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Geek Culture / Pros

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ClearCoder
21
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Joined: 27th Feb 2003
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 25th Apr 2003 17:21
What software do the proffesionals use to:
program
model
and stuff like that...
Newbie Now; Expert Later
Current project: Bomber Blitz Final
http://www26.brinkster.com/dudemansoftware/12.bmp
actarus
22
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Posted: 25th Apr 2003 17:41
They either build it or use Maya...Although 3d sutdio Max is one of the most used also...Still there are lots of high-end products which're use worldwide a few others could be MH's Animation Master,Softimage or Mirai.

An example would be JK2:JediOutcast for which they've used 3dsMax for inanimate objects and Maya for characters.

Caught by the Fuzz,well I was,still on my buzz
In the back of the Van,with my,head in my hands
bitJericho
22
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Location: United States
Posted: 26th Apr 2003 03:19
program: generally some from of c

The 3D Modeler's Group : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/3dModeler/
The Unofficial DB Newsgroup : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DBMag/
large_nostril
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Location: United States
Posted: 26th Apr 2003 07:55
Lightwave 7, Houdini 3D, and SoftImage XSI are used by both the gaming industry and movie industry for 3D modelling. Maya is used a lot by companies to make basic characters and then are 'finished' up in something a little more up to par.

For the programming itself, it is done in some form or another of C/C++.

For 2D graphics, PaintShopPro and Adobe PhotoShop are often favoured.

I guess that pretty much covers the basics. As for sound effects, music, and other digital recordings I don't know what the prefered software/equipment is.

Just as a note, Houdini is a great program that isn't recognized much in the 'individual gaming' sector. Houdini was used for movies like "Lord of the Rings", "Pearl harbor", "Harry Potter", "How the Grinch Stole Christmas", "X-Men", "Hollow Man", and I think "The Matrix" as well. However, I was told (and I can't validate this), that Houdini doesn't run on any WinOS except NTs. Although, Houdini isn't used as powerful a modeller as something like SoftImage, it has far superior graphic routines.

I think Capcom, Konami, and EA use SoftImage. I believe it was also used in making "Spy Kids", "The Hulk", and "AniMatrix". I also heard it was used to make Shinobi, man that game kicked arse.

If you want fresh underwear in the morning, take it off the night before.
Shadow Robert
22
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Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 26th Apr 2003 09:49
Houdini didn't do LOTR nor Pearl Harbour nor Harry Potter nor Xmen... all of those were done using SoftImage 3D or XSI

The Matrix, Matrix: Reloaded have been done with Maya, PhotoShop & AfterEffects.

as i've not even heard of Houdini, let alone seen it in action along with the titles you've just tried to associate with it - my guess is it isn't a program at all but a plugin to enhance SoftImage.

Quote: "I think Capcom, Konami, and EA use SoftImage"


has gotta be probably THE MOST STUPID COMMENT i've heard in my life !!! and my whole bloody family is blonde!
not every company within EA uses Softimage, infact you find me a single bloody company within EA which does ... they all use either 3D Studio Max or Maya.

sometimes you people are so stupid ya'll believe any old crap your fed and feed it onto other people

Professionally used Game Modellers ->
3D Studio Max & Maya

to a smaller degree Lightwave, trueSpace, Softimage XSI & Industrial Magic (Pixal) are also used

the only 2D Art package you will see in every single games development office is Photoshop - you won't see Paintshop Pro, not sure where you got that deluded idea from ... but the program is just not used in a professional capacity within the Games or Cinematic industries. Main reasons being is that it isn't powerful enough and doesn't interact with any of the 3D Software they use, suchas 3DS Max or Maya.

for animation Animation Master or Puppeteer are used quite widely... however Messiah:Animator is also becomming a very popular program.

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
ClearCoder
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 26th Apr 2003 19:02
so if want to program when i am older it looks like i'll have to learn C/C++. Are C and Dark basic similar at all.
seeya
dudeman

Newbie Now; Expert Later
Current project: Bomber Blitz Final
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lcfcfan
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Location: North East, UK
Posted: 26th Apr 2003 20:01 Edited at: 26th Apr 2003 20:02
You haven't heard of houdini its one of the best 3d programs in the world i'm not sure how many films its been used in but i know they used it for blade 2, visit http://www.sidefx.com and try out the apprentice edition it's cool, houdini does run on other os versions than NT i did have the apprentice edition installed on xp, i think photoshop is great but for those who can't afford it paint shop pro is ok i have done a few skins for game models with it.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 26th Apr 2003 20:28
ya morons... the actual program used by everyone for that IS a plugin for others.
just downloaded the actual program itself - all i can say is thank god it is a plugin. I'd hardly call it the best 3D program around, its very far from it.

i'm gonna see about getting the plugins see how they fair, but the rendering capabilities aren't even upto Max standards - the modeling is truely awkard and far to basic - the animation is no different to any other program and i'd still use Maya, SoftImage or AM over it anyday - hell i'd even use Max over that.
As for the effects, the blending of the Post effects with the current development is a nice feature - but its no different that having AfterEffects pluged into Max4/5, Maya or SoftImage XSI.

as for the reviewed links, there are alot of contradictions on there of inteveiws of people who say they've used Houdini for things - yet from what i know, these people are neither the main CG/Graphics Engineers on these projects ... nor do the companies they claim are using them have any official release about using these programs (the one about Squaresoft specifically is amusing as they ONLY use Maya and even during the interveiw they mention what they're using which is only Maya compatible)
There was also alot of words taken for granted which were not said!
From the ghist of all of the "Reveiws" made, it seems like they're trying to make it sound as if these people are 100% endorsing the program when they're not.

personally i'd be a little more than piss'd if some company decided to quote me in such a way. If the product is actually good there is no reason to quote people in such a fashion.

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
Arrow
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Posted: 26th Apr 2003 20:45
Quote: "Are C and Dark basic similar at all"
Um, no. DB is a form of Basic, the to are very different.

The Legend of Zelda IS NOT an RPG! It's an Adventure, just like Ico or Dark Cloud.
lcfcfan
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 04:36 Edited at: 27th Apr 2003 04:41
Houdini is not a plug in it's a full 3d app i have it my self and lots of big development companies use it, just look around the net you will find reviews on it http://www.cgfocus.com/NewsDetails.cfm?NewsID=459 cos you can't really play around with it for 30 mins and say its crap you have to test it properley to see what an excellent program it is also try http://www.3dbuzz.com i think they have some info on it and fantastic arts too
http://www.fantasticarts.com/reviews/houdini4.htm.

QuothTheRaven
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 05:10
Houdini is dying fast....Maya has pretty much dominated the movie industry (Harry Potter, Matrix, LOTR (which also used many in house plugins like Grunt), if you're making a movie, it looks like Maya is going to be your choice. If you're making a game, use Max, because not only is it MUCH easier to use (especially interface wise), MUCH cheaper, but Maya is a nurbs program, always has been always will be. you can't make a game with nurbs...ever...

Darken the skies, we are god
http://www.DelvarWorld.com
QuothTheRaven
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 05:12
of course, if you're on these web boards and are using maya or max, chances are you pirated them. And that's bad bad. But maybe not, I use max at school...pirating is very very bad!

Darken the skies, we are god
http://www.DelvarWorld.com
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 07:34
Icf... i could tell from the second i opened it the program was a Maya Clone - i've used it a little more, and i see it as a clone which doesn't have as many features.

Houdini is a selection of plugins for Maya/SoftImage/Pixal as well as a studio of programs designed to interact with each other at different degrees based on what you wish to be working on at the time.

i read very carefully all the reviews, i've used the blasted thing, and i've seen all the of the so-called praises.
to me it seems like a mediocre product trying to bid its way to something worth being in the spot light ... all of its associations are more often than not through this plugin series which is mostly about the rendering and particle capabilities which only Combustion2 can match blow for blow - yet it uses Renderman which was designed for use with only Maya (and still is a Maya only program) which begs towards the question is this really a new program on its own right or just another licence clone of Maya itself?

Softimage was a clone of Maya, however atleast they've had the balls to change it's setup and features to match thier market... Houdini to me seems like its trying to be everything and failing at it all!

as i've said, if this product was half as good as you two have noted - then surely i'd also be signing its praises and also they wouldn't have to resort to twisted truths for thier recommendations and glowing reveiws would they?

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
Arrow
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 07:42
Last I checked, Maya was cheaper than Max by around $1,000.

The Legend of Zelda IS NOT an RPG! It's an Adventure, just like Ico or Dark Cloud.
QuothTheRaven
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 08:36
Last time I checked Max was $1,000 and Maya was the price of a small car. But then again I've been a Max user my whole life and wouldn't trade Discreet in for the world.

Let's see how many 3d program I can name (not like Terragen or plugins, the ones you buy)! Just because...
3ds Max, Maya (Harry Potter was Maya), Lightwave, Teddy, Poser, 3dmm, Bryce, Softimage XL, Cinema 4D XL, TrueSpace, Swift 3D, Icy Grape (used to make Photoshop into a paint tool for 3d geometry [which is what was used to make Pearl Harbor, btw, that and Dusty and Mercury in house]), AutoCAD (I use it a lot actually), Houdini (it is standalone), Rhino 3D, Shake, MojoWorld, SketchUp, MotionBuilder, Vue d'Espirit, Blender, Carrara, Amapi, Realsoft 3D, Amorphium, Max F/X, form-Z, Illustrator, Plant Studio...

missing anything? I sure hope not...

Darken the skies, we are god
http://www.DelvarWorld.com
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 20:25
Max5 is $3,200 - Maya5 is $6,999
but if you throw in Combustion and MentalRay into Max's price just to be on an even footing and they're around the same price

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
David T
Retired Moderator
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 20:25
Quote: "Quote:

I think Capcom, Konami, and EA use SoftImage


has gotta be probably THE MOST STUPID COMMENT i've heard in my life !!! and my whole bloody family is blonde!"


Nintendo use Softimage on NEC computers It was in an NEC ad.

You are the th person to view this signature.
Programmers don't die, they just Gosub without return....
lcfcfan
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Posted: 27th Apr 2003 22:14
Thats fair enough if thats your opinion raven but i really like it and if it was cheaper then it would definatly be worth buying over something like max or lightwave.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 28th Apr 2003 00:55
fair enough dave your right that is possibly a more stupid comment
i'm surprised they weren't sued for false advertisment.

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
large_nostril
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Posted: 28th Apr 2003 09:17
First you denounce our claims of Houdini being a good program when you don't even realize that it is a standalone program, then you go on about how terrible it is. It is quite obvious that you have not the slightest clue of what you rant, you unwelcome deal of putrid buzzard barf.

Pardon my French, but you sir, are an idiot.

http://www.creativepro.com/story/news/15676.html

"my whole bloody family is blonde!"
Well that sure explains a lot you god-awful bucket of grimy bat guano.

Considering you ramble on about a single sentence in which I made it perfectly clear that it was not a damn fact, your query seems to be nothing more than a pitiable mound of sun-ripened dingo's kindeys.

To you I say, you are an inept assortment of crusty donkey droppings.

If you want fresh underwear in the morning, take it off the night before.
indi
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Posted: 28th Apr 2003 09:32
sun-ripened dingo's kindeys mmmmmm

hehe

I think you all have your favorites and opinions but yes try to be a little more objective in replies, even if your target audience may not like it nor adhere to your advice.



At least your insults are unique and colourfull

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 28th Apr 2003 09:58
nostril do your own freakin' homework on what you're trying to panda too... its a studio of 6 programs collectively known as houdini, however there are also is "an SDK including a Plugin's Library for Professional developers of Softimage, 3D Studio Max and Maya which will extend the current capabilities of your current program of choice..."

and you'll find all the programs that they're glowing about on the website are form professionals using these plugins... non of which really 100% contribute to using a new program.
It's like ChilliSkinner for Max3/4 - it could be lived without and although does add something, i'm hardly gonna sit here and say "Oh ChilliSkinner is an awesome skinning program that has been used on Command&Conqure Generals, Primal, Elite4, etc..."
and then have someone like Athoney Leiman go "yeah i've used it and i find it very helpful" adding to the end "if you can't gather, everyone at Genome Software thinks that ChilliSkinner is great and simple to use!"

i used the bloody thing and it is a ripp on Maya, nothing more nothing less ... i'd probably recommend it to moron's who don't have the braincells to strum together to actually use Maya - but then god knows why you'd want to.
It's stupid that the render's done in it for films were done with Maya or Softimage scenes using Renderman (which you can quite easily do in Maya itself) just so that they could export and edit in Photoshop easier. As i've noted the only thing i fell that this product is actually good at is the particles setup and rendering, but even then it lacks the essentially need animation physics that the others push to make it truely realisitic and life like effects which cna interact with scene in layers (which Houdini isn't capable of, to me this is a fatal bloody flaw) ... infact the only worth while work was by using it in tadam with another program which was setup for these things.

i truely dislike unoriginal clone, i truely hate companies that need to play on peoples words to make them sound good, and lastly i'd bloody pick Max over this for my modeling and rendering needs ... and that is certianly bloody saying something because i'm not exactly Max's biggest fan either.

look aroud the whole community for this product, its all about making the users feel good that they choose to use it over the other packages... you don't see the Mayan community going around "Oh this is the best, we've got a handful of pro's to say something to that effect - you're using the best program!"

infact you look around thier site and Alias|Wavefront will recommend you for certain aspects towards Softimage XSI - the same is visa-versa. if you truely believe that this is some amazing software studio then i feel sorry for you ... however the praises i see arn't comming from the artists of this community!

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
lcfcfan
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Posted: 28th Apr 2003 22:26
Thats a bit harsh raven i would hardly call it a maya clone as it has been around for nearly 10 years now, also i havent been going round saying it's the best program ever i just really like it it's a matter of opinion for example some people liked halo on xbox i thought it was shit but the people who do use this program like it because it is a good program might be dodgy looking and difficult to get hold of at first but the people who take the time to learn how to use it properley see what an excellent program it really is.

large_nostril
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Posted: 29th Apr 2003 03:48
"At least your insults are unique and colourfull"
Thank you. I try to divagate from vapid and subfusc insults such which become demeaning even to the author such as "ya morons".

Raven, its quite apparent that you did not actually read my first post before you started rambling.
When, exactly, did I ever praised Houdini as the best? I merely said, "Houdini is a great program that isn't recognized much in the 'individual gaming' sector."

"i'd bloody pick Max over this for my modeling and rendering needs"
Yeah, about that, I couldn't have stated more denude that Houdini is used for modeling in a professional stature, but for it's special effects.
Quote: "Although, Houdini isn't used as powerful a modeler as something like SoftImage, it has far superior graphic routines."


If you want fresh underwear in the morning, take it off the night before.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 29th Apr 2003 06:31
nostril check the site, thats not what its being billed as ... and certainly not what you guys have billed it as here niether.

you can't compare the products on all issues then say - oh but its for special effects. if you think that then i'm wondering if you've even tried the bloody thing ... it is quite obvious it was designed for FAR more than just effects.

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
large_nostril
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Posted: 30th Apr 2003 06:33
(First matter, sorry dudeman for gettin this so off track. Some people just don't know when they are so incredibly wrong and would choose to argue over a matter to which they haven't the slightest clue.)

"it is quite obvious it was designed for FAR more than just effects"
No? Really? And here I was thinking it only had a single function as a special effects library. Now I guess I had got to be off to go and re-evaluate my existence as a multi-compounded carbon-based life form.

Oh yes, you really should stay consistent with your stories. Especially when you're trying to remove them from the lubricious orifice of a donkey.

"i'm wondering if you've even tried the bloody thing"
Considering I've used Houdini for the past six consecutive months, I too wonder if I have even tried the bloody thing. And to which "bloody thing" do you refer? If it is to be the scab on the sole of my foot, I must go monitor it some more as it doesn't seem to want me to try it.

(And for the very slow witted to which can't even comprehend the simplest of insults, the above consists of mainly sarcastic remarks.)

If you want fresh underwear in the morning, take it off the night before.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 30th Apr 2003 07:19
oh i'm sorry you think that what you have to say would somehow desaude me from my evalation of the product?

you know you need to get the hell over yourself here... explain exactly where my contradictary statments are instead of just trying to insult me here. Just because you're trying to be highbrow about your insults is just pushing for the fact you're being nothing more than a fool who appears to have been sucked in by the self-hype of the product.
i can't see why in any gods name any games developer would touch this program with a 10ft barge pole ... i mean last time i checked a pretty particle system doesn't enable you to do any better or faster high & low poylgon game modeling, UV Mapping or animation.

if you can explain to me how this can then i'm all ears, else cramp something in that big mouth of yours and keep quiet - it is clearly not a product aimed at the games market ... and it doesn't have the sheer depth for the movie industry, i truely can't see a single market being able to use this program as a solo solution which is what it is being benched as - unless somehow i complete missed the point of them trying to attribute this program to every single aspect of the 3D & 2D Artist Industries with high praise from half truth quotes (in true tabloid style might i add) and bare aquiantances...

the more i use this program, the more it truely hate it because all they've done is tried to ripp off all the products they're trying to emulate and they're doing a bloody shit job at it too!

Tsu'va Oni Ni Jyuuko Fiori Sei Tau!
One block follows the suit ... the whole suit of blocks is the path ... what have you found?
large_nostril
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Posted: 1st May 2003 03:46
Fine, fine. Don't get your rectum all in a knot. I'll just leave you to your bodacious opinions.

If you want fresh underwear in the morning, take it off the night before.

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