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FPSC Classic Product Chat / [LOCKED] [Question] Release Textures for free ????

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Tax 78
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Posted: 6th Jun 2013 23:55
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Hi,
Can I release these free textures?






Thanks, Tax

Sorry but I use a translator
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Le Shorte
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Posted: 7th Jun 2013 01:20
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Unfortunately no. They've still got a lot of the original texture work on them.

Yes, I live in Wisconsin. No, I don't live on a farm.
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Tomahawk
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Posted: 7th Jun 2013 03:49
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From what i understand yes. This is at least how i interpret this.

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Tax 78
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Posted: 8th Jun 2013 12:55
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Thanks for reply

Some moderator confirming negative or affirmative ???

Tax

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KeithC
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Posted: 8th Jun 2013 18:11
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Negative. As stated above; they are not edited enough. A simple change of color, etc.; is not enough of a change to put them up for general download.

-Keith

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Flatlander
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Posted: 8th Jun 2013 22:39
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Lee had told me in an email:

I don’t mind re-textures and the sharing of these textures on our standard characters. However, I don't want someone trying to sell the media as a pack that has only a little bit of work done on them.

I guess you be the judge. It looked like from Tomahawk's link (on the word "yes") that Rick Vanner said basically the same thing.


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Tax 78
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 00:46
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@KeithC
Ok thanks for confirming negative, it was just for the community

Thanks,Tax

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Teabone
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 10:13 Edited at: 9th Jun 2013 10:15
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I'm assuming its fine since they are re-textures based off of the stock media. However I'm sure if you did the same to someone's models from one of the packs they might have an issue with this since its minor colour tweaks and not completely new textures.

Since everyone has those textures already, even those owning demo copies I dont think you'd run into any problems sharing these. I think once you start doing this to textures that not everyone has... that's where you'd run into issues.

I personally think its best to only release complete re-textures.

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Tax 78
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 11:32
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@All: These textures are not for download, just for my personal use

Not for download

Tax

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Corno_1
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 13:36
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Quote: "Not for download"

Sad

But now I am completly confused. Lee and Rick said:
Quote: "We don’t mind re-textures and the sharing of these textures. The problems start when someone tries to start selling the media as some kind of pack that had little or no work done on them.
"

Quote: "I don’t mind re-textures and the sharing of these textures on our standard characters. However, I don't want someone trying to sell the media as a pack that has only a little bit of work done on them."

And now KeithC said:
Quote: "Negative. [...]they are not edited enough."

What is now right? Can we share this. I understand when you must buy a pack without you do not have the texture, but everybody can simply download the texture from here:
http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2001&page=free
and here
http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2001&page=Files
So please can someone answer this question?

Corno_1

http://cornofpsc.webs.com/

"The Corno_1 Way of Scripting" by Corno_1
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Tax 78
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 13:46
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Quote: "Sad"

Yes, is sad

Quote: "What is now right? Can we share this. I understand when you must buy a pack without you do not have the texture, but everybody can simply download the texture from here:
http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2001&page=free
and here
http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=view_product&id=2001&page=Files
So please can someone answer this question?
"


ahahahaha right, you can easily withdraw

Tax

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KeithC
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 16:58 Edited at: 9th Jun 2013 17:01
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Let me be more clear. Any re-textures that aren't complete conversions, aren't acceptable for disbursement. Some faces (for example) are untouched; as such anyone could take that portion and apply it to another model rather easily. Same goes for a few of the pairs of legs and so on.

As far as Corno's links go; does the EULA in the free version allow you to redistribute the textures/media in any way, shape or form?

We've had these discussions before; where people change the color/hue/saturation of a certain area of the texture. It's easy to reverse those changes, and get the original colored texture back. A re-texture is just that, an actual redo of the base texture...not a color change.

I appreciate that you're trying to do something for the community, and you're obviously free to do so for personal use. But you cannot redistribute these. Is that more clear?

This is my interpretation of what Rick/Lee meant. Whether it's for sale, or for giveaway; the result is the same.

-Keith

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BlackFox
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 17:20 Edited at: 9th Jun 2013 17:22
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Linking to a post that was made 6 years ago is a little pointless. The best approach would be for either Tax or the moderator(s) to contact Rick or Lee directly and ask them for clarification. Info and positions can change, and it is best to get it from the source. This way there is something to refer to if someone cries "foul". We cannt use "well so and so got an email from Lee and he said blah blah blah" because that is third party information that cannot be referred to if needed. Besides, we have to ask permission from individual artists to retexture their media (ex: bond, Errant, etc) so the same should be for the stock media as well. By having one of the two "higher powers" confirm in a post, then there is something that can be referred to which protects those involved.


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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Flatlander
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 17:24
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I'm sorry Mr. moderator, but your interpretation is way off on stock characters.

Again, Lee told me, "I don’t mind re-textures and the sharing of these textures on our standard characters . . ."

I'm not sure how you have gained so much power but it really sucks.

This is now a good time for me now to bow out of these hopeless conversations as well as these hopeless forums with hopeless moderators!!!!

Bye all. I've been wanting to leave for some time now.


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BlackFox
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 17:28
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Quote: "I'm sorry Mr. moderator, but your interpretation is way off on stock characters.

Again, Lee told me, "I don’t mind re-textures and the sharing of these textures on our standard characters . . ."

I'm not sure how you have gained so much power but it really sucks.

This is now a good time for me now to bow out of these hopeless conversations as well as these hopeless forums with hopeless moderators!!!!

Bye all. I've been wanting to leave for some time now."


I think that is a little harsh coming from someone with experience. If Lee says that, then why not have him or Rick post it themselves. Having members repeating it only adds to the confusion. Besides, moderators have final say. We may not like it, but they can always get clarification and retract/correct their decision. What does it teach new members when we older members lash out at the moderators?


There's no problem that can't be solved without applying a little scripting.
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KeithC
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 17:33
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Color changing some portion isn't a re-texture Mr. Flatlander. It's simply adding a color overlay on some parts, or simply cutting out a few areas into their own layers, changing the hue/saturation/color...and then re-merging them into the single layer again.

The "power" I've gained, is at the pleasure of the owners of this site, and the numerous years I've been here cleaning up innumerable crisis and messes. As well as members throwing temper-tantrums.

You've done a lot for this Community in the past, I hope you change your mind; but, if not, farewell and good luck in what you do in the future.

-Keith

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xplosys
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 17:58
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I remember the original post by Lee being redefined on a few occasions, but I won't go looking for the posts.

There obviously needs to be a distinction between a "re-texture" and changing the color values. Does adjusting the brightness or contrast count as a "re-texture"? Was any new "texture" applied to the original texture?

If the old ruling is allowed to stand then I'm leaving the forum!!!!

Brian.
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Tax 78
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 18:48
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@KeithC
Quote: "I appreciate that you're trying to do something for the community, and you're obviously free to do so for personal use. But you cannot redistribute these. Is that more clear?
"

Not problem is clear

@AllGuys, I did not mean to cause all this discussion, it was just a question, and the answer I was given is sufficient.
Please, anyone to not leave the forum.

For me, the discussion may be closed

Tax

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s4real
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 21:45 Edited at: 9th Jun 2013 21:45
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The re-texture issue was brought up a long time ago when I did some re-textures for some stock characters many moons ago and I got banned for it.

There was no rules at the time if re-textures where aloud so the mod banned me at the time, I email lee and rick at the time and they unbanned me and said this was ok and did not break any copy right laws or forum rules.

But there is rules what is classed as a re-texture or not.

The re-texture has to be 100% your own work and not have any of the original texture in place.

If you do re-texture the stock and is not 100% then you have to email lee or rick to get permission to have it posted on the forum ot the original author.

These rules where put in place after my re-textures where put on the forum maybe there should be a sticky with these rules so people know what is classed as a re-texture.

Just changing the colour is def not classed as a re-texture and Keith is right to say its not aloud.


Sorry to see you go flatlander and think you taken it a bit far but if you want to go then don't blame a mod for doing his job.

best s4real

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rolfy
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 22:27 Edited at: 9th Jun 2013 22:38
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When asking permission to release these kind of textures it is not appropriate to ask anyone but the original creator or owner of the media, if you ask on the forum your going to get different interpretations as can be seen here.
Even if a model pack or software is distributed free the license often remains the same, I have pointed out to members around here before that the retextures they were posting were not enough for release and been duly ignored.

It might be best to not allow any distribution of retextures at all without proper permission from TGC, it is no more difficult or time consuming to e-mail Lee or Rick than it is to post asking here.

By insisting a mod answer the question you force their hand and they will take the path of least resistance and say no, they really dont have any more right to give permission than anyone else around here and if they say yes and the author says no then they are held responsible.

I don't trip over...I do random gravity checks.
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Wolf
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Posted: 9th Jun 2013 23:04
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Changing colors or applying some brushes or filters is not a retexture. <- the whole thing in short.

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Without struggle,no progress and no result.Every breaking of habit produces a change in the machine.
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Teabone
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Posted: 10th Jun 2013 03:02
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I agree with Wolf there.

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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jun 2013 08:03
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Just to update everyone. I've talked to Rick about this (and he's seen the work here), and he agrees that this isn't enough of a re-texture to be able to distribute freely. So there's your "official" answer on the matter.

Also keep in mind, that the OP in this thread did come here to ask before posting them. So kudos to him for doing so. If anyone is ever questioning whether or not they can distribute something similar; it wouldn't hurt to start a thread like this, before making anything available for download.

I'm locking this now, as it's run its course.

-Keith

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