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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / Adding physic!

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Alduce
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 19:08 Edited at: 16th Oct 2012 19:09
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Hi again!
I slowly back to my old programming point but I really would to add some 3D physic plugin in my DBPro!

So, what the best 3D physic plugins?

And are there some free 3D physic plugins?

I was searching "newton plugin" but I don't know if it's free and I can't to find links for download!

Thank you!
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Phaelax
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 20:20
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Found these in about a minute using forum's search feature:

Dark Physics

Box 2D

Newton Wrapper

XenoPhysics (Havok Wrapper)

Quick ODE

"You're not going crazy. You're going sane in a crazy world!" ~Tick
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Alduce
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 20:42
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Thank you so mutch Phaelax, are these plugins all free?
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Phaelax
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 20:49
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I think some might be, check them out for yourself. Box 2D isn't free, I know for sure cause I have it.

"You're not going crazy. You're going sane in a crazy world!" ~Tick
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MrValentine
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 21:24
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Dark Physics is not free either but comes in the awesome bundle Dark Game Studio

Alternatively Dark Dynamix is the latest version of the PhysX engine for DBP which is a DLL Wrapper form meaning the end users need not install the NVidia PhysX software unless they want hardware accelleration which requires an NVidia GPU... the official drivers package the PhysX drivers with them...

Personally I prefer Dark Physics but when I can pull together the cash I will be going for Dark Dynamix...

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Alduce
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 21:47
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mm so is dark dynamix the last version of dark physic? right?
And with this dark dynamix I can avoid to install the NVIDIA PhysX software.

If I want to use dark physic so I need to install NVIDIA PhysX software.
all right?


And, the best FREE solution?

And about newton wrapper, XenoPhysics (Havok Wrapper) and Quick ODE what you dudes can tell?

Are these cool? are these free?
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Brendy boy
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Posted: 16th Oct 2012 23:12
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Quote: "newton wrapper"

very good, complex to set up for a begginer, FREE

Quote: " XenoPhysics (Havok Wrapper)"

unfinished, FREE

Quote: "Quick ODE"

simple to use, less features than the other plugins, FREE

BBB GUI Plugin
Landscape & Map Creator
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Alduce
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Posted: 17th Oct 2012 00:29
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Thank you!
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Matty H
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Posted: 18th Oct 2012 18:47
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Free version of Dark Dynamix has just been updated.

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Alduce
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Posted: 19th Oct 2012 22:45
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But the free version of Dark Dynamix is just a demo or a complete (maybe reduced) version of priced Dark Dynamix?

And, best Newton wrapper or Dark Dynamix about performances and frames per seconds?
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Andrew_Neale
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Posted: 20th Oct 2012 10:16 Edited at: 20th Oct 2012 10:18
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From my personal use with both, Dark Dynamix is considerably faster, offers far more features, is much easier to develop with, is based on an industry standard physics engine (PhysX) and is also continuing to be supported and developed whereas I remember reading that Newton (or at least the wrapper) is being discontinued.

I have the paid version so I'm not sure how limited the free version is, but from the look of the post where you can download it (http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&b=8&t=187776&p=0) you can still do quite a lot with it. However, buying it for £38 (http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2318) if you can afford it is a good price in my opinion for the best of the options offered by Phaelax.

Dark Physics - This is basically just an old, dodgy, hard to use version of Dark Dynamix.

Box 2D - As the name suggests this is only good for 2D and your post specifically requested 3D. Otherwise a very nice plugin though.

Newton Wrapper - I used this for years before Dark Dynamix came out but it lags behind now in efficiency, features and ease of use.

XenoPhysics (Havok Wrapper) - I have not tried this myself but it is based on Havok, the other industry standard. Having read through the thread, this may prove to be an excellent alternative in time, but I'd be wary of using it in a project whilst it is still in mid-development. I'll be keeping an eye on it though.

Quick ODE - I've very little experience with this but if I'm correct in assuming that it is the semi-implemented and unsupported physics engine that ships with DBPro then I'd avoid it.

I think the best thing you can do is to structure your code so that changing physics engine doesn't affect most of your code so that you can swap physics engines around without causing yourself problems. Then maybe start off with one of the free plugins and see how you get on. If it meets your needs then fantastic. If not, then take a look at another one and see if it fills the gaps and hopefully, because of your well structure code, you'll be able to integrate it very quickly.

Anyway, these are just my views on the physics engine side of things, so please don't take them as gospel. Work out what it is you need from your physics engine and match it up against the descriptions provided in the relevant forum threads to see which ones will cover your requirements.

Hope this helps a bit!

[Edit]Fixed some formatting issues and a misplaced bracket.[/Edit]


Previously TEH_CODERER.
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Alduce
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Posted: 20th Oct 2012 13:01 Edited at: 20th Oct 2012 13:17
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@Andrew_Neale
Thank you for your advices! Really complete description of what these physic plugins can give to me.

I will to take a look today about Dark Dynamix free version! (the v1.11) And from what I just reading seems to be really modern and optimized!

A little parentesis about Newton Wrapper:
I am a bad programmer, but from what I tested in last 3 days I really like me! Really complex structure (for my level eh..) but when I managed the Newton force and pushed my cube (thans to forum help!) I really "falled in programmer love" with Newton Wrapper!

Ok, back to your words, you're suggesting me to make my code in a way it will let me to change physic engine with a little work...
heheeh yeah dude, this is a BIG advice for me but I don't really think I am able to make a so cool code about! But I will try!


In finish, please answer me :
Is Dark dynamix in the same "vector force logic" than Newton Wrapper?
So If I want to push or rotate a cube in Newton, I just need to make a force vector and apply this vector to the object!

I think this way is the more "realistic" considering we are using physic engine! So, did Dark dynamix use (more or less) this logic way?


EDIT:
LITE VERSION DOES NOT INCLUDE:

Vehicles
Particles/Fluids
Soft Bodies
Cloth
Force Fields
Joints

WTH!! No Joints so I can't assemble my PhyxX airplane made by 6 pieces?
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Andrew_Neale
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Posted: 20th Oct 2012 15:12
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No problem, I'm glad it was useful to you!

Dark Dynamix does work like that as well; applying forces to create movement. There are commands such as 'dyn add local force' where you tell it what force to apply in each direction.

From the sounds of it though you're getting on well with Newton, so if it is handling everything you need then by all means stick with it! I always loved Newton and only moved to Dark Dynamix for the extra features (which aren't in the free version by the sounds of it) and speed it provided which for what you're doing might not be required. I guess the free version is only supposed to be a preview to encourage you to buy the full version then, because that is a lot of features missing.

In terms of writing the code to easily change engines later, it is almost like writing another wrapper. So you'd have your own set of functions such as 'Physics_AddLocalForce' which just calls the 'dyn add local force' command from the plugin and do this for various bits of functionality you need frequently so that if you change the physics engine, you then just have to change these functions rather than having to change all your code in lots of places. It takes some time to plan out and write but if you end up needing to change physics engine later on it saves so much time. Also, it is just a pretty good programming habit generally. If you were making a game in C++ for example then you might want to make it for both Windows and Mac. If you wrote your code like this then at a later stage you could swap between using DirectX and OpenGL for rendering and only have to update one bit of code rather than change your whole project.


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Alduce
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Posted: 20th Oct 2012 15:19
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Quote: "No problem, I'm glad it was useful to you!

Dark Dynamix does work like that as well; applying forces to create movement. There are commands such as 'dyn add local force' where you tell it what force to apply in each direction.

From the sounds of it though you're getting on well with Newton, so if it is handling everything you need then by all means stick with it! I always loved Newton and only moved to Dark Dynamix for the extra features (which aren't in the free version by the sounds of it) and speed it provided which for what you're doing might not be required. I guess the free version is only supposed to be a preview to encourage you to buy the full version then, because that is a lot of features missing.

In terms of writing the code to easily change engines later, it is almost like writing another wrapper. So you'd have your own set of functions such as 'Physics_AddLocalForce' which just calls the 'dyn add local force' command from the plugin and do this for various bits of functionality you need frequently so that if you change the physics engine, you then just have to change these functions rather than having to change all your code in lots of places. It takes some time to plan out and write but if you end up needing to change physics engine later on it saves so much time. Also, it is just a pretty good programming habit generally. If you were making a game in C++ for example then you might want to make it for both Windows and Mac. If you wrote your code like this then at a later stage you could swap between using DirectX and OpenGL for rendering and only have to update one bit of code rather than change your whole project."


Dude, you answer helping me very much! Thank you!
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Mage
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Posted: 21st Oct 2012 11:50
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Quote: "It takes some time to plan out and write but if you end up needing to change physics engine later on it saves so much time. Also, it is just a pretty good programming habit generally. If you were making a game in C++ for example then you might want to make it for both Windows and Mac. If you wrote your code like this then at a later stage you could swap between using DirectX and OpenGL for rendering and only have to update one bit of code rather than change your whole project."


This is a very important concept.

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Alduce
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2012 02:33
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Dudes, how the hell I can use the lite version of Dark Dynamix??
here my post in dark dynamix thread:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=200952&b=30


where I need to put all the dll and subfolders?
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