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Geek Culture / How DarkBASIC was created?

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1tg46
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 22:20
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I was wondering how DarkBASIC was created. I am pretty sure that I saw somewhere that DarkBASIC was created with C++, but I want to know a tiny bit more. Like how many lines of code did it take to make DarkBASIC programming possible. Who had the first idea about DarkBASIC, and how did thegamecreators came to be.

Does anyone know? If not O'well

Thanks,
1tg46


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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 22:41 Edited at: 10th Nov 2004 22:43
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Well, its a long and complicated process, but involved 1 carrot, 1 brussel sprout and a blender...

Quote: "I am pretty sure that I saw somewhere that DarkBASIC was created with C++"

No - knock of the ++ and you'll have the correct language.

Quote: "Like how many lines of code did it take to make DarkBASIC programming possible"

It took many, many lines...

Why not e-mail Lee directly ?

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Benjamin
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 22:55
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I thought it was created with C++

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Van B
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:13
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It started with Lee and Rick, Lee told Rick that his dream would be to create his own programming language, and so they started work. IIRC Rich was originally a freelance web designer who loved nothing more than making retro style tech demos (like about 100 of them!) and code snippets - then when TGC expanded Rich was taken on as the full time web admin dude.

Then Mike joined shortly after DBPro was released to help combat bugs - and Ravey joined the squad recently to work on side projects with DBPro after the success of that driving school CD-Rom thing.

Nowadays Mike and Lee are both working on FPSC and combating bugs at the same time, Rich is busy with the website and other admin stuff, Rick - I think he spends most of his time with marketing stuff.

There are more freelance style folk, like Simon the artist for instance.


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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:19 Edited at: 10th Nov 2004 23:21
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If you had come to the Convention (and stayed around to the very end), you would have got the full history of it...

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:31
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1tg46 - look at the VERY early editions of the newsletter, specifically the interviews with Lee and Rick to find out how it all started.

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:36
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I thought Lee started it with his uncle Malcom, then later when it was far enough along he went through Rick to get a publishing deal; then ropped his brother Micheal into lending some 3d talents for media.

All of this after he gave up being a programmer of the Mindstorms for Lego.

could be wrong :-\


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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:40 Edited at: 10th Nov 2004 23:42
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If I remember, it was thus (extremely condensed version) :

Rich was at some company (cant remember the name now, so I'll call it X). It wasn't Mindstorm - it produced educational games for home computers (some of which I used to have - until I started writing my own).
Lee joins X
Lee leaves X (not straight away of course)...
Rich leaves X
Lee starts Games Creators
Rich joins Lee

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Van B
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:43
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You mean Rick (not Rich) right?


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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:44
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i know Lee was working for Lego, and i'm pretty sure on the Mindstorms Robotics programming before he left to make DarkBasic.
i know that the original version was done with alot of Malcoms help, which makes me a little sad that he never really gets any recognition.

don't know much about the relationship between Rick and Lee.


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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:44
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No - unless I haven't remembered Lee's story correctly...

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:44
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TCA - It was Rick Vanner working at Europress, he was one of the top producers there. Lee joined, worked on Click and Play, Rick asks him to make a PC version of AMOS (pretty much). Lee says no. Rick tries again a year or two later, Lee says yes. They both leave, work on DB, release first version around 1999. The rest as they say is history.

Cheers,

Rich

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:45 Edited at: 10th Nov 2004 23:46
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Rick Vanner is the original member; Richard Davey was just a forum member that helped out, and was roped in. IIRC

[post.edit]
ya know we really need Lee to be sitting here explaining the history


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Posted: 10th Nov 2004 23:47
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Ah - so I did remember it incorrectly then. Well, thats drink for you...

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:05
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Rick and Lee own the company, yes. Always have done. We wouldn't exist today without Ricks control over everything, that's for sure!

The full accurate history, direct from Lee's mouth, is in issue 2 of the newsletter (as I said above).

http://www.thegamecreators.com/?gf=newsletter_issue_2

Cheers,

Rich

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Ian T
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:10
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Mike joined well before DBP was released !

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:13
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Yeah He was the third dude on the payroll. Me being the fourth.

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David T
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:20
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Would it be possible to tell us how many lines the original DB and DBPro are?

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Ian T
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:21 Edited at: 11th Nov 2004 00:21
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One.... Make_DARKBasic()!

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Phaelax
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:35 Edited at: 11th Nov 2004 00:36
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If I remember, Lee had to go to uncle malcom for help with creating the parser. Lee was also one of the few last remaining AMOS programmers. This all used to be on the original DB website.
Alos, didn't Lee say he didn't know C when he started making DB?

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:50
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He didn't know ASM when he started DBP, i know that much.
probably explains a few things to a few people ^_^

even though Lee's relative arn't on the payroll doesn't mean they didn't help enough to be recognised in thier own rights


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Ali M Oldboy
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 00:53
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Quote: "
Well, its a long and complicated process, but involved 1 carrot, 1 brussel sprout and a blender..."


Damn! I thought it WAS made by that!

-ALI-

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Richard Davey
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 02:01
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Quote: "even though Lee's relative arn't on the payroll doesn't mean they didn't help enough to be recognised in thier own rights"


You mean in all manuals, documentation, etc? Oh wait.. they are

Chris is the main one to be honest, today he still works for us on model animations.

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1tg46
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 02:44
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Thanks for explaining all of this, it seems very interesting.

@TCA
Quote: "Why not e-mail Lee directly ?"

My use of email is very strict with the parents. I am lucky to even email robK about a problem with his plugin. At the moment RobK is the only user of the forum that I can send and receive stuff from, as the parents setup AOL in a certain way.

I hate it, but I have to live with it


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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 02:45 Edited at: 11th Nov 2004 02:47
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The security on AOL is not that good
But if you cant e-mail anyone, then, as Rich suggested, you will need to find one of the early newsletters.

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 02:54
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No i don't mean documents and manuals... i mean more through the community.
I dunno, just seems like most people don't know anyone on the team past Lee, Rich and Rick;

There's Simon, Philip, Ravey (dunno his real name lol), etc... as well. TGC is surprisingly large now.


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PowerSoft
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 03:34
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Ravey == Dave Milton?


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Van B
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 03:44
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a.k.a. Ravey Davey Gravy


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Mussi
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 03:54
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no no no, you guys got it all wrong... this is how it all began.

It all began when Lee was born



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Neofish
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 03:56
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It all began. Lee came into existance. There was no light, so Lee made the sun...have I got the wrong story again?

Anyway I have been interested in the history of DB...so how old was Lee when he started?

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Mussi
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 04:12 Edited at: 11th Nov 2004 05:27
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no no no, you guys got it all wrong... this is how it all began.

It all began when Lee was born . Lee started playing with the and the when he was only 12 years old. Then suddenly an idea flashed trough his mind , he was going to take over the with the all mighty . Lee went and he . Then suddenly out of nowhere, he was reborn (maybe it was an ), only this time he looked more like . When he was only 4 years old, he started drinking , he started seeing some imaginarie friends... and . and manipulated Lee to work for the dark side, they mainly used for that. Then oh my god there was Dark Basic

So it couldn't have been Lee, I personaly think it was , but there's a big possebility it was instead



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1tg46
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 04:31
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An amusing story Mussi.


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Mussi
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 04:35
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It's my examweek that made me do that . And also kept pushing me .



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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 05:19
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creative use of the emoticons... i gave it a B+ keep it up trooper


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Richard Davey
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 07:25
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There are loads of people involved, lots of whom you'll never hear about. Lee, Rick, Mike, myself, Ravey, Malcolm, Chris, Simon = the core team. Our Swedish 3D guru Michael also worked on FPSC. Then there are people like Kes and Andy who do/did 3rd party development directly for us. Plus the sales team (Simone & Yolanda IIRC). There are lots of people we work with who distribute our products in other countries (Gilmer, Roby, etc) but they do not work directly for us. So yeah, quite a few people are involved really, but the first 8 I listed are the core team right now.

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1tg46
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Posted: 11th Nov 2004 20:11
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I don't think all of them are active in the forums, are they?


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Richard Davey
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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 00:00
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No, some of them have sense!

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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 00:55
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i was there at the convention with lee mike ravey and carly (gamzman) when lee was telling us his story.

malcom is lee's uncle who helped lee out so much as a kid, lee wanted to pay him back by letting his uncle work for him.

lee applied for a job, there were 3 directors, rick was the director that said "stop, i'm taking him for my department, i dont care what u say" lee left, and i think rick left 6 months later or got fired or something and phoned lee up casually to say "hey how ya doin" and lees like "im 1337" so ricks like "im pwnd" so lees like "omg noob come work for me" so lees former boss now works for him

i didnt here the story of how mike came into the equation. ravey was in blitz and then came to the dark side.

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Cian Rice
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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 01:51
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Quote: ". ravey was in blitz and then came to the dark side.
"

I think you mean that Ravey redeemed himself from the dark side of the force and came to see the light.

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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 01:53
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Indeed And from what he showed at the demo, he should also have a Halo...

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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 02:18
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u mean the demo at the convention?

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David T
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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 02:59
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Quote: "Indeed And from what he showed at the demo, he should also have a Halo..."


Do tell

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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 03:34
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Quote: " u mean the demo at the convention? "

Yes indeedly

Quote: "Do tell"

It was a shader (and non-shader) based 3D shooter.

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David T
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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 03:59 Edited at: 12th Nov 2004 03:59
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Any more info? Like what exactly you saw?

Don't tell me they made you sign an NDA

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Posted: 12th Nov 2004 06:35
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Quote: " Any more info? Like what exactly you saw?"

You should have come to the convention in person, you know...

All it consisted of was a mixture of large square rooms and corridors, with homing baddies (like that revolting Serious Sam game). Dont think I've got the program any more, so I cant show you unfortunately.

If you ask Ravey nicely - he may furnish you with the appropriate graphics.

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Toby Quan
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Posted: 14th Nov 2004 12:37
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Here's an old image that I found of DarkBasic on the internet. I put a few Flash effects on it ... just for the fun of it ...



Here's the source website:

http://www.colorarts.de/dbde/news/gcreport.html
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