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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Proof that piracy does *not* pay...

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Jeku
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 19:35
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Hey everyone,

I found an interesting short article on Gamespot that tells the account of a guy who was recently charged with 50 months prison and ordered to pay $700,000 in restitution for selling pirated games! That is quite a heavy sentence and should be a warning for those involved.

Here's the link: http://www.gamespot.com/all/news/news_6089247.html

While they probably won't go after the smalltime guys, you can be sure they've acquired names and addresses of this guy's customers, and this won't be the first time they charge somebody so heavily for this


http://www.jeku.com/audio/
Ancient Chinese proverb: Man who runs behind car gets exhausted.
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Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 19:41
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Jeez! They didn't even buy the originals! They posed as magazine reviewers to get the originals before pirating them.

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John H
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 19:50
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Ha! Take THAT!


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Dazzag
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 20:04
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I don't agree with piracy, but it has always been this way. The "dealer" gets heavy handed big style, and the users are pretty much ignored. Look at drugs. Slap on hand for users, and dealers go to jail 'n stuff.

Otherwise I would be quaking over my (rather large) collection of old albums I copied to tape years ago.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 20:32
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*instantly deleted everything on his pc* i admit im a smalldoer... but if i cant afford the software, either way the company wont get money... as soon as i saved up the money i'd go out and buy it (soz if this sounds like its encouraging warez cos i dont mean to)

edit: KIDZ! you may think its ok to be cool like me and become a smalldoer like cool old froog, but it isn't, cos there are times when u cant control urselves and go overbord... kids! DONT SMOKE! oh right i was on about WAREZ... SMOKE... but dont do warez

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Jonny_S
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 20:58
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LOL *runs from the FBI*........while smoking

Supermonkey - The crime gifhting sex god monkey!
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nuclear glory
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 21:04
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I was surprised by the number of people that tried to talk me into using pirated software for game design, even before NG got off the ground. I don't operate that way, and for good reason (as we can see from above)

Could you imagine what would happen if you built a large company and the foundation was laid with pirated software!? You'd be a very large target. They'd take everything, including your shirt.

Lead Programmer/Director
Powerful Collision DLL for DBPro and DBC: http://www.nuclearglory.com
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Neophyte
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 22:38
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@nuclear glory

"Could you imagine what would happen if you built a large company and the foundation was laid with pirated software!?"

No need to imagine. Its already happened.
[href] http://pc.ign.com/articles/490/490038p1.html[/href]
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Preston C
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Posted: 12th Feb 2004 22:53
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Yeah, I'm against piracy in every way. Programmers motos should be "If You Can't Buy it, Make it!"

Cheers,
Preston


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Jeku
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 01:12
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A company I used to work for in town used to run off of 100% pirated software. Every day I would show up and wonder if they would be ransacked by the IDCA or some other company--- and I would express this to them occasionally. Finally they got their crap together and as soon as they started making some real money, they purchased licenses for all the software. Paranoia can do wonders hehehe.


http://www.jeku.com/audio/
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james1980
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 01:42
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they do that to that guy but won't stop all these popup ads.
DAMN THEM!!!
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HZence
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 01:50
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Actually, that proves the piracy does pay (the RIAA ).


Team EOD :: Programmer/Storyboard Assistant
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Shadow
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 01:56
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The most obvious anti-piracy argument is "If you make the developers lost all their profits through piracy, how are they gonna make any more games?"

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Jeku
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 01:58
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But then to play devil's advocate, if you weren't going to buy the game or software anyways, is it ok? You're not really taking money out of their pocket, per se. But it's like living in a house and not paying for it--- the house still took hard work to make.


http://www.jeku.com/audio/
Ancient Chinese proverb: Man who runs behind car gets exhausted.
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Shadow
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 02:02
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Wow, the forum gets quick replies these days. I remember the days when I would have to wait a day for a reply.

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Toilet Freak
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 02:25
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yeah, that'll be right...

http://www.toiletfreak.dbspot.com/
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Ian T
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 03:43 Edited at: 13th Feb 2004 03:44
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Quote: "we hope that the suspicion of a fraudulent use of an image-treatment software reveals to be unfounded."


Doh. So they used a pirated photoshop.

On one hand you can look at it and say 'there's no way anyone will find out'... but on the other, when/if someone does find out, your entire rep comes crashing down on you, and your company is ruined. Just another reason not to pirate, especially if you want to have any kind of a future in game development!


On the topic, kudos to indi for having the guts to say no to a bunch of pirated models made for his game. That's integrity .

--Mouse: Famous (Avatarless) Fighting Furball

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nuclear glory
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 04:31
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Quote: "Programmers motos should be "If You Can't Buy it, Make it!""


Agreed.

This one works too: "Do something to build revenue, then buy it!"

Lead Programmer/Director
Powerful Collision DLL for DBPro and DBC: http://www.nuclearglory.com
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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 06:00
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I have never even considered pirating software (sure, I have over 300 songs on my computer, but I had to wait till Chistmas until someone would give me the money to buy the stuff!)

Take a look to the sky just before you die

---For Whom The Bell Tolls, Metallica
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Slayer
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 06:14
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Hell he should have stoped. He made enoff money $$. I wish
I could do what they did. See theres good programers and bad
programers in this world. Im in the middle. I was going to pull this
stunt in school onece, but I told myself I shouldent do it. But man
it would have been something good and very funny.

I dont know how to spell
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CattleRustler
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 06:20
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until the clang of the iron gate, that is

-RUST-
"What the... Mooooooooooo!"
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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 06:21
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no, for me it still would've been funny
joking

Take a look to the sky just before you die

---For Whom The Bell Tolls, Metallica
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Van B
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 10:47 Edited at: 13th Feb 2004 10:50
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I'll admit that I use a hookie copy of Windows98 and Office2000 at work, but that's more convenience than anything because they're both on the same disc with all the common device drivers, makes it much quicker to install and setup PC's. Some PC's only have licences for 95, but I've installed 98se on most of them without a legal licence. The way I see it, we pay for Office2000 licences, and NT licences every year, and you buy them in blocks so you tend to have extra licences that your not using because you'd but licences in blocks - so in my book, the extra cash we fritter away on unused licences and the fact that we have Win95 licences for everything makes up for it (not loosing any sleep, that's for sure). In Scotland, it's the managing director that is ultimately held responsible, I could have all the nasty cracked software available on my PC without the MD knowing, and he'd get a big fine or go to jail if I got caught with it!.

Thing is though, the minute you do things properly (a lot of companies think they're legal, but they're not) - you get harassed by Microshafts crack group of telemarketers. They phone and con you into doing a survey where the only real purpose is to find out how many licences you have. This is so they can check their records and decide whether to audit your software. We keep a list of all the crucial info like licence numbers and software versions, so that each call is pretty much the same info, keeps them off our 'mostly legal' backs.


Van-B


The nature of Monkey was irrepressible!.
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MiRRoRMaN 64
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 11:10
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As for dealing and selling pirated games I fully agree, those lamers need to be locked up. As for piracy itself, I'm a 110% pro piracy, free software rules.

But that's just my opinion, but hey, that's why I typed it.


x2sys.hatesit.com
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Ian T
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 18:58
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Quote: "I'm a 110% pro piracy, free software rules."


I'll remember you said that...

You really think it's a good thing to steal programmers and developers' hard work, which they just want a bit of profit for after the publishers take their due to fund their next project? You think it's fine to basically spit on their faces, say you don't care how hard they worked, you just want it for yourself and they don't deserve anything for it?

--Mouse: Famous (Avatarless) Fighting Furball

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Jeku
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 20:25
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Quote: "As for piracy itself, I'm a 110% pro piracy, free software rules."


Cool, so when you write a game or useful app that you want to sell, I'll just crack it. You're OK with that? Sweet.


http://www.jeku.com/audio/
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MiRRoRMaN 64
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 20:36
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Quote: "Cool, so when you write a game or useful app that you want to sell, I'll just crack it. You're OK with that? Sweet."


Yes, I'm okay with that. Since I already had it happen to a couple of my released products in the past. I considered it a compliment to my work.

Any game worth pirating means a game worth playing. They'd never crack and release a crappy product nobody wants.


x2sys.hatesit.com
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Ian T
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 21:35
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Someone has a seriously warped worldview. Maybe once you take economy in school you'll get a clue.

--Mouse: Famous (Avatarless) Fighting Furball

I am the chainsaw paladin.
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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 21:58
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hey, idiot above mouse, no, it means it sold well and they just want a profit! stop stealing jakass

Take a look to the sky just before you die

---For Whom The Bell Tolls, Metallica
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AlecM
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 22:15
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although I agree that on a whole piracy is a bad thing... Destroying the ability to make money off of any artform will help it in the long run. Take music for example. If there was no money to be made in record sales we wouldnt have britney spears or other disgusting coperate designed pop acts. You also need to understand that the vast majority of musicians never make any money, and its not related to there skill either. So if records were virtually free artists could still make some cash from concerts and everybody would be happy (except disney). You would lose some good music but you would also start hear alot of interesting new music. Most people who are musicians don't become musicians for the money anyway

The same ideas can be transfered to any art form. However it gets trickier when large production budgets are involved in something like movies and games.

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Jeku
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Posted: 13th Feb 2004 23:56
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I don't understand how you say that it will help in the long run if nobody makes money from art--- that's just crazy IMO. There are many talented musicians out there that wouldn't be doing it if they didn't make a living. What's the incentive for spending months working on a bunch of songs if there's no money involved? Sure, it's nice and cheery to say that artists should be doing their art for the sake of art, but that's just not realistic. There are many more rewarding things than money, I know that, but without money you don't live.

If the only way for an artist to make money is to throw concerts, what about other kinds of artists? (painters, etc.) I think right now there's BIG money in the recording industry--- I think it's an urban legend that nobody makes any money.


http://www.jeku.com/audio/
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MiRRoRMaN 64
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 00:09
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Quote: "Someone has a seriously warped worldview. Maybe once you take economy in school you'll get a clue."


Look, I'm just being frank here. I like piracy, there's plenty of stuff out there you have to pay for, and if there's something I really really like (like DarkBasic) I still buy it.

Quote: "
hey, idiot above mouse, no, it means it sold well and they just want a profit! stop stealing jakass"


I'm holding a serious conversation here, and I'm being truthfull. If people start cursing the conversation is over, simple as that.

So no reply for your silly remarks, sorry. I haven't replied to flamebait since 1997 and I'm not about to change that now for you.


x2sys.hatesit.com
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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 00:12
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you just did reply, thief, and no, that wasn't a joke

Take a look to the sky just before you die

---For Whom The Bell Tolls, Metallica
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Preston C
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 00:30 Edited at: 14th Feb 2004 00:51
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Quote: "X2SYS
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
User

Joined: Sun Jan 11th 2004
Location: Netherlands "


Quote: "Look, I'm just being frank here. I like piracy, there's plenty of stuff out there you have to pay for, and if there's something I really really like (like DarkBasic) I still buy it.
"


He's been here for less then three days, and he's already making a bad rep for himself. I say we just ban him and the rest of the spammers right here and now. Piracy isnt a good thing, like mouse said, it negatively affects the world economy. If that happens enough, we may one day be forced to life in caves! Some things arent always meant for try before you buy. But pirates think thats true, that everything can be tried before buyed (and maybe even kept without buying). YOU think that is true. But everyone else here knows that its not. Pirates piss me off, so you'd best not get on my bad side.

[Edit] PiratSS and Uberwigget, dont worry, I'm not saying that the type of pirates you are piss me off, just software and media pirates.

[Edit 2] Oops, heh, make that one month and a few days (man, I gotta get some sleep)


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nuclear glory
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 00:39 Edited at: 14th Feb 2004 00:53
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That's 1 month and 3 days <nudge>

I thought I was really confused for a moment there.

I give you all full permission to freely redistribute/use the demo version of the collision system from our website. Isn't that nice of me?

I thought about putting a <please pirate> sticker up, but that might attract the wrong community.

(Note: That's my idea, don't PIRATE IT! And if you do, please provide a link to our site.)

Lead Programmer/Director
Powerful Collision DLL for DBPro and DBC: http://www.nuclearglory.com
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MiRRoRMaN 64
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 01:47
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Quote: "He's been here for less then three days, and he's already making a bad rep for himself. I say we just ban him and the rest of the spammers right here and now."


Excuse me? Where do you see spam?

Look, like I said before I'm not going in on any flamebait because well, I'm probably a whole lot older (and wiser) than you. I wanted to go in depth in this subject since I used to crack software as a kid too (but I quit because of course I know it was wrong, I was 16 back then, a loooong time ago) and it could have made an interesting conversational piece. Hell, you might even been able to convince me of your point of view, but well, since you seem to be at a lower level here....

Btw, most of my packages are bought, but stuff I test or don't use frequently I leech of the net.

I'm quitting this treath all together because of the stupid remarks. I'm being the wisest here, so if they wanna ban me for speaking my mind but keep you cursers on here who can't hold a decent convo well that's really up to the owners of this board.

Also, I'm guessing that you'll try and make a smart elic remark on me saying I'm smarter in this post regarding to piracy, well, have a ball with that. I'm outta this treath, and I wont even read it anymore, because well.... I'm above this level, and quite a bit actually too.


x2sys.hatesit.com
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Ian T
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 02:43
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Quote: "I'm being the wisest here, so if they wanna ban me for speaking my mind but keep you cursers on here who can't hold a decent convo well that's really up to the owners of this board."


If you consider leeching off of the decent human population to be wise, then perhaps that's true. But you know as well as I do that the only reason piracy dosen't have an even larger negetive effect on the world is that decent people-- most of the people on this forum for example-- do not sink as low as software piracy to get what they want, and thus there is always a community of good for the pirates to leech off of, but never completely kill.

--Mouse: Famous (Avatarless) Fighting Furball

I am the chainsaw paladin.
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Lord Ozzum
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 02:58
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You, wise? You admit to pirating games after this guy was fined 700000 bucks and getting a couple of years in prison?!

Take a look to the sky just before you die

---For Whom The Bell Tolls, Metallica
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IanM
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Posted: 14th Feb 2004 02:59
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Quote: "Btw, most of my packages are bought, but stuff I test or don't use frequently I leech of the net"


Ooo, look! Someone left a ferrari at the side of the road. I think I'll test it ...

Look you dope, theft is theft even if you only 'test' or use it a 'little bit', whether it's a physical item or software.

Did you even read the acceptable usage policy? Y'know, this bit?

Quote: "Do not involve or advocate illegal activities (including piracy)"


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