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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / DBP General Questions and Announcements

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MrValentine
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 07:16
Not fully understanding this thread yet, but just wanted to tag in as post 101, shall catch up now and see if I can help in here too

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 07:39 Edited at: 14th Jul 2014 07:40
Quote: "Not fully understanding this thread yet, but just wanted to tag in as post 101, shall catch up now and see if I can help in here too"


LoL... hiya Mr. V!

This "mutt" thread is a creation of mine, with the intent of providing a refuge from having to start a whole new thread for minor chit-chatty things... it's sort of like Arnold's restaurant, if you're familiar with the old sitcom Happy Days - or perhaps more like a cold, dank alley on a stormy Thursday in mid-November. But I digress... welcome to our fractured discussion.

By the way, as an AppGameKit backer, can you provide any info the current available version of AppGameKit in regards to the 3D objects situation?

I believe I read that object animations don't work yet, but that's ok, I have a couple of ideas that wouldn't require animated models.

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MrValentine
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 08:23
You can see updates and look at the stretch goals to see where everything is at the moment here https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/tgc/app-game-kit-v2/posts

Click on the deceptive 'Home' next to where it says 'Updates' at the top, as a web developer I would never ever give it that title...

Maybe Project Info or just Information... Home is so... daft

Anyway there are no help documents containing Anim other than Sprites in the help documentation for the latest Alpha release...

Feels so awkward seeing the blackberry logo there >.< I think they should focus on the three main platforms, adding Blackberry is not really profitable for devs or TGC... but that is my opinion entirely... [Kindle Fire or Amazon is actually picking up pace and I think should also be considered as a publishing point too!]

There are Shaders btw both for 3D and Sprites... I assume the first below is for 3D Objects... [Ask me in about a month what everything in AppGameKit does as I will be tearing through the command set as soon as I can to get up to speed with what I have missed over the years since AppGameKit was released, Purchased it in Release month and never really touched it beyond compiling samples]

'''
SetObjectShader

Description

Sets the shader used to draw this object, the shader must have been loaded with LoadShader. A shader is like a script sent to the GPU to tell it how to combine the polygon and texture data to display it on screen. By default objects are assigned an internal shader that can handle 1 diffuse texture (in stage 0) and up to 2 lights (1 directional light, 1 point light). If you use a shader ID of 0 the object is assigned the internal shader.
''''''
SetSpriteShader

Description

Sets the shader used to draw this sprite, loaded with LoadSpriteShader or Loadshader. By default sprites are assigned an internal shader that can handle 1 texture and a color. If you use a shader ID of 0 the sprite is assigned the internal shader.
'''

Hope that answers the Shader questions from earlier...

Quote: "old sitcom Happy Days"


So many reminders that I am getting older day by day lol...

Judging by the current progress, the IDE is being worked on now, and should be done mid August if not the start of August...

And then it will be stretch Goal 3 for 3D related expansion including Animation, which I think will be September~ by my guestimation...

I am looking forward to completion and inclusion of proper physics [Bullet, Goal 4] which will allow some good rapid testing for mobile development kits as well as clean coding without plug-ins getting in the way ^^ something I am guilty of doing, But I solely use DBPro for Prototyping to see if an idea works really... and plug-ins help greatly!

Quote: "hiya Mr. V!"


Hello Back

Quote: "welcome to our fractured discussion."


Fractures lead to solutions in my view point [Look at what the Egyptians did with tell-tale blocks and you will see what I mean]

I had been following this thread, but only when the RSS feed was alive... [I moan a lot about that, but it really saves 70-80% of my getting up to speed with what is going on around the forum, as you know I am in many boats here aside from FPS C/R...]

I have read all 100 err plus this page 2 [I use 100 posts per page] So I am up to speed here

So much stuff going on in my books lately, hope to help out more here soon...

STYX is a plug-in I Swear by, so highly recommend it as your first purchase, I avoid using M1U as I like to support TGC as much as possible and have purchased practically everything DBPro related, just missing NGC I think of the useful plug-ins...

Ask me about any plug-ins you find aside from 2D Plug-n kit which does not work beyond XP as far as I know as the samples just die... and Dark Video as it is redundant today... it should be removed tbh... and not Nuclear Glory but I should have that soon, ignore Pure Plugin as from what I know the developer has absconded?

Uhh I better zip it for now lol I have begun writing a novel and cannot stop typing when I start lately

Hope this was useful!

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 17:11
Quote: "Hope this was useful!"


Always!
I had hoped a general "hangout" thread like this would be beneficial for everyone, and it seems to be the case. I've learned way more on these threads than I could ever teach/research myself.

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MrValentine
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 17:25
Why do I feel as though I am the only DBPro coder in the North-West lol

How many of you would like to see fully tested and documented DBPro command sets? With at least three (where possible) example implementations?

I am making this for Windows 8.1 but also considering eBook releases along side the apps...

I cannot ask for contributions as this will be a paid product... Which means I must truly master DBPro alone, Oh Joy 😂 hehe

I am also working on a tutorial app which will be released on Windows Phone 📱 8.1 as well Windows 8.1 and Kindle and possibly another distribution channel which I am exploring soon...

I also began work on a Sci-Fi Novel

Oh, leaked info on my projects complete

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 21:25
Quote: "How many of you would like to see fully tested and documented DBPro command sets? With at least three (where possible) example implementations?"


Sounds promising! So you're trying to document all existing commands, as well as the most popular plugins including stuff like like Sparky's and Matrix1Utils?

Or did I misunderstand, and you actually meant a set of your own custom commands?

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MrValentine
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 21:34
Not the free ones, there is plenty of information and support for them...

I will run a poll on future users for which plug-in they would like extensively documented, but, the free plug-ins are not a focus point for me yet...

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 14th Jul 2014 23:49
Quote: "I will run a poll on future users for which plug-in they would like extensively documented, but, the free plug-ins are not a focus point for me yet..."


Cool! An area of interest for me personally are the CSG commands. I've had hit-and-miss success with them, and I think there's a lot of potential there, if their mysterious nature can be explained!

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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 17th Jul 2014 17:28
The user-made fonts on fontstruct.com look really awesome. I might give it a go if I ever have an idea for an original font!

666GO†O666
Stab in the Dark software
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Posted: 18th Jul 2014 18:39
Quote: "Cool! An area of interest for me personally are the CSG commands. I've had hit-and-miss success with them, and I think there's a lot of potential there, if their mysterious nature can be explained!"



The CSG commands in DBPro are not very good even if you know how they work.
I developed better CSG commands for DBPro.
The CSG commands keep the UV and normals from the original objects.
They will be part of a Physics plugin that is under development.
Check out this post, there is a demo you can download and test.


http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=210697&b=1

[img][/img]


WindowsXP SP3,Vista,Windows 7 SP1, DBpro v7.7RC7
Stab In The Dark Editor
The coffee is lovely dark and deep,and I have code to write before I sleep.
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 19th Jul 2014 03:25 Edited at: 19th Jul 2014 03:29
Quote: "The CSG commands in DBPro are not very good even if you know how they work."


DBPro's anything isn't very good according to most users... yet here we are clinging around it like microbes on an asteroid.

I don't expect miracles, but I'd still like to see a nice addendum detailing what's actually happening (or supposed to happen) with the 4 basic commands.


Quote: "I developed better CSG commands for DBPro."


Yes, I've tried your demo (which is excellent) and have already passed out twice from holding my breath waiting for it!

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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2014 19:29
Does anyone know of a DBP or Matrix1Utils command that will return the path of an object's texture after the object has been saved and then reloaded?

My goal is to create new objects from the limbs of existing objects and keep the same texture. (I realize I can manually name the limbs, but is there a way to find out its texture path without having to manually save any info?)

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wattywatts
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2014 19:44
Well I just checked out the kickstarter link Mr V posted, the 3D sounds solid, I wonder if it is. Actually, WTF? Everything they listed was supposed to be done by Feb 2014 and yet the agk site still says "Our 3D commands will follow later after the core version has been rolled out to the most popular platforms." V2 isn't even listed anywhere.
Shady, shady, shady.
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 23rd Jul 2014 20:31 Edited at: 23rd Jul 2014 20:32
Quote: "Shady, shady, shady."


LoL... I think it's because TGC is such a small company that their aspirations outweigh their manpower.

It would be nice to have clearer documentation on AGK's progress, since they collected donations for this product. I haven't donated anything myself, but I would like to purchase AppGameKit at some point when I feel comfortable with the progress reports.

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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 24th Jul 2014 20:36
New code snippet in the 20 Line Challenge forum.

(Thanks to Chafari for the inspiration.)

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SamKM
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Posted: 24th Jul 2014 23:35
Quote: "Does anyone know of a DBP or Matrix1Utils command that will return the path of an object's texture "

Might not be much help, but I'm guessing you already know the 'limb texture' command? It works on objects too if you give the limb number as zero

The code never bothered me anyway...
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 25th Jul 2014 06:19 Edited at: 25th Jul 2014 06:31
Quote: "I'm guessing you already know the 'limb texture' command? "


Nope! I really don't know how that command works. I've neither used it nor ever understood it.

Quote: "DBP HELP: "Limbs that have been loaded pre-textured contain internal image data and return an image number of zero.""


Does this mean the command only works for images loaded with LOAD IMAGE? What I need is access to a pre-textured object's texture (as in an object that's already been saved with a texture and loaded again with LOAD OBJECT.)

It seems like after an object has been textured and saved, DBP then knows the name of the file to look for to load it again. Obviously the texture itself is not stored in the object file, just a reference to it, so the object data must have the texture's file name in there somewhere, right?

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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 25th Jul 2014 06:36
Could LIMB TEXTURE NAME possibly be what I'm looking for?

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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 25th Jul 2014 06:44 Edited at: 25th Jul 2014 06:45
!-Eureka Streaker-!

My faith is restored.



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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 25th Jul 2014 06:57
Some textures I made with pixlr yesterday... free to use.







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chafari
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2014 19:53
Quote: "(Thanks to Chafari for the inspiration.)"


I made a little change to your code in your site .I hope you don't mind.

Cheers.

I'm not a grumpy grandpa
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 5th Aug 2014 08:23 Edited at: 5th Aug 2014 08:29
Quote: "I made a little change to your code in your site .I hope you don't mind. "


Not at all! Variety is the spice of life... and paprika is a good one too.

Here's a very basic color slider finder thingy I made for my map editor. It could be shorter perhaps:



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chafari
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Posted: 5th Aug 2014 12:43
Quote: "Not at all! Variety is the spice of life... and paprika is a good one too"


Short and practice...from time to time we need something like this code to guess color values.

Cheers.

I'm not a grumpy grandpa
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 10th Aug 2014 04:39 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 04:44
Hello all,
I'm trying to capture a picture of this sphere, but all I get is a black image. I'm pretty sure I did something like this at work the other day. What am I doing wrong? Is it my computer??



UPDATE:

Looks like throwing a SYNC in there did the trick.



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Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Aug 2014 07:17 Edited at: 10th Aug 2014 07:59
@DerekDarkly
Indenting your code would make it much easier to read. The actual code looks okay to me though.

---------------------

I just noticed that I use white space in a pretty disciplined way. I didn't even realise I had these rules until editing someone's code who uses white space very differently to me.
I always group similar lines together, such as assigning values to variables, but then I will leave a gap if need to put something different afterwards, like a condition.
Multi-line commands have no gaps between their nested levels.
Multi-line commands always have a gap before and after (unless the line before or after is its parent's opening/closing statement), even if next to similar multi-lined commands.
Example:


It's weird how I have made such rigid rules without even realising it.

------------------------

Interestingly, I stumbled upon a blog talking about Dark Basic and the author recommended getting DBC over DBP, because 90% of search results on Dark Basic will be information on Classic.

---------------------------

Am I getting this thread right? It is a general chat about Dark Basic coding?

Formerly OBese87.
MrValentine
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Posted: 11th Aug 2014 16:28 Edited at: 11th Aug 2014 16:28
DBPro / DBP General Questions and Announcements

not sure I might be reading the P in DBP wrong...

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 11th Aug 2014 21:57 Edited at: 11th Aug 2014 22:00
Quote: "It's weird how I have made such rigid rules without even realising it. "


LoL... i think at the end of the day we're all creatures of habit. What's familiar to us is usually what looks "right".. another person's way usually looks wrong. I am admittedly guilty of ignoring industry standards. I took the same renegade approach to learning guitar - ignoring how to read sheet music and memorizing countless chord variations, and just teaching myself by ear and playing what I liked.

Quote: "DBPro / DBP General Questions and Announcements
not sure I might be reading the P in DBP wrong...
"


Was that a shameless plug? LoL

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MrValentine
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Posted: 11th Aug 2014 22:01
Quote: "Heh... i think the 'P' might stand for pond."


Or Penguin

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 14th Aug 2014 06:37 Edited at: 14th Aug 2014 06:38
A hand-drawn (mirrored) tennis ball texture with noise and engrave effects. I messed up the outer curves but it's just a rough draft and I can't draw well anyway. Feel free to use it.

I'm thinking of doing something with exploding tennis balls.



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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 14th Aug 2014 06:42 Edited at: 14th Aug 2014 06:43


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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 15th Aug 2014 05:12
Messing with the native reflection shading..
Quite fun, but the slowdown is noticeable.



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Derek Darkly
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Posted: 26th Aug 2014 19:06 Edited at: 26th Aug 2014 19:08
Just want to applaud MateiSoft Romania who is making some good progress with his "Glue Engine" which will eventually be an entire game editor. (Why would I promote someone else's product? Look at the video and you'll see the full potential of what's going on there.)

I remember some of his early uploads that didn't work so well, but it looks like he's really taking his time with the details of this project. While many complain about DBPro, he appears to be taking full advantage of what's already available. Definitely one to keep an eye on!



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MrValentine
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Posted: 26th Aug 2014 19:21
But is that using DBPro? GDK?

James H
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Posted: 26th Aug 2014 20:40
Mr V, looks dbp(maybe gdk) with evolved shaders minus terrain and a gui(maybe BBB) with some import/positional control and combining of primitive media and some csg to me. I ended up skipping through it due to boredom so maybe I missed other stuff, but I could only see the gui used as a plan rather than totally functional, example the terrain wasnt shown and evolved hasnt produced an editable terrain demo yet
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 26th Aug 2014 20:57 Edited at: 26th Aug 2014 20:58
Quote: "But is that using DBPro? GDK?"


He told me he was using DBP and C++.
He didn't mention anything else, but he might pop in and tell us.

Functionality does appear to be limited still, but I like what he has so far. Nice, clean looking app.

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TheComet
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Posted: 27th Aug 2014 03:08 Edited at: 27th Aug 2014 04:27
@Derek Darkly
Those are the exact same shaders evolved is using here:
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=211683&b=1

What's going on?

R.I.P.
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 27th Aug 2014 17:25
Quote: "Those are the exact same shaders evolved is using here:
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=211683&b=1

What's going on?"


I noticed that. My best guess is that he is planning on using them.
Heck, I don't see why anyone wouldn't. Evolved himself says it cool.

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wattywatts
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Posted: 27th Aug 2014 18:36
Quote: "I don't see why anyone wouldn't"

The advanced lighting system in particular seems a bit volatile to me. I tried the Malevolence demo, which apparently uses it, and had very strange graphical problems. I looked at their forums and saw that other people were having different problems that I wasn't. I just don't think it's predictable on various PC's, though I wouldn't have a clue why.
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 27th Aug 2014 22:28 Edited at: 27th Aug 2014 22:29
Quote: "The advanced lighting system in particular seems a bit volatile to me. "


I'm not very familiar with any advanced lights... are you talking about the lighting shaders on Evolved's site?

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wattywatts
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Posted: 27th Aug 2014 22:51
No the individual shaders appear to be fine, the advanced lighting system is a whole network of shaders that can be called and used simultaneously.
Take the cubic light shader, it can handle lighting and normal mapping, but that's it. You can't add other shaders to the same object. With the ALS you can combine whatever shaders you want, such as global directional lighting with parallax. (at least, that's my understanding of it so far)
It's a great idea, but has some problems on various PC's for reasons I'm not aware of.
http://www.evolved-software.com/advancedlighting/advancedlighting
Ortu
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Posted: 28th Aug 2014 00:09
I believe malevolence uses the old AL system, evolved has done a major overhaul if not a complete rewrite. these newer screens all use this newer system. It seems to be a bit more stable in general, and can do a good bit more, but it definitely will run into problems on older cards.

The dbpro code which hooks it all together is not easy to dig through, and it is even more difficult to extract specific portions out of the larger system, or to add new components to it, but I think it has a ton of potential for those who are not experts in working with shaders.

wattywatts
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Posted: 28th Aug 2014 00:40
Quote: "The dbpro code which hooks it all together is not easy to dig through, and it is even more difficult to extract specific portions out of the larger system, or to add new components to it, but I think it has a ton of potential for those who are not experts in working with shaders."

Couldn't agree more. Great bit of code, not an easy read.

Would be very difficult to debug on something like what Mateisoft is working on, which could potentially be installed on a lot of different hardware configurations.
Derek Darkly
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Posted: 29th Aug 2014 02:31
Hey, what about an "ICE BUCKET CHALLENGE GAME MAKING CHALLENGE" thread? Anyone wanna spearhead that? Maybe set an end of October deadline? Just a thought.

The ALS ice bucket challenge is huge here in the states right now... what about in Europe? Is that a "thing" over there also?

Could draw some attention to TGC products if a bunch of tribute games were coded. A good one for AppGameKit developers, especially.



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Ortu
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Posted: 29th Aug 2014 10:40
General Announcement:

I've put a new WIP up for a large, long term project

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=211983&b=8&msg=2531635#m2531635

Derek Darkly
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Posted: 29th Aug 2014 21:12 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2014 06:20
Quote: "I've put a new WIP up for a large, long term project"


Looks good!
You've obviously put a lot of work into it.

But why is your video framerate so choppy? Is it the program or just the vid?

Quel
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Posted: 30th Aug 2014 01:00
Oh where - oh where could such a thing start spreading from if not from the states, good job!

It's like everybody makes up a single big idiot entity on Earth nowadays.
Ortu
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Posted: 30th Aug 2014 07:26 Edited at: 30th Aug 2014 08:45
It's the vid Derek, and what's strange is that it wasn't even choppy while recording, but the playback almost seems to be dropping every other frame. It also has a lot of visual color banding that isn't present in actual game play.

I need to experiment more with the capture settings I think.

edit:

Well here is a quick little bit from fraps without the lag. Updated into the intro post as well



Derek Darkly
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Posted: 10th Sep 2014 08:40 Edited at: 10th Sep 2014 08:42
I was toying with ideas for generating cloud textures and I saw that someone used several faded/offset sprites to create a nice blur effect. I combined this with the natural puffiness of spheres and came up with a decent start.



Derek Darkly
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Posted: 10th Sep 2014 08:41
[pic for above post]

Ortu
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Posted: 11th Sep 2014 03:33
Nice! Clever

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