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Geek Culture / The new Windows (longhorn)

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David T
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 19:46


Pretty good! What do you think?

Go here for more: http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/longhorn_alpha.asp
Visit [url]www.lightning-systems.co.uk[/url] :: [url]www.realgametools.net/forums[/url]
Drazo
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 19:52
Tried the link.
If you wait a bit as it loads, sroll down then up - it smudges everthing! :lol

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Drazo
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 19:55
In other words, when I tried the link, it went all wierd.
This never happend before on other sites. Faulty site?

Join FWMB @ aimoo
I'm one BIG nasty lizard.
David T
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 20:03
Works fine with me and I'm on Opera at the moment

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MrTAToad
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 20:25
I do hope they fix explorers habit of crashing when trying to read faulty/non-closed CD's.

I hear that it may be sort of database-based filing system, for searching, I presume.

Good news everyone! I really am THAT good...
http://www.nickk.nildram.co.uk/ for great plug-ins - oh my, yes!
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 20:56
The site worked fine for me. There is not enough of a change to make me craze this new version yet, although its got 2 years before release anyway. The space left if a good addition, but I kinda like bringing up the pie charts in XP anyway

David T
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 21:17
I like it, but I suppose I'm a Win 2K convert so it doesn't count

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 18th Jan 2003 22:19
Odd... that looks like an old build, especially as its still being called XP (^_^)

they changed the name (and build name) to .Net Windows 6.0.053.5782 they're upto
but then again perhaps that isn't the Beta but the Preview version - cause they changed alot of the graphics about the past 4months, i kinda like the paperclips revenge look.
you have him on that version?

he so piss'd everyone off who used my comp, cause you'd like go over the hdd and he'd popup and tap the screen "did you know you can keep your Hard Disk(s) in tip-top shape if you schedual me to maintain it!"

Thing is though non of the beta testers are allowed to show anything ... someone found out i had it the other week and bugged me for like 6hours to send him a screenshot of it.
Ended up going to my secondary machine and sending him a jpg from that mwhahaaa
he's still to dense to relise!

hope you don't get into too much trouble if MS find out

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 19th Jan 2003 04:49
That looks as horrible as XP, my XP looks like win 98 =)

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Rob K
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Posted: 19th Jan 2003 17:46
I like the XP look.

Longhorn doesn't look very impressive though. Three years and all they have done is put a green meter under the hard drive - which should have been done years ago. The new filing system (based on Yukon) will be a much more interesting development.

NOBODY has a forum name as stupid as Darth Shader. I do.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 03:01
oh there is much more to .Net than just the new graphics (which infact alot of which have since been taken out)

There is the new 128Bit Partition System which is likely to be vamped again before release.
Alot of internet based features are there ... the actual features of the OS when your using it are apparent, but just looking at it they're not. But i agree with the guy on one point - the new Flex desktop does seem like a poor fan Visual system (although some of the new tools are cool, like having the water movement when you move the mouse and alphaing desktops which nVidia users benifit from now)

i like the XP look, now that i'm used it - certainly seems ALOT better than the old one

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
MrTAToad
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 16:18
Are they going to improve the crash resistance again (as its still possibly for a program to totally take out XP) ?

And, are they going to fix NTFS/CHKDSK bugs (chkdsk always reporting an error when there isn't etc) ?

Good news everyone! I really am THAT good...
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David T
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 18:53
There won't be any NTFS bugs in there, mainly because it is based on WinFS

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MrTAToad
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 19:30
Ah - the database filing system ?

Good news everyone! I really am THAT good...
http://www.nickk.nildram.co.uk/ for great plug-ins - oh my, yes!
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 20:06
WinFS is more like an evolution of NTFS ... uses a better structure for the file tables and notations.

the bugs with NTFS arn't that there arn't bugs, its that it was never enhanced enough to handle the extra data strain XP placed upon it.

and don't look forward to a crash free OS, because one it Microsoft (you'll never be free of them) ... and secondly it is ALL brand new.

although the front gives you the impression that it is based upon another windows system, the actual Operating System has been evolved again - completely rewritten from the ground up, not DOS, not Win32 and not WinNT ... what it offers is greater speed, greater memory access (which has been a plauge on ALL of the Microsoft Operating Systems), greater data security level.

It will be much harder to crack files on the new file systems due to the fact of a 32bit base encryption that only a registered windows can unlock.
meaning if your Windows code is fake, you won't be able to run hardly ANYTHING.

thought alot of what ie being tested now is just improved concepts on XP
if anyone does get thier hands on Windows .Net you'll understand more clearly the updates.

it is a fact that it will have better compatibility, as it will optimally run the right OS Environment as the Multiple Environments are now true Environments like AmigaOS uses rather than the wrapped environments we currently use.

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 20:39
That sounds great Vegeta! I'm kinda excited now Not that I have many problems with XP compared to my older versions

Megaman X
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 20:56
Yeah, I don't like the default view of winXP... that blue bar, with a green start button is the ugliest thing I've ever seem yet . I use in classic mode or I download some themes from the net freely... ack... that green button, ack...

"A true warrior fights with skill, not anger..."

Gif edited by Kangaroo2
Rob K
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 21:16
"It will be much harder to crack files on the new file systems due to the fact of a 32bit base encryption that only a registered windows can unlock.
meaning if your Windows code is fake, you won't be able to run hardly ANYTHING."

If the so-called security features on Office XP, Windows XP, Windows.NET 2003 and XBOX are anything to go by - hackers will have cracked it very quickly. Office XP was cracked instantly. A Windows XP crack emerged a day later - and it wasn't long before there was an All-XP keygen. The trouble is that all the best hackers will get their teeth into it - and then nothing lasts long.

The new explorer will probably be even slower than the Windows XP shell (which is absolutely pathetic when it comes to pop-up menues and copying / pasting / deleting files), but one can hope.

NOBODY has a forum name as stupid as Darth Shader. I do.
rapscaLLion
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Posted: 20th Jan 2003 22:59
HAHAHAHA ROFL!!!
"Windows enthusiast community"
I can just imagine a bunch o nerds siting around a coffee table discussing the altest window builds...

Alex Wanuch
aka rapscaLLion
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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 21st Jan 2003 01:21
lol I was gonna point that out Raps, but thought I might offend some1

Ryu I agree - the green button with blue bar is ugly - however I do like the new rounded Windows design tho - it doesn't look as clinical I'm sure many were glad of the option to switch to the classic look tho

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 21st Jan 2003 10:05
After using the WinXP style for a while whenever i go back to an OS which doesn't use it actually kinda drives me insane.
I guess i'm just used to being in the habit of giving things a chance until they grow on me (or piss me off so much my PC goes out the nearest window)

There are some better designs out there, which from some reason most of which don't want to work on my system ... i mean i've got the odd one to change the look but its off cause you have 3 types of them some use Windows Blinds, some use that Windows Facelift or whatever its called and some use Plus!
its damn'd annoying ... i mean i've used Blinds since ME was first released but still i'd prefer it to use the windows thing because nVeiw has a problem with any other theme aside from Plus! themes

As far as i know Windows .Net has not yet been hacked, mainly because it is using a new File System - but its and updated NTFS - and the XBox hacks i've seen only work 50% of the time, which is amusing as the XBox runs on Win2k!

Plus everyday hackers are barely ever able to get past XPs system especially when on NTFS because the dual file system.
Cracking serial codes is one thing (especially when you're given the source 3months in advance and it still takes you ages to crack it) actually hacking the operating system itself is another.

I've not seen any software yet that is able to sucessfully HACK an XP product once it goes into activation mode, nor have i seen any of the activation number keygens.

simple fact is XP was only hacked for installation as the other programs because each time they're nearing completetion someone leaks out the beta which includes this information... but somehow with the new file structure i don't see anyone bothering to waste thier time, and there are gonna be alot less "hacking" tools available this time around.

which was backed up officially by the Back Orafice team, who are employeed at Microsoft now to sepecifically hack and find bugs in Windows.

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Rob K
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Posted: 21st Jan 2003 20:55
"I've not seen any software yet that is able to sucessfully HACK an XP product once it goes into activation mode, nor have i seen any of the activation number keygens."

I have certainly seen the first, I used it on my WinXP Pro installation because I did not want to send MS any info at all.

"and the XBox hacks i've seen only work 50% of the time,"

Could you explain more? By hacks I meant mod-chips and so on.

Despite MS' attempted advances, security is pretty poor - whatever MS & fanboy wininformant.com might try and prove (with totally irrelevant statistics). Linux' may not use such a clever core - but its simplicity in terms of architechture makes it very non bug-prone. They have failed so many times that I don't trust them any more - but I will (hopefully) be proved wrong... wait and see.

NOBODY has a forum name as stupid as Darth Shader. I do.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 22nd Jan 2003 01:43
i've seen people use them too ... but try to update with SP1 which fixxes so many problem XP has its stupid

you can't because it isn't a true activation number, and windows knows it - it will tell you to contact microsoft about it.

there is NO real way to get around XP's security system either to crack the product efficiently or to actually gain full system access in the same way as is possibly with Win9x|NT

as for Mod-Chips, they're not really hacks - they're hardware updates ... you swap one bios chip for the factory generic one. I can guarentee you that whoever sells you it never made it themselves, it was a leak from the factory.

the only reason microsoft products get such a high rating for piracy is because its the highest profile product you can get. you can't really make infalible software, and whenever there is a new OS released there are thousands of bedroom hackers - some which work together, to break the codes.
and as i said before oftenly its because of a leak that they are hacked in the first place...
i don't think you can really call it a hack if someone has made something with the source - because if thats the case then Quake3 and Half-Life mods are "hacks" ... which isn't true they're modification.

The only thing that changes the term is the fact between legal and illegeal. I've been told be a friend who literally hacks software for a living, that microsoft products are the hardest to hack without referrance.

The only reason Linux is so hard to hack is quite a simple reason - there isn't a STANDARD version ... one hack for Redhat won't work with Mandrake - because there are little things which are different ... so unless you can get ahold of EVERY version of Linux and make a hack specific which also has to check for which OS - then its unlikely worth the trouble.

Windows is an extremely complex peice of software with over a billion lines of code - and it is hard even with 180 programmers to catch all of them, simply because you need flawless communication.

they fixx every possibly entry there is as quick as they can, and althought you might not like Windows - i very much doubt any other OS is going to take over anytime soon.
However Microsoft are taking to great an advantage of the situation for it to warrent me explaining the evils of piracy - because they're just as greedy selling operating systems too close together for pathetically expensive ammounts of money.

Personally i wouldn't say microsoft has failed at anything, becuase the overall system compatibility with windows is greater than any other operating system - also the overall product support is also alot greater.
Might not seem it, but for Linux it takes months when bugs are found - whereas at Microsoft they know there are bugs and don't wait for reports but deliberatly try to crash the system and debug everyday with constant updates, even if its a little thing.

Also remember that they're not only working on the OS, but also trying to make sure that is functionability is idiot proof. I really don't see the adverage users getting on with anything except BeOS or Win9x/XP ... most here don't count as adverage users as you've all been using computer for years, you understand quite a far bit - perhaps not as much as some around here, but still understand FAR MORE than the adverage user cares to know.

I think because Windows is really the only viable choice right now everyone loves to sit there and find faults with it ... if you look closely at any program you'll find thousands of fualts - doesn't make it any less of a program.
I mean i can sit here and telling you a list as long as both my arms whats wrong with 3dsmax. That said, i still use it daily and although i'd prefer not to as much after a while of understanding howto get around its quirks you relise that it is a powerful tool.

personally i hope this new version of windows isn't leaked, because it is a serious peice of kit which is going to have 2years of debug time prior to release - as well as 2years of professional hackers cracking it.
Once it comes out, you can expect it'll be a while before ANYONE hacks it.

I think the beauty about AuthentiCode, is that even with the source code - you need to understand the language to understand how the key algorithms are developed.
(^_^) so i'm pretty sure it is going to be secure

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Rob K
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Posted: 22nd Jan 2003 15:27
"you can't because it isn't a true activation number, and windows knows it - it will tell you to contact microsoft about it."

You just unpatch before the upgrade and then repatch afterwards, but point taken.

"The only reason Linux is so hard to hack is quite a simple reason - there isn't a STANDARD version"

Not true - this is an issue, but the fact that Linux is Open-Source means that in many cases, bugs can be found more easily and patched quickly. Linux architecture is not fancy or clever - but it is simple and reliable. It is a well-known Unix based setup which has already had far more years of testing, debugging and fixing than Windows has.

"I think the beauty about AuthentiCode, is that even with the source code - you need to understand the language to understand how the key algorithms are developed.
(^_^) so i'm pretty sure it is going to be secure"

I am more of a protectionist than a cracker myself (I am developing TZ Copy Protection EP) - but I will be interested to see the finished product . Complicated maths is always a right bastard to crack - especially if you use a lot of advanced floating point functions. FDIVs are even nastier. And of course lots of dummy stuff to hide the wood in the trees, so to speak.

NOBODY has a forum name as stupid as Darth Shader. I do.

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