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Geek Culture / frames & web components?

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M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 00:38
Hi everybody, I'm making a website using frontpage and would like to use frames for the sidebar/header, and web components such as hover buttons etc...

Obviously I would like the site to be as compatible as possible on different systems so what are the limitations of using these? I remember being told that frames were only compatible with Internet Explorer, but I dont now about the rest...

Thanks in advance.

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
spooky
22
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Joined: 30th Aug 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 00:43
Frames with with almost all browsers but Frames ARE THE WORK OF THE DEVIL! Don't use them, you will regret it later. Search engines HATE frames, printers hate frames, I hate frames, everyone hates frames!

Hover buttons in frontpage are done with java applets mostly and these should be ok, but lots of people have problems with java on websites, specially some macs. If you want fancy buttons, suggst you learn to do normal rollover buttons by switching between two images, or better still, learn CSS stylesheets and do it that way.

Boo!
Ian T
22
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Joined: 12th Sep 2002
Location: Around
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 03:15
FrontPage has a decent build-in nagivagiton bar system and headers can be cut-and-paste work in HTML. Frames are evil.

--Mouse: Famous (Avatarless) Fighting Furball

A very nice %it, indeed.
Mattman
21
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Joined: 5th Jun 2003
Location: East Lansing
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 03:19
just a bit of JS should do it me thinks

Got a knack for finding secrets??? Jingot Racing---A new brand of Racing---Only from Nightwatch Studios
"hey, it's tomorrow" - Hamish
TKF15H
21
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Joined: 20th Jul 2003
Location: Rio de Janeiro
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 03:21
why are frames evil? I like frames. It makes loading pages faster...

Morfy's Law - Enythink thet ken go rong willll.
Cole's Law - Thinly sliced cabbage.
M00NSHiNE
21
Years of Service
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 10:45
OK, looks like I should drop frames then.

Thanks for the advice evrybody

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
Jess T
Retired Moderator
21
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Joined: 20th Sep 2003
Location: Over There... Kablam!
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 14:14
For the image roll-over, stick this somewhere just after the <body> tag:



Note that the ../images/imagename.gif is just the directory of the image, the ../ spcifies the root directory of your website.
You can use any type of image, you don't have to use gif's.
The WIDHT and HEIGHT should be set to the exact pixel widht and height of your normal-state image.

Hope That Helped...


Team EOD :: Programmer/Logical Engineer/All-Round Nice Guy
M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 6th Nov 2003 16:07
Thanks

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
Jess T
Retired Moderator
21
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Joined: 20th Sep 2003
Location: Over There... Kablam!
Posted: 7th Nov 2003 05:28
I'm just tryin to be a nice Guy...


Team EOD :: Programmer/Logical Engineer/All-Round Nice Guy
QuothTheRaven
22
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Joined: 2nd Oct 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 7th Nov 2003 06:10
Don't use frames.

Ever.

I use them and hate myself for it.

Jess T
Retired Moderator
21
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Joined: 20th Sep 2003
Location: Over There... Kablam!
Posted: 7th Nov 2003 07:47
LoL...
Don't worry, we all hate you for it too, QuothTheRaven.

Just kidding... lol...

But seriously, if you want to improve your loading times etc, try using iFrames, they are like frames, but scroll and are alot more user-friendly...

Hope I Helped...


Team EOD :: Programmer/Logical Engineer/All-Round Nice Guy
the_winch
21
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Joined: 1st Feb 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 00:21
iframes suck as well, especially if you have a wheel mouse. You have to have the pointer in the iframe to scroll.
klariza
21
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Joined: 6th Nov 2003
Location: uk
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 00:45
i used to use frames on my website and i regreted and had to pull down the whole site for a couple of days. why?
a. they take up to much room on the server
b. they can be a pain to keep them attached to the main pages - if u get what i mean - the matching up of the names and links of the side frame to the main frame and whatnot.
c. some older web browsers cannot handle them - and believe me - some ppl still use these older browsers

i find using tables a much easier route and using flash mx for making ur own flashy buttons - rather than use these roll over buttons straight onto the html page -
if u use flash for making ur buttons - its not hard - then u save space on ur server as there is only one file to upload.
if u use a roll over button straight onto a html page - u need 2 graphics files to upload as well as ur html page which equals three files

this is what i am doing on my website - using mainly flash mx for making up my website to save room on the server - especially if the pages rely heavily on graphics

I am obsessed by Toasters - especially talking ones...bizaare really isn't it?
klariza
21
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Joined: 6th Nov 2003
Location: uk
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 00:46
oh yeh and i know absolutely nothing about css style sheets and stuff - i have tried to learn it - but i never got very far.
so the method i use above is an easy way out for me lol

I am obsessed by Toasters - especially talking ones...bizaare really isn't it?
Jess T
Retired Moderator
21
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Joined: 20th Sep 2003
Location: Over There... Kablam!
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 03:17
Quote: "iframes suck as well, especially if you have a wheel mouse. You have to have the pointer in the iframe to scroll. "


Oh.. ok.. Well, I've never personally used them, so im not sure, but i guess they arent very good then... lol... oh well...


Team EOD :: Programmer/Logical Engineer/All-Round Nice Guy
Dsarchy
21
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Joined: 4th Oct 2003
Location: UK- Kent
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 12:33
Instead of using frames you could just add "return to top" buttons. That way it is just as quick. Although I guess if your page is plasted with them that would look crap as well.

"Is it really good is a hoover sucks?"
M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 15:15
Cheers for this advice people, youve really helped. To think of the mistakes I could have made! Well what I really wanna do is for buttons, have a small icon that, when the mouse hovers over it, changes colour and acts as a hyperlink to the other pages. How'd I do that (in Fpage)?

Cheers again.

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
Dsarchy
21
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Joined: 4th Oct 2003
Location: UK- Kent
Posted: 8th Nov 2003 16:10
Dont think you use the image but I know that you can use CSS to change te look of a hyperlink.



put that into the head section.
There are lots to play with like colours/fonts/text decloration/stlye. So you might want to read up on it.

---------------------------------------------------------
or there is DHTML. (Dynamic Hyper Markup Language)

You can change the image to go from a alpha to its original colour.



put that into the head section again.
And to call it up use this piece of code in the body.


"Is it really good is a hoover sucks?"
M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 9th Nov 2003 17:41
Now things are getting complex. Cheers anyway

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
Dsarchy
21
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Joined: 4th Oct 2003
Location: UK- Kent
Posted: 9th Nov 2003 22:31
Yeah I kinda drifted away from Fpage. But to be honest Fpage is sh*t.

Drop it. Learn HTML/Javascript/CSS get on Notepad.

"Is it really good is a hoover sucks?"
klariza
21
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Joined: 6th Nov 2003
Location: uk
Posted: 10th Nov 2003 00:29
lol exactly what i think- frontpage is sh*t
i have always hated it - never could design a half decent site with it.
i am a major fan of dreamweaver mx (yes mx, not 4 or 3! lol) i find it nice and easy to use. *kisses her dreamweaver mx*

learn html? on notepad! blimey - thats going round the long way a tad isn't it?
i tend to use dreamweaver to write the code for me, then tweak it in various places.
i am crap at java script and CSS as i probably mentioned b4.

I am obsessed by Toasters - especially talking ones...bizaare really isn't it?
M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 10th Nov 2003 10:53
I havent really got time to learn any other languages with my college work going on - I am touching on macro programming in VB in Excel for my AS level in IT but thats about it. Im thinking of finding a better piece of software - something better than fpage.

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
klariza
21
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Joined: 6th Nov 2003
Location: uk
Posted: 10th Nov 2003 15:37
well that aint hard to find better software than frontpage lol (well actually i lied there - there are probably worse packages out there)
*kisses her dreamweaver mx again*

I am obsessed by Toasters - especially talking ones...bizaare really isn't it?
M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 10th Nov 2003 18:21
I get the feeling *she* likes her dreamweaver mx quite a lot. Have to look out for that one.

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//
klariza
21
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Joined: 6th Nov 2003
Location: uk
Posted: 10th Nov 2003 19:06
too right i do! lol Takes away the fun of learning the whole html language.
it is handy to one or two things about html if u want to tweak ur html page a little. But at least you don't need to know the whole language first hand and remember it.

I am obsessed by Toasters - especially talking ones...bizaare really isn't it?
klariza
21
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Joined: 6th Nov 2003
Location: uk
Posted: 10th Nov 2003 19:09 Edited at: 10th Nov 2003 19:10
ignore this silly post - i have just figured out that them dates were join dates - not dates of when posts were posted - forgive me for not looking into this too closely lol

I am obsessed by Toasters - especially talking ones...bizaare really isn't it?
M00NSHiNE
21
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Joined: 4th Aug 2003
Location: England, UK
Posted: 11th Nov 2003 21:06
Haha, lol, those dates confuse me too

ZEDWARE website coming soon... //END TRANSMISSION//

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