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Geek Culture / £250 Upgrade

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DivW
21
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Joined: 31st Jul 2003
Location: Scotland
Posted: 13th Jan 2005 04:22
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I recently bought Deus Ex 2 for my computer, and was a trifle annoyed to find it runs pathetically slowly on my computer. I upgraded it last year and it's current Specs are Athlon 2600+ Processor, With ASUS A7V8X motherboard. I have just bought an Audigy 2 ZS 6.1 Sound card, and i have 512 DDR-3200. I have an 80 Gig Hard drive partitioned into a 20G and a 60G at 7200 RPM, and a GeForce FX 5200 card. Not quite sure what the on-board memory is on that. Anyway, the performance of my computer is not good. I have around £250 for upgrades and tweaks, so any suggestions? I was thinking about a Athlon 64 but i'm going to wait and see if the 939 chip causes a price crash. I'm thinking about trying to upgrade sometime soon, so what should i buy? A new graphics cards, one that eats pixels for breakfast, or a better processor? A SATA Hard Drive? Any ideas would be nice. I have application software on C:/ along with Windows, and i have My games on D:/, along with my files. Does this make a difference? I keep them both fully defragmented (when possible).

-Dave

Your soul...it tastes like chicken

Official Website Postponed Indefinately
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Dazzag
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 05:16
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Graphics card. Get an overclocked 6800GT BFG. Read an article saying they are almost as powerful as an Ultra. And with your processor holding the GPU back then theres no point in getting the ultra. Or get an X800Pro (XT will also be held back by the CPU). Nothing else will see such a *massive* increase for games. Not memory, CPU or anything. Try it watch your speed go up by several times.

BTW, I have a RAID 0 configuration with 2 10k SATA Raptor drives. They load Windows XP Pro with two revolutions of the little blue bar (green on home?). Same setup used to take about 8-10. Cost, erm, something like £400 for the trouble. Nice, but apart from installation and level loading, game speed is not much better at all.

On the other hand, increase the amount and get a 20.1" LCD monitor! I just got one yesterday. My old 19" CRT finally bit the ghost, and I couldn't be bothered moving it's almost twin brother from 6 foot away. And the LCD looked too tempting. 1600x1200 goodness at 16ms response, plus lovely portrait mode (like the old Macs from like the 80's) for viewing things like this forum with an unbelievable amount of topics on one page (1200x1600 resolution). Tis nice. And it's black. Mmmm...

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Neofish
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 05:23
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Quote: "get a 20.1" LCD monitor!"

When my moniter dies (not by my fault ) i'll nudge my dad into buying three or four of flat-screens and give me one (his office has a load of computers so it wouldn't be a bad investment)

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Dazzag
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 05:31
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When I bought my monitor I saw that there was this option which has a huge pedestal which supported 4 of my monitors. Thats 4 20.1" LCD monitors running at 1600x1200 each. So 3200x2400 resolution. Nice. They have similar efforts at work with 2 17" ones linking together to make one desktop. Nice.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 05:35 Edited at: 13th Jan 2005 05:37
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I've just spent £170 on a nice silver 17" monitor, simply because the quality on the 19" is really, really, awful. And all the shops stock the same model. It doesn't matter, 17" is big enough for me. SATA not worth it you say? Ah well. But i'd rather not blow my wad all on a graphics card. I could baybe stretch my amount to something like £350 but then i'd have to wait around 2 months to get the money together. I want a New Mobo and a 64 bit chip, and if i was getting one, and my Budget was £350, then what would you forum chappies recommend? (Edit: For the Graphics Card, Mobo, and Processor. Sorry bout that.)

Here's the pricelist addresses for 3 local computer shops.


Thanks -Dave

(PDF) http://www.pless.co.uk/retail/retail.pdf
(HTML)http://www.budgetcomputers.biz/catalog/price.php
(HTML)http://www.thecontrolpanel.co.uk/main.htm

-Dave
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 05:42 Edited at: 13th Jan 2005 05:45
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I've just noticed this offer. Any good? GeForce fx 5700le 128mb for £52.59.

Or the 128MB RADEON 9800 PLATINUM for £111.48.
I like the looks of that one...but what is the new AGP thing all about? Someone said something like my motherboard wouldn't support some newer cards unless it had AGPX or something like that. What the devil's that?

-Dave

-Dave
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 05:56
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Well with that budget, i've formed this list here...



How does that look? Much more afordable, and a 939 chip, will be nice. Or would i still be better off getting an FX chip?
Please make some suggestions if you have any. I used the Budget Pricelist to put that together by the way.
-Dave

-Dave
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Neofish
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 06:52
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Quote: "939 chip, will be nice"

does your mobo support skt939?

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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 07:00
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The one in the list does yes. As far as im aware, everything in the list is compatible. Unless there's some hidden evil.

-Dave

-Dave
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Dazzag
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 07:09 Edited at: 13th Jan 2005 07:11
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Didn't say SATA wasn't worth it. Hard disk access is amazing now. Just isn't the number one requirement when gaming. I didn't upgrade it for games.

Don't know why you are bothering with the MB and CPU upgrades though. Will make it a little bit better, but nothing truly amazing in games. A fair bit less money would get you a decent X800 or 6800, and either of those should cause some amazing improvements. Friend of mine has a 9800Pro with a 3Ghz P4 and he gets about 16000 in 3DMark2001. I've seen benchmarks online for the same spec PC with an X800 or 6800 getting near 30k out of the box. Some of them upto 32k. Upgrading that CPU to the same sort of speed increase you are talking about will be like upgrading his to a 3.6Ghz P4. And I'm telling you his benchmarks (with an upgrade of the 3.6Ghz CPU) will *not* get anywhere near the 3Ghz PC with one of the better graphics cards (GPU). Maybe get a couple of thousand more (say 180000, or even 20000 if lucky, and overclocked), but nothing like the GPU upgrade.

Going from a AMD 2600 to a AMD64 3000 is hardly a major upgrade for games anyhow. And def. not worth the money and hassle to do this.

ie. these days the CPU is *not* where it is at. It's the GPU (Graphics). And apart from some GPUs being too powerful for certain CPUs, then with a 2600 you will be fine for a X800Pro or 6800GT.

You were joking about the AGP remark wern't you? Won't even go into PCI Express then....

Cheers

Ps. Neofish : The MB is the £83 part of the list.

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 07:46
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I havn't dabbled in hardware for around 8 months, so i'm a little behind. Last time i checked, AGPx8 was the new thing. Are we still at AGPx8, or do the more advanced graphics cards require something more?

You've got a point with the 2600 to 3000. It's not worth a £200 upgrade. I'll upgrade my processor towards Aug, when hopefully the prices will be lower.

So what do you say to the Radeon 9800 Platinum? Is that a good upgrade, or is it worth getting a better card? I'm willing to spend £150 when i upgrade the graphics card. It's my next upgrade. I might even the card tommorow, if i can decide tonight.

-Dave

-Dave
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Dazzag
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 08:18
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The 9800 will be a very good upgrade. No worries.

AGP is practically dead. AGPx8 was the most it went to, but if I remember rightly, even the most powerful cards don't get past AGPx4 (they say AGPx8, but don't actually pass the speed of AGPx4). ie. totally useless. Raven posted some useful stuff a while back.

Anyhows, PCI Express has now pretty much taken over. If you do upgrade the MB then make sure it has this. Some cards don't even have AGP versions now. Much like the old PCI when AGP came along.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 08:26
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After looking at some online reveiws, the Sapphire Atlantis RADEON 9800 Pro is looking nice. Any thoughts?

-Dave

-Dave
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 08:31
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hmm...thanks for the info Dazzag.I can see i've fell behind in the hardware computing. Probably should have realised that when the bloke in the camera shop started talking about Firewire and i didn't know what he was on about. (I do know it has been around since before USB, developed by apple, yada yada yada. i've been trying to catch up.)

Time to get a subscription to PC Plus i guess.

The Saphire above is an AGP card. So how much Life is left in AGP, in your opinion? I'm probably going to get this card when i next get a chance. Probably soon. I promised i'd take my girlfriend on holiday so i have a bit of saving up to do soon. Best get it while the money's there.

-Dave

-Dave
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Dazzag
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 08:39
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Quote: "Sapphire Atlantis RADEON 9800 Pro"
Ironically thats the one I ordered from Dabs yesterday. Didn't need the faster cards really (been burnt before) and just spend £450 on a monitor. And I tend to play Doom3 type games on my laptop....

The way I see it, AGP looks almost dead now. By the end of the year it will be like the original PCI. Then when the X800/6800 (not XT or Ultra - you will get no real gains over the Pro/ GT on your CPU) comes down a lot by the end of the year you can upgrade (and put 9800 in an old machine). That will max out the 2600. Luckily the 9800 should be fine till then. Then in another year get a whole new PC with a PCI express effort and the latest 64bit (or whatever) CPU around.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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DivW
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 08:48
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Sounds like a plan, than man. (or rotating floating skull. Everyone to their own, right?)

Seriously though, cheers for the advice. I think i'll go along with that idea just now, and spend the money i saved trying to re-educate myself. It just goes to show if that technology is moving so fast right now that if you sit back for 5 seconds it's like waking up in the year 3000. Except everyone is still alive. You know...

-Dave

-Dave
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Dazzag
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Posted: 13th Jan 2005 16:26
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Yeah. I took ages choosing a laptop, waiting for the next big thing. In the end I would never have bought one. Eventually just got one on a really good deal. May have not been the absolute fastest, but it plays Doom 3 just fine.

Cheers

Ps. Should get the 9800 today. C'mon Dabs.....

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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Dom
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Posted: 14th Jan 2005 01:14
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Is the Athlon XP2800+ good for someone on a budget like me? I am making a PC from scratch cos this one (P3 600mhz) is soo RUBBISH! An dabout graphics cards is Nvida a better choice than radeon or whatever.


Thanks to Animeblood for the Logo!
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Dazzag
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Posted: 14th Jan 2005 02:32
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Just got my 9800Pro. 2 days from Dabs. Not bad. Just about to have dinner, so no time to install Annoying 19" CRT just sitting in lounge doing nothing until I dump it at some point. Shame the only thing wrong with it is that it flickers now and again. Probably an easyish hardware fix. I've seen it before with an old monitor. Flickers a bit, makes you feel sick, then flickers faster and faster over the months until it turns off and smoke comes out the back

I was always told (and have found plenty evidence on line) that the 9800Pro was a bit better than the Nvidia 5900 Ultra (which you can get for about the same price). But it's a spin up for a lot of the Nvidia/ ATI cards that are of the same level (eg. X800/6800). Either way, going from a P3 600Mhz (with I'm guessing something like a GF2 or even Voodoo 3) to a 2800+ with, say, a 9800Pro, should be quantum leap material. Oh boy and all that ie. anything remotely recent will blow you out of the water I would imagine.

Cheers

I am 99% probably lying in bed right now... so don't blame me for crappy typing
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