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3 Dimensional Chat / How to make this model... :-/ (no pics, just theory... or help o.O)

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DARKGuy
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Posted: 6th Feb 2005 17:58
Um... hi all?

Ehh....well yeah, I'm still fighting with that "secret" project of mine =P... it's a bit late so I might not talk way too much but hey something is something... anyhow

Remember that one model I made of that cat woman with the two blades? I got some concept art from the author (dude, she's good) and I noticed I could use NURBS technique for making a high-poly model out of it and then use it nicely in a video and such, and for the game, using optimization techniques, removing polys and such for making my own low-detail model for in-game use. Now the problem is the following one: Her trenchcoat.

I'm making my game in DBC due to DBP having bad issues with Win2k and my video card (which maybe I'll replace in a month or two) though, noticed DBC doesn't accepts any mesh animation data that sucks , so I was thinking in splitting up the trenchcoat into blocks like...



And so on, linking them and such for avoiding some "cuts" on it. Problem is that it will look way too unreal for being a trenchcoat and also will be a pain in the ... for animating. I was wondering if any of you could give me some ideas on how to animate it (I don't care if I have to make it as a separate object either) without mesh animation and using the method I showed above can't seem to find one that suits it. Bone animation might be a possibility, but I don't think DBC supports it either

Thanks in advance, as always

Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"
DARKGuy
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Posted: 11th Feb 2005 10:44 Edited at: 11th Feb 2005 10:47
*bump* Um.. anyone?

[edit] Here's a reference from my old model



Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"
DARKGuy
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Posted: 16th Feb 2005 20:45
:bump: No one?

Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"
jrowe
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Posted: 16th Feb 2005 22:52
The main trouble you'll have is doing it with limb animation, as DBC doesn't support skeletal animation. I'm not sure you'll be able to do it. With a cape it's be possible as you'd only need 2-3 vertical limbs, but with a trenchcoat you need the limbs to be interactive horisonally too, so with limbs it'd be very difficult to get the planes to line up correctly, if that makes sense to you.


For Fathers and Sons who enjoy wholy spirits.
DARKGuy
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Posted: 19th Feb 2005 09:25
Yup, it made sense and I tried that way too, so hasn't worked either :/ I know there's another way, or at least, anyone can tell me how do I stop DBPro of crashing when I open any 3DS file? 'cause, I could mesh-animate, then use DBPro, but it crashes with a 3DS file, and Panda doesn't exports my model's animations, so I'm stuck there

Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"
jrowe
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Posted: 19th Feb 2005 16:57
The 3DS format is buggy with DBpro. As you're using DBpro now, you can use skeletal animation, making eveything simpler too. Skeletal animation is incompatable with .3ds, so i'd use .x instead. If you export the model in the screenie as .x I'm sure it'd work very well in DBPro.


For Fathers and Sons who enjoy wholy spirits.
DARKGuy
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Posted: 20th Feb 2005 07:57
Problem is, I have 3DSMAX 3 and Panda Xporter doesn't exports the animations!

Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"
Opus
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2005 01:26
DARKGuy, the following is the Readme file of the free conv3ds utility. I'm just beginning to learn about this stuff and I haven't tried it myself yet. Look it over and see if it would work for you. You can find it on the Internet through a Google search. If it's not what you are looking for, then sorry, please ignore.


conv3ds
-------

conv3ds converts 3ds models produced by Autodesk 3D Studio and other
modelling packages into X Files. By default it produces binary X files
with no templates.


How to use it
-------------

At its simplest you can run it with no options and it will (endeavour) to
produce an X file containing a hiearchy of frames. For example:

conv3ds file.3ds

will produce an X File file.x. Use Frame::Load to load the frame.

If the 3ds file contains key frame data then you can produce an X file
which contains an animation set using the -A option. For example:

conv3ds -A file.3ds

Use AnimationSet::Load to load the animation.

If you want to make an X file containing a single mesh made from all the
objects in the 3ds file then use the -m option.

conv3ds -m file.3ds

Use MeshBuilder::Load to load the mesh.


Other useful options
--------------------

* The -T option will wrap all the objects and frame hierarchies in a single
"toplevel" frame. This enables you to load all the frames and objects in
the 3ds file with a single call to Frame::Load, using the default options
(ie. Load the first toplevel frame hiearchy in the X file). The frame
containing all the other frames and meshes is called "x3ds_filename"
(without the .3ds extension). When used with the -m option this option has
no affect.


* The -s option allows you to specify a scale factor for all the objects
converted in the 3ds file. For example

conv3ds -s10 file.3ds

will make all the objects 10 times bigger, and

conv3ds -s0.1 file.3ds

will make all the objects 10 times smaller


* The -r option reverses the winding order of the faces when the 3ds file is
converted. If after converting the 3ds file and viewing it in D3D, the object
appears "inside-out" try converting it with the -r option. All Lightwave
models (see notes below) exported as 3ds files will need this option.


* The -v option turns on verbose output mode. Specifiy an integer with it.
The only useful (currently) integers are:
-v1, print out warnings about bad objects and general information
about what the converter is doing
-v2, print out basic keyframe information, objects being included in the
conversion process, and information about the objects while being saved.
-v3, very verbose (mostly useful for debugging) information.

The default is -v0.


* The -e option allows you to change the extension for texture map files. For
example:

conv3ds -e"ppm" file.3ds

and file.3ds contains objects which reference the texture map file brick.gif,
the X file will reference the texture map file brick.ppm. The converter does
not convert the texture map file. The texture map files must also be in the
D3DPATH when the resulting X File is loaded.

* The -x option forces conv3ds to produce a text X file, not a binary
X file. Text files are larger but can be hand edited easily.

* The -X option forces conv3ds to include the D3DRM X File templates in
the file. By default the templates are not included.


Other options
-------------

* The -t option specifies that the X File produced will not contain texture
information.

* The -N option specifies that the X file produced will not contain Normal
information. All the D3DRM Load calls will generate normals for objects
with no normals in the X file.

* The -c option specifies that the X file produced should not contain
texture coordinates. By default if you use the -m option the outputted mesh
will contain 0,0 uv texture coordinates if the 3ds object had no texture
coordinates.

* The -f option specifies that the X file produced should not contain any
FrameTransformMatrix.

* The -z and -Z options allow you to adjust the alpha face color value of
all the materials referenced by objects in the X File.
This is best illustrated with an example:

conv3ds -z0.1 -Z0.2 file.3ds

says add 0.1 to all alpha values under 0.2. And

conv3ds-z"-0.2" -z1 file.3ds

says subtract 0.2 from the alpha values for all alphas.

* The -o option allows you to specify the filename for the .X File produced.

* The -h option tells the converter not to try to resolve any hiearchy
information in the 3ds file (usually produced by the keyframer). Instead all
the objects (when the converter is not used with the -m option) are outputted
in toplevel frames.


3ds file produced from lightwave objects
----------------------------------------

There are a number of issues with 3ds files exported by the trans3d
plugin for lightwave. These are best handled using the following
options to conv3ds.

conv3ds -r -N -f -h -T|m trans3dfile.3ds

All the 3ds objects which we've come across produced by trans3d and the
lightwave object editor need their winding order reversing (otherwise they
appear "inside-out" when displayed) and contain no normal information.


Hints and Tips
--------------

Some of these are pretty obvious but are probably worth saying anyway.

If, after loading an object produced by conv3ds into the D3DRM viewer,
you can't see the object then try using the -s object
with an integer of say, 100, to increase the X file objects scale.


If, after loading the object into the viewer and switching from flat
shading into Gourard shading the object turns dark grey try converting
with the -N option.

Textures can be the biggest problem. If after converting the object the
textures don't get loaded then make sure that the object is referencing
either .ppm or .bmp files (using the -e option), make sure the textures
width and height is a power of 2, and make sure the textures are stored
in one of the directories in your D3DPATH.


Known bugs and problems
-----------------------

Currently conv3ds can't handle dummy frames used in 3ds animations.
It just ignores them (but will convert any child objects).

Eternal student in search of knowledge. But will settle for the occasional epiphany.
DARKGuy
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Posted: 28th Feb 2005 11:46
Hmm.... that might be useful.. I'll take a look at it and download it and such... thanks for that, wish me luck

Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"
DARKGuy
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Joined: 28th Nov 2003
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Posted: 28th Feb 2005 13:51
Er... well, I gave it a try. It exported correctly, but the mesh animation was not there. I guess X doesn't supports any mesh animation

Quote: "
-= 933 Mhz - SiS 630/730 8Mb - 128 RAM - 2.1Gb / 6.2Gb HDs - Sound: C-media CMI8738/C3DX PCI - CD-RW 52*32*52 - Windows 2000 =-
"

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