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3 Dimensional Chat / community compilation?

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BenDstraw
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Posted: 19th Feb 2006 22:57
I have a very interesting idea will anyone join me in this and tell me what they think. How about a community compilation? We all work on a rendered scene together. This can take place instead of one contest(which would be up to winner of this last one once that mess gets clean up!) then after it is done continue with contests as usual or trade off? or along side the contests? now exactly how this is gonna work I’m not sure that’s why I want some of your opinions first cause I believe this could turn out great and the final render could end up on the newsletter. which would be our only reward I guess.

So here are some of my ideas on how this might work.
1.Person with strongest comp holds all the models. They will give us a poly limit based on how much they think their comp will take without crashing and dying.

2.anyone willing or has the time will make a model. all people will have a chance to enter a model. if they make crap models that is not as important encouraging them to get better is. so their model will be respected and placed in. where they fall in composition is based on the community(ex. models lacking quality would not be the center of focus).

3. I call on sepp, Ooga, and bigAdd to help me moderate this if it takes off. not because these gents are my best friends or anything its cause they are regulars of this forum and are plenty trust worthy to do a good job. if they are willing that is.

4. even though I asked sepp, ooga, and bigAdd to moderate I would want this to be as democratic as possible. everyone can throw in their opinions. everyone will have a voice.

5. The holder of the scene(person with the strongest comp) will be in charge of rendering(ex. shaders, sampling, lighting). so if he has a good renderer then that’s a bonus for this community

6. textures will be up to the creator of their own model. they may turn in an untextured model then anyone from the community may submit a texture.

will those are some of my ideas. I’m aware that many things are untouched but this idea is in its infancy and may never take off. I just thought it was a good idea. if anyone would like to see this happen or has any ideas to add please reply. or am I just crazy?

anyways things for reading all this craziness,
BenDstraw

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 19th Feb 2006 23:57
Well why not? There are a few of these on the net, if we get it good enough I'll try to do my best to get it into the 3D world magazine, I'm a regular at the forums and the editor has the occasional drop in.

Although in the forums they have a whole animation going, but there was one group of people from CGtalk doing a huge 3D model, I was it the WIP in the 3D world magazine and looked sweet.

Quote: "3. I call on sepp, Ooga, and bigAdd to help me moderate this if it takes off. not because these gents are my best friends or anything its cause they are regulars of this forum and are plenty trust worthy to do a good job. if they are willing that is."


Awww thank you, I am willing, I am doing my a levels, but I can still contribute.

If my PC allow's me to sign onto my forum (Sometimes I can, its being a pain) then we can use that for discussion and try to keep up to date on here, if not use someone else forum.



Quote: "5. The holder of the scene(person with the strongest comp) will be in charge of rendering(ex. shaders, sampling, lighting). so if he has a good renderer then that’s a bonus for this community"


I would recommend this person owns a recent version of Blender, C4D, Maya, 3DS Max or similar and has good enough knowledge to use it AND is a trusted member of this community. (Names that crop up in my mind are Big Add, Dark Coder, Ooga Booga, Oolite(Not a regular Joe, I trust him) and some others)
Also we will need to have as many backups, so when we have a backup ready, the main comp person will need to send the whole scene to all the back up people, even if they can't use the file format, we just need the files.

We all should use the universal format .3ds or obj, .3ds would be better, I don't know the texture compatibility of .obj

Also I will check if Oolite will want to help, he's a good modeller and I know him from another forum. (well two other forums now)

Quote: "This can take place instead of one contest(which would be up to winner of this last one once that mess gets clean up!) then after it is done continue with contests as usual or trade off?"

Contests should continue, I might need support with it though, especially with this running, as you can see I am getting sloppy with the comps, forgetting to post important notes, and once I missed people's entries so as it was when it started you and/or BigAdd might want to continue to help if you have the time


Of course this is a good idea, now all we need is ideas, writing is my hobby, so maybe I could think of a story within a freeze frame.

Of course, we will need a concept artist, I will ask Jonny if I catch him on MSN, but due to him not being as active I'm guessing he is busy or away, so if no dice I'll look around for places, my mum and sister are illustrators so hopefully concept artists won't be hard to find.

And well alls up to the community

BiggAdd
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 00:18
I'll help you moderate if you want. It sounds cool.

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 00:30 Edited at: 20th Feb 2006 00:32
Myself and BenDstraw have been discussing our own ideas over AIM so I'll post mine, and hopefully he posts his

I thought of having a huge scene render over a town at night, 11,000x11,000 pixels would be a good render size for that kind of thing.

The town would consist of a lot of people ideas, where there is a story told in each little bit, like you could have gang warfare in one bit, a police chase in another, I was hoping to have a contrast in emotion from left to the right, so the more left, the more happier the scene, the more right the darker and evil/sad the scene is, this way it is a good well for people to create ideas.

Finally as a joke I said we could put waldo/wally somewhere for a wheres wally/waldo challenge however it would work in some sort of scene

Mucky Muck Ninja
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 00:32
Sure id be willing to help
I am reasonably sure that my iMac G5 could handle a fairly complex scene, ill be using the newest version of blender of course. If no one else wants to hold the models I am open.

This sounds like it would be really cool, im interested as to how it turns out.

''From now on we will travel in TUBES!'' ~Tenacious D
"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes."
~ Douglas Adams
BenDstraw
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 00:40
good i have all my mods thats perfect. adding to sepps idea i beleive the happy part of the scene should be more natural with more trees and people. and the darker part of the scen would be more mechinical. describing how we lost touch with our natural side and our mechinical nature is driving us insane. and we will only be at peace once we find a middel point. which if thats true there should be something in the middle that represents perfect peace. maybe a peace side or yin yang or anything else of that nature.

thats good guys we need more ideas from other member dont be afraid to speak up, you'll be heard

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 00:49
Good idea, the middle really need to be a mix of the two, but working together, the right side will have a lot of death, from the sounds of things Judge Dred will be on the right But no, can't have a character that has been acted by Sylvester Stallone ugh! Nature would be the purity of the left, so people are real happy, the middle would be neutral, people are not waving to each other, but they're satisfied with it, and the left is the real hell hole, death, violence all around.

BiggAdd
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 02:22 Edited at: 20th Feb 2006 02:24
121000000 pixels!!!!!!!!!!! that will take ages to render, even on my pc! but hey... if you must.

BigAdd
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 02:31 Edited at: 20th Feb 2006 02:40
Wow.... i remebered the password to my old old old account. Man i was such a noob back then

BenDstraw
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 03:15
yeah but such a big project deserves high dpi

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Mucky Muck Ninja
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 03:59
You wouldn't even be able to see half of the image at once lol, I think thats a little overkill. Maybe i misunderstood tho.

''From now on we will travel in TUBES!'' ~Tenacious D
"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes."
~ Douglas Adams
BenDstraw
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 04:15
we would render it to that then resize it to 1024 x 768 the high render size is there for detail then resizing it down to viewable size would keep all those details just smaller i think thats what he meant!

God modelled man in his own reference image.
dark coder
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 04:41
if i wasnt rendering it all on the viewport at the same time(hiding objects) then i could easily render 10mil+ polys.

and yeah i think having one side evil and one side good would be a great idea, youd have to make a plan of every building tho, and people pick buildings to make from the big map.

and i think that rendering it big is a good idea as you could scroll across the image and see all the various houses and whats going on there, and this wouldent be possible on a 1024*768 image.

Halowed are the ori.
Uncle Sam
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 05:03
If anyone needs a fast comp to render the final image, I guess I could do it.

--------------
Uncle Sam
Mike Inel
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 05:07 Edited at: 20th Feb 2006 05:38
Wow, that'll be interesting... I might join...
But I have a question, what's the genre? I suggest the happy side is a bit fantasy and the chaotic side would be a bit modern or mechanical... (Just like in RF Online http://www.codemasters.com/rfonline/index.php?territory=EnglishUSA, Cora is the fantasy, Belatto is in between, and Accretia is the mechanical...)

All projects have been cancelled due to some important matters (darn it!) but "The mask of Zorah" is still continued...
BenDstraw
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 07:35
thats what i was gettin at mach lol. and the idea of picking out the building is a good one all we need is a concept artist to realize that map then were set.

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 20:36
Good ideas people
the idea of a 11,000 x 11,000 pixels would be to fit as much of the detial as we could in, and well with flash I'm sure someone would be able to make a player that will let you browse the window and zoom in to parts.

Good idea Mach

Quote: "If anyone needs a fast comp to render the final image, I guess I could do it"


These would depend on your app and how well you can use it, simply because we will want a nice looking render, as you would find with powerful tools

BenDstraw
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 20:50
if anyone wants to be responisble for holding the scene. post your machine specs and your best app and maybe a picture of something you rendered that would show your skill in that apps rendering.

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 20:56
I would, howover C4D CE 6 doesn't export above 640x480 unless I use a screen render, but that will only take up the window size. And TrueSpace 5 isn't very stable on this system, plus I'm not a huge fan of using it for rendering

dark coder
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 21:02
2x 7800gtx`s
amd athlon x2 4400+
2gig ram
2x200gig hhd`s

app:max8,

i dont have any exactly amazing renders to show as i mainly do lowpoly work, but if you look at my entry to the improvement contest that had some basic lights and materials, using mental ray im capable of using various maps, shaders, global illumination, caustics, volumetric lighting/fog, particles etc etc.

also if we are to use some universal format i would suggest the .obj format as its supported by most modellers i know of and it saves smoothing groups/normals correctly whereas .3ds seems to be rather iffy.

Halowed are the ori.
Mucky Muck Ninja
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 21:21
iMac G5
1.8 GHz PowerPC G5
512 MB RAM
Nvidia FX 5200

Some of my best:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v440/MasterChief54924/ACRender4.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v440/MasterChief54924/550PorscheIcon.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v440/MasterChief54924/BuggyRender6.jpg

''From now on we will travel in TUBES!'' ~Tenacious D
"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes."
~ Douglas Adams
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 21:25
Personally I would go for DC, but Oooga is just as capable with his renderer, however, DC has one powerful piece of hardware that will cut down on the render time (as the image size would take ages to render) as ram is a big factor in rendering, having 4 times as much ram than Ooga is a bonus, even if he is using a Mac

But its up to you lot as well

dark coder
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Posted: 20th Feb 2006 21:29
well i dont see why we cant have multiple people doing there own versions, or would the poeoples renders who dont get used get annoyed as setting up thousands of materials and render properties would take tonnes of work :p.

Halowed are the ori.
BenDstraw
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 02:29
well i thought one person would be better cause we need a single final product that comes from all of us working on it.

God modelled man in his own reference image.
greenlig
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 02:46
I have a small issue though, I use a LOT of shaders for my models, and I dont know a way to get Blender materials into MAX if thats what were using to render. Textures dont do enough justice.

Any ideas?

I'm all for this.

Aust. Convention...get there!! http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=38799&b=2&p=1
BenDstraw
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 04:32
well the person who will be incharge of the rendering will be incharge of the shaders. unless anyone else knows a way.

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Mucky Muck Ninja
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 06:25
I think before we spend a lot of time deciding whos gonna render it we should actually make something to be rendered. :p

''From now on we will travel in TUBES!'' ~Tenacious D
"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes."
~ Douglas Adams
dark coder
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 06:51 Edited at: 21st Feb 2006 07:18
well we need someone to make a big sketch or something of the whole design of all the buildings and things that are happening, which would probably take alot of time and community input so we have time to tank about the small things :p.

@greenling, when you say alot of shaders can you elaborate as to what they do.

Halowed are the ori.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 18:04
We should apply positions to each other, and consider the expertise of the person.

Of course the person who holds the scene is in charge of rendering and shaders and can pick and choose what to model. If we use shaders, I'm sure it won't be to hard to make the same result in another app, as long as colour measurements are the same or are easy to calculate (Like those who use % and other who use numbers up to 255 for colours would be easy to work out)


Quote: "I think before we spend a lot of time deciding whos gonna render it we should actually make something to be rendered. :p"


Yup

Well, ideas is the first step, lets see what people want to put into the scene, I mostly intend to work on the dark side, using some of my poetry as ideas for whats going on.
If anyone wants to use any as idea builders, then I got some on this website -> http://seppuku05.deviantart.com

I'm not a good drawer, so any concepts will be written or very crude.

And once final concepts are figured out, those who have nothing to do can start, firstly lets get those ideas

Oolite
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 19:10
ok this sounds fun (only had a browse through)

my site is totally outdated but i have a lot of work on my blog site,
[href]spaces.msn.com/eedam[/href]

i recommend 3000x3000, that way its big enough for a decent print size and its viewable on every screen.

i'm a max man, i do recommend OBJ, keeps UVW coordinates, and more or less everything supports it, 3ds is too messy between apps (especially between c4d and max, which sepp can vouch for)

Well, if you look at my portfolio i can model characters cars, low poly high poly, i can UVW Unwrap and i can texture pretty well, but its one of my weak points, I can also Rig, which we might need because you don't want to model a character in a pose and then realise it looks wrong and then its pretty difficult to get it into a different pose.
I like the idea of the cityscape with different things going on, then we could have "teams", that work on different areas of the picture.

You might want to make a timeline when it gets more into swing, set deadlines and make sure people stick to them, then your not waiting for one section to be done, and whoever is rendering should try and render in passes, to keep render time down.


And you don't need shaders, you can acheive just as much with the proper material knowledge (i'm talking max wise)

sorry if i went over things already mentioned

Back from the dead...again!
Mucky Muck Ninja
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 19:36
I think greenlig was just calling the blender materials shaders lol.
This all sounds good, im not much of a drawer either so ill have to wait until we have some concept before modelling. We should definately have some rusty machinery on the dark side though

''From now on we will travel in TUBES!'' ~Tenacious D
"It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes."
~ Douglas Adams
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 19:48
3ds is a pain I agree, but does .obj keep the texture as well, never was sure if my problem was the uv program or the file format that didn't keep the textures attached to

Oolite
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 19:57
nah obj is pretty much perfect for textures, ZBrush to Max and vice versa is always perfect, 2 million odd polygons in obj format is about 20mb, i'm pretty sure it will be more in 3ds, there are some certain parameters to tick when exporting to obj.

It stores all the correct UVW Unwrap info, but you have to apply the modifier on after the import if you wish to see the final UVW. but otherwise you can just apply the textures and it works fine.

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 21:04
Oh ryt, kewl, well then we use .obj

Oolite
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 22:31
if everyone agrees, although if we are going to rig things, then we need to export... FBX, which to my knowledge, max,maya and motionbuilder do

Anyone know of any file formats that support skinning and rig info?

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 22:45
Doubt we'll need a rig as it is a still, but if we're using Dark Coder's pc to render, then we have 3DS max on there, but surely you could export the model in the need position with out the bones/rigging

BenDstraw
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Posted: 21st Feb 2006 23:28
posing with bones and ik solvers in max wouldnt be a problem we dont need the animations thats all.

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Oolite
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2006 11:19
yeah you can bake the pose down into the mesh before you export, it would be nice to have them rigged, saves staying unhappy with one pose or redoing it..

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BenDstraw
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2006 05:47
so im sure dark coder is the candidate for the render but that will for sure be arranged at the time of its need. now we need a concept artist. id say anyone should just start posting up drawings of there concepts just so we can get some ideas floating. ill get some posted tomorrow cause right now im going to bed

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2006 12:27
Yeah, I'll try and get some concept art drawn up, I already am having ideas for certian parts

BenDstraw
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Posted: 27th Feb 2006 03:31
hey sepp hows that search been going. cause if we cant find an concept artist we could all just submit drawings!

God modelled man in his own reference image.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 7th Mar 2006 18:52
Sorry, didn't notice I had a reply No concept art really, having a lot of work on my hands at the moment.
However I have some good news (well goods news on this end) the 3DW community project has quit (Shame there was nice work) Jim Thacker/Judex (Forum admin/Magazine editor for 3DW) is keeping the 3DW topic open for 3 months to see if people want it still open if peoples material is useful. And I thought, maybe I could ask him to allow this project to take up that space, that way we can get extra artists, meaning concept artists too, however the experience of modellers over at 3DW may outweigh our experience, but it will be a big render, so it won't matter so much.

I will post a request, however I would suggest more input.

The link is here.
http://forum.3dworldmag.com/viewtopic.php?t=7729

If we get into it more than the last lot, then there could be a chance to get into the magazine, even if it is as part of the 'from the forums' section

I will post, but its up to you lot if its a good idea, I can easily turn them down.

BenDstraw
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Posted: 8th Mar 2006 14:27
that sounds great like a double community project sounds interesting i just hope people here are interested as well.

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 8th Mar 2006 17:55
yeah, I think they're turning the thread into a Team Request sort of forum now, I'll see what happens and keep you guys updated with changes until we can post there

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 9th Mar 2006 00:07
I also must add, John-S has been suggesting that the leader of the project should make a post with the concept plus progress onto the Community project forum, a couple of people want to get rid of the topic, but he said if the leader of the project would post and if he posted his project, and maybe a little outside support, then it would show that keeping the forum is a good idea, but of course we will need to come up with some stuff

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