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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] religion, politics and Controversy, well someones gotta start a thread about it

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Oneka
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:21
eh...trust me you take an ape baby from its mother or kill it will react in away you would think a real person would act..and also they iq can not be compared to a human...iam mean an iq of 70 for a human is really bad but for a monkey that is good...they have thier own scale...

Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:23
I'm Anti-Merranvo

Ian T
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:23 Edited at: 3rd Jul 2005 13:24
Quote: "AND WHO WAS DOING THE TESTING? If I were to throw you into rushia (assuming you don't speak rushain and the rushains can't ever understand you, hell scratch that, I put you on ajsfdodasj a planet far far away with human level inteligent beings) they would probally think you are an idiot too..."




This has got to be the most hilarious thing I've read in... forever.

1. It's spelled Russia kid.

2. No, they wouldn't think I was stupid, because any sentient being is capable of recognizing anothers' communication on some level. If language failed I could communicate quite well with sign language, and if neccessary, a human being can indicate their intelligence with mathematics and geometric shapes (nobody could ever get an ape to draw a series of different parallelograms or explain Pi through shapes)

3. We have machines that can reliably test brain activity. Without high brain activity, high intelligence is impossible. Human beings have the highest brain activity of any creature on the planet. It's as simple as that.

Seriously, kid, I'm pretty sure you're around twelve years old at this point, so: You're really not old enough for any kind of debate yet. Live a few years and learn a few facts and come back then. You're just making some hilariously silly posts right now.

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Ian T
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:26
Quote: " trust me you take an ape baby from its mother or kill it will react in away you would think a real person would act"


Yes, I'm sure it would pull out an Ape-gun and threaten you to give the baby back; or attempt to negotiate or bribe with Ape-diplomacy and Ape-money; or go to the Ape-police and report the Ape-duction so they could find the abductor on their Ape-cameras and send in an Ape-squad to get the baby back...

...except, oh wait, they're not genetically developed enough to be capable of understanding the basic concept of any of those things.



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Oneka
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:26
lmao yeah..but they show some emotion..they dont just walk away and freak again
@mouse who you saying 12? seppu? and btw are you like 14 or sumthin?

Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Ian T
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:27
I was talking to Merranvo, the sole source of infinite unintentional humor in this thread. And no I'm not 14

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vid1987
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:28
I am sorry if you thought i was trying to offend you..

I have indeed heard about Walt Disney being a satanist, yet his cartoons and films were an inspiration to me So that proves that I don't discriminate or hate the Anti-Christs in any way.

Anyways, did Disney ever admit to being an Anti-Christ? or is it just a rumour because he named one of his characters Pluto?

Just wondering.

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:29
@ TK, Insomnia? if you mean that by finding posts I reply to instead of going to bed then yes.


@Mouse, oh please don't make me argue about animals and emotions please....I did that once before on msn to another TGC member (won't name names) man that kid was ignorant, ANIMALS DO HAVE EMOTIONS!!!!!! THEY LOVE, THEY HATE, THEY EVEN HOLD A GRUDGE, okay lemme tell you a little story (the same one I told the other dude, but he didn't listen, hopefully you will understand from it)

We had one of our really nice cats that got on with all the others (we have a lot of cats) which is strange since not all of them like each other, get into fights most of them, this cat was fine with them, but one day the cat is found murdered by our neighbours' dog, the cats, started acting strange (like they always do when something has happened) some of them were moping around, you could tell they were sad, and we found the cat dead. But thats not it, the older cats, gang up on the same dog and swipe at its face and make it run away to say 'Oi you horrible dog, you killed our friend, we'll never let you forget it' now no one can tell me animals don't have emotions (are you forgetting humans are animals?)

SageTech
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:30
Quote: "religion, politics and Controversy, well someones gotta start a thread about it"


Not really...

forum.Sagetechsoftware.com. Post at em' will ya?
Ian T
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:31
Quote: " MOUSE, you really don't get it do you?

Mathamatics is a HUMAN invention, true it is most likely universal, but it CAN evolve diffrently."


You're no longer making any sense at all. Are you seriously saying that the apes have their own form of mathematics which measures brains in ape terms, and their machines would make us seem stupider? For god's sake, take a peek at the world around you kid. You've walked straight off the track of unreason into complete surrealism.

Quote: "In spain, putting your cup upside down is an extream insult (or something like that) do you think they would understand that you are american and just let you pass?"


Way to throw in a meaningless nonsequitor. And yes, they would let it pass, because they're not stupid and like all human beings they are capable of understanding the concept of different cultures

If I looking for blog
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:33
@vid, thanks alright, prolly misinterrpreted what you said, soo tired lol.



I'll check what people have replied to what I just wrote, then say something and go to bed

Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:33
Quote: "I have indeed heard about Walt Disney being a satanist, yet his cartoons and films were an inspiration to me So that proves that I don't discriminate or hate the Anti-Christs in any way."


That's the stupidest thing I've ever read.

Oneka
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:34
Mathamatics is a HUMAN invention, true it is most likely universal, but it CAN evolve diffrently." mouse he sad HUMAN so I dun think were talking about apes..and universal i think he means its universal for it can be applied to many things..I gotta go to sleep soon so I cant really reply to another post >_<

Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Ian T
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:37
I'm not certain what he thought he was getting at, but he definatly proved absolutely nothing. The kid apparently seriously believes that all kinds of animals have human or meta-human intelligence and are capable of sentient thought. And they act like animals with sub-human-intelligence because... well... wait, he hasn't explained that part yet. Oh well.

Sigh. This has been a mighty amusing trek through the realms of insanity, but I think I'm going to have a cup of tea and hit the sack now.

I look forward to reading about how human organs are sentient beings and are horribly oppresed through the transplant system tommorow.

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Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:40
Animals are cute n cuddly, I want to squeeeeeeze em FOREVAH!

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:44
@ mouse, humans have more iq than common animals because our genetics are more advanced, ape is an early stage of human evolution, you can communicate with an ape and teach it sign language (an ape sign language not the kind for deaf people) Humans are mutant apes, there thats all we are, mutants bring to mind an odd picture, but another word for adaptation is mutation. Animals only have a smaller IQ, humans are not above them, does whats his face who uses a computer to speak and is in a wheelchair rule over me and you? he has a much higher IQ, like we have over animals.

So I'm gonna make my summary point here.

Christianity is ambiguous hence problems in its religion and outcome
Humans are no way above animals, just because the bible teaches it.
War is not just
Seppuku isn't 14 he is actually 16
Seppuku has put people in a arguementitve state
Seppuku is pure evil
that no one likes Seppuku
and Seppuku has argued with mods and is not band
you can add your own seppuku conclusions as well nothing too offensive tho

Oneka
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:45
I like Seppuku
I like his game
you wont get banned
and you just felt like outputing your thought....


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:47
@ Merranvo, I totally agree, animals do have their own tech and culture, primates use tools, cats have their own personality based in their culture, you know some cats a snobs, others a screwy, some bullies, others are miserable gits.

TKF15H
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:49
Quote: " comparing intelligence to technilogical inovations is NOT a mesuement..."

OK, then what is? Attempts to study any linguistic capabilities of various animals have failed (except for the McDonnalds clown that speaks with dogs in a certain commercial) so it can't be that either. And are emotions relevant?
I've seen a rabbit eating grass like it was any day, while two of his brothers lay a few feet away from him with their internals on the outside (naughty Cocker Spaniel ripped em up).

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:51
you like my game? thanks, its barely touched and I'm liked........(someone likes me.......checks for sarcasm......) are you mad? joke lol thanks. I know I won't get banned for argueing, relious debate isn't an arguement you get banned for
ME NEED SLEEP AHHH

Any way, now that I've discuss religion, for the extra arguements, I'll add government tomorrow.

Oh and the Disney-Satanist thing, is true, you wouldn't believe it, I was suprised when I found out, its not bo yang or anything

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:53
oh and I've got to say this, this is my most popular thread ever, 82 posts in............an hour and a half or longer, ronin is about 70 and thats about half a years almost

well good night

TKF15H
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:56
Quote: "Beavers build DAMS, and you can't just throw it all anywhere, skilled but mabey not precise laying of things."

Instictive, as a bird building a nest, an ant digging a hole, etc.

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vid1987
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 13:58
Even though I just went on a big rant about Christianity debates I think I might explain something to you people...

I have a theory...

Humans have the God-given ability to resist... Observe..

Animals can't resist their instinct...

Although humans have almost all of the same instincts as animals.. sexuality for example.. humans can resist sexual intentions while animals can't.. that is a theory that can't be proven wrong..

What do you say to that?

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:06
Quote: "testosterium"


Sorry vid, I take it back. THIS is the stupidest thing I have ever read.

TKF15H
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:08
Quote: " RAPE... MURDER... I think that is enough,
as a note, most serial killers are just high on testosterium, can they stop their insticts...
Mothers are overprotective of their young, that is instict..."

Not really, as serial killers WANT to do what they do, it's not like they go to court saying, "My body did it! I actually wanted to go watch the ball game!".
As for being over-protective, that's not instinctive as there are mothers that aren't.

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vid1987
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:09
Yes of course people have instinct... and MOST people give into it...

Here is another example..

If you were to set a bowl of food down for an animal to eat..
I bet you any animal (if it's not physically hurt or sick) will automatically eat the food...

And say you give some food to a person the person can make a decision (even though the person is indeed hungry) to not eat the food.

Does anybody see what I'm getting at?

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
TKF15H
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:12
Yeup, it's called reasoning.

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vid1987
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:14 Edited at: 3rd Jul 2005 14:15
Have you ever seen an animal commit suicide or hold it's breath?...

Think about it man..

Anyways, I'm done with this...

Peace


"If I wasn't so poor... I'd be rich..." Me
Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:16
You're stupid.

Testosterium? I know what you were TRYING to say, it's just, take one more look at that word. Maybe grab a dictionary. An english one.

Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:20
Quote: "by committing suicide we will releive the pressure, animals just deal with it.."


I'd wager that animals don't have that "pressure" to deal with in the first place and if they did, they wouldn't know it.

Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:22
Quote: "Let me see, if you don't know how to spell know, then you think it begins with an n, you won't find the spelling of know..."


But you had the first nine letters right, so a dictionary would have been perfect, but yes, finding it still would require a bit more abstract thought than you're used to.

Jonny Ree
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:32
Seppuku Geijutsu:
*havent read anything but parts of the first post sorry* but:
I think part of being a buddist as the Dalai Lama said, is to accept and respect the beliefs of others, even though you dont agree with them. It should be alright to point out your own beliefs on this.. and I agree with some of what you've said. but what is the point of starting a thread like this when with it you press your own way of thinking on others.. You start the post off with attacking groups? why? what can you gain by doing so other then ticking people off?

Quote: "well someones gotta start a thread about it"

really?

Keaz
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:36 Edited at: 3rd Jul 2005 14:51
I wasn't sure if I even wanted to comment on this topic as it is such a hot button. I plan on making two posts like it or not. One(this I will state my views) the second I rebutte what people want to say about them(in an hour or so, so those who want can get in there two cents worth)

This is my two cents or more and mine and my wifes personal beliefs and how they came about. I warn you ahead of time this is a deeply personal subject to me and therefore the longest post have ever written on this forum. @Sep: If you truely want others views and are searching for what you believe read my little essay.
Don't open the code unless you really want too.

Well you've been warned:


Finally, I personally have a better rule than the golden rule and a lot more fun. "Do whatever you want as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else."

P.S. It's late and I have coding to do. So now I am logging off. If any you of wish to respond to me personally on this issue, you can email me here:
keaz@kashkreations.com (Just put DBForum in the topic.) Else just respond here. Well goodnight all.

Breaking Stuff=Fun!,Bug Testing<>Fun!, Bug Testing=Breaking Stuff, so...
Bug Testing=Fun! Hmmmm....
DOES NOT COMPUTE! SYSTEM MALFUNTION!
TKF15H
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 14:59
Quote: "But if your a religious baby, you would go to heaven and it wouldn't matter."

If you are a Christian, thou shalt not kill.

Quote: "Not that I don't love the animal rights, it is just that Jimmy is inferior and can't comprehend anything longer then the first sentence."

Your spelling is what's inferior.

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Keaz
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 15:10
I am gooder at spelling than u. C eye can spell two.

Breaking Stuff=Fun!,Bug Testing<>Fun!, Bug Testing=Breaking Stuff, so...
Bug Testing=Fun! Hmmmm....
DOES NOT COMPUTE! SYSTEM MALFUNTION!
Jimmy
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 18:00
Yes, I too love that abortion topic.

Chris K
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 20:09
OK. So I read the first few posts then got bored.

Firstly,

Quote: "1. Stories passed down through oral tradition historically remain extremely accurate and close to their original versions."




How would we know if stories passed through oral tradition would be accurate? Surely the point is that the original is lost. If there was a hard copy to compare it to then of course it wouldn't deviate very far, because they'd had a hard copy.

Secondly, I'm sure this must have come up somewhere or will come up, so I just want to say that the evidence for evolution is utterly overwhelming.

It is literally one of the most definate theories in science, as certain as they can come. It is more definate than tectonic plate theory, all fundamental physics blah blah blah most of the science national curriculum.

To make someone not believe in evolution you really really have to brainwash them from a very young age, and then continue with boosters of anti-evolution books all through life.

The thing you have to remember with evolution was that it was discovered in a universally religious time - no one was trying to destroy christianity, in fact Darwin, on discovering it, said something like "Bollocks, this looks pretty bad, I've discovered something terrible".

The theory of creation had a ridiculously unfair advantage over evolution in that it was already completely believed everywhere. It just shows how powerful the evidence for evolution is that it managed to completely over turn everybody's ideas. You have to admit, those guys must have been pretty blown away to give up what they had believed their whole lives because two or three people explained something new.

Imagine if evolution was absolutely entirely believed everywhere (as creation was), and then two guys (the only two people who believe it in the world) went to the natural history museum or wherever and gave a lecture detailing the evidence for it. Do you think the world would be flipped around? Would it fight it's way into every textbook in the country?

No

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 21:40
thanks for all your comments, and Keaz (I see you point, you kinda helped me think about myself too ), ahhh you guys got me up till 5 this morning aggghhh oh well I managed to catch up on sleep.
@Johnny Ree the point really was to start a religious discussion so I can understand what I should follow and what realistic an resonable, to see if I could understand why people followed christianity and whether people see the faults in religion, or am I not seeing things clearly, and well it helped, yeah Dalai Lama said that, I shouldn't really have taken the attacking approach, sorry about that, my intention was to show what I see of Chrisitanity at the time of posting, considering I am still agnostic, I wanted to use that to gain more insight, and so I succeeded.

Now I am no longer Antichrist, I disagree with the concept of beleifs that of things that aren't real, but they help people and give them confidence, so it can't be too bad, its not my thing though. Religions like Christianity teach riteousness and loving etc, people just choose to try and twist points to work their own way, not the fault of religion, the fault of the person. I should be more tolerant of what other people believe, the single main problem I have with Christian teachings is the Sanctity of Life, All human life is sacred, humans are above the animals, that I totally disagree with, I don't like the fact they(not all, just some) are confused on certain teaching (hence they twist it in their own way) before anyone disagrees, Catholic church thing abortion is completely wrong. C of E thinks its OK under circumstance. I think there should be only one church, to keep beleifs strong, confusion between them weakens the rules. And of course, I should pick my own beliefs, I agree with a lot of things that crop up in religion, but I disagree with the concept of god, I believe in reincarnation and helping the fellow man and learn to read between the lines, well the reason I should go into buddhism, now I understand I shouldn't hate other religions makes it that much easier to become one, Thanks guys


Now that religion is sorted, who wants to talk about government, I don't think as many people will get so worked up on this one, although people will find mind control theories a little odd....

Richard Davey
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Posted: 3rd Jul 2005 22:59
I think this thread has gone on for long enough. At least it didn't degenerate into the usual flame fest topics like this generally start, and for that reason alone I will merely lock it and not delete it.

Quote: "And yes, they would let it pass, because they're not stupid and like all human beings they are capable of understanding the concept of different cultures"


Wishful thinking if ever I heard of it.

The human race is the most barbaric, un-just, war mongering, destructive, ruthless, back-stabbing, money grabbing, murdering, conflicting, selfish breed on this entire planet - a plant that we're so "intelligently" destroying piece by piece.

If scientists want to actually do some good, give up wasting their "enormous" brain power on proving where we came from and start figuring out how the hell we're going to rectify the utter mess we've made of what was once a beautiful unspoiled planet, irrespective of how it all got here.

Perhaps we are more intelligent than animals, but at least you don't see them fucking each other over for a dollar.

Intelligent? Arrogant more like.

A great many people think they are thinking when they are really rearranging their prejudices.

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