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3 Dimensional Chat / Approaches for modeling a character

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 25th Sep 2004 16:21
Okay, so i think its time i got off my lazy @$$ and started making a character for my RPG, got sick of the sphere . So I can model okay with 3ds max, but I'm stuck on how to go about making clothes, hair, etc. Ive also heard its very helpful to have a concept sketch... do I need a front and side view?

Thanks! (hint hint: Brent/Psionic - 2 best modelers ive seen - could use some help )

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 26th Sep 2004 01:02
**appears in a etheral sphere of binary code and wireframes**

Eh..hmm..I wish I could sing a song like the fairy god mother from Shreck 2 but I think I'd get banned for life.

Quote: "Okay, so i think its time i got off my lazy @$$ and started making a character for my RPG, got sick of the sphere "


Bout time!
Quote: " but I'm stuck on how to go about making clothes, hair, etc. Ive also heard"


This part really is not that difficult. Clothing is Simple, and has many approaches. The easiest is simply use a good texture, but there are times when you need real geometery for a coat or shleves or such. Make sure you have geometery that follows the lines of your clothing, and simply extrude or smooth shift the geometery out. Then texture.

With hair it's much easier. I've done 3 models that I've put on these boards.(well 4 but I never finished him). First Check out the Deen model I did. Look at his hair. I shaped the top of his head to give the impression of hair, then I added texture to do the rest. Thats all, no elaborate geometery just some texture. On another model I did I named Eyrilus, I modelled the head, and in another layer I modeled a wig. I started with a flat square plane, cut lines into it, then unwelded the points to form strands. I added more lines so I could style it. Then I made it fit his head closely, then I textured it. Nothing really diffucult. It's just techinique. And once you understandt he technique and the tools you have its easy.

It's difficult to describe. You've just gotta do it.

Quote: "Ive also heard its very helpful to have a concept sketch... do I need a front and side view"


Concept Sketchs always help! They cant really hurt. When modelling your basically creating something from an empty screen, and this concept art can give you a goal or an overall idea which is important to get you started in the right direction. You dont really need a front and side persay..you might on a face or an extrememly intracate design. But most of the time you can eyeball most detial.

I modelled Deen for an angle shot I drew. No front or side needed.

Just remember these in this order ok? This is paramount. In real 3d such as movies and the like the order of importance goes:

Lighting
Texture
Geometery(or modeling)

However in Game 3d or game characters the list is:

Texture
Geometery

The reason is your texture must take lighting into account to be realistic, and game engines dont really support on the go radiosity calculations. Yoru texture is the deciding factor. You can take a 2000 poly model and give it a good texture and then pass it off as a 10k model easy. Light in the texture is paramount. You have to add darks under the arms and between the legs, under the chin and behind the ears. I baked my textures of Deen with GI to get this uniform lighting.

I hope that wasnt all confusing. Enjoy. Let me know if that helped.

"Laugh to scorn the power of man..."
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 26th Sep 2004 01:55
Thanks Brent, this was really helpful. So how do I go about making the torso? Should I just start with a box and adjust the vertices from front and side?

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 26th Sep 2004 02:40
Yes, Start with box. Then knife geometery as you see fit. And do post screenies.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 26th Sep 2004 06:32
I'll draw one and start posting my work... you can help . Thanks!!

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John H
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Posted: 26th Sep 2004 13:35
Brent is a busy man.


Check out our Team Request in the Team Request section if you want to help!
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 27th Sep 2004 14:46
tee hee... I'll draw one at school tomorrow in some boring subject like french or history

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 27th Sep 2004 15:19
Yep, I'm a busy man. I dont really know if I'd have it any other way either.


Just post away.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 28th Sep 2004 08:30
crap, lots of HW today. Lol sorry im trying not to let this post slip down... so if i get time to scan one today I'll try.

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 1st Oct 2004 23:30
I have no patience. Post now or forever how your piece.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2004 02:25
Hey! Sorry, I just got around to drawing a reference image! I know I should have done it earlier, just been REALLY caught up with HW. Ok ill try to scan it in and upload in a few mins, must go eat breakfast now.

Thanks

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2004 16:56
Here ya go:



Lol yes i know it sucks, he doesnt have any arms, I cant draw them "outwards" for some reason . Dunno, Ill try to add some arms when I get time. For now, I'm guessing I should start on the torso. So Your Highness 3d Modeling Sir, where to start?

Thanks!

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Wiggett
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2004 18:43
thats gonna be one hell fo a crazy rpg. i cant model people for peanuts, mind you im using milkshape, so starting witha cube doesnt help, considering i can only change 4 vertices. i wonder if i can change the amount in a cube like you can with stacks etc on a cylinder.

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 4th Oct 2004 02:48
Quote: "thats gonna be one hell fo a crazy rpg. "


Meaning, its too hard to model ?

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 4th Oct 2004 04:41
Eh...hmm.

1. Block your character in using cubes or cylinders. I start with a cube for his head then extrude down to form a neck then a torso. And from there extrude out to form his limbs. Once he's been 'blocked' in roughly, start cutting the geometery and shape him. The blocking in phase is basically the same thing an artist does when he sketches his form quickly to capture the motion in a gesture drawing.

You can use a cube for his chest and head, but cylinders seem to work better for his limbs.

Hope that gives you some idea. Just make sure you have a good understanding of the tools at your disposal and go from there.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 4th Oct 2004 10:52
Quote: "start cutting the geometery "


What exactly do you mean by that? I'm using 3ds max, so is it better to start with a box with a lot of segments, or is it better to start with a box with no segments, then add them as needed?

Thanks!

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 4th Oct 2004 12:22
Cube with no segments, the see if you cant find a knife tool or an add edges tool or something like that. I dont know the 3dsmax term but I know for sure that it has a darn good one.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 4th Oct 2004 14:18
Ya, its called "cut", or "quickslice".

I cant do this tonight, gotta work on a speech, I'll try after school 2morrow. Thanks!

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 4th Oct 2004 15:00
Ok... worked on it a little, decided to screw the speech and do it 2morrow. Here's a screenshot from the front viewport in 3ds max. I made a box, basically outlined the character, then sliced(added edges) and repeated. How's it so far?



Thannks for any feedback!

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 5th Oct 2004 13:36
comments plz anyone?

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 08:18
anyone? brent? how's the torso look?

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Bishop
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 08:34
what kind of model are you shooting for? higher polly, low polly, good detail, etc....this is just about as good of a start as you really need.....just get all the basic shapes in for his body (head, neack, torso, limbs, etc) and the work your way from the torso out....this seems to work best for me

cheers,
Bish

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 09:12
Low poly, cartoony style guy.

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 12:49
Well my good man, there's not much for me to comment on yet. But its a start. I mean..there isn't really much to comment on..yet! So extrude or bevel or shift yourself some gemeotry out and make some arms and legs.

It might help to take your picture and draw lines to sorta plan your mesh out. Open it up in mspaint or something and draw lines where you want edgeloops, or lines to show the flow of the geometery.

Cheers, and post some more screenies darn you!

"Laugh to scorn the power of man..."
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 14:59
Hahah.... hey brent how long will you be on? I have to do some math, but when I'm done, I can work on it more. AND POST SCREENIES .

Oh and also, I started on the thigh area, but I didnt extrude or anything, I just made a new box, and edited the vertices, knifed/adedd edges, same way I did the torso. Is that bad, or should I go with extruding/beveling?

Thanks!

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 6th Oct 2004 16:54
Ok ur right extruding is easier i think, here a screenie, torso and thigh area done...



also, should I do that thing where you delete one half then mirror and weld it?

Thanks!

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 13:55
hey brent ur online right now...can i plzzzz get some C&C? Thanks!!!

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Ron Erickson
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 00:07

If you want some C&C, do some more work. There is absolutely nothing to comment on.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 08:28
lol, okay, sorry.

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 13:05
I thought I posted...strange. I hope my post wasnt deleted. As it had nothing offensive in it. However I believe Wolf has a point. Mirror the geometery and get busy. Rough out the design then we'll work on chiselling details in!

Cheers.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 13:29
OK, I got a basic body done, I'll try to post, soon.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 16:43
I is trying, sir!



I know he's a little crooked, but I drew him that by accident, I'll have to straighten him out a little. Haven't welded the edges yet, still playing w/ it .

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Supremacy
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 21:38
for c&c's do more stuff and show, for your first model is coming pretty good.

TEH_CODERER
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 22:09
It looks 2D???

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 9th Oct 2004 14:59 Edited at: 9th Oct 2004 15:00
Yes, it looks 2d because i am looking at it from teh front viewport

@ Supremacy Project - Thanks! I'm trying to work on it whenever I can, but I got even more HW over the weekend

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 12th Oct 2004 08:48
comments brent?

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 12th Oct 2004 12:26
Eh. Finish the character so I can comment on him. I cant 'critique' a few more boxes. So finish him up and round him out. NOW! so I'll truely have something to comment on!


Now go and become a modelling god!

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 12th Oct 2004 16:39
Bleh, fine. OK but how do I do a head and the cap/hair?

Thanks!!!!!

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Supremacy
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Posted: 13th Oct 2004 00:55
do the head, chamfer a front edge and extrude, subdivide a bit and you got a 18 polygon hat

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 13th Oct 2004 12:29 Edited at: 13th Oct 2004 12:30
Added a head.... sort of



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Posted: 13th Oct 2004 12:34
looking good for your first

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 14th Oct 2004 09:04
Thanks

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 16th Oct 2004 14:19 Edited at: 17th Oct 2004 10:27
extended the arms, other minor touch ups, welded the middle together.

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 16th Oct 2004 22:10
Hell, that's one skinny neck, is your guy supposed to have a neck like that?

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 04:19
AHAH i added the neck in like 2 secs.. I'll make it wider. Good point.

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 07:07
You are welcome.
Don't worry it's hard modelling humans, I'm learning blender and although I can add a neck when I do stuff begins to come out of the shoulders and stuff even though the faces haven't been selected, I just need to dissolve some faces to get it right.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 10:27
Hows this:



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Cian Rice
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 10:50
It looks a bit thicker, but not that much.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 10:59
Even thicker? Are necks even supposed to be that thick? I mean, they're not exactly as wide as your head, a lil less.

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 11:01
I know they shouldn't be uber thick but just a bit more would do it I think.

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