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3 Dimensional Chat / WIP low-poly elf

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NanoBrain
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Posted: 30th Jul 2005 23:37 Edited at: 30th Jul 2005 23:39
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Hello all,

I am not a modeler, but I am all I have. So, to create a 3D game, I have to create the models myself. Therefore, here is the first model for what I hope to be implemented into a completed rpg, sometime in the latter future. It will eventually, maybe be the main character(3rd person), an elf. The torso in the image below is designed to be shirtless, which is why it is shaped so plainly.



Please critique my doings. The model is going to be used in DarkBasic Classic in runtime amongst many other polyons, due to scenery and other characters. Therefore, as low poly as I can get, without the character looking like a complete block, is what I am aiming for. Also, there can be no mesh deformations, unfortunately. Just limbs. Thank you all.


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Neodelito
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 00:02
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Nice.. please continue..

"La Ignorancia es no saber lo que se debe"
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discostu
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 03:35 Edited at: 31st Jul 2005 03:35
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You need to add more for us to comment on it properly, but apart from that,
Quote: "neodelito:Nice.. please continue.."


hello.........Hello...........HELLO......H E L L O!
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NanoBrain
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 04:46
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Thanks to the both of you.

I failed to mention, though the topic states, that it is in progress, and I will be updating the thread as I work on the model. I should have more by night's end.


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discostu
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 15:29
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cool cant wait

hello.........Hello...........HELLO......H E L L O!
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Jonny Ree
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 20:56
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Alright lets see here is a few things to make note of:

- The head needs a few more polys to make it rounder
- The head also needs to be placed further forwards
- the throat needs to be wider from the side so that it cover the area (a bit before where the jawbone ends and to the back where the spine go. so almost all the way to the back of the head.
- The ears and nose needs to be a tiny bit lower. (I'm at a internet coffee shop, so cant upload a image which shows the changes.. sorry)

The thorso looks neat dont have anything to point out on that atm. The model is very well done for your first.. and you could probably end up as a modler if you kept doing this.

Keep working on it, and please post your progress

http://seikensteel.com
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NanoBrain
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Posted: 31st Jul 2005 22:47 Edited at: 31st Jul 2005 22:49
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Jonny Ree,

Below is an image of the changes to the head and kneck of the model. By the way, thank you for your input, which did and will help me greatly.



To round the head I first used subsurf. Well, it looked nice, but the poly count was unreasonable. However, I kept the subsurf form and added a decimator to it. This brought about a nice form, without such a high poly count.

I widened the kneck from back to front, making a few adjustments to the upper torso. I also heightened the kneck upwards a bit, and raised the head. The head has also been moved foward, which made everything look much better, and real.

Laslty, I have added a few more polys to the nose, and lowered it. Which, by the way, gave the head a great improvement. The ears are also lowered.

Thanks everyone for your good words of motivation.


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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 00:55
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Hello all,

Here is a trial of the arm. I was not too sure how to go about creating it. Therefore, I simply modeled each section by extruding from a box and scaling for the shape. I then subsurfed both sections to make the arms more round than a box.

Any suggestions?




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Blazer
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 00:59
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It's The torso guy from Monty Python Holy Grail! . Unless this is gona be a stradegy game I think you can allow some more polys. Good Start though

I discriminate against discriminating people....
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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 01:09
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Blazer,

As far as I have planned, and forsee, which isn't too much, the scenery is going to be a bit more complex than usual. There will be much grenery in the scene, as in tress and bushes, etc. The motivation for the environment is coming from the game, Morrowind:The Elder Scrolls, in that how the scenery is grand and beautiful.

Therefore, most objects, if not all, I am trying to keep to a bare minimal in polycount. However, I could be overdoing it. I am not sure. However, once I start to implement everything into its package, then I can add to or take away as needed, in polys. Thank you for your input.

Accually, my first image in this post was the original polycount style I was aiming for. However, Jonny Ree stated about the flatness of the face and a few other things. So, I experimented, and figured that the newer look, looks great, and the poly count shouldn't be too bad. So, I have loosened up a bit on the strictness effeciency for this model. In the end, time will tell.


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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 01:21
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@ blazer ha ha lol, BITE YOUR LEGS OFF!, come back and fight like a man!

http://seppukuarts.proboards45.com

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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 07:03
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Hello all,

I have completed the limbs, which was quite difficult for me to do. Reason being, since DarkBasic Classic does not support mesh deformation, I have to figure the best design that will work for moving, unconnected limbs. While on the subject, does anyone know a good way to model, that where the limbs are ultimately supposed to connenct, they will not be too ugly when rotated?



I have given the torso a higher polycount, which ended up looking better, in my opinion. Thanks to Jonny Ree and Blazer, pulling the strictness on that out of my mind. I can't say the limbs are the best, because the legs do not seem in porportion.

What am I suppose to do for the hips, since I can't mold the meshes together? I did the best I could. Lastly, for lowpoly, what would be the best design for the hands? A single cylinder, or a bit more complexed mesh? Thank you.


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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 08:55
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Hello all,

I have finnished the hands and feet, and have also linked the limbs together, onto the torso, in heirarchy. However, I am a bit confused about how I should save the model, and how I should implement it into DarkBasic Classic. Do I save the individual objects as seperate .x files? Or, do I save them altogether as one .x file? I wish to later animate the limbs.

I will experiment for a while, and check back here when finnished. Thanks for any replies.


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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 10:00 Edited at: 1st Aug 2005 10:02
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Hello all,

I am a bit confounded at the moment. When loading my object into DarkBasic Classic, only two of the fifteen limbs are visible. The head and the hip, and the hip is even rotated incorrectly. I am now trying to figure this out. For now, an image of the situation is below. How may this be fixed? Thank you.




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Undercover Steve
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 12:59
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how many vertices is it?
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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:06
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Jr noober,

That is accualy a good question. I will try to figure this out, though. I am using Blender, and am not sure where to get that number from. However, on the brighter side, I have been able to get more parts showing on the screen at one time, by interestingly, and confoundingly changing the names of each object. If the objects has a period in it's name, it will not show. Also, I seem to have to put an "H" at the beginning of the name. However, this doesn't apply when I put an "H" at the beginning of all the names.

For example, the head and the hip were the only names that didn't have periods in them(except the "Torso", and both started with an "H"(no other names started with an "H"). The head and the hip were the only two parts showing in the picture above. So, this made me believe that if I put an "H" before "Torso", for the torso limb, it might appear also. Well, it worked.

So, I tried this for all objects and it did not work. Then, I took the period out of all the names, and kept the "H" in. This mad most of the objects visible. However, the torso was no longer visible, and part of one of the legs. What the heck is going on?


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Aaron
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:14
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Nice elf i love elfs in mid-evil stuff like world of warcraft and runescape and everquest plz show more i would like to see it all done


Modelin Rank: Novice! Noob
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NanoBrain
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Posted: 1st Aug 2005 22:53
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Aaron The Modeler,

At the moment I am tied trying to get the model to import into DarkBasic correctly. This very problem has hindered me in the past from wanting to create and use models in DarkBasic Classic. However, as soon as I get it working, where I understand the problem, then I will be continuing completion of this model, and so on. Thanks for your words!


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Undercover Steve
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2005 03:27
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try DarkBasic Classic into DarkBasic Pro :p...seriously classic never liked my models.
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Cyril Grey
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Posted: 2nd Aug 2005 04:26 Edited at: 2nd Aug 2005 04:27
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Nanobrain,

Good looking model. The bicep looks too big for the forearm, and I'm not sure why you've expended all the polys on the kneecaps, although it will give them a unique feel once textured.

I am not the world's best modeler. In fact, I know modeling will be my most time consuming challenge once I get to that point - especially the mapping.

I found this tutorial to be pretty good:
http://www.psionic3d.co.uk/tutorials.html
However, since you want all of your limbs separate, you may want to go about it differently.

What modeling program are you using? I use milkshape and find that I can simply create a whole model then add bones and animate them. Each bone constitutes a separate limb im DBP, so I can connect weapons, armor, etc to the various limbs quite easily. The only limbs I'll create separately are the arms, since I find them to deform oddly at the shoulder and under the arms.

If you aren't using milkshape, I'd be happy to email you one of my models made in milkshape so you can try it in your program.

Good luck. Keep up the good work!!

Cyril

With math all things are possible
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Jonny Ree
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Posted: 4th Aug 2005 23:41
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Hey, I appologize about my inability to follow up on your model as I havent been able to access the net very frequently these past weeks.

I really hate using my own work for referance to others.. but in this case I feel it might help you out.. and provide a contrast to the pointers I'm giving.

Now, its quite uncommon to see people actually acting on comments and trying to improve which I really respect you for

I'm still sitting at a internet cafè so I cant make you any images to show you where I'm pointing.. but I'll try to explain as well as possible.



Here is a model I made for test.. http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=52651&b=3 <-- download it here if you want to play around with it.

Anyway, if you compare that image to yours.. perhaps place it behind.. you may see a few differances.

A few points would be:
- The head is a bit big compared to the size of the body, not the length however.. which seems to be right compared.
- The arms are too short, try bending your arm over your head, and you'll see what I mean.
- The pelvis needs to be taller.. over twice the size I belive.
- also the biceps was mentioned.. which are too big, and I agree.. but they are also a bit missplaced.
- Try building some sholders

When thats said. Great work on this!, an please keep it up

http://seikensteel.com
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Raven
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Posted: 5th Aug 2005 05:01
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Best tip for creating models is to learn how to draw Turn-Arounds.
It's 1000x easier to work from an image that it is to freehand, in-fact I now very very few people who do freehand models anymore.

Takes far more talent and time. Neither of which are particularly nice.

What I'd suggest is to have a learning point, find some turn-around by someone else. There are a few concept artists out there who just seem to randomly release work. It might not seem like much to try, but in-fact perfecting your techniques for design and getting an eye for the rough sizes really helps.

http://www.finearts.sk and http://www.3d.sk

those two sites will provide you with real people turn-arounds. You can then edit from there, but you don't get that unrealistic fantasy look by purely copying them. Just use them as a base. Once you have the main model you can then later add detail.

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BenDstraw
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Posted: 5th Aug 2005 05:33
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a reference is always the way to go just like Raven said.

John HandCock
http://www.blacklabstudios.5gigs.com
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NanoBrain
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Posted: 5th Aug 2005 21:40
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Jonny,

Thank you again for the tips. I will encorporate them into my model, as soon as I get home from work tonight. I will update this thread with any improvements. Your delay was no problem. I keep myself busy. Thank you for sticking by my side in helping me, and thank you for the referance model. It will come in much handiness.

Raven,

Thank you for the suggestion of the turn-around images. I will definitely check out those sights, and grab an image or two from them.

BenDstraw,

Thank you for your added encouragement!


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