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Les Horribres

19

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Joined: 20th Nov 2005

Location: My Name is... Merry

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 08:36

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Of scripting.

First, Let me introduce myself. I am Merranvo and I have been with this community for quite sometime, ignore my join date for it is decieving. I was here when the scripting section was but 2 pages long and was a massive yard of questions and few answers.

That is what I changed. Having a background in programming and having read the uses and functions of the script commands/conditions I managed to figure out many solutions to problems people had dissmissed as impossible. I devised numerious ways to use scripting to peoples advantage. To make it do what it was not intended to do.

In that period scripting flourished like wildfire. There were few people doing it (I remember jasuk in particular) but there were more people interested in what could be done. With every answer I gave I also provided support for people to learn scripting. And pretty soon people started to learn. BOOOM.

Scripts began flooding in, from simple modifications to existing scripts, to Hud Changers. It was this time that I released the jetpack script in lieu of monsters release. People questioned how it worked and I explained and scripting still thrived.

However shortly after that it has died down, less people care about getting something scripted and prefer to concentrate on models or media. This message is about those who still care. Many people might have given up on scripting, yet there are some who are still trying to find something unique, different. (me excluded... I just make what is asked for) sometimes ideas pop-up that might be able to be done but due to peoples lack of intrest, they die out.

In a recent thread about another newly scripted medic a person claimed that 95% of all people who view a script use it. I would like to say that it is my belief that that number is closer to 30%. The reason is very appearnt.

It is in my oppionon that people are now expecting MORE out of scripting then they have before. It isn't that the way it is done currently is bad, it is that they believe that all scripts should exibit a sort of professionalism where they are perfect. It feels like people are wanting pro games instead of indi games and that the scripts being made are too indi for their games.

What I am saying is simple, enjoy FPSC, play with it. But don't be so serious, we may be game makers, but this professionalism hurts those who just want to have fun. Even if you think a script is crap, praise the maker and give him advice, scripting is still not fully discovered, there are many things we can do with it... but as long as we pass off the little stuff you can not expect any big stuff to come along.

This has been a message by your local Anti-Mod Merranvo (Private Joke), have a nice day.

Your Mod was deleted by the Government.

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Bloodeath 6 6 6

19

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Joined: 5th Nov 2005

Location: Sierra vista in indonesia

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 10:49

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uhm make me a shorter version of all this...im not gonna read all that

Whats a fps without the blood,guts,death,khaos,and disorder?

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Benjamin A

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Joined: 31st Oct 2005

Location: The Netherlands

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 13:26

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Quote: "uhm make me a shorter version of all this...im not gonna read all that"

It's not even worth reading..... Sorry to say so, but it seems like Merranvo misses the past when the whole fpsc world was revolving around him.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.

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brummel

18

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Joined: 26th Nov 2005

Location: Sweden

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 13:32 Edited at: 19th Jul 2006 13:40

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Well said Merranvo.

Well, what can i say? Its the hard truth. IMO you cant make a good game without scripting. Sure, you may have the best of models, yeah, but some things cant be made by modelling. The game i am working on now could never have been done without scripting, and neither could Conjured Entertainments game have been(i mean his unfinishd project Nirvana).

However scripting isnt hard to learn, i even think its fun to script. So everyone who cant script should make it a try.

*EDIT*

Quote: "it seems like Merranvo misses the past when the whole fpsc world was revolving around him."

No, i dont think this is about nostalgia. Its more about the underestimated power of scripting.

Peace out

Dont forget to visit my website for scripts!

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xplosys

18

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Joined: 5th Jan 2006

Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 16:14 Edited at: 19th Jul 2006 16:24

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Quote: "However scripting isnt hard to learn, i even think its fun to script. So everyone who cant script should make it a try."

I agree that scripting can make or break a game The problem with .fpi script is it's total lack of documentation. The very nature of FPSC negates the need for scripting, in that it handles everything for you.

Some have written tutorials on scripting, but they are very limited and tend to cover one task in particular, without any explanations of WHY you write this or that. Therefore, people copy what scripts are useful to them and disregard the rest, not trying to work with a language they can not understand.

Others always answer with something like "It's possible with scripting, and then leave a few lines of code with no description or explanation like "Oh yeah... that clears everything up. Why didn't I think of that."

IMO, all scripting I have seen seems to be a matter of trial and error. "This worked for me." Nothing is written down or explained properly. When someone documents the language, we will see more people scripting. If I knew more about it I would try to do it myself, but I am fumbling through it like most people here. I take an existing script and work with it until I get the results I need. A long and tedious process to say the least.

BTW: This is not to take away from those who have taken the time to write scripting tutorials and help others with scripting. (Merranvo, BULLSHOCK 2 , uman, etc... too many to list). I for one appreciate it. We just need something to take us from the basics up if we are to learn to do it ourselves.

Crazy Grandpa

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HandK

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Joined: 24th Jun 2006

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Posted: 19th Jul 2006 16:47

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I agree that scripting is an important part of any finished game.
I also agree though that the plug and play nature of FPSC, means that I "expect" the scripts to do what they say, and there to be lots of them

The main problem as I see it to the issue of lack of interest with scripting, is that if you want a script you "Imagine" it already exists. Now with models this isn't so. You hope it exists. But if it doesn't, (Say when you want a British Redcoat), you are not surprised.

With scripting, no matter what it is, you imagine that FPSC should come with it. Or if not, that its easily obtainable.
Lets take the Jet pack script. When I found that there wasn't one with FPSC.I assumed that this was because it was impossible within FPSC.
So when I discovered it on here, my first reaction wasn't,
"Wow how did they do that", but rather
"Why wasn't that included in the first place"

I probably wouldn't have thought this, if FPSC actually came with a script editor.
I had assumed, NO editor = No need to edit = All scripts I need are here.

When I looked at how few scripts there were, and worse how they are not described properly, I popped over to the forums to see what was about.
And here is the second problem.

Practically every time I wanted a script, it either already existed, or was publicly declared undoable.
And the times it was neither, I couldn't do it myself, because I hadn't been practising doing all the easy ones, that you need to do to know what you are doing.

1) Either FPSC 1.1 (or whatever) is shipped with a script editor or
2) FPSC 1.1 Is shipped with a million more scripts.

@xplosys ,

I agree about the tutorials, (well last time I looked), a proper tutorial should, list all the tools you need, and teach you the concept of scripting, not just here's how you do this.

I for one, am totally rubbish at media content, and feel I add nothing the FPSC community.

So if you post a good tutorial, I will

1) Call your Master xplosys on all my posts
2) Change my location to Under the tutelage of Master xplosys
3) End all my posts in the script forums with But this needs to be checked by Master xplosys

H&K

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Conjured Entertainment

AGK Developer

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Joined: 12th Sep 2005

Location: Nirvana

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 17:08 Edited at: 19th Jul 2006 17:12

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Quote: "Even if you think a script is crap, praise the maker and give him advice"

I never thought I would here you say that.
When I first started out scripting, you used to rag on every script I posted.
You were the first person to tell me how noobish it was.

Quote: "It's not even worth reading..... Sorry to say so, but it seems like Merranvo misses the past when the whole fpsc world was revolving around him."

I remember those days, because it's when I first started out.
He's not the only one who misses the old days.
Back then everything needed to be scripted, but now everything has been done.
That's why is fading out, because so many popular demands are taken care of already.
I have been too busy with school and work to do any scripting lately.

Its been awhile for me, but here is a list of what I can remember working on...

Complete:

Jetpack

Death Cards

Suicide Bomber

Sliding Platforms

Multi Track Radio

Colored Glasses

Night Vision Glasses

Flashlight (LightRay)

Combination Lock

Incomplete:
___Allies
___Melee
___Hovercraft
___Stationary Guns

When I consider the time I spent on Skybanks and Models and Segments and Music, one thing becomes clear.
The scripts drive the media, but they aren't anything without the media to be driven.
Whether you are writing scripts or modeling a dragon, it's all good.

Yep, those were the good ol' days. (about a year ago?)
Time restraints are my major hurdle in being creative.
I hope I can make time soon to get back into FPSC proper.

Don't forget to visit Conjured Entertainment

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xplosys

18

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Joined: 5th Jan 2006

Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 19:22 Edited at: 19th Jul 2006 19:36

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@HandK

Yeah, I wish I could write the definitive tut, but as I said. I'm pretty much lost myself.

@Conjured Entertainment

I can't believe I didn't mention you. You helped with some of my first script issues.

BTW: Props to those who worked on http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/FPI_Script

Crazy Grandpa

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SpyDaniel

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Joined: 4th Feb 2006

Location: United Kingdom

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 20:29

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Melee has been done, I have done it and others have, its nothing more than changing the range of the weapon.

Your signature has been erased by a mod

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xplosys

18

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Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 22:36

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Higgins, that gives me an idea.

Can we add melee animations to the existing weapons, and use them when ammo runs out?

Crazy Grandpa

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Les Horribres

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Joined: 20th Nov 2005

Location: My Name is... Merry

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 23:10 Edited at: 20th Jul 2006 00:43

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@xplosys: I unfortunatly have to say that I have no clue how to script.... I just do, it is like in a game of frisbee, you learn how to throw it to get to the other person... but you can't explain how. You can demonstrate, but explaining the complex mathematics of throwing a frisbee is beyond your capabilities. (I appologise if you are a mathematician).

In my case, I just KNOW how do to do somthing. It is very hard to explain my thought process because I don't understand it myself. And the issue is that knowing what needs to be done is one of the biggest parts of scripting. I can explain how scripts work to a certain point, but explaining how to project your ideas into a form such as that... it is very very hard.

Quote: "or was publicly declared undoable."

And I wish people would stop doing that. Say "I don't think it can be done" or "no one has done it yet". I remember

Quote: "I never thought I would here you say that.
When I first started out scripting, you used to rag on every script I posted.
You were the first person to tell me how noobish it was."

Yes I did, but I also gave personal insights into it. The difference between then and now is that the insane superioristic part of me brought about from the scripting craze has signifigantly died down, and that now the amount of people scripting has also. Even if you say something negitive it is better then looking at the thread and thinkg "the same old crap". One of the things limiting scripting is the fact that people are not encouraged to do so anymore. And their work is often ignored or never seen. Oppionons matter, they change what the world is like and how we live in it.

I agree that many demands have been met, but there are so many more that have not. You could do an arrangment to have a useable keypad, for one. No one requests it because they don't think about such a thing anymore. Either because they are content with what they have, or believe that it is impossible.

The impossible is a limit set by those who do not understand, defy that limit and reach heights never seen before.

Quote: "uhm make me a shorter version of all this...im not gonna read all that"

It took me 30 min to write that, it will take you 3 min to read it.

BenA... a person can not truthfully say that they walked away from power willingly. So sure, I am lustful for the reign I once held. But it is not I that will be leading it. There are quite a few old members who still posses the power of scriping and a few promising new ones.

If you read carefully you would see that I asked for support for scripting. Not for myself, the time which I was a 'god' is long over, to seek power like that again would need more then a resurection of scripting, but a firm totatlitarian rule over this minisociety.

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xplosys

18

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Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games

Posted: 19th Jul 2006 23:29

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Quote: "It is very hard to explain my thought process because I don't understand it myself."

lol. Yeah, I figured out what was causing that and quit it some years ago, but there has been some lasting affect to my memory, it would seem.

Anyway, I completely understand about just knowing something. It's just too bad we don't have any more information than we do about the language. Some of it is straight forward and self explanatory, and some of it seems to be contradictory or make no sense at all. Things that should obviously work don't, and things that should not do. I'm sure in time we will learn.

Crazy Grandpa

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Les Horribres

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Joined: 20th Nov 2005

Location: My Name is... Merry

Posted: 20th Jul 2006 00:44

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Quote: "lol. Yeah, I figured out what was causing that and quit it some years ago, but there has been some lasting affect to my memory, it would seem."

Yes... it's the women, allways needing so much when you have so little to give.

(no offense)

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Bloodeath 6 6 6

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Posted: 20th Jul 2006 06:59

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anyone can explane how to throw a frisbe...
extend your arm to about an 85 degree *or 90* so that your arm is right infront of you and snap your wrist before its straight infront of the other frisbe'er

Whats a fps without the blood,guts,death,khaos,and disorder?

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Les Horribres

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Posted: 20th Jul 2006 07:40

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Uhh... that is mini math. And at 90 deg the frisbee falls back down on you?

No, there are mabey a hundred or so mathematical calculations involved in throwing a frisbee, and further more, some of those calculations are automatically preformed by you in your subconscience. I really don't wish to read up on my areodynamics at 1:00AM but I know that the enviromental conditions such as viscosity (what is the renolyds number?) or velocity of the air affects how you throw a frisbee. You naturally adapt to the situation and many don't even realize that they did.

As I said before I use to be an expert grenade thrower in Halo, never managed to succeed with long range pegging, but allways had it right below the person. I can't explain how I managed to do that, I can only tell you that I did.

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