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FPSC Classic Product Chat / Riker 9 Debate [Flame Bait]

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Les Horribres
19
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Joined: 20th Nov 2005
Location: My Name is... Merry
Posted: 11th Feb 2006 00:06
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Here... since you all are soo insitant in flaming Riker 9 in one way or another, Keep it in here.

Mods, I ask you to keep this unlocked given that it works... I am tired of the new threads, CB is tired of having HIS thread deleted (And it will be, given that incense continues to post), and we all know that Riker 9 is the Noobs Frontier of Complaint.
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Aoneweb
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 00:33
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rofl


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=ChrisB=
19
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Location: starring into a viewfinder
Posted: 11th Feb 2006 00:40
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Oh thats enough.
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Benjamin A
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Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 11th Feb 2006 00:41
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Some people around here really act like they own this place.....

There's one way to stop the whole Riker9 discussion and that is by showing some tangible evidence of the progress. It's as simple as that. You can talk all you want about how wonderful Riker9 is, but it's vaporwarem until real evidence is shown that it really is an exsisting project.

We've seen more then enough vaporware around here and as far as I'm concerned Riker9 belongs to that category until it's proven otherwise.

MegaMusic Pack 01.... 31 original soundtracks for your games!
http://www.aeilkema.dds.nl/mega/index.html
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Les Horribres
19
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Joined: 20th Nov 2005
Location: My Name is... Merry
Posted: 11th Feb 2006 01:57
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Good... now we are starting somewhere
Take in a deep breath and let it all out...
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Sunflash
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Joined: 28th Jun 2005
Location: Seattle, Wa
Posted: 11th Feb 2006 02:16
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lol! Perfect timing Merry

When FPSC develops enough, lets make a Redwall game!

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BULLSHOCK 2
Retired Moderator
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 02:43
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you cant show progress with a big coding assignment like that.

you cant release a program that half saves, or half fixes the framerate. think about it.

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Conjured Entertainment
AGK Developer
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 04:50 Edited at: 11th Feb 2006 05:11
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Quote: "There's one way to stop the whole Riker9 discussion and that is by showing some tangible evidence of the progress. It's as simple as that. "

I agree.
Each "issue" could have been a sperate build, starting with Save/Load.

He should have had that by now, because he is a DBPro Guru.
Then he could keep delivering a build with every new whistle, whilst doing them one at a time.
I'm waiting too you know, and to the point that I want to start workin on the Save/Load myself.
Not because I want it, but because it is the most desired "fix" by the masses.
It should have been first and then get that out fast.
Save/Load is what they all "complain" about.

I wish they would all stop complaining too, and a Save/Load would shut them up for awhile.
There is my opinion. It is not a flame, but merely a suggestion.
Save your breath, because I have already been informed that I am an idiot.





Merranvo
Your idea of having a thread for a "Frontier of Complaint", is not a bad idea.
Why call it flame bait?

Why not call it "Complaint Department"?
Then all the complainers could gather to whine in one spot, and free the rest of the threads.



Support Your Local CE-FPSC Chapter
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RJ is out Leave a message
19
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Joined: 7th Nov 2005
Location: The butt end of the U.S.
Posted: 11th Feb 2006 05:16
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Maybe it's lost in the Duke Nukem Forever vaporware department!?! Who cares? I plan to buy DB PRO anyway! Its not cellblocs responsiblity to code save/load/framrate whatever! I'll code it myself shhhhhhsh!
ChrisB you are as useful as a DOS program under WinXp go away shoo! shoo!
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=ChrisB=
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 08:16
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*raises eyebrow* why do I put up with idiots like him? Tim, PLEASE tell me WHY I DO IT!
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Benjamin A
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 10:00
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Quote: "you cant show progress with a big coding assignment like that.

you cant release a program that half saves, or half fixes the framerate. think about it."


Well if he's going about his coding that way it already is a disaster. You should tackle per section. So first tackle the framerate isssue, then load/save, then vehicles and so on. Since all of these are clearly distinguisable sections of code, you can show progress, by building only releasing that part of coding.

MegaMusic Pack 01.... 31 original soundtracks for your games!
http://www.aeilkema.dds.nl/mega/index.html
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Jikito
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 12:54
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It took nearly 3 years to develop FPSC, and at the time, from what i can tell on the original posting on Riker9, he was first waiting for the release of DBpro 5.9

all considering, the original post was only made 3 months ago, it takes time to study the code, I would assume, and then move on to pick apart what needs to be worked on.

then there is testing, and retesting.

I am no programmer, nor could I even script my way out of a paper bag, but 3 months isnt very long to go over what took 3 years of development with a fine tooth and comb.

The man also probably has a real life. you know... Kids, wife, job. Unlike the developers of FPCS (whose primary focus is developments of FPCS and other products) im sure he isnt able to focus his 24/7 time on the making of a plugin that would be free to the community.

and if he doesnt make the rebuild, no loss, im sure Lee and Chris Bamber are already looking into the issues addressed and are already working on much of it.

also, there are many other talented programmers that seem to be lurking on these forums,and many of them most likley studying the FPSC code intensly. even for them, it will take time, the software has only been out for 6 months.
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Gamz
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 13:01
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COMPLAINCOMPLAINCOMPLAINWHINGEMOANCOMPLAINCURSECURSECOMPLAIN
COMPLAINCOMPLAINCOMPLAINWHINGEMOANCOMPLAINCURSECURSECOMPLAIN
COMPLAINCOMPLAINCOMPLAINWHINGEMOANCOMPLAINCURSECURSECOMPLAIN
COMPLAINCOMPLAINCOMPLAINWHINGEMOANCOMPLAINCURSECURSECOMPLAIN
COMPLAINCOMPLAINCOMPLAINWHINGEMOANCOMPLAINCURSECURSECOMPLAIN

Okay I'm done.
But I don't actually have anything bad to say about Riker 9. Won't
the complainers be a little put off by the words 'flame bait'?Won't
they think its a big flame war that theyre going to get caught up in?

/.,.\-Meh? Everyone loves fat penguins!
((_ _)) Support your local Riker 9 Chapter.
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tpfkat
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 14:49
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if hes giving it away for free then why hassle him, just for this he should charge people for it.

the programmer formarly known as thicko.
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BULLSHOCK 2
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 17:49
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Quote: "Well if he's going about his coding that way it already is a disaster. You should tackle per section. So first tackle the framerate isssue, then load/save, then vehicles and so on. Since all of these are clearly distinguisable sections of code, you can show progress, by building only releasing that part of coding."


being a programmer myself, i knw thats how we should attempt to tackle things in an order like that, but if you have ever programmed any project other than "hello world" then you should know that it never turns out like that.

plus, you can just change sync rat 33 to 60 and call it better framerates.

and for save/load, he had to write a different method for the AI scripts, because in order to save the position of physics objects and such, he had to PAUSE the script position, and FPSC wasnt designe dto do that, so its a bit more work than you think...

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crow34
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 18:33
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certain folk in this community want things now now free or else
and in my opinion fpscreator even though i consider it a program of perfection was in my opinion realised far too early and needed more development time

i dont want to see this happen to rikers9

personally id rather wait for rikers 9 with patients

and i know cb will deliver shear perfection

so to the moaner and flamebaiter heres a quick thought

shut the big fat hole in the middle of your face

and support rikers9
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Bloodeath 6 6 6
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Posted: 11th Feb 2006 19:17
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riker 9! riker 9! riker 9! riker 8! riker 7! riker 6! riker 5! riker 4! riker 3! riker 2! riker 1! BLAST OFF!!!!


BOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMM!!!!!!

Nunticaelitusphobia---im scuurrred of the internet
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Chenak
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Posted: 12th Feb 2006 03:15
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I was thinking of trying to replace the scripting with LUA scripting, and replacing ODE with newton physics just for the hell of it, turns out it's not so easy .

After attempting this feat of insanity I gotta say cellblock has guts for even attempting to add the features missing for FPSC. Some of the weird and wonderful things inside that source code... well, are crazy and make no sense, yet work somehow . Don't think Lee himself understands them

Good luck CB! If anyone thinks it's easy to add saving and stuff to fpsc look at the source code and have a go for yourself. Maybe you can do it, who knows....
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BULLSHOCK 2
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Posted: 12th Feb 2006 05:18
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ya iknow what you mean.

he said he was also cleaning the source up a lot, like with a lot of functions, so im looking forward to that too

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Les Horribres
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Posted: 13th Feb 2006 01:05
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Just a few notes...
[Flame Bait] is the tag mods put on flame threads.

It is utterly stupid to program 1 aspect of a program and ignore the other aspects. You get it so each works, then you start to get them to work together.
Take a small project I am working on, PowerBond, just something to do while my teacher droans on about nothing. The idea was at first to just make an easy GUI system for Java. Well, I got that done rather fast... then I began to get more creative, I added in a small time 2D physics engine and had to fix multiple problems while getting it fully attached. Now I have it attached, but having little experiance with physics writting, I have some collision issues... Sure I could have rem'd out everything and fixed the collision issues first, but then I would not know if I had everything working because the engine outputs with the GUI Shapes system.
In a more complicated project you would have to attach multiple things and get them to corroperate propperly, to attach one at a time will almost certainly gaurantee hell while attaching the rest, but if you get them all attached at the basic lvl and fix the problems they have with eachother, it takes less time, although there may be more bugs.


Save/Load is easy, but CB wanted to get it so that the S/L was small, instead of the 30mb of arrays that run though FPSC. Besides that, there is less room for error if you are loading only a few arrays and a few variables.

Frame Rates were dependent on the DBP Upgrade, and as I understand, CB is having a culling problem which was suppose to be fixed with 5.9 . FPSC wasn't using culling or what not, and that would have been better, or what not.


Also, according to phycology. It is better for people to write out their frustrations then to let them overtake you.
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RJ is out Leave a message
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Posted: 13th Feb 2006 02:37
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When I first looked at code and binary years ago, It sucked, But still with out it there would be no gaming entertainment today..When I first gazed at DOS I said "ok". After I learned to use the scripting language for Duke Nukem 3D and mastered game design eight years later and made many unpublished mods with QUAKE QUAKE2 QUAKE III and the Lithtech engine I said "Cool I can do this!" But then one day..I got a hold of the shareware version of the Dark Basic software from PC Gamer and I finaly said "This is a joke right?" Basic is used to floss my teeth right? Just wait till I get my hands on Dark Basic Pro and dip my hands into the source of this bizzare game engine! Can't wait to hear what I'll say next....
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