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Geek Culture / thinking about going VB...

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Oneka
20
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:37
I dunno...but I think I might go VB becuase I like to make my life harder ...but I think I may like VB becuase its like up there with C++ and VB in my mind are like the top dogs in programming... but the onlything that is stopping me is
if I make a game and I wanna sell it to I have to have a license or something? What whould I do in the place of Matrixs...and the reason why I thinking about changing is it doesnt require DirectX to use..unless I use it and doesnt make huge EXES...so What are the pros and cons of VB vs DB? I dont like C++..its not hard I just dont like it..


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
David T
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Location: England
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:39
VB is license free.

For all 3D stuff you need to get a wrapper class / some code that manually does directx or opengl for you - not easy.

The best thing about VB IMO is the RAD (rapid application design) - you can make a windows gui app with ease. Trying to emulate what DBPro does however will take more time.

Get 15 new commands, all the date / time commands left out of DBPro for free!
DOWNLOAD PLUGINS HERE: http://www.davidtattersall.me.uk/ and select "DarkBasic"
Oneka
20
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:44
yeah I noticed the gui thing...that was one turn on..is it somewhat faster then DB? like if my coding was the same would it run alittle faster? and does the reason DB takes afew seconds to start up becuase of loading DLL? and Wrapper class?


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
David T
Retired Moderator
22
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Location: England
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:46
VB is nothing like DB - don't just get VB so you can do what DB does but faster. Doing 3d is very hard with it, and start times vary on how you code.

Get 15 new commands, all the date / time commands left out of DBPro for free!
DOWNLOAD PLUGINS HERE: http://www.davidtattersall.me.uk/ and select "DarkBasic"
Oneka
20
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:50
yay Hard I like it hard...well is there like a trial version or something like a demo to see what its like? so I dont blow 100-150 bucks on something I dont want..


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
David T
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22
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Location: England
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:51
Try to download the express edition of the new version. OR a learner edition of an earlier version (Vb6 is best I think).

Get 15 new commands, all the date / time commands left out of DBPro for free!
DOWNLOAD PLUGINS HERE: http://www.davidtattersall.me.uk/ and select "DarkBasic"
CattleRustler
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21
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Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:51
you do mean vb.net right?


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
Oneka
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Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 05:55
where is the question...I looked on the microsoft website..and Vb.net on the website it said something about making NET files instead of Exes whats that all about?


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
David T
Retired Moderator
22
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Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: England
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:03
Quote: "you do mean vb.net right?"


No, I mean VB6

Get 15 new commands, all the date / time commands left out of DBPro for free!
DOWNLOAD PLUGINS HERE: http://www.davidtattersall.me.uk/ and select "DarkBasic"
Cian Rice
20
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Joined: 8th Jun 2004
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:04
Don't leave us man! I want to see Daikanu come thru! Enter the compo and hope you can win DBPro!

Got anime?I do.
Oneka
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Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:09
no iam gonna finish DO just thinking about after it VB is the next language I wanna tackle..I still will use DB just I wanna learn DB too


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Cian Rice
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Joined: 8th Jun 2004
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:11
Good., cuz you didn't realize this but I had a gun pointed at your head just in case...

Got anime?I do.
Oneka
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:16
lol *checks his house* ya Iam sticking with DB for a couple of years but iam gonnna move on to VB in some point of time..I was just prethinking..


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Oneka
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:23
o yeah Animeblood if you wanna play the first Daikanu Online um tell me...


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Cian Rice
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:40
Yes, I do!

Got anime?I do.
CattleRustler
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 06:54
/me slaps DavidT about a bit with a large trout!

Quote: "I looked on the microsoft website..and Vb.net on the website it said something about making NET files instead of Exes whats that all about?"

I have no idea what you mean but anyway, if you are going to learn VB and you mean in a couple of years from now, that should be sufficient time for vb6 to be dead and burried. Good.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
David T
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 07:58
Quote: "/me slaps DavidT about a bit with a large trout!"


/me slaps .NET about a bit with a large trout

I just prefer vb6 - with .net it went all mainstream and visual studio-ey. Before it had a nice feel to it, didn't feel quite like the others and wasn't full of garbage vocabulary like "solution"

Get 15 new commands, all the date / time commands left out of DBPro for free!
DOWNLOAD PLUGINS HERE: http://www.davidtattersall.me.uk/ and select "DarkBasic"
Oneka
20
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 08:28
ok just get byond and get a account and page me sometime my pager is Darkfirewolf5


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
CattleRustler
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Joined: 8th Aug 2003
Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 10:40
DT, I am talking about the core language and how its on par with c-based counterparts (no longer a kid brother) and the fact that it is truly OOP now. I could give a rats ass about the frilly stuff hanging off the sides

raw code - raw power - raw meat


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
BearCDPOLD
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Joined: 16th Oct 2003
Location: AZ,USA
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 11:51
meat is good

Crazy Donut Productions, Current Project: Project Starbuks
Sony stole our name!
TKF15H
21
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Joined: 20th Jul 2003
Location: Rio de Janeiro
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 12:04
Odd seeing cattle talking about raw meet...

Oneka: If you like making life harder, you might want to give WarBasic a try. No FOR loops, just DO..Loop (for now, will work on that later). IFs allways have ENDIF, even if it's on the same line. But hey, it runs in Linux/windows and an XBox port is being planned.

Van B
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Location: Sunnyvale
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 20:05
I never got along with 3D in VB, it's so much more complex than DB, VB is really an application language, nothing else - it might churn out the odd 2D RPG, but there's really no grounds for making 3D games in VB when we have so many other options designed for the purpose. VB is only really fun when your getting paid to work with it, certainly not what I'd call a hobbyist language, personally I think getting DBPro learned inside and out then moving to C++ if you have to is the sensible route.


Van-B


Muhahahahaha.
CattleRustler
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Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 7th Oct 2004 22:31
well things may be different now that you can use Direct X natively in VB.NET/C#.


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!
blanky
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Joined: 3rd Aug 2004
Location: ./
Posted: 8th Oct 2004 05:17
VB.NET is SLOW CRAP.

I know this, as I have the full versions of both Visual Studio 6 and Visual Studio .NET 2003.

...and actually the European representative of Microsoft said that .NET is NOT SPEEDY and so GAME DEVELOPERS should stick with older languages...

If you want SPEED, learn C. Not C++. C.

Visual Basic 6 is decent, although admittedly older.

.NET has VB.NET actually taken SERIOUSLY (THANK GOD FOR THAT!).

But.. Visual Basic 6 is faster, and if you have DirectX installed, try playing with Projects > References > DirectX 8 for Visual Basic Type Library, and download M$'s DirectX8 VB-only SDK = FUN

I recommend VB. Actually, I learnt VB6 as my first EVER language, then I learnt Dark Basic.

They're both based on the BASIC syntax so you should be well at home, but purchase a decent book on Visual Basic as there's no built-in How-To-Program guide, and you've got to be able to use object-oriented (the . symbol e.g., setting the caption of Button1: Button1.Caption = "Whatever"), etc. And Functions.

I recommend Deitel&Deitel's book (www.Deitel.com) Visual Basic 6 - How To Program. I learnt my first programming language at 10 using that book

NOTES ON VB SPEED
=========

In VB.NET i did something which VB6 can't do. I created a Console application.

Then I added a Form (basically a window which can be designed beforehand and shown whenever).

I used the following commands pretty much:

Sub Main()
Console.WriteLine("Loading...")
Form1.Show
Console.WriteLine("Done")
End Sub

For 'Loading...' to appear in a console window, it took about 0.1 seconds.

For Form1, an EMPTY form to Show, it took 5 seconds. On a P4 3.2GHz 1GB Ram, no other programs running.

In Visual Basic 6:

I created a Form which had a Label called Label1 (aren't I Imaginative ) on it. I called the Form frmConsole for no particular reason. I made it so frmConsole would start up as the first Form, and I also added a Form called Form1.

'frmConsole's Code

Private Sub Form_Load()
'so the code looks kinda similar
Main()
End Sub

Sub Main()
Label1.Caption="Loading..."
Form1.Show
Label1.Caption="Done!"
End Sub

When run, it was SO fast the screen didn't even flicker. Form1 was there and on my fake console it said 'Done!'. I didn't even see the 'Loading...' bit!

(I retried this experiment on a 450MHz Celeron, (just the VB6 one) and I saw the screen flicker slightly. Slightly.)

I think this makes it clear that .NET is slow, anyway

[img src=http://blanky.pt-web.net/ddd.gif] >::p
Oneka
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Joined: 24th Apr 2004
Location: Hampton,VA
Posted: 8th Oct 2004 05:37
um...I do sometimes not use For command in my game I make my own using gosub loop because sometimes I have the need to have a for command run twice (one inside another) and it like Crashed my comp so I built my own using gosub and placing it to loop with a var + 1 at the end for a set amount of time...


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
the_winch
21
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Joined: 1st Feb 2003
Location: Oxford, UK
Posted: 8th Oct 2004 06:43
Quote: "I think this makes it clear that .NET is slow, anyway"


No it just makes it clear that .NET apps take a few seconds to start up.

Shrink dbpro exes with upx
can i scream?
CattleRustler
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Location: case modding at overclock.net
Posted: 8th Oct 2004 07:35
hee hee.
Blanky, .net applications are compiled-on-demand and optimized for the current system. The first time they load they load a little slow, after that they are right quick. Overall, from an OOP programming POV (and IMHO) vb.net puts vb6 not only to shame, but to bed. And btw I use both professionally.

but to each his own. Enjoy programming whatever language you use


DBP_NETLIB_v1.4.3 DarkTOPIA site coming soon!

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