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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Why should abortion be illegalised, the person isn't even born yet?!

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 08:21 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 08:23
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Quote: "But they don't even give the babies these drugs. They feel all the pain of being sliced apart or having their skulls crushed to make their passage out of the womb easier."



Do you remember being born? Do you remember feeling pain when your umbilical cord was cut? When you are cicumcised? (Or not)

Really Mouse. This is getting stupid. Isn't there some Mouse hole you should be crawling into by now?

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Eric T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 08:32
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That arguement is stupid, of course you don't remember the pain of that time... the problem your forgetting is that there was pain none the less and they probably felt it at the time.

I am not anti-abortion, but I am for the tolerance of all human right (except for korean gamers, cause they aren't human, there is nothing inside those bodies! ). But I do belive that we should make sure no pain is felt to something being killed (or not killed depending on whether you feel life begins at conception or if it starts at birth). There needs to be some humanity involved in it. What are we, Neandertals?

And I also think anyone woman who has 5-10 abortions a year should be turned down at the door. It'll teach her to keep her legs shut next time...

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
http://blog.myspace.com/erict An Alternative to Mouse's blog. Now with more lowbrow opinions.
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Raven
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 08:36
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Quote: "That arguement is stupid, of course you don't remember the pain of that time... the problem your forgetting is that there was pain none the less and they probably felt it at the time."


but then you get into the whole argument of if they can understand that it is pain?

Ever watch a baby run around the room? They tend to only cry when they feel it'll get them more attention; but if they hurt themselves when they have your full attention, they won't blink an eye-lid.

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Eric T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 08:40
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Must be them british kids, or my sister was an exception

Jesus she'd be in my room and I'd be sitting there just watching her run into the wall a few times (it was a great show) and then she'd hit er head hard and she'd freakin wail...

I don't know if they can understand its pain, but I do think we should still be human about it. I mean, if your unsure if they can, still be cautious about it, right? Preventitive maintenance(sp? on both words)

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 08:44
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Eric T and Jimmy have the best Blogs on the planet...

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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Killswitch
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 08:53
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All these people saying that they can't argue about this because they're not women, and don't have the right to do/not do something to someone else's body are missing the point. A baby is seperate from the mother, individual ALIVE.

Abortion is murder. If you have an unwanted pregnacy then the child can be put up for adoption after it is born. That way:

You're happy as you haven't killed anyone.
The child is happy as it isn't dead.
Another couple are happy as they are no longer childless.

How can you say that life begins when your born? What about the second before your born, aren't you nearly exactly the same? What about the second before that, or that?

If you really don't want children then don't have sex.

BTW: Before someone even suggests it I am not a fundementalist christian I am an aetheist. (And also a bad speller).

~It's a common mistake to make, the rules of the English langauge do not apply to insanity~
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Shadow Runna X
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:07 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 09:09
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My agreement is with KSwitch, the pineapple lover, although my views may differ.

First off, I don' think the pain factor is the important argument of abortion, the importance is the fact that a human life is being removed from the world before having the experience of a normal life and die without any feeling of love in their "life".

If I said, I'm just gonna kill you, but don't worry, you probably wont remember it cos you'll be in a deep sleep for the rest of your life, would you feel more comfortable? (And don't argue that it's not the same thing)

Unlike Switch, I am a Christian and according to the Bible, John feutus jumped for joy... meaning that feutus feel. Not only that, but scientifically, neurones and all that are developed at a very early stage.

If you have sex, are you not meant to be prepared to take up the responsibility of caring for a child? That's what sex is for in the first place.

Peace Out.

P.S. Anyone hear of that time that "crazy" guy shot that doctor that carried out abortions? He took a life, but by doing so saved so many. Think about that while I go to bed.
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:10 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 09:15
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Quote: "
Really Mouse. This is getting stupid. Isn't there some Mouse hole you should be crawling into by now?"


No, but if you continue to give me such a clear excuse to newbie slap you for being a tool, I'll gladly do so


By the way, I agree that pain isn't really a factor when a human life is on the line, but I think it kind of solidies the case against late aborptions especially. I can't agree with people who say that life in binary-- it does not seem true to me that a one-day old embryo is just as alive as a kicking, bouncing nine month old baby-- but I think both sides of that little case have merit.


Quote: "P.S. Anyone hear of that time that "crazy" guy shot that doctor that carried out abortions? He took a life, but by doing so saved so many. Think about that while I go to bed."


No more so than killing a slaver would be doing a favor to the slaves. I see your point, but I can't side with you... People who want abortions will go to someone else; meanwhile a human life is lost for no good reason and another is sent to jail for life. Both for simply standing up for what they believe-- one of them (the shooter) in a foolish, irresponsible and arguably cruel way.

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Eric T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:15
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Quote: " Eric T and Jimmy have the best Blogs on the planet... "


Thank you, thank you

Funny thing is, that we are both from utah. Shows that Utah gives us a sense of humor

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:17
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Eric and Jimmy are both 'funny' for each other if you know what I mean.

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Eric T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:23
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Real clever mouse.... real freaking clever.

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
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Raven
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:25
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Quote: "P.S. Anyone hear of that time that "crazy" guy shot that doctor that carried out abortions? He took a life, but by doing so saved so many. Think about that while I go to bed."


Typical. You feel that babies being born to families who don't want them are going to have a rich and full-filled life?

All these people saying that they can't argue about this because they're not women, and don't have the right to do/not do something to someone else's body are missing the point. A baby is seperate from the mother, individual ALIVE.

Quote: "Abortion is murder. If you have an unwanted pregnacy then the child can be put up for adoption after it is born. That way:

You're happy as you haven't killed anyone.
The child is happy as it isn't dead.
Another couple are happy as they are no longer childless."


Point 3 is worthless, there are many more children without homes, and even more in homes that don't want them. What does the government do to change this? Makes adoption so [censored] hard that it's pointless to try, not to mention expensive. Since when did human life come with a price tag?
Oh wait I know since slavery times; funny how making it illegal doesn't change the fact that this is exactly what the government does.

Sorry but from my point of view I would kill someone if I saw a situation as so hopeless than th have them suffer; and eventually die anyways. Giving them a chance to live based on slim odds is just not a very realistic view.

Before you say anything, no I have no quarrel with killing things; no matter what it is. Provided there is for a rational reason.

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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:25
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Hey, I was bored

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The Wendigo
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:25 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 09:28
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How in the heck? How did you pass the n00b detectors, Renegade. My political science teacher wouldn't let anyone write any essays on abortion because it was such a hot topic and you dare go into a software developers community and open the topic up for debate? In my opinion. This was clearely meant to create a flame war as abortion is easily one of the most contoversial(sp?) topics in the world. People have died in violence over this topic for goodness sake! If I were a mod, it would be locked right now and Renegade would have his acct. suspended!

PS - I don't even know why I'm throwing this in here, but I have tense issues about abortion because I wouldn't even be alive today if abortion were legal in the 50's. My mom was adopted because her mom didn't want children and enjoyed a wild life style.


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Mnemonix
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:25
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I have a somewhat unrelated question to pose to everybody...it is sorta related but not fully.

Supposing that man has a great achievement and comes up with a self-aware computer program...would it then be murder to delete that program or in someway permanently deactivate it(kill)?.

Just wondering what people think about this.

Try out the controller:-
http://controller.logicstudios.net
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The Wendigo
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:30
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Hehe. Interresting. If you could actually create a program that was selfaware (I don't believe this can actually be done... not for a very long while at least) I don't think it would be murder because it isn't human. However, it would probably be the equivellent to killing an animal, in my book. Um.... that's just a wierd outlook altogether. I feel wierd now for answering that.


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Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:40 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 09:41
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mnem, by the time someones coded such a program thats self aware etc, chav's will have been long extinct, therefore there wont be a reason to have an abortion
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Ian T
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:44
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Wendigo, I understand this is a very sensitive topic to some people, and the kid was undoubtedly just looking to rile people up. But as long as it doesn't completely degrade into personal attacks, good can come out of it-- take the discussion you and Mnem are having there

Additionaly, I feel I'm rather too involved in the thread now to lock it. But I'm sure there are plenty of other mods keeping an eye on it.

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Megaton Cat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 09:57
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Quote: " No, but if you continue to give me such a clear excuse to newbie slap
you for being a tool, I'll gladly do so"


For "Being a tool"? I don't think
you'd want people to know they have a corrupt mod on the forums who abuses his powers because he had a simple disagreement of opinion with a fellow user. And yes Mouse, it IS an opinion, despite what that Maddox person was filling your head with. You do realize that site is an intended joke and whatever he writes on it is all for laughs? Have a cup of tee and rest your debate-crazy head.


(Well okay maybe that looks like coffee. As long as the caffeine does the trick.
)

It's M-E-G-A-T-O-N. NOT MEGATRON.
DON'T MAKE ME GET THE RABBIT.
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dj blackdragon3710
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 11:12
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Quote: "Lets just all go eat pie. "


I agree .

Quote: "But if you don't believe in an after life, you any of you be willing to DIE right now?"


Being afraid of death is quite silly, let alone anything else that can kill you. You can die walking down the street. Your body can even kill you. So whats the point in being afraid to die ?

<<<<<Used to be "djblackdragon" with being registered in January, 2003, no matter what it says on the left<<<<<
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Richard Davey
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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 11:20
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I'm going to lock this now (I would have done sooner but I only just read it)

My complete and utter sympathy goes to anyone who has read some of the comments posted so far, and who's ever been involved personally (either directly or indirectly) with an abortion, and the traumatic effects it can have.

Two Worlds and in Between
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