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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Why should abortion be illegalised, the person isn't even born yet?!

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ReneGade RG
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:13
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Why should abortion be illegalised, the person isn't even born yet?! Some people need abortions to save their life and people who choose to have it should not be criminalised! Why is it such an issue?!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.
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Eric T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:19 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 06:19
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Since I know this is gonna get locked anyway, lemme quote carlin:

"Why is it, that all the people who are against abortion, are people you wouldn't wanna f*** in the first place?"

Good ol' Carlin, got a quote for everything.

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
http://blog.myspace.com/erict An Alternative to Mouse's blog. Now with more lowbrow opinions.
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:21
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Here's something Jimster would say:

What if your giving birth to a granade??? You wouldn't want it to go off while you're giving birth do you??

Should have thought about that.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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ReneGade RG
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:21
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That doesn't answer anything!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.
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Raven
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:36
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heh.. ^_^ that is kinda the whole point.

to be frank(rather than bob), unless your a woman.. shut the [censored] up!

i'm gonna find that 'Posting and You!' film .. cause seriously YOU need it.

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:39
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Are you referring to me or ReneGade 12345?

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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zenassem
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:41
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"Why is prostitution illegal? Sex is legal... Buying is legal... But buying sex.... illegal!" -George Carlin

in before the lock. So I guess going off topic won't really matter.

~zen

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vid1987
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:43 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 06:44
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Quote: "That doesn't answer anything!"


I'd like to first point out that this post is idiotic and I agree it should be locked.

But anyways,

The baby has life while in the mother's womb... but hey, if the mother wants to murder it I don't see why she had sex in the first place.

If the mother wants to kill the baby, I think they should go ahead and kill the mother aswell... at least that's my opinion.. but hey, I don't make the rules..

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
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Raven
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:44
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you know what's funny about that Zen, is when your in a relationship it always sodding costs you anyways.

I mean it's not like you can have it on demand, most of the time while it doesn't cost money; it costs other things like compromises about the Sunday Football game and such.
(by compromise i mean, they get thier way )

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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:48
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I think is perfectly right!
It's a very easy mistake to get someone pregnant and if you don't want the kid then get rid of it..simple..and it's hardly alive.

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vid1987
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:51
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There's no such thing as "hardly alive"...

Either it's alive or it's dead...

You may think otherwise but I really don't feel like debating with the likes of you..

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:55 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 06:56
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Quote: "unless your a woman.. shut the [censored] up!"


From the quite reasonable point of view of a pro-lifer, that's exactly like saying women can't tell men not to commit rape because they don't have the same sexuality


Do you honestly think a baby is not alive until it is born? They are living, breathing, eating, talking, kicking; doing everything a newborn does only months old in the womb. They have brains and memories and a conciousness and are aware of everything around them, and have a vague perception of the world outside of the mother's womb. From three weeks old they can feel pain.

One of the few noble aspects remaining in modern society is that the strong should protect the weak and the powerful should protect the defenseless. Any adult would be called a monster for chosing their life over that of a young child, and rightly so. I don't think anyone here would disagree that any decent person would give up their own life to save that of a newborn baby. So why is it that when suddenly we are faced with the choise of a mother's life or that of her completely helpless and defenseless, and absolutely alive, fetus, we suddenly forget this nobility and decide that since we don't know the child, it's okay to murder it and pretend it never existed?

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:55 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 06:59
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Deibiddo 1987, you really don't know what you're talking about, so I'd advice you keep opinions to yourself. This thread is gona turn ugly soon anyway...

@Mouse: People become what they are as they grow and live. A baby that wasen't even born (and far FROM being born, as during an abortion) isn't realy a living, breathing, thinking, person.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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David T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:56
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I'll take bets now on how this is going to end up...

Facts are meaningless.
You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.
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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:56
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abortion,welfare,medicare,public schools........
Can anyone take care of theirself or be responsible for their own actions?
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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:58
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I think its right if the parents can't cope with a kid. It's a easy mistake for someone to get pregnant.

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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:00
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It is easy to prevent the pregnancy aswell.
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:00
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Quote: " I think its right if the parents can't cope with a kid. "


Simple question: If it's right to kill of a living human unborn child because you "can't cope" with it, is it right to kill a born two, five or eight year old child for the same reason?

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:00 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:01
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I don't think anyone but a women can safely argue this topic.

Lets just all go eat pie.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:01
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No because then...you put it up for adoption...

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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:02 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:02
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Quote: " Yeah, and I don't think anyone but a women can safely argue this topic. "


I reiterate the rape comparisin: that's exactly like saying women can't say it's wrong for men to commit rape because the do not have the same sex drive.

Quote: " No because then...you put it up for adoption... "


And so you can't put the child up for adoption because it hasn't been born yet- how does that make it right to kill it?

"Sorry officer, I know you think it's murder and all, but really I just couldn't afford to drive all the way to the city so I decided to just kill them..."

Yeah, that's humane all right

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:02 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:02
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Quote: " No because then...you put it up for adoption..."


Yeah and then the child ends up with problems the rest of his childhood.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:02
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Mouse, why would you bring common sense to this argument?
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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:03
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Quote: "men to commit rape "


Women also commit rape...

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:04 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:07
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Quote: "I reiterate the rape comparisin: that's exactly like saying women can't say it's wrong for men to commit rape because the do not have the same sex drive."


So if a women was raped against her will and got pregnant, she does not have the right to an abortion?

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:05 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:07
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Quote: "Women also commit rape..."


That makes the analogy imperfect, it doesn't make my point any less sound.

Quote: "So if a women was raped agaisnt her will and got pregnant, she does not have the right to have an abortion?"


Sigh. The old pity card.

Rape is a horrible thing. Unwanted pregnancy is a tough thing. Unwanted pregnancy caused by rape can be a nightmare for a woman. I know this rather well. That does not justify the murder of the child. It exists, and no matter what caused it to exist, it's a living sentient organism with as much a right to live as anyone in this world.

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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:06
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Quote: "So if a women was raped agaisnt her will and got pregnant, she does not have the right to have an abortion?"


Answer that one Mouse!

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vid1987
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:06
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Yes,

I agree with Mouse..

Quote: "Deibiddo 1987, you really don't know what you're talking about, so I'd advice you keep opinions to yourself. This thread is gona turn ugly soon anyway..."


I assure you, I know what I'm talking about..

And this thread is already "ugly"... but you sure aren't helping much...

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:07
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Quote: "Answer that one Mouse!"


I just did.

Meanwhile you've dodged my perfectly clear child murder question because it completely defeats your argument

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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:08
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No...im just getting bored of "arguing" its my opinion so ill leave it at that.

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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:09
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Quote: "Quote: "So if a women was raped agaisnt her will and got pregnant, she does not have the right to have an abortion?""

How about adoption? In the U.S. families are waiting to adopt neborns.
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:09
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Child murder? I hardly call something that's a mere few months and not even developed a "Child".

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:09 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:11
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Quote: " No...im just getting bored of "arguing""


I'll take that as a "touche"

Quote: " Child murder? I hardly call something that's a mere few months and not even developed a "Child"."


I repeat (start reading up already):

A child one months old:

-Has unqiue DNA
-Has a brain
-Has emotions
-Can use all its senses
-Can feel pain
-Has a memory
-Is human by all biological standards

How the hell is that "not a child"?

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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:10
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Quote: "I'll take that as a "touche""


Yeah...ok

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:10
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Quote: "How about adoption? In the U.S. families are waiting to adopt neborns."


It's not really that easy as going to EBgames and trading in your copy of Halo.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Raven
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:11
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Quote: "I'll take bets now on how this is going to end up..."


£10 says it's locked within 8hours ^_^ (i think that's being generous though)

Quote: "I reiterate the rape comparisin: that's exactly like saying women can't say it's wrong for men to commit rape because the do not have the same sex drive."


I think you miss the point Mouse. In-fact you've passed the point and ended up in the next town over.

Simple fact of the matter is.
I'm not a woman. So why the hell should I have a say over what happens with someone else's body.

That's like me going in to hospital and the Doctors automatically decide to put me through a life-threatening operation without asking me if it's something I want.

At the end of the day that's how I view the whole subject.
Why should men have any say what so ever over what women can and can't do with thier own bodies when these inalienable rights are supposidely things that have been squashed from society conserning men.

Well? You can't give me some rape bull about that too; cause Abortion is not the ONLY answer. It's not anyone's place to make the mind up of anyone that happens to, mearly give them the options.

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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:12
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Quote: "It's not really that easy as going to EBgames and trading in your copy of Halo."

What is your point? I didn't say it was easy.
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Mnemonix
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:12
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Hehe I love arguments

Well I dont really have a valid argument because I dont really possess an opinion in this case.

I will say that I do feel that it the majority of abortees(Is that a word? I dont know) use it as a way to "cancel" a mistake instead of facing up to responsibility, certainly in the UK anyway. Anyway I have arguments for it and against it in my own head, and thats quite enough for me thanks.

Try out the controller:-
http://controller.logicstudios.net
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:12
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Well said Raven.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:13 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:14
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Quote: "I'm not a woman. So why the hell should I have a say over what happens with someone else's body."


Par to the course, Raven, you completely miss the entire argument. A human fetus is an individual living being temporarily reliant on its host for sustinince, not an organ of a woman's body.

Quote: " Well said Raven."


Again you dodge my repsonse to your argument

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:14
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Quote: "What is your point? I didn't say it was easy."


Well that's what you made it sound like. As in "Pregnancy? No big deal, just put it up for adoption".

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:15
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Quote: "I'm not a woman. So why the hell should I have a say over what happens with someone else's body."

The baby doesn't have a choice.
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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:15
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Basically the mother can do what she wants with the kid...it is hers!

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:15 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:16
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Raven pretty much has it right.

And I almost never side with him.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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David T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:16
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I know this is probably going to kick up a whole big storm, but... today I stepped on an ant. In fact, make that a snail. That's more an organism than a few week old embryo ever was, but I killed it.

Am I the devil?

Facts are meaningless.
You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.
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soadjason
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:16
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Quote: " Basically the mother can do what she wants with the kid...it is hers!"

so your mother should ba able to terminate your life?
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:16 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:17
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Quote: "I know this is probably going to kick up a whole big storm, but... today I stepped on an ant. In fact, make that a snail. That's more an organism than a few week old embryo ever was, but I killed it.

Am I the devil?"


Hell yeah.

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Dark Flame
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:17
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Yeah thats quite cruel david t...

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:17
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Quote: "so your mother should ba able to terminate your life? "


Yeah if she feels the need to.

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BatVink
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 07:18 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 07:25
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Since when did an unborn child not have life?

Why do people think it is OK to take away from somebody else what they have been given; the chance to experience life after birth?

Why do children in the process of being aborted try to escape from the utensils?

The fact that people see abortion as acceptable, often without actually thinking about what the are taking away from a defenceless human being, is a sorry sign of lack of morality today.

What is even more distressing is that people debate the topic without respect for people's feelings and circumstances. There are people here making wry comments for the sake of joining an argument. This is a sensitive topic, and not one to use as an excuse to fight and gain points against one another.

Hopefully, it's simply a result of a generally young and immature audience.

BatVink
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