a test run, something to test out codes and stuff.
Quote: "those tires are way too high poly btw, but the model overall is great."
the reason is i want to have a smooth tire movement and thanks about the model. feel free to use edit for any of your models and code. the model is surppose to be a
70 chevelle ss 454

would this be possible to do a motorcycle 2 or the models needs 4 wheels.
off topic, have you ever play these games : roadblaster(arcade); mach rider(nes); and my favorite road rash(gensis).

would like to combine all the funny elements into one game


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LBFN
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Posted: 29th Sep 2010 18:00
Quote: "do you use any other 3d program."

I have an old versions of Blender, Wings 3D and TruSpace somewhere on my computer, but I never use them. Milkshape does what I need, so I use it almost exclusively.

Quote: "i want to figure out what i am doing wrong and not be a lazy coder and having other members doing the work for me."

That is good; and is the whole idea.

Quote: "the reason is i want to have a smooth tire movement"

Having a high-poly tire will of course help, but it seems like you could use a much lower version and still get good results. The texture/ normal map will make the big difference.

Quote: "feel free to use edit for any of your models and code. the model is surppose to be a
70 chevelle ss 454"

Thanks for that. It looks like a Chevelle. I may just UV map it and use it in some games. Thank you.

Quote: "would this be possible to do a motorcycle 2 or the models needs 4 wheels."


I am fairly new to DP, but I seem to remember that the documentation indicates somewhere that you need 4-wheeled vehicles. I have not tried a motorcycle, but that is a cool idea. An alternative might be to make an ATV 4-wheeler.
Quote: "
off topic, have you ever play these games"

Yes, I used to play Road Blaster in the arcades. It was a lot of fun. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 10:40
lbfn thanks for your model....

but i am still trying to make mine work. i think it must be something i am doing in blender.

made car body assign it a bone to it. i also did that to all the wheels but i think i use the wrong method....must try something else.


LBFN
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 16:05
There is a Blender tutorial on the FPSC board for rigging as well as many others here:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=154558&b=24

I tried importing the .x versions of each of our models and got nothing. I also tried importing the Milkshape version of mine; again, nothing. Good luck with it.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 21:00 Edited at: 30th Sep 2010 22:04
@lbfn

thank for the link...i check it out but no luck. i hink theres something wrong with blender direct import, it might be using 8 version. does mlikshape export in 3ds format. the models might work better in that format. i would like to know how did you rigged the model in milk. {did you combine the body and tires as one object then you assign the bones to them or is the body and tires seperate with the own body}

2{you said in earlier post you assign the vertexs to the bones, what did you mean about that in milkshape term, i don't use milk but in blender i think theres a option like that called bone heat. is the same method}





these are all the steps in am doing in blender only program no other 3d program.
ok now i have start over and start writing down what i have done. for my first atempt :
a.the car body and tire are not combine as one,
b. bones not combine to body.
c.when i am exproting ; i am selecting the model and bones to be export. i am using directx 2.49/2.5 export not the one from blender with these options:
preset = directx
export mode : e select.
then i save and load in using howdo program link in top post for is code. pic here is to show qirefame of model and bones.
URL=http://img715.imageshack.us/i/48600010.jpg/][/URL]

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

in this pic, whats is happing withe tires...





and last pic..whatdoes this error mean



LBFN
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 21:18
Sorry to hear that. That thread is somewhat dated, so it is very possible that it was done on an older version of Blender.

Milkshape can export to .3ds, however, it cannot export bones. .x format is the only one I could get to work with bones in DBP.

Here is a thread on the 3D Chat board that might help.
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=173959&b=3

If not, maybe you could post a request for Blender rigging info there. There are several people around that seem to have Blender down. If all else fails, maybe you could email/PM Kira Vakaan.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
HowDo
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 21:51
leo877 is the above picture of the car in outline mode how you have it positioned in blender?

looks like your x y z are facing the wrong way, in AC3D I have it set
Y
|
Z----->X

your above picture looks like this.
Z
|
X--->Y

Dark Physics makes any hot drink go cold.
leo877
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 22:10
@howdo

Quote: "Z
|
X--->Y"

yes i think thats how it is....x going forward and y going to the left and z going uo so if i change the formation to what you saying should it work


leo877
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Posted: 30th Sep 2010 22:46
@lbfn

so you saying after i put bone in tire a have to animate the tire in other for the rig to work.


LBFN
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Posted: 1st Oct 2010 01:22 Edited at: 1st Oct 2010 01:29
Quote: "so you saying after i put bone in tire a have to animate the tire in other for the rig to work."


I assigned what I call the root joint (bone/limb) to the main body of the car. Then, I will select that root joint and create another joint (child) at the very center of the tire and assign the tire vertices to the joint. Do this same procedure for all four tires. That is how I rigged your model in Milkshape and how I have done previous models that have worked with DP.

In Milkshape I have to select to export it with animations in order for it to work. I don't know about Blender.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 1st Oct 2010 04:53 Edited at: 1st Oct 2010 04:55
lbfn

thnkas for all your help ...so far. but still don't know after i add bone to tire, do animate the bone/tire 360 ( like rotate as is moving on the ground) in other for it to work...i gonna have to try more methods in acouples days ...work the next 2 day are work...bummer ....this rigging and physic is making me go mad.....


howdo metion something about why my tires are funny...so i must be close...the solutions is there i am just looking to hard.

Quote: "
Y
|
Z----->X

your above picture looks like this.
Z
|
X--->Y
"



LBFN
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Posted: 1st Oct 2010 05:43
In order to get the axis' set properly, it seems like you could simply rotate the entire model 90 degrees in order to line things up like HowDo said.

It sounds like you understand that you have to actually animate the tires in Blender - that is not necessary. All you need to do is assign the bones properly and it should work in DP. The actual wheel rotation is done in DP. This is why you need it to be centered, so the wheel does not hobble along.

Quote: "thnkas for all your help "
That brought a smile to my face I am glad to help you. I know that Blender has a ton of capabilities and that it can do awesome things if you are willing to put in the time to learn it. I have never taken that time, so I applaud you sticking to it. Hopefully someone will help you out in 3D Chat.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
HowDo
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Posted: 1st Oct 2010 20:53 Edited at: 1st Oct 2010 20:54
what I was trying to get across is that the x axis must go though the center hub of each wheel.

[]-----[] <-on the x axis


[]-----[] <-on the x axis


in words, you have the axil bar going through the side of the wheel instead of its center.

if you had just done it in code with boxes and cylinders you would have got the same result.

I hope this help and not confues you further.

Dark Physics makes any hot drink go cold.
LBFN
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2010 01:37
leo877:

You might check Ortu's last post here:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=176081&b=1

It might be of help to you.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 4th Oct 2010 06:38
@ howdo

thats a whole lot better for me to understand what is going on... i have try some different steps with wat you said but same and diffenret result.... the new result as i try to comply, it gomes to one set phy wheel command and it highlight in a grey box.

@lbfn

thanjks for this link and comments. i check it out, did wat it say but no luck...still " tire spinning like a coin on table"..

update, i try simething else..

i convert my mode from format to load in characterfx and follow a tutorial with the smae concept to load a car in the code from dark physic code that i post here


LBFN
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Posted: 4th Oct 2010 07:40
I thought about suggesting CharacterFX. I loaded your model into it to see how hard it was to use to assign limbs (I have only used it 1 or 2 times before) and it takes a little getting used to. It took me about 10 minutes just to get two limbs placed and I hadn't even assigned the vertices yet.

As an alternative, you can get a 30 day trial of Milkshape for free (to register after that is $35 US if you want to continue using it). Here is a link to the site (I use v 1.84):

http://chumbalum.swissquake.ch/ms3d/download.html

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 4th Oct 2010 22:19 Edited at: 4th Oct 2010 22:21
lbfn

so do you have characterFX.... i found this post search about car and physic b4 i made this post and found this..

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=146920&b=30

so if this works i might just make models in blender and get the tires working cFx..

off topic what are you working, any programs or games


LBFN
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Posted: 4th Oct 2010 23:51 Edited at: 4th Oct 2010 23:51
I'm sure if I used CharacterFX more I would get used to it's controls. Since rigging your model took less than 10 minutes with Milkshape, there really hasn't been much of an incentive for me to learn CharacterFX. Anyway, thanks for the tut.

Quote: "off topic what are you working, any programs or games
"

yes, I manage to keep myself quite busy with game creation. What I like to do is complete a little work on a game and then move to do something on another game and on down the line. In the past, I worked primarily on one single game for two years and got burnt out. I currently am either developing media or doing coding on six different games. On top of this, I am learning how to code with C++.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.
leo877
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Posted: 5th Oct 2010 03:27 Edited at: 5th Oct 2010 03:30
Quote: "PHY ADD VEHICLE WHEEL 2,"5", 1.39, 0.30, 4.52, 0.05, -0.60, 0, 0 :`Cylinder_002"


were is 5, being a limb, is there a way or command to rotate to be on the x axis

this is starting to get on my nerve, try blender, and try charcterfx but no luck in getting the tires to roll right....


leo877
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Posted: 5th Oct 2010 06:07
does any one know what this mean....



LBFN
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Posted: 5th Oct 2010 06:07 Edited at: 5th Oct 2010 06:08
What I do is look at where the limbs are at on the car and assign them accordingly. I have included a screen pic of the car in Milkshape, showing how the joints are seen in DBP.



I also am including some diagnostic code here so you can determine what the limbs on your car are according to DBP:



You'll notice that I have remmed out a section of the code. UN-rem it (is that a word?) and run it. Press L to cycle through the different limbs of my version of your car. The program will stop when you click a mouse button.

Next, change the car's object filename to your car model. Write down what DBP shows the limbs as. Change the limb assigments in the code (notice that I wrote which is passenger front, driver rear, etc.). Rem out the code section again and run it to see if it helps.

I'm not really a programmer.....I only play one on TGC.

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leo877
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Posted: 5th Oct 2010 08:07
lbfn

made some progrees after your last post...i got better results but the bones in the whell made it look funny...


i was not putting bones, and thats why the tires were spinning wrong.

thank for your code but it didn't help to much, and i am having problems making the the tires move coreect.

like you said ealier you after a while you get burn out so thats whats happen now with this physic car thing.....time to take a little break.


HowDo
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Posted: 5th Oct 2010 18:48
leo877could you upload a 3ds file of your model then I will be able to have a look at it, AC3D does not load x files only export them.

Dark Physics makes any hot drink go cold.
leo877
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Posted: 5th Oct 2010 21:09
howdo

i made a zip folder with two different models, bones and no bones.
any help on what i am doing wrong would be appericate.


off topic
also i know i alot of my post has mispell words, is i type to fast, don't re-read the post and sometimes i post when i am tired.


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leo877
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Posted: 6th Oct 2010 10:08 Edited at: 6th Oct 2010 10:09
lbfn

did a google search for roadblaster and found this link on wiki
give great detial on about the game.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RoadBlasters


HowDo
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Posted: 6th Oct 2010 18:26
try this could should work or at least show you what I did which was center your car in the (xy) and (zx) and rise it so the wheel are on (zx) plan

Dark Physics makes any hot drink go cold.

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leo877
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Posted: 7th Oct 2010 02:09
howdo

thanks. which model did u center, 3ds or ac file. w/bone or no bone. i check all off them just in case.

also when i try to install bone 3ds into your program assign wheels to limbs.

[img]

from my experment with this is not to make clone/duplicate the same objects...i think this is what is happening.


the other day after lfbn post got some ideas and put bones combing together with the tire. when i load it in your program, my tires stop spinning but the wheels move around different.


Gamer X
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Posted: 7th Oct 2010 04:15 Edited at: 7th Oct 2010 04:15
you posted in my thread requesting a little help from me and I am here. I can't do much because I haven't dove that much into DBPro (besides a little editing of the fpsc source).

you asked
Quote: "are the axis system are them same in fpsc and dbpro. "


as far as I know they are the same especially after seeing your pics in this thread. Z is forward and backward, X is left and Right, Y is up and down.

as for the bone structure I can tell you that all bone structures need a base bone in blender. from there on you can extrude bones and disconnect them from the base bone while retaining the parent link to the bone for the tires.

I am not sure if this will be much help but it is all I can really offer right now seeing how I never messed with darkphysics. If I manage to come up with something that can help you i will post here. For now good luck solving this problem.

leo877
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Posted: 7th Oct 2010 07:14
gamer x

Quote: " from there on you can extrude bones and disconnect them"


i know how to extrude but how do disconnect them. do you have any videos, or tutor on your web page about centering cursor.
[img][/img]


HowDo
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Posted: 7th Oct 2010 13:35
I think I did both not that I could see any difference between boned and not boned but stick to ac files.

just looked at above screeny and I see its only showning two objects, it should be showing 5, one for the body of the car and then the 4 for the wheels.

ok, big updated



found that your model centers were off, like outside the object or forward of there centers.

above code should sort out physx for the model and the new model in in the download button.

Dark Physics makes any hot drink go cold.

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Gamer X
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Posted: 7th Oct 2010 17:25
Quote: "i know how to extrude but how do disconnect them"


alt + P is to disconnect bones in edit mode

leo877
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Posted: 8th Oct 2010 08:51 Edited at: 16th Oct 2010 02:26
update:
this physic things is not working out for me. must be something i am doing wrong, coding or something in blender, so time to find another way for car to move in stead of using dark physic.

my last attempt, my car move but no rotation in tire. tkae a break and come back to this problem later

so for those forum members thanks for helping me out and making me models that do work that aren't made in blender.


edit 10-15

stay alive until i figure out was going wrong with blender and dbpro


leo877
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Posted: 2nd Dec 2010 11:31
bump bump


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