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Geek Culture / what is the easiet programming language existed?

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 14:32
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Quote: "Try doing a for / next loop in HTML. Hell, try doing anything procedural in HTML!"

You could say the same thing of java. It's kinda object oriented, HTML. and Java IS a language.

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Eric T
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 14:40
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But the main thing is:

HTML no compile
Java yes Compile

Thats usually how you can tell a language, is if it actually has to compile. Now there are a few exceptions out there, but as long as i live HTML is not a language.


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Mnemonix
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 15:04
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Html isnt object oriented at all. That is the stupidest comment i have ever seen at this board.

It is perfectly feasible to say that you can do procedural things in java.

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BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 15:06
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What if Internet Explorer and the like were considered compilers for html?

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 15:08
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Thats like saying doom 3 is a compiler for save files

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Eric T
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 15:09 Edited at: 19th Oct 2004 15:10
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Quote: " It's kinda object oriented, HTML."


LMGDMFAO i shoulda refreshed...HA.
Can't say anything else.

And as for IE being a compiler, Its a veiwer, not a compiler.


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BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 15:10
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That was a good one Mnemonix
(don't kill me, I'm a n00b )

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 15:16
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heh, tis ok, drop by the IRC channel some time, we can help you out with this theoretical stuff.

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Indian Homie G
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Posted: 19th Oct 2004 16:07
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hah.. we never did logo in school... my dad taught me when I was in like 4th grade

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 10:01
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Quote: "Re: Javascript. Ilya: It's built into HTML."


No, it isn't.

HTML isn't a programming language. It never will be. You cannot compile it, you don't even interpret it. It's structured mark-up definition, nothing more. If you think you can "code in HTML" then pull your head from the sand and get over it, you aren't coding at all, you're structuring a document, that's all. Life goes on.

Cheers,

Rich

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 12:58 Edited at: 20th Oct 2004 13:00
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And the great Davey pwns once more

But yea, saying javascript is built into HTML, is like saying PHP is, or that TPC`s are built into DBP. Well maybe thats not the best comparison, but its 4am here.

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 13:04
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Quote: "Html isnt object oriented at all. That is the stupidest comment i have ever seen at this board.

It is perfectly feasible to say that you can do procedural things in java."
Acctually it isn't when you make a java game you always have to do something for the computer to do anything.

In HTML it is kinda object oreinted. Maybe my definition is different, I say that:
Procederal(sp?): It starts at the top and goes down

Object oreinted: It jumps around to different spots as you click stuff. and reads the code that way.

So I guess HTML is really both, it goes from top to bottom, then jumps around.(like the hokkey pokkey!)

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 13:31
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????

Quote: " Acctually it isn't when you make a java game you always have to do something for the computer to do anything."



Right...

Are you sure your not thinking of javascript....? otherwise, go and learn about java. My server is written in java, and all i do is start it running and it takes care of everything else itself.

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bitJericho
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 13:39
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perhaps he runs a computer in his basement full of slaves memorizing ones and zeros... and then when he gets in the mood he sends crazy java to them, to each work on on command together at the same time...


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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 13:46
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I think the argument he is trying to make is that java is event driven in a similar style to Visual Basic, if so, he probably thinks this because he uses applets. Applets may have an effect he described, but applets are not part of the language, they are part of the api and often are not included.

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 13:54
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Yeah, I didn't know java could compile as anything but an applet.

But it still reads the code in the way I described. Vb is procederal, it starts at the top and goes down(in a timer), you could use vb object oreinted like, but it's not really being object oreinted, it's just going through it proceduraly then makes little procedures and variables for all the objects. I coded in VB and Java(havn't in quite a while) and I know the inner workings(mostly of Vb)

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 14:05
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If you know the inner workings of VB then how is it possible to say that VB is not object oriented?
Java does not read code the way you described at all.
VB starts at the top? VB starts either with a form load or a sub main to my knowledge. VB is object oriented.

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 14:18
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acctually, it does start at the top, it Dim's all the variables(which are at the top, then goes to formload(which is a procedure).

Procedure: Proceddural

How can you say it going to form_load is object oreintented when it goes there without you doing anything at all!

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 14:25
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But you do do something, you tell it to start there. It starts there by default, but you can change where it starts. As for the dimming of the variables as you put it, can you do anything else but that at the top hmm?.

Look, im going to bed now, somebody else can knowlege you about this. Object oriented programs ARE LEGALLY allowed to contain procedures,(object methods). Ok, so if its not object oriented, how exactly do you look at the contents of a text box, or alter them, or run methods on them(none of the textbox strike me at this hour) if they are not objects hmm?. Go and get a book about object oriented programming, read it, then come back here and post what you have found out.

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BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 14:34
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Object Oriented=Making Nachos.

YOu setup "recipes" for objects, like Custom Types, setting the parameters for an object, filling in the necessary parameters and using fillers for parameters you will not need. The program can then access information about these objects and can use them in several different pages in the program.

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 14:39
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Not quite.

Ok, say you have a car
It can have properties, such as color, engine size, number of doors...etc.

but it can also function, such as being able to ignite fuel, and it has all the know how to move, while all the user has to do is know how to control it.

Basically, an object knows how to do what it needs to do independantly and contains the data for it to accomplish the tasks it needs. Therefore its not important for the programmer using the object to know how it works, just how to use it(you dont need to know every detail of a car to drive it. Much less a microwave oven).

Neither do you have to know all the complexities of a common dialog box, you set properties, and invoke methods, but VB isnt object oriented hmm?

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 14:55
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Whatever, I just got an e-mail from Spammer Xtereme, I'll check the MS website later.

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 15:07
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pwn3d

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 15:21
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By Spammy? I'm still not done this, I WILL FIGHT TO THE DEATH!!!

I CHALLENGE YOU MNEMONIX TO A MUD WRESTLING DUEL!!!

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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 15:27
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Mnemonix
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 15:47
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Of course.

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GothOtaku
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 16:10
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I always found the BASICs easiest of all although Pascal, Fortran 90, and Euphoria are really easy and powerufl. Modula-2, LOGO, COBOL, and PILOT can be easy but also have their little issues that can make them pretty confusing.

As for the "HTML is a language" debate: it's a markup language not a programming language you can't do any calculations in HTML.

As for the "VB is object-oriented": it is not object-oriented, it's event driven. VB .NET I think might be but the classic VBs aren't (no inheritance, etc.).
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 20th Oct 2004 20:05
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Quote: "In HTML it is kinda object oreinted. Maybe my definition is different, I say that: Procederal(sp?): It starts at the top and goes down"


Actually I would agree that HTML is more object focused than anything else. But it's not object-orientated CODE (or procedural code for that matter). Saying it is based on objects is quite accurate though, as anyone who has delved into the Document Object Model in any depth would agree.

But let's not confuse objects with OO programming practises here. They are a world apart.

Cheers,

Rich

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Manticore Night
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 08:15
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So we're both right? I guess all those teachers in elementary who told you to "agree to disagree" were right.(But I still want that mud wrestling fight)

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BearCDPOLD
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Posted: 21st Oct 2004 08:55
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yeah, videotape it and upload it I wanna see the action

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