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FPSC Classic Product Chat / Need Help Choosing A new PC, and the best place/way to purchase it

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washburnrover
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Posted: 7th Mar 2012 06:44
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Hello, I'm an aspiring game developer who's been in the buisiness since the 3rd grade... I'm currently a student, and don't have time to have a job but I have used FPSC enough to the point I legitimately am near the point of making an FPS on par with BF3 or COD, and yes, the prime issues with FPSC had to be fixed to get that far (took lots of scavenging)

Unfortunately, I'm stuck with a laptop that has a 1-core 2.1 GHz CPU with 3 gb ram, and 256 mb v-ram... the main issue being my CPU and GPU

I obviously need a major upgrade (and I literally cry when i see idiots who just have lots of money, so they buy alien-wares simply to player farmville, yes, farmville). One Question I have is, How much of an Upgrade (at least AMD-A8, preferably i7 for CPU). It must be a laptop (college in near future), and ought to last my development needs for a good 5 years. I really am looking into High-End Game Development, because I'm extremely good, and passionate about it thanks TGC, u got me hooked

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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Marc Steene
FPSC Master
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Posted: 7th Mar 2012 16:14
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Quote: "but I have used FPSC enough to the point I legitimately am near the point of making an FPS on par with BF3 or COD"


I stopped taking you seriously after reading this statement. Not to put you down or anything, but a one man team using a $30 game engine will never, ever be anywhere near on par with a multi-million dollar organisation hiring hundreds of professionals in every field, from level design, to sound design, to animators, to modelers, right down to actors to use in motion capture performances, each of whom have years of experience and are paid nice salaries for their work, which occurs over a course of 2 years+ intense labour. Just to give you an idea of the resources that go into making a AAA game, here is a Vidoc from 343 Industries on the making of Halo 4 (you can see everything from level designers, to programmers, to the musicians recording the music, to motion capture): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6UL63Zo-uo. To say FPSC, an engine which doesn't even support Anti-Aliasing or AF, can compete with engines like Frostbite 2 is ridiculous.

What you can do, however, is work within the limitations of the engine and create a game which is fun to play, and in some cases, looks very nice, and if it is good enough, start selling it through a small publisher.

As for laptops, HPs tend to be good value for money (despite their fairly high failure rate). Try and avoid Acer laptops, they are mainly multimedia centers and don't have much in the way of graphics. Asus laptops are also very nice for gaming. Of course, if you have some money to splash out, Alienwares are very nice laptops (well built from quality materials) and I have yet to see a laptop which can match it in build quality (and the customisable lights are just awesome). The important thing is not to give up - if you enjoy game designing, you should consider it as a future career option (that's what I'm doing, after I study Computer Science at university). Hope this helps


Specs: Alienware M17x R3. i7-2630QM. 8GB RAM. Nvidia 560m. Momentus XT Hybrid Drive.
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A dude
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Posted: 7th Mar 2012 16:14
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Great deal!

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Sony-VPCF136FD-Laptop-w-Windows7-NVIDIA-GeForce-GT-425M-/280839045166?pt=Laptops_Nov05&hash=item41634fc02e

You could upgrade the ram. Ram isn't too expensive.
Also, wrong section. It should be in geek culture.
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washburnrover
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Posted: 7th Mar 2012 22:44
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@Marc Steene, no offense, but you underestimate my capabilities. I've won 2 international science competitions & 10 State & 30+ Regional Science Awards (from Engineering Firms like: Burns and McDonnell, Oklahoma State University, and Many more, BTW, I'm pretty early in High School) for my projects on Sound Acoustics and Graphics + Physics
I understand FPSC's limitations. I also understand how to counter-act them (the sound interpretation sucks by my standards, but I'm designing my personal plugins to use reverb, echo, strength in Decibels, based on every form of positioning. FPSC's Hardware inefficiency is actually very easy to overcome, if you know where to use more detail, and where lack of detail would help. I'll be doing lots of voice actin alongside many of the Honors Theater Students I'm friends with, and some Marines too... Motion capture is going to be used (i got connections) to save as frames for the TF341 characters in the Campaign. FPSC does have Anti-Aliasing Support from various mods, though not in the current 119 Beta, I'll be adding that as well as Project Apex when HockeyKid Releases it.

I'll be integrating a Chat System connected through the external launcher (which is what sets up lobbies and automatically sends it's members to the designated match).

Attached is a screeny of a map i'm working slowly on, remember, all I've got is a 1-core 2 Ghz CPU, and I'm running at 20-30 FPS (that sucks, but given my specs, the efficiency is fantastic!)

I've been able to take advantage of 119 to load like 40 of EAI's weapons in a map like this, as well as 8 different TF341 characters, and use about 1.6 GB RAM.

I have professional Programmers willing to put their time + effort to helping me considering the obstacles I've already overcome (One thing Others and Myself hated about FPSC guns is the sound realism, but I've already modded about 50 gun sounds for ideal realism)

My intentions are to give aspiring PC gamers with everyday computers to still be able to play a modern game, but have graphics all the way to that of BF3 (and yes, I have all the resources other than a new PC). It will be a free alternative (and competitor) to COD and BF3, this is a response to SOPA (if you can't have those games for free, might as well have the next best thing! and I don't support most cases of Pirating, and I despise such actions on TGC's content, because they're like a 3rd party, almost indie, even.)

Anyways, thanks for the heads up, but believe be, I'm already Black-Belting My head through those barriers (i don't know karate lol)

@A dude: thanks, appreciate it unfortunately (and rightfully so) My parents don't trust Ebay, and i don't trust their return policies. If we're allowed to post best buy links, I'll link what i'm drooling over (Alienware Laptops = ideal but too expesive in most but not all cases... Asus Gaming is where i'm leaning, more value efficiency + easily Swappable components.

I posted this to FPSC Chat because I need it specifically for FPSC, I hoped more FPSC users would check here

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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Soviet176
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Posted: 8th Mar 2012 16:18
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If your looking for a budget PC newegg has a great DIY combo for $451 AMD quad core with intergrated 6550D. It's one of their new APU products. 8GB of ddr3 1600mhz ram terabye hard drive. Pretty good for FPSC. They also have a PC going for about $390 which has the new FX series six core. It does not have a graphics card but an extra 160-80 or so can get you an ATI 6870 or w/e.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.789246

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.789249


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washburnrover
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Posted: 11th Mar 2012 04:04
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Wow that's awesome! If i was old enough to live on my own
when window shopping teh interwebs i'm unfortunately limited to retail store websites (e.g. Best Buy, Micro Center, all those other overpriced places). My Dad thinks the internet is too dangerous to buy expensive stuff off of (what a noob, he thinks that any webpage not loading right is automatically a virus... lol)

So I appreciate Seeing that thx, but I'm sooo limited

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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JRH
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Posted: 11th Mar 2012 11:55
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Quote: "i'm unfortunately limited to retail store websites"


Issue with this is that most of their equipment will be aimed at your average home user, not someone making an FPS. I think you should try to get past this.

I recently bought a fairly high-spec laptop, and I still have my PC which I recently upgraded. Funny thing is now, all I ever do is Remote Desktop into my workstation using either of them. Keeps all of my documents in the same place
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TriSpefear Studios
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Posted: 11th Mar 2012 19:24
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Quote: "he thinks that any webpage not loading right is automatically a virus"


my problem too

"Everyone may doubt me, but your just giving me more of a reason to continue on..."
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A dude
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Posted: 11th Mar 2012 20:01 Edited at: 11th Mar 2012 20:02
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When you buy a PC do not get an integrated video card. They can't run most games even if they have what it takes to do it. For example, on http://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri/intro.aspx, it says my computer can't run many games. All the hardware my computer has, could run it. It has enough video memory, pixel shader, TNL, vertex shader, RAM, CPU, and the other stuff but... it says it can't. The reason for that is because the video card is integrated! Screenie attached. (Ignore the OS thing. It doesn't know what the Windows 8 Consumer Preview is.)
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ASTECH
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Posted: 11th Mar 2012 20:09
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Well, I'd always say stay away from integrated but if you get a Core i5 or i7 machine then I'm sure it would do for FPSC work. I've owned a previous gen i5 and the performance was amazing for medium gaming and FPSC work. Laptops aren't going to be much less then $2,000 and be gaming worthy most of the time. If you could get a desktop and buy the graphics card yourself, you would be better off.

PC Specs: AMD X4 2.7Ghz, 8GB DDR3 RAM, Nvidia 9800GT, Win. 7 Pro 64 Bit
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A dude
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 00:03 Edited at: 12th Mar 2012 00:04
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EDIT. DIDN'T READ THAT YOU COULD NOT BUY THINGS ONLINE
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Soviet176
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 01:49 Edited at: 12th Mar 2012 02:05
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Quote: "When you buy a PC do not get an integrated video card"


It's not integrated in the way you guys think. Traditionally integration is in the mother board. The AMD APU's have a 6550D integrated inside the processor. It's much faster than what your thinking of, having used, and built PC's with the same thing. It's more than enough powerful to run FPSC and play FPSC games whilst still playing other games. Much more powerful than your current system.

I suggest people look up the new APU technology. It is really interesting stuff.

**Edit**
I also forgot to say that you can do hybrid crossfire with the APU. Meaning, if you really need a performance boost you can purchase a cheap ATI 6770 dedicated card and crossfire it with the 6550D.

If your father reads consumer reports (Most people do) he will realize that newegg came in #1 most voted by everyone for online shopping. Towering over amazon, best buy,walmart etc.


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washburnrover
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 03:14
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K thx guys, u helped give me a good idea on where to go (in terms of the A6/A8, and the i5. I had my eye here:

It has an A8 quad-2.5 GHz CPU, AMD radeon 6620 with 512 mb dedicated GFX, and up to 2.5 gb shared graphics (and considering its ram is expandable from 6 to 16 gb, that's not a problem)
It goes on sale for about $520... good deal?

btw, it plays BF3 at ultra settings with 25-35 fps. Console gamers: still think gaming pc's are too expensive?

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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Toffeemouse
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 14:11
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Quote: "been in the buisiness since the 3rd grade"


Quote: "I legitimately am near the point of making an FPS on par with BF3 or COD"


Quote: " laptop that has a 1-core 2.1 GHz CPU with 3 gb ram, and 256 mb v-ram"


Quote: "because I'm extremely good"

Quote: "took lots of scavenging"


Where does one begin
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washburnrover
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 20:10
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@Toffeemouse
what? I didn't understand your point?

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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Brendy boy
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 20:34
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Quote: "Quote: "been in the buisiness since the 3rd grade"

Quote: "I legitimately am near the point of making an FPS on par with BF3 or COD"

Quote: " laptop that has a 1-core 2.1 GHz CPU with 3 gb ram, and 256 mb v-ram"

Quote: "because I'm extremely good"
Quote: "took lots of scavenging"

Where does one begin "


and this
Quote: "
If i was old enough to live on my own
"


BBB GUI Plugin
Landscape & Map Creator
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s4real
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Posted: 12th Mar 2012 23:36
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@washburnrover :- I like ya spirit and keep it up even if it is a bit unrealistic.

Hope you find your idea computer remb you don't have to go brand new to play fpsc games but the faster the system the better the performance.

I still use a geforce 8800 gts and works very well with fpsc even with the newer updates.

best s4real


Pack ya games with vishnu packer its free. Vishnu game launcher is now released.
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Bugsy
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Posted: 13th Mar 2012 22:34 Edited at: 13th Mar 2012 22:36
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Quote: "I legitimately am near the point of making an FPS on par with BF3 or COD"


COD:


BF3:


Your Game:
imageflock.com/img/1331669697.jpg[/img]

To start off, am I the only one noticing a slight discrepancy here?

alas, I'll continue;
First, to be a pursue legitimate next-gen game development, I'll recommend a desktop, since laptops just can't muster the graphics or processing power to compete with what a good ole' desktop and it's normal-sized components.

Now that that's out of the way, I'm going to suggest building this desktop yourself. This way you can be sure you're getting a good deal. (building a comp will end up easily several hundred $$$ cheaper than buying one.) Building computers is also easy to learn, ESPECIALLY with all of your major accolades in the field of science and engineering. most of my friends, who I'm convinced have below-mentally retarded level IQ's can slap together a computer in mere minutes, and do it frequently for LAN parties and whatnot.

For the actual components, I think an AMD 6-core, like perhaps a 1090t will do you fine, and there's no need to overclock. As for RAM, go for 4 or more GB, coupled with a 64 bit copy of windows 7, as it's fairly reliable and common and runs FPSC very well. if you're feeling adventurous, use linux. As for a GPU, the AMD 6950 has never done me wrong, and you can unlock it to perform akin to that of a 6970. That'll serve for your main PC.

Then, Let's work on your fileserver. most nextgen games need entire dedicated computers just for all the assets and whatnot. I'd get a nice raid system, but since you, much like me, are short on funds, do what I did, and use an old machine laying around, just be sure to put a reliable, fast harddrive in it.

With that taken care of, I guess you'd need a laptop to present a playable game concept to anyone you meet, or potential publishers of your BF3/COD-killer. For that, I'd suggest getting an ASUS. it'll be expensive, but you can probably run the game at a high setting. that'll impress once you work on making some decent looking graphics and whatnot.

Last, I'm sure you, much like any other game designer, will need a large renderfarm for to make high quality videos, and 3d animated trailers, and cutscenes for the game render quickly, without taking too much of your busy college-student life. I'll suggest looking into boxx technologies for something like that.

With all of this state of the art, top of the line equipment, I think you'll be more than prepared to make the next game on par with COD, if not BF3 (however I'd look into licensing a more powerful engine, or developing one yourself.) Let's just hope that, by the time you've amassed all of this necessary equipment, BF4 or Black Ops 2 hasn't come out.



imageflock.com/img/1326073833.jpg[/img]
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washburnrover
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Posted: 13th Mar 2012 23:10
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@Bugsy
thanks for the tips, and as for what i meant when i said "I legitimately am near the point of making an FPS on par with BF3 or COD"
i mean individual entities (not a full map, simply due to my craptop computer)

I'm also comparing to the console versions to start off, then work my way to get closer to top of the line pc graphics, once again, i'm stuck until i get a high-end computer.
Also, when i mentioned COD, i particularly meant black ops, which ran off the same IW-engine as COD4... I think many fpsc games have surpassed that at least.
keep in mind i've only been able to work with what i have, 1-core 2ghz CPU, 256 mb ati 3000 (not hd version) "grandpa needs a pc to order airline tickets, and nothing else" kind of laptop (btw, my grandpa has a better laptop than me for that reason, outside that he just leaves it to gather dust)

I've worked to hard learning and loving computers to this day, and when people who don't know what CPU stands for have alienware laptops... I'm pissed

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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Bugsy
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 04:51
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Quote: "i mean individual entities"

so you mean, you make better 3d models than the treyarch team?

Quote: "when i mentioned COD, i particularly meant black ops, which ran off the same IW-engine as COD4... I think many fpsc games have surpassed that at least."

I think you might be mistaken. never have I played an FPSC game with a 10 minute firefight in an area larger than my living room.

Quote: "when people who don't know what CPU stands for have alienware laptops... I'm pissed"

don't be pissed. alienware is overpriced garbage. It's like buying beats by dr. dre headphones. you're paying for the brand name and the logo.

imageflock.com/img/1326073833.jpg[/img]
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feedmelmao
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 05:19
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Quote: "don't be pissed. alienware is overpriced garbage. It's like buying beats by dr. dre headphones. you're paying for the brand name and the logo."


Yeah seriously. I fell into the trap last month and i'm stuck with a computer that i won't use because i'm too scared to break it. However, if you have the money and you really want a top of the line laptop, Alienware is actually alright(Because from my knowledge building a laptop is extremely difficult). HP and ASUS also have a few really good laptops but all these are easily over $1000, so i would just recommend building your own desktop, and buying like a notebook for college use.

My Alienware:


The Man with the Golden Gun
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washburnrover
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 06:17
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@bugsy
1) it depends, but compared to black ops on the ps3, yes, I can't exactly compare to the pc version of course
2) as for large open areas, I've seen extreme improvements in 119.7-119.9 for open maps, EXTREME IMPROVEMENTS! I've had fire fights with about 10 enemies that respawn behind enclosed areas (if i put more effort, i could imitate Treyarch's technique of dynamic AI, where it has craptastic waypoint-only ai until it reaches a certain point, where only a set # of enemies can actually be at once, and then switch to a more intelligent AI.
3) I know, I'm just saying I literally have the WORST laptop that was available 3.5 years ago. plus, alienware has Hardware that is very hard to find elsewhere (e.g. gtx 580 rather than 560) even though it's much pricier than it should be, for laptop users (which i will HAVE to be under the circumstances) they offer the top of the line, even though double the price of an unnoticeably less than the top of the line asus laptop (funny/sad story, i met a middle aged guy with one of these, he said he got it so he could be better at farmville... )

@feedmelmao
thanks 4 the heads up man yeah, and the only reason I gotta have a laptop is for constant transport, not for the battery... if i had my way, i'd get a slim desktop that would still allow me to build/upgrade it (when the time comes) and i'd pay a lot less

That Big Idea guy that can't find the time...
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Soviet176
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 06:25
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Quote: "never have I played an FPSC game with a 10 minute firefight in an area larger than my living room."


Lmao best ever.


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Bugsy
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 06:38
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Quote: "it depends, but compared to black ops on the ps3"


besides slight texture and shader improvements and maybe a couple more polys in distant buildings and featured characters, there is no difference between PC and PS3 black-ops. I have both. There is no difference in gameplay between the two. both single player campaigns last approximately 6 hours. just stop pretending to be an uber-dev you're not. even on the FPSC home-page it admits you won't be making the next halflife, or even quake. Those 2 games aren't nearly on the level that call of duty is.

Quote: "as for large open areas, I've seen extreme improvements in 119.7-119.9 for open maps, EXTREME IMPROVEMENTS!"


yeah I bet, I'll admit v1/19 is a step up, however these open areas are limited to 40x40 segments, which is about 320 feet in any direction. that's tiny compared to even ps2 fps games. that's maybe the size of rust in mw2. minus the view outside the map.

Quote: "double the price of an unnoticeably less than the top of the line asus laptop"


well since it's unnoticeably less than top of the line, I'm sure it won't be a problem. You won't notice the performance drop. I'm just suggesting a desktop, because my 700$ desktop, that I built in 15 minutes, after maybe 30 minutes at compUSA outperforms (and will outlast) that 3000$ alienware pictured.

so I'll just say that I highly, highly, HIGHLY suggest getting a desktop. honestly you can afford an AWESOME desktop and decent laptop for still less than what the Alienware will cost. As a "high end game developer," You're going to thank me in the long run for begging you to get a desktop.

imageflock.com/img/1326073833.jpg[/img]
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