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FPSC Classic Product Chat / Winners of October's Level Design Competition...and their Levels.

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Benjamin A
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Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 29th Nov 2006 22:24 Edited at: 29th Nov 2006 22:28
Quote: "Edit: It looks like I'll have to do it all over again, as the saved game doesn't stay once I close out the program."


Sorry about that, it was packed with FPSpack and that doesn't work with the new save/load features yet.

Quote: "I think we need a limit on file sizes. This has been discussed a bit before but it is a one level contest. And this will lead to more level optimization."


That depends on what size you're going to limit it too. If you're going to use a number of different segments and a good number of different entities, the level size will go up quickly, there's nothing we can do about it. I do optimize my levels as much as possible, but if you want quality levels, you have use 512x512 textures (or even higher) and that comes at a price. We've seen the quality go up over the months, but also the file sizes have gone up.

I don't want huge file sizes, but the way FPSC is build, it just gives larger file sizes when trying to create quality textures.

If you limit it, we would need to make less use of different segments and entities and that may result in less good looking and diverce games. You basically end up seeing the same segments throughout the level.

With the new theme, Urban, I already can predict that file sizes will go up, especially when people are going to create cool looking urban levels.

@Keith.... I've got one question. I've been considering an Urban style game for the TGC/nVidia competition. I'm not sure if I'm going to get it done on time, since I'm still working on my Commander Josh entry. But if I make it on time, will I be allowed to also enter into this level competition as well as the TGC/nVidia competion?

EDIT: thanks Keith for allowing us some more time to enter, hopefully even more will enter this time, the entries are getting more and more and better and better, it's a challinging competition by now and that's good!

I'm really hoping TGC will step in and donate some prizes also, since this competition has benefited the community and is raising the quality of levels being created and that's good for them also!

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
Luke314pi
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Joined: 11th Apr 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posted: 29th Nov 2006 22:52
Keith, you can put my Horror Accessory Pack up as a prize again next month.

KeithC
Senior Moderator
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Location: Michigan
Posted: 29th Nov 2006 23:03
Quote: "But if I make it on time, will I be allowed to also enter into this level competition as well as the TGC/nVidia competion?"

Absolutely.

@Luke; thanks, I will put it in.

@Bullshock (whenever you read this); I assume ECS Pro is good to go again?

As far as the filesize goes; there was a level this month that was around 300MB. That's what we're talking about. Everybody discuss the file size limit here, and we'll decide on one.

-Keith

Luke314pi
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Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posted: 29th Nov 2006 23:42
Personally, I do not think there should be a file size limit either. If someone has an incredible story to go along with their level that involves an extra 100 MB of video cutscenes, I have no problem with that at all. I don't want creativity to be restricted by file size.

filya
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Joined: 23rd Aug 2006
Location: USA
Posted: 29th Nov 2006 23:44
to be honest, I haven't really tried looking at what takes up the space in the levels.

I have seen .x files to be around 20-30 kb. The .fpe and .fpi files are small 2-3kb text files. So I am assuming that the bulk of the space is taken by image files and the exe.
Obviously much can't be done about the .exe, so it all comes down to texture files.

So to reduce the level size, I guess we have few options :
1. keep texture sizes to 512*512 (or even smaller), but then we sacrifice quality at close range
2. try and reuse textures wherever we can. (mainly on floors and walls)

I guess 150Mb should be good enough for a level.

-- game dev is fun...but taking up too much time --
KeithC
Senior Moderator
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Posted: 29th Nov 2006 23:53
In real game-making (especially games that are downloaded) file size is very important. Remember that people need to spend time and bandwidth downloading your level; they may not do so if its enormous. This is where you have to get creative with your level design; see what you can do with a simple room, then go from there.

I'm thinking a limit between 150-200MB might be the way to go.

-Keith

Benjamin A
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Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 30th Nov 2006 00:05
300Mb for one level is may to much, I agree on that. I've got no problem with 150Mb or so.

The thing with FPSC is that one level can be almost as large as a complete game, especially if you use stuff from one level in another. My original Commander Josh game is about 200Mb for the full game. 15 levels in total. Yet if I do build one level on it's own I'm already around 80Mb. You can have a large level, yet the full game may not be much larger at all.

Quote: "[quote]Quote: "But if I make it on time, will I be allowed to also enter into this level competition as well as the TGC/nVidia competion?""
Absolutely.[/quote]

Thanks Keith!

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
flashing snall
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Location: Boston
Posted: 30th Nov 2006 00:08
man, my level was only about 80 mg i think, i dont even know how to make a 300 mg level!


"these shoes are 300 hundred dollars"-Shoes by Kelly http://smallgroup.be/
Silent Thunder
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Location: The Ship
Posted: 30th Nov 2006 00:10
Quote: "300Mb for one level is may to much, I agree on that. I've got no problem with 150Mb or so."


mine was almost 300mb, but now that wmv and mpg videos work, my game was cut down to about 150mb.

my avi video file alone was 118mb.

RedneckRambo
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Location: Worst state in USA... California
Posted: 30th Nov 2006 00:44
My level was fairly small I think it was like 70mb and the level was extremely short because I didn't think you could make long levels (since my comp is terrible it lags even with a small level)

I actually think a file size limit is smart. a 300mb level is huge.
Quote: "
man, my level was only about 80 mg i think, i dont even know how to make a 300 mg level!"

I don't think I know how either, flashing, lol.

I love butter
FredP
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Posted: 30th Nov 2006 03:14
You can use .wmv files instead of .avi.

Silent Thunder
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Posted: 30th Nov 2006 06:39
Quote: "You can use .wmv files instead of .avi"


lol, yea, i kinda figured that out, after, i uploaded it.

FredP
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Posted: 30th Nov 2006 06:41
Thanks to Candles for that info.
If not for him I would still be using those fat .avi files.

Silent Thunder
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Posted: 30th Nov 2006 06:47
Quote: "If not for him I would still be using those fat .avi files"


Right when i was uploading i was going crazy trying to find a .wmv to .avi converter, and I finally found sony vegas under my desk, i wish that i had posted that in the feature creep forum before that.

but for some reason it didn't work before, thenall of a sudden it worked, makes no sense.

KeithC
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Posted: 30th Nov 2006 13:47
OK, the judge list is filled out for the December/January Level Design Comp. Tschwarz has agreed to judge this time. I want to give other members the chance to judge as well, so I'd like to set up a "vote for your favorite judge" type of thing. I'm thinking to leave 2 of the 3 spots for judging open, as one spot must be left open for the winner (if they choose to help); if the winner declines, then all 3 spots would be open. I'll see how much participation this generates; I just have to figure out the timing of it all.

Also, Tschwarz has generously donated Signs IV for this competition.

-Keith

flashing snall
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Location: Boston
Posted: 30th Nov 2006 21:48
Quote: "Also, Tschwarz has generously donated Signs IV for this competition. "

oh man, this is somthing ive been looking into!
now that i think about it, this theme can be anything, all you have to do is say that the location of your level is a city....


"these shoes are 300 hundred dollars"-Shoes by Kelly http://smallgroup.be/
KeithC
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Posted: 30th Nov 2006 22:00
Quote: "all you have to do is say that the location of your level is a city...."

Not really; you'll see what the requirements are in a bit.

-Keith

flashing snall
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Posted: 1st Dec 2006 00:25
Well, you would need a little more than that... I havent started at all yet, so i dont know...


"these shoes are 300 hundred dollars"-Shoes by Kelly http://smallgroup.be/
KeithC
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Posted: 1st Dec 2006 00:26
Alright, the new Comp. is up; this one's going to get unstuck. Thanks again for everyone's participation.

-Keith

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