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Geek Culture / Windows 8

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lazerus
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 12:17 Edited at: 13th Dec 2011 19:53
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Well, been using the developer version of windows 8 in uni for while. I have to say its not appealing...

This is not me in the video, nor am i so picky over bug issues as it is the developer version. I am however with him completely on how crap the UI is. The amusing thing about all this is were studying this under HCI unit and were actually referencing to it as a bad example now. I've had about 8 hours of fiddle time with it and i can honestly say its unappealing. Why would you need tiles like a windows phone when your have a dual screen 3820 x 2160? There are hundreds of normal options/functions buried in rats nests of menus in places that make no sense. They have basically dumbed down windows.

Sorry about the dead link, seems its one of the awkward videos to embed.

http://youtu.be/35jVZFFwPrU

You can try it yourself right now though you cant uninstall since it is a full OS, so a empty partition would be a safe bet when you want to return to something useful. So anyone else had the pleasure of using this?


http://lazerus-reborn.deviantart.com/
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Quik
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 12:23
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have already had 2 threads about this XD

and i have only looked at videos, it looks SHOE, Iam sticking with 7 until windows 9, lets just hope windows 9 will be useable


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
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bitJericho
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 12:33 Edited at: 13th Dec 2011 12:37
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I'm sure windows 8 will fix the usability issues by release time.

I personally can't wait for it to come out. It's going to be above and beyond the best HTPC interface ever. Right now my HTPC runs Windows 7 MCE, but Windows 8 looks like it will blow it away. It wouldn't surprise me if TVs start shipping with Windows 8 built-in, though I haven't heard anything about that.

Have you used Windows 8 exclusively? It might give you a better impression. It took me a good 2 weeks to get comfortable with it. Maybe that's a problem, maybe not, what I do know is it does end up making sense and you can get comfortable with it.

But yeah, there's plenty of room for improvement.

The Windows 8 app store is going to be the place to go to buy/sell apps for windows. It's going to make people very rich. It has the potential to blow the apple app store away. It's got the possibility of being *huge*

If the people reading this had half-a-brain, they'd be developing apps RIGHT NOW to release on day 1. It's going to be flooded really quickly, if you don't get on it, you're going to miss the money train!


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Quik
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 12:48
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Cant say that it looks very great for what i do (gaming, chatting, surfing, multitasking like shoes, etc)
but yes, for TVs and the like i can indeed see it comfy, but for my PC computer? no..


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 13:06
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i winder if windows 8 will be able to run on a desktop computer and have all the same funtionality/driver/hardware support of windows 7.


dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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bitJericho
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 13:07
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Quote: "i winder if windows 8 will be able to run on a desktop computer and have all the same funtionality/driver/hardware support of windows 7. "


I run it right now on my desktop. Right now it's basically windows 7 with a Metro interface that replaces the start menu. There's a few other changes here or there.


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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 13:33
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lool. Well as far as i know, you can just switch it to the classic windows interface.

One thing i noticed about windows 7 is that it seemes to be a lot better ant resourse managment and even tho it a really hungry system and eats almost all of your ram, but it manages to mantain speed and smooth performance.

I wonder if windows 8 will be even more resourse efficient?

(i call it that, because it gives you back all the resourses in stable performance but people always flame me saying stuff like XP is a lot more resourse efficient and 7 eats tons of resourses! and refuse to llisten to me when i tell them that you get a lot more out of your system in return for the resourses than you get out of XP which is noticabley slower and chuggier in PCs that run 7)


dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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Quik
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 13:36
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Quote: "One thing i noticed about windows 7 is that it seemes to be a lot better ant resourse managment and even tho it a really hungry system and eats almost all of your ram, but it manages to mantain speed and smooth performance. "


I find it weird how windows 7 runs more smoothly and with less problems on my laptop (2gb ram, 3ghz processor and a worthless graphic card) than windows XP..


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
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bitJericho
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 14:04
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Yeah, windows 7 has a lot better memory management than xp.


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TheComet
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 19:46
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Great find! Loved the video ^^

TheComet

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 13th Dec 2011 20:03
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To be honest, we're actually looking at an early version that's pretty much pre-public beta and is aimed at developers. So of course, there's no doubt a lot to be done and no doubt feedback from the beta when it's released will help it more user friendly...just as long as Microsoft's idea of a public beta isn't the same as Square Enix's, which was, "everybody's saying it's totally crap, pointing out lots of problems, however, they're all wrong, so we'll release it like this...wait...why's nobody playing our game?" (In reference to FFXIV)

The public beta worked for Windows 7 and I found at the start it ran much better than any previous Windows, including XP because at the start I found XP was horrific but it improved greatly after it got service packs.

As far as functionality goes, it looks like Windows 8 is still going to cater to how everything runs on Windows 7, but they're just adding functionality and an alternative interface, which will no doubt be very useful for touch screen computers. I notice Apple took inspiration from their touch screen technology with the latest release of their OS but had it work with their touchpad and I wonder if Windows 8 will offer the same thing? It'd be interesting to see and I hope anything they do add will be optional as to cater for those who much prefer to be old fashioned.

However, I've not installed Windows 8 yet, I might wait for the public beta - I do have a spare partition to run it, it can replace my installation of Ubuntu.

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PAGAN_old
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 02:49
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Quote: " find it weird how windows 7 runs more smoothly and with less problems on my laptop (2gb ram, 3ghz processor and a worthless graphic card) than windows XP..
"


yeah thats exactly what im talking about


dont hate people who rip you off,cheat and get away with it, learn from them
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Agent Dink
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 03:37
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The guy in the video is a total tool. I can tell he's a linux snob, lol.

http://lossofanonymity.wordpress.com
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old_School
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 06:07
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Quote: "The guy in the video is a total tool. I can tell he's a linux snob, lol."

That guy likely makes more then all the forums members combined. Anyway, windows 8 so Ive herd MS say is not for everyone. To me its mostly appealing to small businesses who use touch screens or cell phone users. Anyway you sack it, touch tech is the future. This is windows introducing us to that type of tech on are desktop.
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DeadTomGC
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 08:01 Edited at: 14th Dec 2011 08:08
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Quote: "I find it weird how windows 7 runs more smoothly and with less problems on my laptop (2gb ram, 3ghz processor and a worthless graphic card) than windows XP.."

Well, It would actually mmake sense if your laptop was made when either vista or 7 was around. These OS's are designed to be optimized for certain likely chip properties like cache size and type and maybe different command codes. So if there are features meant to be used by the win 7 operating system that the chip is not using because it is running xp it will naturally be slower at performing the same tasks.
Also if the OS can count on more ram than using it will really boost system speed.
when I upgraded my laptop to 7 from vista the ram usage went from 52% to 41% out of 4GBs of ram.

Edit: about windows 8 so far, I hope that the interface isn't close to done. It does not look like it is. However if they didn't put this out so that people could try the interface then why did they put it out?
BTW I really like windows 7 there are a few things that I would like to be able to find easier but other than that I just want it to be fast on next gen processors.


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TheComet
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 09:05
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Quote: "Anyway you sack it, touch tech is the future. This is windows introducing us to that type of tech on are desktop."


Hmm, let me correct that sentence a bit...

Quote: "Anyway you sack it, touch tech is the future. This is windows introducing us how NOT to do it."


Ah, much better

Why would Microsoft make an OS that's "not designed for everyone"? I think that's just a stupid excuse. An OS is supposed to be designed for everyone, that's the whole point of installing an operating system, so you can operate with the system effectively! And Windows 8 isn't showing any sign of effectiveness, only confusion and incompatibility. If that's really going to be their UI then that kills it for me.

TheComet

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Quik
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 09:09
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IF EVERYONE could get ahold of touch screens etc, if it was standard then YES FOR THE LOVE OF SHOES GOD FOR IT

but now, no, NO, i dont want a shoey touch screen, since its TOO EXPENSIVE.

as of now, iam very happy with windows 7, and really, i see no need for a windows 8, even without the whole touch-phone-thing


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
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ionstream
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 12:22
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I'm going to refer to the guy who made the video as Gus.

Gus is running Windows 8 in VirtualBox on Ubuntu. He gave the virtual machine 2gb of RAM, presumably because he only has 4gb in store, or he would have given the VM much more. Gus then comments on how slow Windows 8, despite the fact that he allocated the minimum amount of memory required, in a virtual machine while running screen capture software.

Gus then becomes frustrated with the start menu and control panel interface, implying it is stupid because he doesn't immediately know how it works and because it is different from the previous versions of windows.

Finally, Gus turns an air conditioner on in the background and then mutters while he stumbles through the preview.

Quote: "That guy likely makes more then all the forums members combined."


Judging by the number of ads-per-second his many hundreds of videos churn out, I wouldn't doubt it - thankfully that doesn't validate his point at all.

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Quik
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 12:34
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Quote: "Gus then becomes frustrated with the start menu and control panel interface, implying it is stupid because he doesn't immediately know how it works"


that is a valid point, especially considering it is WINDOWS, which is the main operative system for most people, When iam getting a new operating system, which ill use for gaming, surfing and chatting, i dont feel like spending an hour figuring out how to do those things, or even starting it up


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bitJericho
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 12:46 Edited at: 14th Dec 2011 12:50
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Quote: "that is a valid point, especially considering it is WINDOWS, which is the main operative system for most people, When iam getting a new operating system, which ill use for gaming, surfing and chatting, i dont feel like spending an hour figuring out how to do those things, or even starting it up"


So the first time you ever used windows, you knew exactly what everything was?

Are you still using the class start menu or have you moved on to the nice (less intuitive) XP style start menu?

Have you even tried Windows 8? Once you figure out how to go to the metro interface, and more importantly, quickly jump back out of the metro interface, it works just fine (just click start again in the bottom left corner). It's more like a fullscreen start menu rather than a whole new way of doing things.


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Agent Dink
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 12:56
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Quote: "That guy likely makes more then all the forums members combined."


Doesn't mean he's not a tool...

Ionstream hits the nail on the head, he's just a cynic who made a poor video absolutely criticizing a pre-public release that he clearly doesn't understand. From how he navigates the standard control panel I'd venture to guess he doesn't even know how to use XP properly.

http://lossofanonymity.wordpress.com
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lazerus
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 13:18
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Quote: " If the people reading this had half-a-brain, they'd be developing apps RIGHT NOW to release on day 1. It's going to be flooded really quickly, if you don't get on it, you're going to miss the money train!"


We have a few of the developers coming over to uni for a week workshop on developing apps for it. We also get developer accounts for free, along with access to there library's and feedback/testing/general support and finally if we get that far, access to there beta/alpha tester base. There's supposed to be 8 people in total split between 38 people. Happy days.

I did hint at the guy was a idiot but it was one of the few that picked up on some problems, The massive wasted space and scrolling through about a hundred tiles or so just to find what your after. I would have gladly screen-capped and gave a reasonable review on one of the uni computers but the admin dislikes people installing stuff. (He hasn't forgiven me for Halo CE lan wars across 32 comp's, mainly since i never invited him...)
An I've just fixed the last of my problems here so I'm not about to screw about with another OS on mine either.

But yes it has potential i just dislike the interface behind it. I'll put the occasional memory leak down to the build type but as said above this is for a touch screen if anything. Possible benefits would be the kick-start of a touchscreen rush meaning normal Led/Lcd's will be cheaper for the smarter people aha I don't see any reason to upgrade yet at any rate. Wait for the fallout of release problems to pass then ill think about it.


http://lazerus-reborn.deviantart.com/
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old_School
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 13:59
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I loved the above argument touch is too expensive. Being a older guy, I remember when cd's were too expensive.Heck I remember DVd's being expensive and tapes for those old enough to know what a tape is even. The point is, touch tech will come down in price. Supply demand will ultimately lower the price and make the tech available at a resonable price. As stated, Microsoft is preparing us for the future rather you like it or not.

I'm getting ready to make a program for a bunch of gas stations using touch tech and they are a small business. If they can aford it, it will not be long before the average consumer can aford it as well. When you look at OS tech, you need to think 10 years ahead. People still use XP and its way outdated. This is what Microsoft has to consider when releaasing a OS a long with a million other things to consider. The "solution" or Os has to be able to meet the current markets needs today and tommarow.
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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 14:00
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From what I've seen of videos it's designed both for how we use Windows 7 and the metro interface for touch screen. It looks like they're adding more options rather than taking away current ones. When MS says 'it's not for everyone' I assume they're referring to Metro as opposed to the entire operating system. Can metro be turned off or avoided? How much customisation is there?

I've sat in shops before now playing with touch devices with Windows 7 installed, to be honest I didn't like it. Great with a mouse but didn't think it as great with my fingers. So as far as touch devices go, metro looks like a much more preferable option.

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bitJericho
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 15:02
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Quote: "Can metro be turned off or avoided? How much customisation is there?"


With the beta you can hack the registry to make the normal start menu show up instead of metro.


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MrValentine
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Posted: 14th Dec 2011 23:19
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Has anyone tried the obvious... TGC product testing?

Alsk I tried to download the beta... but the installer asked for a cdkey which they did not give anywhere... so can someone point me in the right direction I would like to download it again to test in VM

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enderleit
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Posted: 15th Dec 2011 00:46
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Funny how he has one video where he hates it, and one where he loves it?

- Martin Enderleit
http://sites.google.com/site/menderleit
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David R
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Posted: 15th Dec 2011 16:16
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Quote: "or he would have given the VM much more. Gus then comments on how slow Windows 8, despite the fact that he allocated the minimum amount of memory required"


The other interesting thing about that is I did pretty much exactly the same under VMware and the Win8 DP version still booted up impressively fast. If they've fixed anything this time around (and with Win7 too, really) it's boot speed

It's just the usability once it has started up that takes a nose dive

09-f9-11-02-9d-74-e3-5b-d8-41-56-c5-63-56-88-c0
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Indicium
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Posted: 15th Dec 2011 17:03
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Am I the only person who fails to see how touch screen technology is the future in any way? I don't want to touch my screen, I'm not creepy like that, I'll happily just look at it and press buttons.

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Quik
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Posted: 15th Dec 2011 17:08
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except for being more flexible and smooth when doing casual things on the pc?
nah....

but for gaming it defo isnt on the PC (but on handheld consoles definitly!)
and for developing? hrr.. dunno...

but for the casual user, yeah touch is awesome


The result of origin.. Oh and ponies
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MrValentine
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Posted: 15th Dec 2011 17:20
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You should look into haptic feedback development... also anyone seen yhe new or even old Tron movies...?

In the first movie the guy has a tough desk screen... woah did nobody notice that? Also the new movie has awesome touch screen... MS has already showcased some amazing advancements if I can find the links soon I will linky

If we get Tron like touch screen I am IN... otherwise... Mouse and keyboard baby¡

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Isocadia
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Posted: 15th Dec 2011 17:48
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I can't see myself using touchscreens for even casual stuff. I want to look forward, not downwards. But I want my hands to type on the desk, cause beating gravity is kinda a forcing thing to do if you're doing it for 2 hours straight. So really, touchscreens on desktops will never be it for me. I also hate those low press in keyboards. Mine is an old Compaq nameless keyboard that i've used since forever, and I still find it one of the best keyboards I've ever used.
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Agent Dink
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Posted: 16th Dec 2011 04:26
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Yeah, unless you're holding the screen in your hands there is no ergonomic or comfortable way to use touch screens. I find them frustrating and limiting when used for anything other than casual use. Mouse and keyboard forever.

http://lossofanonymity.wordpress.com
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