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Geek Culture / Acclaim goes under

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GothOtaku
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:03 Edited at: 4th Sep 2004 00:04
We all know Acclaim and that they've been one of the longest running game developers. Well turns out they've been having some troubles or something, hard times in the game industry I guess. Kinda sucks because they've been around FOREVER.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=581&e=2&u=/nm/20040902/tc_nm/leisure_acclaim_dc
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:05
Shame - but then the only games I've brought from them was Test Drive 2/3 on the C64...


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MiR
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:07
I´ve heard of that. Luckily I can´t remember ever seeing a decent game from them.


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GothOtaku
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:13 Edited at: 4th Sep 2004 00:19
They did a bunch of things. Some of the notable ones over the years are: Turok series, Forsaken, BMX XXX, the Magic: The Gathering PC games, Crazy Taxi, the NBA Jam series, Riven, Re-Volt, Shadow Man, X-Men: Children of the Atom, Riven for the Play Station, and the new Worms game.

EDIT: They also had a bunch of games in development that would've been great like The Bard's Tale, the Alias TV show's game, 100 Bullets, Gladiator Sword of Vengeance, and The Red Star.
Ian T
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:15
Not a big deal with me. Seems to me that they mostly just recycle licences. I'll stick with developers that get famous from their own stuff. Take Bethesda, who've been around for ~12 years and are big & rich from their own Elder Scrolls series.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:15
Nope - haven't played any of them...


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Cian Rice
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:43
They did have some good titles coming like the tuning street racing game Juiced, and the Red Star, but that's all I was looking forward to, and 100 Bullets, but they didn't have publishing rights to the Bard's Tale GothOtaku, and Alias has already come, out (a while back too) along with Gladitor Sword of Vengenace and neither of those two are even good.

Got anime?I do.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:44
Heard about thier problems when last Turok was under development, alot of guys were worried about thier jobs.
This actually goes hand-in-hand with a number of growing cases across the industry.

Everything is changing, and no one is quite sure to what.
Right now is certainly not a good time for the games industry, no matter what large companies would have you believe ... there is alot of crap going on in the background.


Ian T
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 00:53
This is absolutely nothing but poorly structured companies folding with new technological developments shifting the market away from them. EA grows fatter. Nothing new really.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 01:01
EA has bought out close to 28 companies world wide in the last year, and they own 4 of the largest franchises which don't seem to be getting old in the publics eye all of which are getting evolutions this year.

The difference between EA and others now, is quite simply they're as ruthless business wise as Microsoft.
Sieze a market, bleed it dry, move on...

Ultima is dead because of this, and everyone knows it.
Command & Conquer isn't far behind.


Ian T
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 01:05
Yup! That's what I was talking about!

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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 01:05
Shame - I like C&C


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Jeku
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 05:57
Quote: "The difference between EA and others now, is quite simply they're as ruthless business wise as Microsoft.
Sieze a market, bleed it dry, move on..."


EA also has strict deadlines for just about EVERY one of their games. This means they start axeing features left, right and centre to meet them, which in turn means the majority of their games are rather ho-hum and average at best. If this is the only way for a games company to survive in the future, I don't want to be a part of it.

Manticore Night
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 06:39
But you are, you work for them right?

It's amazing how much TV has raised us. (Bart Simpson)
Jeku
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 08:47
Quote: "But you are, you work for them right?"


My contract with them is over for now, as I have about six more courses until I finish my degree. I am contemplating whether I should work in the games industry when I'm finished or a regular software house.

Sir Spaghetti Code
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 10:03
Yep, this is pretty sad for the old console heads. Acclaim brought out some sweet stuff on the SNES. Some of the oldest companies are going down left and right these days! Let's see here:

*3DO

*Interplay

*Acclaim

I know there are more. Help me out here people!


"What is a game if not illusions stacked upon illusions?"
GothOtaku
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 12:22
Interplay's no more!? Damn, they were one of the originals, founded way back in '83. That really sucks because they produced some very excellent stuff. In fact, I probably have more stuff from Interplay than any other company (although this is probably due to them being more prolific than other companies). Time to mourn...
CattleRustler
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 12:30
Interplay did Cyberia, Cyberia2
damn great games


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA - September 2004
Ilya
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 13:12
I liked the MM series(6-8) by 3DO.
In fact, those might be the best games I ever played.

Ian T
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 13:25
3do made the Heroes of Might and Magic series, the best turn-based strategy games ever made.

It's now in the dubiously skillful hands of Ubisoft.

Dave J
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 15:37
Yesterday Codemasters cancelled it's game Dragon Empires due to 'technical difficulties', the game had been in development for the past 3 years and had a huge fanbase, I believe poor programming was the cause of its downfall though.


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Cian Rice
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Posted: 4th Sep 2004 22:56
Hey mouse nice sig, "elder scrolls IV".
I'd have to disagree with the EA Games being "Average", I mean look at NBA Street and Need For Speed Underground.

Got anime?I do.
Mentor
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 00:22
whats to worry about?, software houses disapear but not all of the customer base will just switch to EA, for every mainline software house that goes down, the Indi coder gains customers, take a look at the styles of the houses that have gone, there wasn`t enough money in it for a mainline software house to keep going, but a bedroom coder could do quite nicely from the "leavings" of the big boys.

Mentor.

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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 01:57
Thank you, yes that's what it's all about ...

Sir Spaghetti Code
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 06:03
I am not worried, just a little disheartened that some of the oldies that use to rule the industry when I was younger have folded up and blown away. Try to find a story about Interplay closing. It's sad. They were still tryng to keep there doors open, but then the state had to close them down, because they were not able to pay ther workers, they did not have any workers insurance (which is illegal), and other pronlems. I know that this is all illegal, but it is sad that some of the workers were still working while not getting paid, just to try to get out another game to keep the company afloat.


"What is a game if not illusions stacked upon illusions?"
Mentor
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 07:49 Edited at: 5th Sep 2004 07:52
you think they are oldies?, Heres some of the game industry daddies, some of them never made the step from small games houses to big firms with artists etc.
Ocean, Activision, US Gold, Melbourne House, Level 9, Rainbird, Martech, Elite, The edge, Electric dreams, Imagine, Hewson, Bubble Bus, Gremlin graphics, Ultimate, Gilsoft etc etc.
there are a LOT of companies went to the wall towards the end of the eight bit era, eight bit showed the way in ideas and possibilities, many of the original houses just died with them, unable to meet the need for proffesional artists and national adverts, musicians and co-ordinators, but it realy was the era when the kid down the road could be a millionaire by the end of the week, I doubt times like that will ever come round again.

Mentor.

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Sir Spaghetti Code
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 09:18
I know those companies are not really oldies. i just meant that the have been around for a long time. Of course tons of companies are going to go under with each new jump in technology, but these where a few of the companies that had stayed on the boat through countless tech leaps, but have not found they have nothing to stand on.


"What is a game if not illusions stacked upon illusions?"
Dave J
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 09:56 Edited at: 5th Sep 2004 10:35
Quote: "Melbourne House"


Melbourne House was taken over by Infogrames so I'm not sure if you can say they still exist or not, the offices are still there, they just look very different. Not to mention all our games have now turned to hell lol.


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Ilya
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 10:17 Edited at: 5th Sep 2004 10:18
Quote: "I\'m"

Offtopic:
Why's it like that?
vvv
I'm
^^

Sir Spaghetti Code
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 10:35
Not sure. My "Out throwin up Vulcan Gang Signs" was the same way. I wanted "throwin'", but it came out "throwin\'". Strange.


"What is a game if not illusions stacked upon illusions?"
Dave J
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 10:35
Forum bug, in my post I didn't have the \ - No idea why it happened. o_O

Anyway, I edited it and yeah, there was no \, so I submitted it and it's gone. Weird.


"Computers are useless they can only give you answers."
Jeku
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 11:26 Edited at: 5th Sep 2004 11:27
Quote: "I'd have to disagree with the EA Games being "Average", I mean look at NBA Street and Need For Speed Underground."


Actually those were two great games from EA, but what I was mostly referring to were the EA Sports titles that come out every single year. They are done on such tight deadlines that many features just never get around to being implemented. What I'd like to see is EA take a 2-year break for one cycle for even just one game (i.e. NHL), and make it kickass. A company like EA could pull that off.

Bedroom coders seem to be the true innovators (look at Counter-Strike) because they can afford all the time in the world. Small developers have a little more leeway after they've published a few games under their belt. Many small developers are the ones creating the cookie-cutter games for the big publishers because they need to get their foot in the door.

Ian T
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 11:57
Plus look at EA's Harry Potter games... pure tripe. Even if you don't like the books, you have to admit there's one hell of a lot more they could have done with the concept.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 13:53
Mentor alot of the companies you've listed are now bought out or changed thier name and are doing quite well.

Companies like Activision, Electronic Arts and EIDOS Interactive (US Gold) are not going to go away.
There is just too much business for them worldwide... this said,
EA have and always will be 'drop a feature to meet a deadline' for most of thier games. They're roots are from Software not Games, remember they only actually got into the game market until just over a decade ago... The EA Sport series have always done alright, but it is Maxis and Westwood that gave them the financial backing to actually grow like a virus.

As such those companies are left to thier own devices, as they release 'sure-fire' hits. Probably because they're not geared towards a single male general target audience (thats Activisions areas of expertise )

However this said...
EIDOS have been making losses, infact only a year ago they were in REAL trouble. Although you can say 'yay! this is all just good news to Indi developers and bedroom gamers.' fact is it isn't.
Well it isn't in the fact that honestly speaking i've not seen an independant or bedroom developed game worth squat in the past decade.

Seriously, even Counter-Strike and Day of Defeat. Don't get me wrong their nice games, but they're really they're nothing innovate.
One is a standard online team-vs-team which allows you to get a different weapon if your team (or you) are doing well... the other is a standard Class based system.

At the end of the day both use a very simplistic Capture-the-Flag system and are about as innovate as Kellogs releasing the K-Lock boxes. Sure it's a nice touch, but hardly something which makes you step back and thing 'Sweeet!'

Innovation lies really with guys like us, PureBasic and BlitzBasic users. Even further down the line I would say that this actually stands for only 10-15% of the community who don't want to make the next Final Fantasy or Doom 3.

Titles like Monkey Bowling, are innovative takes. That is a single game out of so many... and what is even worse is that games are very rarely finished because people are taking on too much for thier own good.
Rather than like back in the Speccy days where you'd slog away and make a simple platformer, now that platformer has to look awesome with shader graphics, play just like the latest version of Mario and have levels larger than the city of Los Angelos.

Back in the day, developers were restricted by the systems... this ment far far better quality games which everyone could enjoy and you would seen finished.
Now what restrictions are there?

Markets have evolved too far for developers like us to hope to keep up with, without working together as teams.
Unfortunately this is another aspect that is very sorely lacked in the term 'bedroom developer'... it should really be called 'Lone Wolf Developers'

That entire sodding term is actually ironic, because you know what happens to lone wolves in the wild?

The professional industry is in shambles as is the hobbiest insdustry... it is as simple as that.
Games require far more time, effort and skill now. Something which is apparently lacking currently.
Forget about the damn innovation unless you work for Ubisoft or are a hobbiest; even then some of the most Unique games in the world are just totally overlooked no matter how big a developer you are.

Startopia - Sort but truely awesome
Oni - Bungie's best work to date, and also most under-rated
Beyond Good & Evil - A very nice evolution of the Platform Genre
Oddworld - Showing you don't need 3D Graphics to make a good innovate game

Rather than embracing titles like this the industry shoves them under the carpet hoping not to worry.

What's worse for the industry is that genre's keep getting killed off too.
Adventure Games, Platformers, Real-Time Strategy, Etc...

These are now specialist genre's because the Mass Market is in FPS and RPG aparently.
You wanna know why?

Because the console market owns the direction of our games.
As you have to upgrade PCs just to play games now, Consoles have become the machines which dictact the genres we play from day to day...

Ever tried an RTS on the console? yeah... exactly.
What is even worse is because of this the PC markets genre's are drying up but even more over is the fact that we STILL don't get half the game types that the consoles do.

Last Final Fantasy on the PC was FF8. You want to play something like Dance Dance Revolution... pfft! not on your PC you won't.
The PC Platform quite frankly has become FPS heaven, with almost no sodding enhancements other than snazzy new graphics.

20years ago Nibblers was one of the best PC games, so simple and addictive. You think gamers care about graphics?
How many mates do you know who have a nokia and sit there addicted to snake even after mobiles being commonplace for almost a decade?

People want games they can have fun with... and that is exactly why the industry is dieing.

No innovation, No fun!
Graphics don't make the game, developers do.


GothOtaku
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 15:03
Quote: "
Last Final Fantasy on the PC was FF8. You want to play something like Dance Dance Revolution... pfft! not on your PC you won't."

No, last Final Fantasy for PC was XI and I have Dance With Intensity on my PC with a pad.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 15:48
yeah but XI is an MMORPG, I doubt many people count that part of the Final Fantasy Series; well not the usual FF Players & Game Devs.

I mean there is a world of difference between an MMORPG and the FF RPG.


Mentor
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Posted: 5th Sep 2004 19:58
duh! bought out and doing quite well?, they don`t exist any more, end of story, thats like saying Fords ownership of Jaguar means Jaguar still make desirable cars (ROFLMAO) like A two litre diesel? (ROFLMAO) and the new body shapes look like the bastard mating of a Scorpio and a badly damaged late model Jag, in other words, PIG UGLY and conventional, Jaguar are now OFF my dream car wishlist, I wouldn`t touch one with a bargepole, and would only take one as gift if it was just to sell on and buy a real car.
likewise I don`t think Buying out Melbourne house and leaving the offices open means their are any great adventure games out on the market by them, I was talking about the REAL original companies, not the leavings from some asset stripping excercise, we lost a lot of original concepts along the way (remember PieMania?), those companies are for the most part dead and buried.

Mentor.

PS: saw a concures standard v12 Jag in town the other day, pure art, stood alongside the current offerings it makes you realise just how bad they now are.

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MiR
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Posted: 6th Sep 2004 02:25
Ultimate is still around and doing well though(Ok so they´ve got a few more workers and are called Rare). Though I haven´t played a decent game of thiers since Conquer´s bad fur day. Thank god they had a demo of Grabbed by the Guoulies. I could have made a very bad mistake.
I do agree that the pc is missing a massive range of titles.If I see another Farcry any time soon I´m going to ram the disc through somebody´s head. Why can´t they stop making tech demos and start making games?


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Sir Spaghetti Code
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Posted: 6th Sep 2004 06:20
I may have already said this in this thread, but I am just not very satisfied with PC games. Frankly, I just don't really likr FPS or RTS games. And that cust out about 90% of all PC games. I don't understand why game companies think that in order to make a game on the PC, their only options are those two. The other 10% is made up of about 9% MMORPGs, with the other 1% being misc. And, sad to say, that 1% is where most of the real gems are (at least for me).


"What is a game if not illusions stacked upon illusions?"
Ian T
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Posted: 6th Sep 2004 07:16
RTS and FPS games can really kick ass, but aside from that, there are a ton of RPGs for the PC too. In fact, all the real RPGs are for the PC... the consoles get the playable movies and cheesy anime adventures.

Okay, so I generalized ... spam me!

Sir Spaghetti Code
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Posted: 6th Sep 2004 09:52
I just don't like FPS or RTSs. And I know some people will not understand this, but I like linear console RPGs. I don't like games like Diablo and Bulder's Gate. I play RPGs for the story, not for the combat. But that is just my opinion.


"What is a game if not illusions stacked upon illusions?"
Flashing Blade
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Posted: 6th Sep 2004 21:05
I've just skimmed through this topic so sorry if this point has been made.

Isn't Acclaim just a publisher and not a developer?
e.g. Burnout 2 was published by Acclaim but developed by Criterion Games.
Burnout 3 is going to be published by EA but it was still developed by Criterion.


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teh game wiz
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Posted: 6th Sep 2004 22:19 Edited at: 6th Sep 2004 22:22
i like the current pc games(fps and rts).
the new relistic graphics and pysics in the new games makes them more enjoyable to me(like in old games you could go through walls and strange things would happen that ment game over, when it shouldnt).

although i havent seen any well known ones recently, racing games used to be a good genre on the pc(i still got some old steering wheels). 2 days ago i went to games star live(no, i didnt have a chance to go on halo 2. the cue was estimated at, at least 3 hours ) and there was loads of racing games there(almost as many as fps) and some of them were for the pc.

btw, what genre is conkers bad fur day?

Ian T
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Posted: 7th Sep 2004 04:03
Diablo wasn't the kind of RPG I was talking about. Morrowind, Gothic, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights-- those are.

MiR
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Posted: 7th Sep 2004 20:49
Quote: "btw, what genre is conkers bad fur day?
"

Single player is a platformer and mult player is a third person shooter death match thing.
Sir Spaghetti Code: I´m the same. I love console style RPGs but can´t stand th pc ones. The 2 types shouldn´t be called the same thing. It gets too confusing.


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