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Geek Culture / €497 millionfine levied against Microsoft

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MicroMan
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 17:10
Microsoft was fined by the EU Commission today. They will have to pay €497 million for illegal corporate practices relating to the Windows Media Player.

http://sg.biz.yahoo.com/040323/1/3iyw4.html

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They SAID that given enough time a million monkeys with typewriters could recreate the collected works of William Shakespeare... Internet sure proved them wrong.
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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 17:15
And unfortunately they can appeal, dragging the whole thing out for a few more years.


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MicroMan
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 17:19
Whenever I do a reinstall of Windows, the Media Player is the first program I hunt down and destroy. That and that MSN thingie.

-----
They SAID that given enough time a million monkeys with typewriters could recreate the collected works of William Shakespeare... Internet sure proved them wrong.
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TheAbomb12
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 17:54
Wait a minute. Why is it illegal for them to bundel WMplayer in Windows? Isn't windows their product? Why would it be illegal business practice?

Amist the Blue Skies...
Elleomea
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 18:08 Edited at: 24th Mar 2004 18:09
It's because they're abusing their monopoly in one market to try and gain a monopoly in another. The average user will just use whatever is bundled with his system, this is one of the reasons IE is the world's most popular browser, despite being a long way behind most others interms of features, security and efficiency. IE being bundled with Windows is what lead to the D.O.J Vs. Microsoft anti-trust case a while back, unfortunately after Bush came in to power all Microsoft got was a slight slap on the wrist (there had been talk of forcing Microsoft to split up in to separate companies).

This fine is only around 1% of Microsoft's wealth, but what's more important is Microsoft are being forced to unbundle Windows Media Player with Windows for sale in Europe and to make it possible for their competitors to build support for Microsoft's video formats in to their software. This also creates a precedent for the future.

How much ham could a hamster stir, if a hamster could stir ham?
Damokles
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 18:13
But I suppose Microsoft could give it away for free on the internet, right ?

- Stand clear of the closing doors -
TheAbomb12
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 18:15
Quote: "they're abusing their monopoly in one market to try and gain a monopoly in another. "


hmm. That seems really stupid to me. I can see it if microsoft had made it IMPOSSIBLE for anyother media player to be installed and used correctly; but otherwise, its the dumbest thing i ever heard of.

It would be like a car company putting their own stero equipment in the car, and getting sued for it.

Amist the Blue Skies...
Drew Cameron
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 18:26
But isn't WM Player the best media player there is? I've got no complaints with it. Why get rid of it so users have to get something inferior?

The guy behind The Old Remedy - coming June 2004 : 30% completed!
CattleRustler
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 18:29
they'll just give it away free, just like internet explorer.



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empty
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 19:28
Quote: "That seems really stupid to me. I can see it if microsoft had made it IMPOSSIBLE for anyother media player to be installed and used correctly; but otherwise, its the dumbest thing i ever heard of."

No, it isn't dumb.
Do you use the Internet Explorer? And if so why?


Quote: "It would be like a car company putting their own stero equipment in the car, and getting sued for it."

If 90% of all cars world-wide were made by that company, then yes it would be the same.

Me, I'll sit and write this love song as I all too seldom do
build a little fire this midnight. It's good to be back home with you.
TheAbomb12
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 19:45
Quote: "No, it isn't dumb.
Do you use the Internet Explorer? And if so why?"


Because it comes with Windows. Its their product, so they should be able to put their other software on as well. If their software inteferes with other Media players, THEN I can understand the suit.

But if I wanted to, I could easily download other media players easily like music match or Winamp. But I don't like either so I stick with WMplayer.

Amist the Blue Skies...
CattleRustler
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:01
I have to agree with Abomb



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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:18
Quote: "But isn't WM Player the best media player there is? I've got no complaints with it. Why get rid of it so users have to get something inferior?"


oops... you've just admitted to preffering AOL over any other ISP

http://www.tinnedhead.tk under re-construction.
jrowe
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:23 Edited at: 24th Mar 2004 20:25
Quote: "But isn't WM Player the best media player there is? I've got no complaints with it. Why get rid of it so users have to get something inferior?"


er... no offence but what other programs have you tried?

WARNING STARTING RANT


Problems with WMP: WMP "Media browser" every time you start it up, or it trying to update your "Media Library". There's also the fact that you can't turn visulisations off without turning it onto "album art" manually every time (I need the playlist open). There's also the fact they removed the "Windows CD player" when they give you XP to force you to use WMP program or download your own.

I'd use Winamp if it wasn't for the Adware.

Forgive me if I want a media player that I can run in the background that doesn't use up all my RAM and my CPU time.
All I want is a CD player that does the basic stuff without pissing me off, so I wrote my own.

RANT OVER


For Fathers and Sons who enjoy wholy spirits.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:23
This is just getting f**king ridiculous now!
Internet Explorer is bundled with Windows because it is File Explorer; they just added the ability to browse the internet with it.
It was a bloody innovation making Internet Exploring and File Exploring in the same program! It makes everyone's life much easier not having to a) run two programs to do the exact same bloody takes and b) need to learn how to use 2 seperate programs.

Media Player Series-9 (which this is about people) IS NOT supplied with Microsoft Windows, it has to be downloaded and is yes FREE ... as opposed to Quicktime ($20) or RealPlayer One ($35).
Winamp is free, but isn't widely used by any online supplier making it blend into obscurity nowadays.

Microsoft Windows is a computer operating system for the x86 (AMD/VIA/IBM) and IA (Intel) based machines, designed for the home user.
It has nothing to do with monopolising the market trying to get everyone to purchase thier products.

Media Player is FREE and directly uses DirectX to play media files.
Movie Maker is FREE and directly uses DirectX to create videos.
Explorer/Internet Explorer are FREE and used to access the computers files or internet.
DirectCD Writing is FREE and used to create CD/DVDs.

you currently CAN NOT play DVD Movies in Media Player WITH OUT a 3rd Party DVD Renderer (so how the hell it could monopolize anything without it being completely self contained!!)

Quicktime and Realplayer are both equally used online along with Media Player.

This is just ANOTHER case of people trying to get money out of Microsoft for creating an Operating System that is very simple to use which includes everything for everyone to use without having to search online to download.
Microsoft offer so many FREE, SIMPLE TO USE, SELF-UPDATING, COMPATIBLE services in thier operating system.

MacOSX has EXACTLY the same stuff as Windows does.
iBrowse is MacOS's bundled (and apples own) internet broswer
iTunes is MacOS's bundled (and apples own) multimedia player
iStudio is MacOS's bundled Office System

and Macintosh DO NOT allow you to install OTHER operating systems on thier machines. (read your EULA if your a Mac user)
if you ask me Macintosh are the ones who are breaking the Monopoly rules.

Microsoft aren't breaking these rules even slightly, they're trying to give thier users viable products from the get go which all intergrate seemlessly allowing easier use of thier Operating System.

Quite frankly i think everyone should just bloody grow up conserning Microsoft. Sorry but it's upto the consumer what they choose to use, NOT the government to make life harder for everyone.

I use Windows and yes i used everything that comes with it rather than other things. Why? Because they're alot bloody easier, quicker and much more stable!
They do EXACTLY what they claim to do, there is no such thing as half-assed features in a Microsoft Product.

Other software developers should spend less time crying about how thier software isn't used over Microsoft's and spend that energy into actually making something that people WANT to use!
Cause right now no one wants to use the alternatives, that is why they're not used. It isn't a case that they're not available.
People who use AOL ... most of them STILL use IE over AOLE!

Sorry but it's just a fact that Microsoft's products are BETTER, that's why they're used. I mean for crying out loud look at Internet Explorer; not the most technologically advanced Browser, and everyone is still bombarded with Netscape and an alternative - but IE is still majorly used.
Because it'll display a page as it should be, it'll save a page as it should be, it'll print a page as it should and the prefferences don't require a degree in science to figure out.

I keep hearing 'loading times on Mozilla are quicker than on IE, or Safari is quicker than Mozilla' ... this is total BS.
All browsers can ONLY work as fast as your modem is; they're all using the same bloody internet protocols, the difference between Mozilla and IE when loading that makes it seem like it is loading faster is the way it loads.
You can visually see it loading each and everything; whereas IE caches it first; you'll see the pages end result just as fast, but it'll appear to be doing more.

Mozilla might have tabs and popup blocking support and such; that is all fine and dandy. But perhaps more people would like it if they actually bothered to use the WINAPI for the Windows version, eh? As it just looks tacky and the looks are part of how a program feels, and if it don't feel right, people don't like it.

Microsoft learnt this lessing a very long time ago!
Quite frankly i think this is all just pathetic on the part of the EU.


Athlon64 FX-51 | 1.5Gb DDR2 PC3400 | GeForce FX 5900 Ultra 56.60 | DirectX9.1 SDK | Audigy2 | Windows XP 64-Bit
Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:27
james u missed the chance to advertise ur CD player; nm

http://www.tinnedhead.tk under re-construction.
the_winch
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:29
They broke the law, they are punished. Are you saying the law is incorrect?
the_winch
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:33 Edited at: 24th Mar 2004 20:37
Quote: "Media Player Series-9 (which this is about people) IS NOT supplied with Microsoft Windows"

The version this is about is included with windows Xp. If the software in question wasn't included with the os don't you think microsoft might have won?

Quote: "MacOSX has EXACTLY the same stuff as Windows does. "


MacOSX doesn't have something like 90% of the market share.

Quote: "Microsoft aren't breaking these rules even slightly, they're trying to give thier users viable products from the get go which all intergrate seemlessly allowing easier use of thier Operating System."

Funny they have just been found guilty of breaking the rules.

Quote: "Sorry but it's just a fact that Microsoft's products are BETTER"


That is an OPINION not a FACT.
Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:34
anyways, it doesnt matter whether u think microsoft are being falsely judged about the WMP thing, but i think everyone would preffer if microsoft weren't so big.

then again, at least bill gates earnt his way to where he is, compared with people who have their lives changed through inheritance or the lottery, and its not like he rip off employees in the third world like nestle etc.

(if anyone reads a biogrophy of how he and a mate started up microsoft, u'd realise it was a matter of the first come first serve in the industry, and bill gates came first in the queue)

http://www.tinnedhead.tk under re-construction.
jrowe
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:38 Edited at: 24th Mar 2004 20:40
Raven, it's not just that they bundle it with windows. It's the fact when installed on a new PC, Windows media Player is always set as the default media player, Real Music Encoded files will not appear in the My music folder and users are stopped from removing WMP.

They're doing the same thing with the Windows Networking OS (Can't remember the name). They made big compatability issues when networking it with Linux to try and make people think Linux is inferier.


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soapyfish
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:48
Quote: "bill gates earnt his way to where he is"

Quote: "its not like he rip off employees in the third world like nestle etc."


Both very good points. I don't really know what to think, Microsoft does monopolise the market but why should they be punished for being a sucess. Okay so people don't get a chance to introduce there own software but if I was them I'd wait till hoverboards were invented and then monopolise that market(unless microsofts already produced them and is just waiting for the right time for realease.) I might see it from a different point if I was one of these companies but whatever you think 497 mill aint that much for Bill is it. More of a "go to bed with no supper" than a "no t.v. for a year" if you see my point.

HEY, YOU THERE, THE ONE READING THIS, WHY NOT VISIT OUR TEAM SITE.
bitJericho
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 20:57
497 mill is a lot of money for anybody... Billy didn't become rich by giving cash out to whoever begged

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Damokles
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 21:49 Edited at: 24th Mar 2004 21:49
Quote: "They broke the law, they are punished. Are you saying the law is incorrect?"


I hope that question was not meant to be serious. I mean : men invented the laws, they can make mistakes.

By the way, I know the belgian laws are based on a constitution from 1831. Do you really think the things that were correct at that time are still correct now ? (so many things have changed, industries, technology)
The law about drugs here is from 1921. Ain't that funny ? Some drugs weren't even invented.

- Stand clear of the closing doors -
the_winch
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 22:22 Edited at: 24th Mar 2004 22:23
Quote: "I hope that question was not meant to be serious. I mean : men invented the laws, they can make mistakes."


Yep that is the question, do you think the law(s) they broke should exist?
empty
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 22:26
Another Raven post with so many lines and yet so little content and most of it is wrong anyway...

Me, I'll sit and write this love song as I all too seldom do
build a little fire this midnight. It's good to be back home with you.
Cyberflame
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 22:28
If the other companies want their software bundled with windows sooo badly, why dont they pay microsoft to do it?????

DANGIT NEO, YOU CHANGED THE CODE AND NOW THE MATRIX WONT TEXTURE RIGHT.
empty
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 22:31
Quote: " If the other companies want their software bundled with windows sooo badly, why dont they pay microsoft to do it?????"

And get what in return?

Me, I'll sit and write this love song as I all too seldom do
build a little fire this midnight. It's good to be back home with you.
Wik
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 22:36
Their software bundled with windows.


empty
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 22:38
And that'll certainly pay their employees.

Me, I'll sit and write this love song as I all too seldom do
build a little fire this midnight. It's good to be back home with you.
UnderLord
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Posted: 24th Mar 2004 23:56
Quote: "Do you use the Internet Explorer? And if so why?"


IE is probably the only web browser that won't crash on me every 30 minutes using netscape if i go to a certaint site (like a cam community) it will lock up or won't load but IE will load anything even though netscape does have a blockup poper built in.

The search continues.

Current project - A space game
empty
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 00:04
Have you tried Mozilla Firefox? This is not the one you get with the Mozilla Application Suite.
Only 6.2MB: lean, fast and easy browsing.

Me, I'll sit and write this love song as I all too seldom do
build a little fire this midnight. It's good to be back home with you.
Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 00:14
Quote: "By the way, I know the belgian laws are based on a constitution from 1831. Do you really think the things that were correct at that time are still correct now ? (so many things have changed, industries, technology)
The law about drugs here is from 1921. Ain't that funny ? Some drugs weren't even invented."


look at the bible.

and why the hell does anyone use netscape? i hav to make a seperate version of my website just for netscape users, maybe i shouldnt bother and make them suffer for the crime they commit. like AOL users gettin lag on games, they deserve it for using AOL.

how the hell does AOL get the money to send everyone in the world an AOL CD once a month anyway? surely they should giv money to the third world instead, it'll be taken more notice of.

http://www.tinnedhead.tk under re-construction.
Wik
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 00:30
They should. Almost everyone throws out those cds anyway.


Flashing Blade
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 00:36 Edited at: 25th Mar 2004 00:37
I got a mug of coffee on an AOL cd



gonna drink it now


mmmmmm
bitJericho
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 01:25 Edited at: 25th Mar 2004 01:27
empty, what's wrong with you, raven made some very good points and you do a hack job to try and shoot him down, try to back up your statements..at least the_winch gave it a try..

Quote: "
Quote: "MacOSX has EXACTLY the same stuff as Windows does. "
MacOSX doesn't have something like 90% of the market share"


So if MacOSX does it it's ok? I think not, I think it's a perfectly acceptable practice no matter who does it.

Quote: "Quote: "Sorry but it's just a fact that Microsoft's products are BETTER"

That is an OPINION not a FACT. "


In my and many other situations this is a FACT.. notice how I emphasized FACT? Anyways.. Mandrake Linux 9.2(along with others, phlak and im sure more) won't even run on either of my computers.. One's a 2003 compaq and one's an 2000 HP, they don't work because of the computer bios setup. But magically windows works just fine? I don't think windows does magic tricks, not on an OS level. For some reason mandrake linux 9.1 (along with most other distros) makes it nearly impossible for a newb to install drivers.. Great way for me to learn to use linux, by making my computer impossible to access the internet because I use a wifi network. I found a driver for my card, unfortunatley I have absolutely no clue how to install it. In windows it was quite easy, I double clicked a file and answered two questions, restarted and I had a working card. A quick configure of the settings and I had a working network.

Same goes for most software, as raven put
Quote: "I use Windows and yes i used everything that comes with it rather than other things. Why? Because they're alot bloody easier, quicker and much more stable!
They do EXACTLY what they claim to do, there is no such thing as half-assed features in a Microsoft Product.
"


prove it wrong.

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UnderLord
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 02:18
Quote: "They do EXACTLY what they claim to do, there is no such thing as half-assed features in a Microsoft Product."


Wanna bet?

Why does my 3d text screen saver take up so much of my computers resources? 768mb's of ram with a geforce 4 video card.

Why does windows xp always seem to mess something up someway or another?

Why does MS rip people off? (oh wait that isnt one of those half-assed things excuse me)

-------------------
Linux is easy to use...well once you learn to program in it my dad used it for awhile but didnt have the detication to keep on going. Linux is fine.

The search continues.

Current project - A space game
John H
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 02:21
Quote: "Are you saying the law is incorrect?"


In a matter of fact, I think a lot of laws are incorrect Most of the taxes that you pay, you SHOULDNT. Why do you pay social security? The government is saying 'your too stupid to manage your own money, let us do it for you'

How many games that you buy also have some other software with them? When you buy the retail version of counter strike, you also get lots of other games that can be installed (but you can disable them) just like windows. If you dont like IE/WMP you can simply uninstall them. Simple as that.

The only thing on windows I have a real problem with is that DAMNED windows messenger. It always signs me on without me knowing it getting a lot of people pissed off at me for not responding (cuz Im really not at the computer)

This lawsuit doesnt have much behind in IMHO


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the_winch
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 02:24
Quote: "So if MacOSX does it it's ok? I think not, I think it's a perfectly acceptable practice no matter who does it."


MacOSX is not doing the same thing, you can't abuse a monopoly if you don't have one.

Quote: "In my and many other situations this is a FACT"

Exactly in yours and many other situations but not in yours and ALL other situtations. A lot of people find that microsoft products are not best for what they do so they use something else and a lot of people find microsoft products work best so they use them.
empty
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 02:35 Edited at: 25th Mar 2004 02:43
Quote: "empty, what's wrong with you, raven made some very good points and you do a hack job to try and shoot him down, try to back up your statements"

No worries, nothing wrong with me.
Believe me it's a complete waste of time to back anything up when "discussing" with Raven. He won't listen anyway. Off the top of my head I remember these topics I already covered with the black bird:
- C&C Generals (including Names, contracts and pseudonyms)
- Midi (still my favourite)
- CPUs
- limited companies
- Graphics cards (on various occasions, w/ & w/o shaders)
- compiler building
- physics engines (ask Neophyte)
- Java

and there were many more.

Just for you Jerico2day (hoping you're more open minded) I'll back up my statements. Although I could go into almost each of Raven's paragraphs, I'll just take a few now, 'cause it's late and I'm tired.

Quote: "I use Windows and yes i used everything that comes with it rather than other things. Why? Because they're alot bloody easier, quicker and much more stable!
They do EXACTLY what they claim to do, there is no such thing as half-assed features in a Microsoft Product."

I never knew MS products claim to have serious security holes. Anyway, half assed features: Outlook Express? The Editor? Footnotes in Word?

Quote: "I mean for crying out loud look at Internet Explorer; not the most technologically advanced Browser, and everyone is still bombarded with Netscape and an alternative - but IE is still majorly used.
Because it'll display a page as it should be, it'll save a page as it should be, it'll print a page as it should and the prefferences don't require a degree in science to figure out."

No, the IE doesn't display pafes as they should be, but as MS thinks they should be. You won't have any problems with Opera, Mozilla, Firefox or most other browser if the webpage author uses the W3C standards (MS is part of the W3C).



Quote: "I keep hearing 'loading times on Mozilla are quicker than on IE, or Safari is quicker than Mozilla' ... this is total BS.
All browsers can ONLY work as fast as your modem is; they're all using the same bloody internet protocols,"

Erm, I mean, really. Search a web page with lots of nested tables (there are countless of them), save it on you're HD and load it back in IE and then in Firefox.

Quote: "You can visually see it loading each and everything; whereas IE caches it first; you'll see the pages end result just as fast, but it'll appear to be doing more."

Seems Raven uses versions of the IE I've never used. IE 1 by any chance?

Quote: "[About Mozilla] But perhaps more people would like it if they actually bothered to use the WINAPI for the Windows version, eh?"

So there we are, little black bird never used Mozilla.


Oh nearly forgot this one:
Quote: "Internet Explorer is bundled with Windows because it is File Explorer; they just added the ability to browse the internet with it.
It was a bloody innovation making Internet Exploring and File Exploring in the same program! It makes everyone's life much easier not having to a) run two programs to do the exact same bloody takes and b) need to learn how to use 2 seperate programs."

So how come the Windows Explorer and the Internet Explorer look and behave so differently until WinXP? It's not one and the same program, they share *some* of the libraries. What an innovation.

Me, I'll sit and write this love song as I all too seldom do
build a little fire this midnight. It's good to be back home with you.
UnderLord
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 02:41
Theres a fire in my pants theres a fire in my pants....oh wait no its just flamebait on the forums again =P

The search continues.

Current project - A space game
Arkheii
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Location: QC, Philippines
Posted: 25th Mar 2004 02:57
ahem... Microsoft supporter here. You do know that without those bundled programs, Windows would be a stripped down OS. So you buy WinXP without IE and without WMP, etc. So how do you expect to access the internet or play media files? Download off the internet? Definitely not (duh, IE wasn't installed, stupid). You're forced to buy them off the shelves. They can't be free because publishing costs money. That would still make people beg MS to bundle those programs into Windows. So maybe IE and WMP sucks, but at least you have something until you download winamp or another browser or YM/AIM. THEN you can uninstall WMP and IE etc. I wouldn't uninstall them anyway because I use them.

Quote: "Forgive me if I want a media player that I can run in the background that doesn't use up all my RAM and my CPU time.
All I want is a CD player that does the basic stuff without pissing me off, so I wrote my own."


Then request MS to make a developer's edition of Windows. Totally stripped down but with a bundled copy of Visual Studio .NET and MSDN and all the SDKs on their website.


"Story in a game is like story in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important." - John Carmack
CattleRustler
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 03:05
497 Million Euro is 602 Million USD
just in case anyone was interested



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Mattman
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Location: East Lansing
Posted: 25th Mar 2004 04:38
no, its 613 million $$$
nuclear glory
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 04:41 Edited at: 25th Mar 2004 04:44
@RPGamer
Quote: "The only thing on windows I have a real problem with is that DAMNED windows messenger. It always signs me on without me knowing it getting a lot of people pissed off at me for not responding (cuz Im really not at the computer)"


You can shut that option off mate, lol.

On the MSN menu:

Tools->Options
General tab

Then you have check boxes next to the "auto-login" options. I turned them off so I have to explicitly launch messenger and choose to login.

It's better with the butterfly

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Benjamin
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Location: France
Posted: 25th Mar 2004 05:08
Also RPGamer, I noticed you dont have the option on to switch your status to away when you have been away from the computer for 5 mins

Always have, never will =)
CattleRustler
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 05:58 Edited at: 25th Mar 2004 05:58
actually its $620,156,600 usd

497000000 x 1.2478 (euro|usd spot) = above value

I knew I shouldn't have posted after doing the math in my head (602 - 620 transposed)




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indi
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Location: Earth, Brisbane, Australia
Posted: 25th Mar 2004 06:08
suct in billy boy you lost 1% revenue and still have the monopoly. boo hoo like it really hurts him.


Benjamin
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Location: France
Posted: 25th Mar 2004 06:13
The currency converter on a site I'm using says $602,875,689. That just goes to show how fast currency rates change

http://www.xe.com/ucc/

Always have, never will =)
Dave J
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 08:22
It's just so the company can't monopolize the industry. If Microsoft had total market share then they could literally force every other company out of business (either by buying them out or just waiting untill they go bust) and then start charging ludicrously high prices for anything they sell, hence the reason competitors are so important. The government doesn't want this to happen, nor should anyone else for that matter so laws are put in place to prevent it. This is just one of those laws, there are others as well to prevent them from having total market share and believe it or not, Microsoft has been split into 2 companies - Microsoft US and Microsoft World.


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Jeku
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Posted: 25th Mar 2004 09:58 Edited at: 25th Mar 2004 10:00
Gonna reply to a bunch of things people were saying because I missed the boat earlier

Quote: "I'd use Winamp if it wasn't for the Adware."


There's never been any Adware in any version of Winamp I've ever downloaded.

Quote: "It's the fact when installed on a new PC, Windows media Player is always set as the default media player"


You think that's bad? RealOne tries to take over 85% of your extension handling! Of course WMP is set to default media player when installed on a new PC-- that's all there is! Every media product tries to do this, even WinAmp.

Quote: "Why does my 3d text screen saver take up so much of my computers resources? 768mb's of ram with a geforce 4 video card."


Could be sloppy screen saver code. UT2004 runs super slick on my comp and I have 256MB ram with a GeForce 4 TI card. That would be like blaming Microsoft for DBP games running slower than C++ games :p

Quote: "Why does windows xp always seem to mess something up someway or another?"


Explain... is it because after installing and uninstalling many things that something goes wrong? Could it be a piece of faulty software? Noooo, of course not

Quote: "Why does MS rip people off? (oh wait that isnt one of those half-assed things excuse me)"


Explain... their prices? Because the software's not free?

Quote: "I never knew MS products claim to have serious security holes. "


The security holes in Windows are found *because* of their 99% monopoly. If there's a Linux security hole then nobody cares, doesn't make news. Windows security holes on the other hand...

Quote: "Quote: "You can visually see it loading each and everything; whereas IE caches it first; you'll see the pages end result just as fast, but it'll appear to be doing more."
Seems Raven uses versions of the IE I've never used. IE 1 by any chance?"


Does this with my IE as well. That is the technology behind IE--- it precaches the entire page first. I prefer to see everything load up which is why I use Firefox, but that's besides the point...

Quote: "So how come the Windows Explorer and the Internet Explorer look and behave so differently until WinXP? It's not one and the same program, they share *some* of the libraries. What an innovation."


Wrong. Ever since I've been using IE (since version 3), it's had the same interface as usability as File Explorer. They looked and behaved exactly the same! If you open up IE and type C:WINDOWS in the address bar, it'll look and feel just like File Explorer! And vice versa! This has ALWAYS been apparent with IE.

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