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3 Dimensional Chat / Approaches for modeling a character

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 11:04
Haha ok... ill do it later... too much HW

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 12:22
he looks alittle big in the waist area, did he eat to much?

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 17th Oct 2004 12:32
ah yes there's a bit of a bulge... ill fix that

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 18th Oct 2004 08:56
Ok fixed.... Brent.... comments? help!!!!

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 18th Oct 2004 08:59
It's better.

There is only one way to package shaolin: Shaolin Soccer...
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 18th Oct 2004 13:53
hey LOL anime...

Quote: "There is only one way to package shaolin: Shaolin Soccer..."


Dude! omfg! they've been making that movie for like YEARS!

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 04:40
Eh, that movie is already out, it's been out awhile, it came out in 2001 in China and was released on DVD in America on August 31st, 2004.

There is only one way to package shaolin: Shaolin Soccer...
JeBuS
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 05:02
OK, just out of curiosity is this in 2d? Your screenies show what could be a 2d object. Looks like a bunch of splines on a flat surface, or a bunch of vertices connected with line segments.


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Cian Rice
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 05:31
It's 3D, duh! You really need to look more carfully, it's just in front view in the bottom corner it has an x,y,z pointer thingy, plus a mod would've moved it if it wasn't.

There is only one way to package shaolin: Shaolin Soccer...
JeBuS
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 05:37
You can make 2d models in a 3d environment, just read my last post more closely and you'll see how. Until I see some perspective views, I'm not convinced that it isn't 2d.


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Cian Rice
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 05:41
Well it is so get used to it.

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JeBuS
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 05:51
Heh, sorry, but it doesn't work that way

I'll believe it when I see it.


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Supremacy
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 10:06
anime blood are you portuguese?

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 10:08
Yes i've been editing the vertices in the front and side viewport.

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 10:09
No, I'm Irish but I live in america.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 11:35
Where r u Anime?

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AGK Developer
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 11:50
hey do u have any more updated screen shots of your model just wondering

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 13:47
Eh... I'll do it later.

BRENT WHERE ARE YOU!?!?!?!?

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 21:39
I'm wherever I am Indian.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 16:13 Edited at: 20th Oct 2004 16:15
Come on guyz... I need help! So I guess I'm done with editing in the front viewport.



Ok I basically got the outline in the left view...



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AGK Developer
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 08:40
nice

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 09:35
Thx... so where do I go now

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 10:07
Hands and actual feet.

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 12:37
Eh, I dont really know what you want me to say. I cant wave the magic wand. In some things, you just have to 'do it'.

I would suggest knife the geometery down the x axis, then pulling some points around to take out the boxy feel. You know make him round. Thats all I know to do from here.

I've been busy on my own projects lately so I havent been visiting this thread. You've got plenty of other help! so good luck.

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ionstream
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 14:08
Dude, it's not symetrical. Make half of the body, duplicate it and mirror it.

It would probably benefit you to model the person in a standing pose with arms out. Pull his legs in a little and model it like he's standing.
Wiggett
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 21:02
name me one person who is perfectly symmetrical.

Indian Homie G
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Posted: 22nd Oct 2004 09:28
Yeah i know... anyways i redid it and its symmetrical.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 25th Oct 2004 03:11 Edited at: 25th Oct 2004 15:00
ok guys i added more segments and stuff.. I'll post screenies later

here ya go



Oh and by the way, I forgot to mention, I'm going to make him try to look "cartoony" , meaning I'm going to use subdivision, smoothing, etc.

Comments plz!

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 26th Oct 2004 15:11
anyone.. how does the form look?

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Dr Evil
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Posted: 27th Oct 2004 06:52
i think you are losing the point of starting out with a small cube with few subdivisions.
only add vertices if you are planning on moving them around, or are rounding the form.
if you have 3 verts in a perfect line, get rid of the middle one for example.
i'll come back later and tell you more.
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 27th Oct 2004 15:17
Well yeah I'm rounding the form basically. Still not sure at this point whether I'm going to use subdivision surfaces.

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Dr Evil
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 00:38
don't bother using subdivision surfaces at this point. you should master one tool set at a time. start with learning everything about polygons as possible and then once you feel like you can't do anything new with them go to the next tool set.it's better to be a master of one thing than some one with limited knowledge on how to do everything.
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 08:37
Yeah I have a good knowledge of max's polygon tools. So... what do I do next ? Brent....

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Brent_Seraphim
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 06:52
d*mnit...if you know the tools use them. I think you mis took my advice when I said round him out. You added lots of polys and keep the same shape. Get rid of his box feel. Then go from there.

Get rid of his boxy shape.


Keep at it..just make use of those tools, my good man. Weld a few points. You could drop half the polys and keep the same shape.

Best of Luck. And do post screenies of somthing more then the front view. Maybe a prespective view?

Cheers

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Cartmanbeeps
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Posted: 30th Oct 2004 07:57
Thats gonna be.... ummmmm
how do i say this....
a 2d, 3d model.
Indian Homie G
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Posted: 20th Dec 2004 15:51
Bah.... haven't posted this thread in FOREVER . Been really really busy. Anyways... it's winter break and I started working on my dude again. Well I've just been having a hell of a bad time trying to make it with a box, I can't even get a good looking torso. But luckily, I came across an article showing how to use CYLINDERS instead of boxes, and I made a nicer looking torso with that. I think using cylinders will be easier because I need smooth characters for my game, but no subdivision=too many polys!

Now when it comes to arms I am stuck. So what exactly should I do?

Thanks

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 20th Dec 2004 18:14 Edited at: 20th Dec 2004 18:15
you know that, your going about this all wrong. for a beginner anyways..

while the general technique of what your doing is *about* right, the way your doing it is quite silly.
you can't really just jump into your first character without a *plan*, this is probably the biggest rookie mistake *ever*. Getting help from Brent, while he is a competant modeller he isn't much of a tutor (no offense); especially given he uses Lightwave. Psionic would also be very little good to you as a 3DStudioMax user, given he uses Cinema4D.

You'd actually be wanting help from either myself, or Froggermon.

What you need to do, is first get used to the modelling interface and work from a base design. Usually you'd have a concept artist knock up what you need, as you are that guy... this means you'll need to whip up a turn-around. This is a drawing of the model you wish to create from atleast the Front -> Side views.

Seeing as you probably don't have any dissernable sketching talent; I've gone and found an example one on the net. Something you can use for learning with.



This is a Dino Soldier concept from Turok Evolution, he would probably make a good addition as the leader of some non-human race in your RPG if you choose to use him.

I chose this because while he looks difficult the layout, actually makes him very easy. More-over he has a cape, which add a dimension for use later when animating or rigging physics.

Now the task with the image is quite simple. Using Microsoft Paint (as it's the easiest), try to box select around the front -> side -> back parts as best you can, then cut&paste them into new bitmaps.
Save each one with the name appropriot.
In order to export the arm & cape, what you do is make the selection slightly bigger than the image; then on the side / back bitmaps turn on transparency past them in and try to line them up with where they should be. Then turn off transparency, colour the rest white and export with an appropriot name.

Now in 3D Studio Max, what your going to do is to load all of these images... then create a cube. On the first one you'll select the *opposite* face to the one you want to use and map each of the Front -> Side -> Back images too it.
Resize it as needed (use the views to do this)... now move it so that it centres around the waiste rather than the feet.

The next task is to turn it inside out, i'll need to reinstall Max to find the exact control; but I believe you select the faces and in Geometry Edit, there is a 'Reverse' control.

Once that's done what you want to then do is to duplicate that cube (as a copy *NOT* instance) and on that one you then put the arms and cape. Make it slightly smaller than the first one, but only to prevent overlapping.

most people won't add layers, but once you've created these, you are going to want to learn layers. You'll need to create 2, so that you can hide / show these objects and turn off the world interaction. It can be done by making them freeze, but you don't have alot of control over frozen obejcts and I'd recommend that far more for when you need to edit individual objects.

Once you have your templates, the fun begins!
Start with a box and user the side view, extrude the box as needed to cover the *major* areas of the character.

Head > Shoulders > Waiste > Hips > Pelvis

Legs & Arms are always done seperate as they're a different style.
At this point your *only* doing the major details, so don't try to added hundreds of points.. it's just the basic shape your after.

Once that is done, use the Slice Plane and slice up the middle of the object. Then select and delete one side.. don't worry you'll add it back later but now you have the base for the model.

When I get back on later, what I'll do is add a few pictures in order to help explain what I've just gone over. In 3D Max *alot* of your modelling work done with box modelling, is done in the side view. Generally you only use the front view for shaping and Perspective for hard to reach selections or previewing.


Indian Homie G
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Posted: 21st Dec 2004 03:29
Umm

Thanks Raven. But I don't get your cube thing. Can't you just use "viewport background" (alt+b), and put the side view in left viewport, and front view in front viewport? Thats sort of what I'm doing, but, I don't have a good front sketch.

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 21st Dec 2004 04:44
lol, i'm sorting out the images and such now... backgrounds don't work like a cube - cause you can't resize them as you need to or resize together correctly.


Indian Homie G
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Posted: 21st Dec 2004 09:11
alrighty

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 22nd Dec 2004 19:50
Alrighty, well this should help... the original model scene, plus what I accidentially built upto working for an hr before I realised this was suppose to show the basics heh.

The built up one actually isn't done by anything other than cutting away at the first one.
It's in the attachment; the back image seems to be off, because of the size - so best to work to the front/sides then add the back in later... the body is basically done, what to do next will be the face & limbs. I could probably finish the model before the end of the day with texture if i put work into it.

You'll see what I've done with it heh


Indian Homie G
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 03:28
Cool... thanks a bunch Raven. But I'm not at my computer right now so I can't look at this until later today. But for the first one, what exactly did you do to create it? I didn't really understand your whole "cube" thing.

Thanks again

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 03:54
If you look at Dino.Soldier1.max, you'll see the base model... the cube area that makes up his chest is the original cube I made, then just extruded the main areas and shaped.

after that Dino.Soldier.max is created from simply hacking away at the model in the 1st on with the Cut Tool
You'll notice the semi-finished body also has a second half that is identical, that's achieved by deleting the faces along the center.. then creating a Mirror Instanced mesh. When you Instance a Mesh it allows you to do things to the mesh you created it from and the same will happen to the instanced mesh.

A very handy tool to get used to


Indian Homie G
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 05:55
Yeah i know about mirroring, etc. Do you use Edit Poly or Edit Mesh when creating this character? I prefer editable poly...

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 06:18
I use Mesh; I've never found a use for Polygon Mode... seems a bit pointless.


Indian Homie G
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 07:29 Edited at: 24th Dec 2004 04:24
Hmm.. all the tutorials I have seen for modeling low poly stuff in Max use Edit Polys instead of Edit Mesh... what are the differences?

Quote: "after that Dino.Soldier.max is created from simply hacking away at the model in the 1st on with the Cut Tool "


Meaning... moving and editing vertices?

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 16:46
Umm I can't open it, it says some DLLs are missing.

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IanG
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Posted: 23rd Dec 2004 20:41
what dlls?

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 24th Dec 2004 03:27 Edited at: 24th Dec 2004 10:07
Reactor.dlc
Parameditor.gup

I'm using 3ds Max 6... what are you using Raven? It seems to me you are using the 3ds max 7 trial...

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 24th Dec 2004 13:54
OK anyways... so Raven.... how exactly should I start off? I've tried starting with a box and also starting with a cylinder. When I tried using a box earlier I couldn't get rid of the "boxy" shape.. how do I do that?

Quote: "Legs & Arms are always done seperate as they're a different style.
At this point your *only* doing the major details, so don't try to added hundreds of points.. it's just the basic shape your after."


So I've got the basic shape, now how to add details?

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