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Geek Culture / I really really hate windows 8

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Seppuku Arts
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Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 30th Apr 2014 04:31
For me the *worse* Windows experiences I've had have been with 98SE and XP. Vista worked at least, it was just horribly bloated. My best experiences have been with 7 and 8, each still have their flaws. But my earlier experiences with Windows could have very well had me go to one of the alternatives. In an alternate reality I could be typing this message on MacOS and not Windows 8. Thankfully Microsoft have redeemed themselves.

I don't think Windows 8 is going to ever be held on a pedestal, too many dislike the design, but it was to bring in to perspective that I don't know of a single OS that's been solid for everybody out of the box. I am one of the minority when it comes to Windows 8. I wouldn't be able to say if I prefer 8 to 7, whilst all my PC's now use 8, but that's because I own a hard copy of 8 and have only have 7 pre-installed on stuff, but I use Windows 7 at work, it was a nice performance boost when they upgraded. I think my main complaint when it comes to new OS releases and that's backwards compatibility. You can find some stuff runs brilliantly, but there's often something that's affected. Prolly why Win 7 Pro came with Windows XP mode.

nonZero
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Location: Dark Empire HQ, Otherworld, Silent Hill
Posted: 30th Apr 2014 12:27 Edited at: 30th Apr 2014 12:28
What annoys me more than Win8* itself is the ecosystem around it. OEMs are now pre-installing it on all new laptops. I find that annoying. But I get it's the latest OS so "why wouldn't everyone want it?" (for a multitude of reasons). Then, as mentioned, there's the lack of compatibility and legacy support (I've also heard tell of many manufacturers not making Win7 drivers). When I add it up, I get the feeling we're being forced into a new era. That's not fair. Why must the corporate world dictate to the consumer? It's /supposed/ to be the other way around. If the new generation of Windows hasn't addressed my concerns by the time I'm unable to use Win7 any more, then it'll be the last MS OS I ever use. Right now I use Windows and Linux. If Win8 is the future, then I may as well go full Linux in spite of the losing the many Windows apps I do happen to like. Honestly, I'd make that sacrifice just to escape this "future" that MS has decided for me.
To look at it in a positive light: if I'm forced to go pure Linux, it'll be like ripping off a band-aid.


You're a bad man!
bitJericho
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Posted: 30th Apr 2014 19:23
Well, the techies are not the majority of customers. Only the techies appear to hate windows 8, just as they hated all new Windows OSes before it.

Phaelax
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Location: Metropia
Posted: 1st May 2014 00:11
Quote: "For me the *worse* Windows experiences I've had have been with 98SE and XP"


Figures, the two that worked! 98se was great at the time. I used win2k pro for many years but once I finally switched to xp I noticed it was indeed more stable. (2k was still great though and some things did still run faster on it)

Quote: "Only the techies appear to hate windows 8, just as they hated all new Windows OSes before it."

My VP of ecommerce insisted on having vista on all our laptops when it came out. I'm like, hey look guy, I can't run eclipse through a vm on a vista laptop with only 2gb of ram.

I'm sure we can all agree though that ME was by far the worst

Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 1st May 2014 00:32
Quote: "I'm sure we can all agree though that ME was by far the worst"
My dad has had an ME computer running for the last 14 or so years. He runs it most of the day, almost every day, and he says it's never given him any issues at all. He works in the IT field, too. But from what I hear about ME, his computer must be a freak of nature.

Jack
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Location: [Germany]
Posted: 1st May 2014 00:37
Windows 98 - Good

Windows 2000/NT - Bad

Windows XP - Good

Windows Vista - Bad

Windows 7 - Good

Windows 8 - Bad

[/url]
Seppuku Arts
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Location: Cambridgeshire, England
Posted: 1st May 2014 00:42
Quote: "My VP of ecommerce insisted on having vista on all our laptops when it came out. I'm like, hey look guy, I can't run eclipse through a vm on a vista laptop with only 2gb of ram.

I'm sure we can all agree though that ME was by far the worst"


I was lucky to have not experienced ME then.

Also, where I work decided to all upgrade to Windows 7, which is nice and everything is lot more responsive, problem #1 is that the database system we use was designed for older versions of IE and compatibility mode, whilst it helps a lot, it is not without its flaws. Problem #2, for quite some time it was incompatible with a software system used to aid customers. But it now works with the new updated version.

By contrast, where I worked before that, they were still on MSDOS, the manager had a very "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" kind of attitude. This day and age we don't appreciate exactly how much customer data can be squeezed onto a single floppy disk. I suppose it's a fair attitude, never had the system crash on me, where I work now, it occasionally happens.

bitJericho
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Posted: 1st May 2014 01:25
Quote: "Windows 2000/NT - Bad"


What are you smoking? First of all Windows NT is not Windows 2000. Windows 2000 is considered the greatest Windows OS ever released. Go read up on it.

Windows ME never caused me any trouble, but there was very little offered over 98SE

Kevin Picone
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Posted: 1st May 2014 08:16
it's not just techies, for example my niece sold here brand new win8 laptop to buy a second hand win 7 one.

Libervurto
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Posted: 3rd May 2014 23:51
Quote: "the database system we use was designed for older versions of IE and compatibility mode"

What is this? I keep seeing this sort of thing. Why on earth would a database be dependent on a particular version of IE? Why would it be bound to ANY program? Can't people build databases that output plain text? Does database software not come with some kind of interface? What the hell is going on here?

Formerly OBese87.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 4th May 2014 00:06
Quote: "What is this? I keep seeing this sort of thing. Why on earth would a database be dependent on a particular version of IE? Why would it be bound to ANY program? Can't people build databases that output plain text? Does database software not come with some kind of interface? What the hell is going on here?"


Perhaps I didn't clarify it very well. There's nothing wrong with the database, it's the interface, it's a web application. It occasionally gives us errors, I suspect, just by the correlation of us upgrading to Windows 7 and needing to run IE in compatibility mode that it is the cause of the stability issues. As a man of science, I will accepts that it could well be a coincidence and has coincided with a problem elsewhere, after all, correlation does not equal causation. I've not heard the minute remaining XP users complain, perhaps because they don't moan, or because it's not happening to them.

It's infrequent and the database itself is unaffected, after all, the database is purely server side and what happens client side has absolutely nothing to do with how the database works. It just means on the odd occasion we have to restart IE and log back in. An inconvenience, but not a disaster. I can use it without losing my data, it just means I may need to occasionally copy and paste when it fails on me.

BatVink
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Posted: 4th May 2014 09:25
Sepukku, your server-side scripts are just delivering HTML, I would suggest not investing energy in the database activity in respect of Windows client upgrades. But Perhaps your web server team upgraded PHP or MySQL or ASP or SQL Server depending on your platform?

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 4th May 2014 10:25 Edited at: 4th May 2014 10:40
I know that's what it's doing server side, it's poor wording on my part, I refer to the Web Application for interfacing with the database and not the database itself. I believe, judging by file extensions they're using JavaServer Pages.

I did a Google search, it does sounds like some folks get problems with JSP on newer versions of IE, so I suspect it's related. We have to run it in compatibility mode for pages to render properly, but it occasionally have problems. Given we have to enable a series of active x controls as well, I suspect it could be related.

However, it's not my job to debug it, I don't even know where the team responsible are based, I'm a mere call centre minion and I do as I am told...most of the time.

Libervurto
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Posted: 4th May 2014 18:19
I have heard quite a few people complain that they have to use old versions of IE at work because its linked somehow to their business software. I don't understand this as I've never worked in an office. Whatever the reason it seems totally backward.

Formerly OBese87.
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Posted: 4th May 2014 19:28 Edited at: 4th May 2014 19:31
Things would be better if Ballmer were still around.



Oh, and Jack, I've corrected your list:

Quote: "Windows 98 - Good

Windows ME - Bad

Windows XP - Good

Windows Vista - Bad

Windows 7 - Good

Windows 8 - Bad"


nonZero
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Posted: 4th May 2014 22:48 Edited at: 4th May 2014 23:04
Quote: "I've not heard the minute remaining XP users complain, perhaps because they don't moan, or because it's not happening to them."

Minute number of XP users? Clearly things are different than in my country. I'd say at least a quarter to a third of the long-standing small businesses out here still run XP. That ain't just "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"-mentality, either. Loads don't even know support has ended (although has it? I mean MS released that recent patch after XP expired). Yeah. And the majority of, er, to put it lightly, er, "technologically-challenged" and/or "financially-challenged" people run XP. It's still big here. It'll stay that way until the PCs break. Scary to think how different the mentality is out here (RSA).

Quote: "I have heard quite a few people complain that they have to use old versions of IE at work because its linked somehow to their business software. I don't understand this as I've never worked in an office. Whatever the reason it seems totally backward."

I'm not sure but it may be because IE is a Windows component, after all, not just an arbitrary free browser. It probably supports scripting or has an API or something. I've never used it or gotten involved in it because IE had more holes than a block of swiss cheese when I first became a netizen so I started with Firefox and still use it today. In any event, I agree that it's backwards to build software on IE. Software should be as agnostic and portable as possible once it's out of prototyping phase.


You're a bad man!
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 5th May 2014 00:34
Quote: "Minute number of XP users?"


In the building. Like 95% of our computers now run Windows 7.

Phaelax
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Posted: 5th May 2014 01:17
Quote: " have to use old versions of IE at work because its linked somehow to their business software."


I've found lots of in-house web-based software uses activeX controls or tested specifically only in that current version of IE. It's dumb, but it happens.

easter bunny
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Posted: 7th May 2014 04:21
Here is Aus, the banks still use XP


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BatVink
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Posted: 7th May 2014 10:48
There are banks in the UK that still use Windows 2000. Mainly because it's stable and just works.

I guess it's like NASA on a smaller scale. If something works well and your business relies on it, don't replace it with something that will almost certainly introduce problems.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 7th May 2014 10:54
That's right, hence when I worked at Cash Converters they were still using DOS, well it worked and we never once had a problem with it.

nonZero
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Posted: 7th May 2014 12:26 Edited at: 7th May 2014 12:33
Cash Converters in the UK? I never knew they were international. Wow. As for DOS, many POS machines out here still run DOS (because they're still running from ancient times) or a homebrew (probably Linux/BSD-based) strain without a graphical environment. They use basic ASCII chars to draw the sales screen and that's it. It doesn't look too bad using ASCII 219 (dunno what it is in Unicode) & co on a hi-res (well 768/720p) screen.
The freaky thing is when you see one with a touch screen because most of the latest hardware is obviously supported. Makes you do a double-take!
I've heard many reasons for intentionally not using a graphical environment in a homebrew POS system but my favourite was from an IT guy, "They probably did it like this so the staff can't [expletive] with it [cos they don't know how]."

"Oh nonZero, let me tell you, I love you." -- Dark Java Dude 64, Vice-Kapitan of nASA(nonZero's Awesomeness-Spreading Association)

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