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Geek Culture / Ummmm. So what laptop is the best value for money

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MiR
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:02
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I´ve been charged with finding the best value for money laptop in England and since I don´t know a thing about laptops I need your help. The price isn´t inportant, it just needs to be the best value for money. Bear in mind a newbie to pcs is going to use it and they need to pick it up before the the 5th of december.
Thanks for your help you knowledgable people


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bitJericho
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:05 Edited at: 23rd Nov 2004 03:05
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what's the newb going to be using it for?

If he's going to be a perma-newb then I would suggest Dell, as they have, from what I hear, decent customer service, and since things stop working, newbs generally have no other choice other than tech support..

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MiR
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:22
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Quote: " what's the newb going to be using it for?
"

Well he´s a newb to pcs and as they taking it to Spain unfortunatly technical support is out the window. So basicaly something that´s newb-proof and suited for office stuff and simple internet games.


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bitJericho
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:26
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no such thing as a newb proof computer

Get something in the low to mid range from a popular company that puts lots of software on it..

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Dodo
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:31
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http://www.laptops-guide.com/

Part of solving the problem is actually noticing that the problem is there in the first place

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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:54
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Acer ones are pretty good.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 03:58
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Quote: "I would suggest Dell, as they have, from what I hear, decent customer service"
Heh, good joke there.

I myself bought a Dell. Look on the Outlet and you can get some good bargains. They are refurbished laptops, but only because people cancelled or returned their orders. They then rebuilt and re-QAed the machine. Best I've seen was a Dell 8600c 2Ghz Dothan with 1920x1200 resolution, XP Pro, 512Mb RAM, DVD burner, and ATI 9600 Pro Turbo graphics card. All for £915 inc VAT and delivery. That machine basically runs at about the same speed as a 3Ghz P4 (times Centrino by 1.5 normally), and in a lot things outperforms it (SuperPI for example). I know because I got a similar deal (not quite as good though). Runs Doom 3 fine, and you have to love that resolution. Very nice machine.

Note though that there is a Dell 9100 which can be equiped with an ATI 9800 (only laptop I know of). Is actually a cut down version of the X800 apparently and runs about the same speed of a desktop 9800 (about 18-19k in 3D2001). Unfortuantly it is like a brick and the battery lasts less than an hour (8600 lasts 4-5 hours ish).

Also look at RockDirect for serious P4 laptops (2 drives with RAID 0, 3.6Ghz Extreme P4 etc). Again size of buses, sound like airplanes taking off, weigh a tonne, and can replace a radiator if the battery didn't run out after half an hour.

Best place to look is http://www.whatlaptop.co.uk/Forums/Default.aspx Totally helped me choose a machine. Well, is best in UK. There is another one (mainly USA), but I lost the link when my machine died. BG is starting on TV, so must dash.

Top tip is to avoid Alienware. May be good desktops, but overpriced and underpowered in laptops. Got to love the alien eyes (actually an option in BIOS), but the same RockDirect Extreme spec always beats it for speed, and is normally £200 cheaper. Go for a PCTorque, VoodooPC, or perhaps SavRow for similar looking machines with more power and cost less.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 04:00 Edited at: 23rd Nov 2004 04:00
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A friend of mine got an Acer, and they are pretty good. Esp. the Ferrari. But they have a *really* bad reputation. Right up there with Tiny. Check out that forum I listed for some extreme slagging offs. Even Dells shoddy customer service is higher placed.

Look at [href]www.acernotebooks.co.uk[/href] for good buy now pay later deals.

Cheers

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bitJericho
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 04:20
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So now dell has crappy customer service? Odd.. I used to hear great things about them..

Not that I'd ever get a dell, ever. Nor a compaq.. In fact, I would never buy a laptop if I didn't have a very good reason to do so.

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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 04:31
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Quote: "But they have a *really* bad reputation"

Never heard of that...

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 11:29
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Acer are a top brand, atleast for the Art Community as they provide some very good Tablet Notebooks

Personally I'd suggest, Alienware. World-wide support, built for speed, good support service.

That said, Aries do cheap 64bit Laptops

generally you don't want to go for companies that specialise in thier *own* brands.
Dell might seem cheap and idiot-proof; however they're Specialised systems. Only they know how to fixx them, and they tend to go wrong right after the warrenty. Not to mention thier hardly robust.

That is one reason I buy from Alienware.. I tend to have a habbit of dropping my laptop, and well this can often mean the end for them;(i'm so damn clumsy when walking up stairs and i'm not sure why) the ones from Alienware tend to live the longest.

I wanna get one of those IBM eBooks, with the shock resistance heh they look so cool.


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The Nerd
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 22:23
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well i have a Dell dimesion 8250.
And i think thats a good computer
I dont have any probs with it.

Quote: "But they have a *really* bad reputation"


well i havent heard that before




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Kentaree
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Posted: 23rd Nov 2004 22:28
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I got a Targa laptop from Lidl, and apart from a shaky start because the adapter that came with it was faulty, its a brilliant piece of kit.

Desktop: AMD Athlon XP2800+,GeForce FX5200 128MB, 1.25GB DDR RAM
Laptop: AMD Athlon 64M 3000+,Mobility Radeon 9700 128MB, 512MB DDR RAM
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MiR
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 00:37
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Thanks guys.
I think I´ll recommend an Acer laptop with 512mb ram and an Athlon 64.

This one looks nice: http://www.savastore.com/productinfo/product.aspx?catalog_name=Savastore&product_id=10278777&pid=197&rstrat=5674


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Mx5 kris
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 00:47
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well, the best for my money was a Compaq Presario X1000. It is new, has an "ok" graphics card, 30-40gb hard-drive, 516 mb of ram, 19" screen, and of course, 3 usb plugs, built in speaker,sound controls not on the pc, and lots of support for games. I find that its screen is a little strange, but it offers a lot. Good choice for n00bs. Watch the keyboard though, it is pure evil!!!11!!!!!

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bitJericho
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 00:48
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i hate to say this, but a 64 bit processor right now isn't worth the money It's cool to have if your hardcore linux/gaming, but for common business uses a 32bit processor will still be fine for the next 3 years yet.

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MiR
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 01:47
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Well I recommended a 64 bit pc so he´ll be able to run longhorn when it comes round. Might need to update the ram though but in my school there are some 700celerons that run quite fine with XP so as long as it´s 64bit it should run fine with Longhorn....I hope

Well that´s my logic anyway.


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bitJericho
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 01:56
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That's true, but it'll be another year before longhorn is a feasable OS.. if they stick to their release date..

But I thought it was even longer yet until longhorn comes out.. I'm behind the news... not too bad of a choice I gather.. but still not getting your moneys worth

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Dazzag
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 03:19
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Depends with Dell. Luckily they have a worldwide warranty so you can buy it anywhere and it get it fixed anywhere else (I was asked if I was going to use my PC with weapons of mass destruction, but that was about it - honest). Problem with the UK is that unless you specifically phone the Irish helpline you will almost def. get in contact with someone in India. Who can't speak english pretty much at all. And doesn't seem to know about computers. Look at some of the forums for some cool horror stories. Personally I couldn't give a monkeys as I should be able to fix most problems myself.

Again with Acer just look at the forums. Extreme slagging off basically. My friends PC seems fine and everything, and I seriously liked the Ferrari, but for me the screen res tends to be low, and all the bad press totally put me off.

Now fair enough with bigger manufactures you get more horror stories, and nothing really put me off from getting Dell. But you should really browse a hell of a lot. I looked into a lot of forums, and once you sift through the fanboy rubbish (Alienware for example, and the total opposite for Dell by some people - "I HATE DELL. NEVER GET A DELL YOU STUPID MORON!!!" - I bought a Dell... w**ker...), then you can get a better picture. Just research like hell, as it is a lot of money.

A lot of people *love* the Rockdirects in the UK, and they tend to save a couple of hundred quid on the equivelent Alienware effort (Extreme/Area 51 or at least it was a couple of months ago). And the Alienware has been slower consistantly for the last few years for the same machine (same chassis etc.). Only advantage with the Alienware is that it looks a little nicer, has a better screen res and has alien eyes on the front. Prefer more speed myself... was put off Rock at the time because their screen res was a bit low (about 1440x1000ish).

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Dazzag
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 03:21 Edited at: 24th Nov 2004 03:23
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Oh, and with the 64 bit machines, the only machine to be faster (on the laptop forum) than my 2Ghz dothan centrino for 1 million decimal places in SuperPI was a 3400 AMD 64. It was 1 second faster at 39 secs. Even a few 3.2Ghz P4s were slower (about 46-60 secs depending on spec). If they are out with 3.6Ghz+ P4 laptops now then they will probably be beating it I would imagine. Or at least getting close.

Cheers

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freight hopper
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 11:28
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Don't know if Dell markets the same models in the UK. Six months ago (in the U.S.) I bought a Dell Inspiron 1100 for $750. About a month later I got the blue screen of death. Got with tech support (Panama) and was walked through a complete re-install of XP that left my apps intact. He said it was a "Microsoft problem" (yeah, right). About two months ago I decided to upgrade the ram to 1gig and bought thru Dell for $250. Installed the two banks and the computer would not boot. Reversed the placement and it worked. Reversed again and it would not work, etc. It really bothered me that the placement of two supposedly identical components mattered. Yes, I could have raised hell with Dell and sent the machine in only to have some tech reverse them again and tell me it was fine. But this was to be a alternate DBP development machine and I need memory I can TRUST (my own coding and DBP's bugs are quite enough to handle). Anyway, I sold it as is to someone who will only be running Word on it and took the loss. Got a Toshiba M35X-S149 last week and it looks good. The fit and finish are infinitely superior to Dell's. You can beat the Japanese when it comes to consumer electronics. Yeah, you will pay more but you won't end up with damaged goods that some manufacturer is trying to move. I'm done with Dell.

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 24th Nov 2004 11:50
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Quote: "Oh, and with the 64 bit machines, the only machine to be faster (on the laptop forum) than my 2Ghz dothan centrino for 1 million decimal places in SuperPI was a 3400 AMD 64. It was 1 second faster at 39 secs. Even a few 3.2Ghz P4s were slower (about 46-60 secs depending on spec). If they are out with 3.6Ghz+ P4 laptops now then they will probably be beating it I would imagine. Or at least getting close."


I wouldn't mind seeing these results, as the 3400+ AthlonXP-M i'll understand it running level with.. but the 3400+ Athlon64-M, i'm not so sure about. Then again they might be trying to make the tests 'fair', this is a problem i've seen when benchmarking processors.. they tend to want to make the tests a 'fair' test of thier raw speed.

Athlon64 3400+ is given that because it gets a PR3400 (or above), this is in Standard 32bit Space DMIPs
You run the same test in Enhanced 64bit Space, and the same processor gets PR3800 (or above)..

generally speaking 64bit Space has to be enabled in XP once the drivers and service for it is installed. under .Net it is *always* active.. so next generation games will take full advantage.

Best way to see the difference is to download Quake2 Demo from id software, then download the Quake2 .Net... run it in Native then in Managed. 64bit Processor people will see quite a jump in speed.


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