Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

FPSC Classic Product Chat / Good 'ol boy clubs

Author
Message
Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Dec 2005
Location: Wichita Falls TX
Posted: 13th Dec 2006 20:05
@forum members-

I know this is going to make you alla bit mad. I feel that I need to get this off of my chest. What better way than to say it to the people who are the cause.

There seems to be alot of talent here on these forums. to name a few Bond1, Jon, Locrain, Uman, FredP, Bullshock, Errant AI etc... And there are twice as many people that think they are gods but really aren't (They shall remain nameless) and there are those that well...should work a little bit harder at what they are trying to do (they also will remain nameless). there are people here that base there life off of free media which is fine because I know how hard modeling, texturing, reading the manual, and using the search feature can be. something has got to give. With all of the experiance here you'd figure that people would learn how to walk a bit but instead they decide to follow the experienced guys like 16 yr old band groupies. (not taking away from the experiance as they are only doing what they like to do). I think it is time for alot of people to spread there wings and fly. there are far to few "first model threads" now a days . this leads me to believe that no one has any initiative to grow. Which is sad in my opinion.

Come one guys let see some more "first model threads" or "hey what do you think of this" type of threads.

I am not mad I am just saddened that alot of people have just stopped wnating to learn.

ok the next subject I want to tackle is the actualy good 'ol boy club issue. most everyone was brand new to this type of stuff when they started with this engine to include myself. I didn't know my head from a hole in the ground. but bvecause of many members I am fairly good at what I do. I see a huge trnd of threads that need the honest crit get pushed back to the depths of these forums for no good reason. These people are not posting there projects to just have them pushed back. Give them the crit they need so they can better their development. and please oh please stop posting the typical "why did you bump this thread?" or if someone asks a question don't answer with "yes, it's possible." and then leave it at that. that does not do any good. we are here to help each other but there is not much help going out to the people who need it. I think I would blame it on brown nosing, the premise that if I am overly nice to person A then he might give me that new model pack he has been working on.

I gues I am tired of good threads being lost and people moaning about someone bumping it. Alot of us on here don;t have to rely on posts to our projects because we have been doing thsi for a while now. We know the basics and most of the advanced stuff that pertains to this engine. it's the new guys that need the help. so why not take the time to help them out?

That's all I am going to say about this issue. If I get Noob slapped then I get Noob slapped. I have prepared myself for all of the anger that alot of you will post here. I got words for everyone.


Regards,
RF

Storm 6000
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Oct 2004
Location:
Posted: 13th Dec 2006 20:14
No i think you have a pretty good point i remember reading an interesting old post that someone had resarting and all one memer added was please dont bump old posts, i nearly let rip but as the rules dont allows such things i reframed from doing so but it did make me angry to think that they thought they had the write to say somthign like that when really it was none of there business, I agree with what you say and hope people will listhen (i bet many of the people you are talking about would not take the time to read your rather long message)as you may or may not have noticed i have a similar Philosophy as you RF and during my recent return to the forums i have tried to help newer members where possible

Thanks
Adam
xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 13th Dec 2006 20:29 Edited at: 13th Dec 2006 20:31
Quote: "I agree with what you say and hope people will listhen (i bet many of the people you are talking about would not take the time to read your rather long message)"


Yeah, I pretty much agree with your "in a perfect world" rant, but Storm really makes a valid point. The people you are trying to reason with will not read this for two reasons.

1. I doesn't say FREE in the title.
2. It's just to long and it doesn't say FREE in the title.

I vent sometimes (though not as much as I used to because sometimes odd things come out where they never used to before) so I understand. You never know who you might reach.

Best.

Edit:
Quote: "That's all I am going to say about this issue. If I get Noob slapped then I get Noob slapped."


I think we're allowed to vent here if it's done with respect and I don't see any problem with this one, but that's just me.

I'm sorry, my answers are limited. You must ask the right question.

Errant AI
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Aug 2006
Location:
Posted: 13th Dec 2006 20:52
I honesty never fully understood the anti-bumping thing. Plus, very old threads get permalocked by default so, for a person like me, it's very hard to get clarification or up to date knowledge on subjects that were idle before I joined.

Quote: "Give them the crit they need so they can better their development."


That's a double-edged sword there. Frankly, there's a lot of media posted that need Higgins special brand of criticism... But that only gets people slapped. Sometimes the best crit truly is to let someone know that they should capalize on what they've just learned and start over from scratch. Another all to common trend is folks who make a zillion models but never put them into FPSC. I pretty much refuse to comment on models these days unless I have some inclination that the author is actually going to follow through to some degree. As a forum user and someone who likes to see people learning, I get way more excitement from seeing that someone put a new decal or a textured crate into the game than any number of "Lookit, I made this moodle!" threads.

That said, I really think there should be an extra two or three boards added for topics that would be benificial to beginner modelers yet are detrimental to the existing boards. Perhaps even a "Bear Pit" board for FPSC users who are looking for rough, honest crits in lieu of the usual pats on the back or silence.
Pus In Boots
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Nov 2005
Location: S.M.I.L.E. industries
Posted: 13th Dec 2006 21:29
Before I say anything, I'll just say that I'm not having a snap, I'm just speaking in people's defense here. I wholeheartedly agree with what you are saying, but there's a thing or two I don't agree with:

Quote: "And there are twice as many people that think they are gods but really aren't (They shall remain nameless) and there are those that well...should work a little bit harder at what they are trying to do"


Yes, some people fit that ego description to a T, but I think it's unfair of you to try and justify that anyone who isn't a leading leader doesn't have incentive or potential to do good on the forums. Why, "John Doe Forumer" could be up there with Butterfingers, KeithC and the others, they just haven't been given a chance by people like you- like us. Also; unless you said this as a lighter way of saying "you stink"-for which you may disregard this, I think they are trying their best to improve themselves. I'm not exactly high up on the forum food chain, and I try hard to improve what I do and how I contribute to these forums.

Quote: "With all of the experiance here you'd figure that people would learn how to walk a bit but instead they decide to follow the experienced guys like 16 yr old band groupies."


OK, we've seen a few suck-ups around here, leeching off these guys like a baby with a new dummy, but the majority of people don't suck up, they just stick around in search of advice off someone who can give it. Or something like that.

BTW: I like that bear pit idea. Although you could just ask them to be honest, snippy and overall unpleasant towards your idea. After all, that's what reviewers are for, right?



Would you kindly look away from the screen when you're in my presence?

visit www.gameshell.tk
Silent Thunder
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Feb 2006
Location: The Ship
Posted: 13th Dec 2006 23:56
Quote: "there are far to few "first model threads" now a days"


really?

there have been about 4 this week so far.


Get my Mega Segment Pack for free, be one of the first 5 to post
Nickydude
Retired Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Nov 2006
Location: Look outside...
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 01:13
Quote: "I honesty never fully understood the anti-bumping thing. Plus, very old threads get permalocked by default so, for a person like me, it's very hard to get clarification or up to date knowledge on subjects that were idle before I joined."


I totally agree with this, it may be an old post but a newcomer may genuinely want to know what happened to the model / texture / game / etc.


Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Dec 2005
Location: Wichita Falls TX
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 01:36 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 01:38
Quote: "Yes, some people fit that ego description to a T, but I think it's unfair of you to try and justify that anyone who isn't a leading leader doesn't have incentive or potential to do good on the forums"


I think I should what I stated, it's not that they don't have potential it's the fact that they do not show it and when they do they jump in like Yoda. like they saved the world. then there are people who are afraid to show anything because well face it whats the point? it'll probably get 3 replies where 1 might be helpfull and the other two are one word responses. the whole "yeah you can do that" statement in threads that ask if you can do something with the engine. and they never define how to do it they simply feel like showing that they know something or give the appearance that they know something. but in fact know nothing and simply want to be revered as a expert fpsc user.

Quote: "OK, we've seen a few suck-ups around here, leeching off these guys like a baby with a new dummy, but the majority of people don't suck up, they just stick around in search of advice off someone who can give it. Or something like that."


Alot of us learn from the few who can model at a higher level then the rest of us. There is a difference from learning and leeching. I think that keeping interest in something is good for learning but if you read half of the posts from like Jons, smitho's or bonds threads they are full of leeches. That just drives me crazy, you see something you want, learn to make it. Jon and Bond have shown more than enough to give someone a great idea of how a model is supposed to flow. Seems that very few take it to that next level and actually try to make something.


Quote: "there have been about 4 this week so far."


I remember when there was three times that many per week.

I am glad you all responded to this. It makes me feel better knowing that while we do not see eye to eye on everything, most topics we understand the basic principles that are bveing discussed here.

Regards,
RF

Locrian
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Nov 2005
Location: Burton Mi.
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 01:50
Not that my two cents matters, here it is anyways-

I think no matter where you are in this world be it high school or the work place there are going to be cliques. Some people are just naturally going to have more similar mind set then others. Though were all hobbyist here, some are on a much different level from others from the word go. I don't think it can be helped that some people just aren't that serious about this hobby, and others around them can pick up on this.

Looking at my list of threads from the very beginning, I see my first question I ever posted here was in reference to how bad the search engine was. My first thread posting a model wasn't a "look at what I've done for my first model" thread it was me giving away a log fence I'd made for a more fantasy setting. It by the way was usable in a game and not just me giving away a .3ds file saying "Well if you can get it into FPSC".

I personally have no frame of mind to say "Oh I was like that when I first started". My history proves otherwise. I used a search engine, and I gave away only things(or showed) that could be used in a game. So what do I have in common with 90% of the people here? Not a thing. That's why outside the forum I only talk to a number of people I can count on one hand. I only work with someone that has an already proven talent. I don't have time to train anyone, I'm still learning myself.

To me there's a glut of "Lookit, I made this moodle!" threads, as Errant put it. I don't care. I'll never see them in a game, so in all actuality, what dose it have to do with FPSC. I don't care if your taking two boxes and calling it gun, only to never texture it and use the same two boxes to now make a sword. Big deal. Render an image and hang it on moms fridge. Butterfingers modeling style is super simplistic but I see his work in a game and it's very consistent and now revered as "stylistic". Do I place Butter on a different level then some of the people here? Sure do, and I can't help it.

Don't really mind the bumping thing all that much, as long as it's not a post saying "cool" and nothing more. I know why people on occasion have to bump, and I've done it myself from time to time.

As for "The Good Ole Boys Club", there's always going to be a division in classes. If your wanting to answer things for the 100th time, since there's new members joining every week feel free, and I suggest using notepad to save some of the more repeated replies. I've seen a new guy that I'd help because he already proved to me he knows how to look for his solutions. He may be just not finding it, or using the correct terminology. The members like this I'd freely give the key to "TGOB" bathroom. The majority of the others aren't serious enough for me, and my times to limited. I'm sure the people on the Milksahpe forums can be just as supportive as you'd like to see us being.

Just my opinion RF.
Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Dec 2005
Location: Wichita Falls TX
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 02:19
And a fair one at that Locrain.


RF

xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 02:29
I find myself leaning towards Locrains way of thinking more often now. It wasn't so when I first joined. I was more active in different kinds of threads and helped out whenever I could. Now I pass on a lot of threads that I would have once responded to.

Why? They don't concern me, I don't really care about the subject, or I judge the creator of the thread as not worthy of my time. I don't say that to be rude, but when I see a thread where someone has no respect, doesn't try to spell or convey his request in a serious manner, or obviously thinks his time is more important than mine, I just ignore it. When I see bumped threads, I don't really care. When I see the "Lookit, I made this moodle!" thread, I just smile and go on.

This is not my forum and it really isn't even meant for me. Most times I feel like a grown-up in a kids playground, and I don't mean that in a bad way. This is a kids playground, but I'm here for the same reason everyone else is, so perhaps "I don't care" about things that really don't mean anything or matter is the best approach.

I'm not one of the talented ones here, especially when it comes to modeling, but I've had my moments. I'm just here to have a good time, share with like minds, and help where I can. The rest is all crap and in the end meaningless. I do love these deep conversations though.

I think everything we see here is pretty much normal for a thousand or more people of all different ages and parts of the world in one room. Actually, I think we do pretty good and the MODS are a part of that.

Happy game making.

I'm sorry, my answers are limited. You must ask the right question.

s4real
VIP Member
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Jul 2006
Location:
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 02:37
Yeah im with errant with the anti-bumping thing, the problem is some people might miss ya post and a little bump dont hurt to give people a second chance to see it.

Im finding a lot of people just come here to get what they can for free and some want to learn and you going to get this where ever you are in the world,the people u said on your list like butters, loc and the rest are people like myself that take the hobby a little bit more serious where others around the forum dont have the same drive.

I think some people need to take a step back read the post's look at the manual and use the search feature.

I agree with loc on the Good'ol boy club.

Im a wizz at texturing toilets
Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Dec 2005
Location: Wichita Falls TX
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 02:37 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 02:40
Quote: "Most times I feel like a grown-up in a kids playground"


I feel what ya mean man. And I understand what you both mean. Sometimes though it just rubs me the wrong way to see how some of these poeple are on these forums. And some of the arguements that occur here.

I know the good 'ol boy club is every where I think we should refer to as "The System" from now on.

I do like these conversations as well, show that people can agree to disagree in a civil manner.

filya
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 23rd Aug 2006
Location: USA
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 03:52 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 03:52
I have been following this thread since the start, but didn't feel my views would really matter.
I still think the same, but I feel I should post anyways.


1. First model topic:

I understand this is a FPSC forum and not a modelling one. I also agree that the 'models and media' title suggests models and media which are FPSC related. I thoroughly believe that the majority of the models displayed will never be used in a game (not even by the creator himself).
All I think is, it doesn't really matter whether newcomers to modelling post their models or not.
If they do, I don't think most of them do it for review or for critism. I think its mainly because they want to kind of 'show off'. These kind of threads, well... I don't usually respond to.
But the genuine ones which request critism or improvement suggestions...I do appreciate, and I do reply. It doesn't really take too much of my time to reply with my views.


2. Bumping issue

I don't think any thread here needs to be bumped for the sake of it. We have the feature to see unread threads, and I am sure people do use that to catch up on what they have missed.
So I agree to not posting 'BUMP' messages.

But I do believe that older threads should not be locked. Also, on older threads, if someone has a genuine question, he should be free to do so in that thread itself. Why make a new thread for something that already exists someplace else.


3. Trying to learn

RF, I don't know if I am in the majority here, but I for myself have learnt so much from these forums. I did not post my first model here (which was a untextured table) and nor did I post my recent models (a completely animated, textured, FPSC ready snake character).
But I know how much I must have learnt from you great guys here to have gone from table to snake. But I still havent posted any of this for one reason and one reason alone...'I don't think anyone is going to use it in a game!' (Although all of my models have been used by me in the level design contests)

3 months back, I didn't know what a poly was. I didn't know 3D modelling softwares existed. And now, I respond to people's posts who ask for help with problems in their models or textures.

So like I said, I don't know if I am in the majority, but I do hope that I am. I do hope there are so many more here who have learnt a lot from you guys. So you may not see the 'first model' threads, but believe me, there must be 'first models' being produced on people's PCs all the time even now.

-filya

-- game dev is fun...but taking up too much time --
RedneckRambo
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 19th Oct 2006
Location: Worst state in USA... California
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 04:36
Quote: "there are far to few "first model threads""

At least I don't rub ya the wrong way. I just started modeling and made my first "First model thread" hooray for me.

Once masterchief (some random number) guy posted his first model, I think i saw like 4 more within the next week or so, including mine.

I'm still fairly new to the forums and I'm already getting annoyed with bumping threads, not searching, not reading manual and other things of that nature. I completely agree with you Reality.

Tiggle Bitties

Benjamin A
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 13:29 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 13:33
To be honest I don't mind that there aren't so many first model threads anymore.

Let me explain.... I'm not against 'first model threads' at all, but I still don't think thay have a place in 'models and media' at all. A lot of people do post models there that never will be used in FPSC at all. Another problem of the 'first model threads' is that they push the finished model threads or true fpsc wip model threads aside. The 'models and media' is way to cluttered the way it is.

I would really suggest that the 'models and media' will be split into 2 forums. A 'wip models and media' forum and a 'finished models and media', but in either forum the models should be FPSC releated.

Brings me to another forum as well. The showcase one. Imo that one should be split into 2 section also. A wip forum and a finished game forum.

Back to topic..... I'm all for 'first model threads', but viewing yet another modified box or modified sphere isn't really fun. I can understand everyone decides to follow the experienced guys like 16 yr old band groupies. My first 3D model I showed to anyone was a quite detailed spacefighter, not just a modified sphere. Half of the stuff people post here, they should keep to themselves until they have something worth showing. If you post something it should at least be a bit decent and not something wipped up in a minute, at least do some effort.

So I can see people not commenting. I often don't, it's not worth it. What am I going to reply to a thread that states, 'I know it isn't good, I only spent a few minutes on it, it could be better'??? We often see threads like that and people know they shouldn't post it.

I'm all for 'first model threads', but they should be serious and a lot of what we see in 'models and media' isn't serious modeling at all and often it's admitted.

I do understand your point, but I also completely understand the lack of comments.

The other side is, with so many threads each day in this forum, I simply can't reply to everyone of them. I do make a careful selection, I've got better things to do then to comment to each 'first model threads' I do see, when there's nothing really to comment on at all. Time is something valuable for me, so I'm investing it in threads I do see potential in and that appeal to me.

As for the bumping.... that one is tricky. I do understand mods are trying to limit it, since there was a time people brought up old threads of people that weren't even here anymore and brought up nonsense threads. But somethimes it's good to bump older meaningful threads or simply check on the progress. but that's another major problem we see around here..... starting projects (games, media, scripts) and never finishing them or suddenly abandoning them for no reason at all. We should be a bit more consistant in what we create and not jump from one project to another.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
KeithC
Senior Moderator
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Michigan
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 18:22
Here's my view on bumping older threads. If the thread in question contains something useful (such as a free piece of media, or a relevent tutorial) than I'm more apt to keep it unlocked. If the thread was bumped simply because the member was either asking a question (one that could be asked in an e-mail), or just making a frivilous comment on a long dead thread...then it will more than likely be locked (with or without comment). I don't like to see the fresh threads (especially the relevent/productive ones) be pushed to the bottom in this manner.

As far as the "look at my first model" threads; I think they should remain in the 3 Dimensional Chat board, until they are made FPSC-ready. Once you get them into FPSC, then would be the time to post screenshots, videos, etc. That's why it's called the FPSC Models and Media Board; otherwise, post it in the 3 Dimensional Chat board. If the guys who frequent that Board have a problem with it, that's tough. If someone makes a modified sphere or cube, and gets it (textured) into FPSC; that's soemthing relevent to the FPSC Models and Media, because its not real easy, coming off the street, to figure out how to import media properly into FPSC (without a program to do it).

What I don't like to see in a thread title is "Need Help", "A Question", "Look at this", or some variation of those. I don't look at them until they get locked. Be descriptive in your Title; grab someone's attention with it, otherwise it won't show up in a search when someone's looking for your topic specifically (and would therefore shrink the number of like threads that are posted).

Of course none of this will work without the communities help, and the Moderation of yours truly, and the other Mods.

This is a good thread Dave.

-Keith

Locrian
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Nov 2005
Location: Burton Mi.
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 18:57
I like Keith's idea about 3 Dimensional Chat. That personally, would save me from going insane, as I never ever have never even looked in that forum. I'm sure a few members feel the same as I do, and since it's not in fpsc it doesn't concern us. Models and Media would loose so many nonsense post if all the first time openers of milkshape played in another portion of the sand box.

I vote for making that a new rule. All mesh wips are not allowed in Fpsc models and media. Must have a in-game screen shot...Tell me this is a early Christmas gift...purdy please....

I realize this would stop the showing of art like for a splash screen , but you could show an image of your finished splash as it appears in the game with the buttons on it....which is really all that matters anyways.

I'm going from Grinch to giddy with the mere mention of a spark of an idea about cleaning up forums.....
uman
Retired Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 19:18
Now you dont want me to post one of my long threads as no one will read it but heres a short comment :

Personally I rarely as you will all know comment on anyone elses work of whatever kind be it game dev, model, media, scripting or any other content or contribution. Its not my business to comment or give any kind of critisism either one way or another good or bad unless asked for as I see it as what do I know - I just have opinions same as everyone else and most often keep them to myself unless its something that pertains partcularly to my own development or area or interest and I dont wish to say it - any particular expertise. The way I look at it I make games and dont ask for critism one way or another - they please me or not and thats sufficient so I treat others the same way and dont comment. Its just a personal thing. You wont ever have seen many comments by me appertaining to others work.

As to helping others I do what I can when I can dependant upon what I know which is not enough in many instances to be able to comment in a helpful way in many cases. Personally I have perhaps not worked in depth with FPSC as much as many other users as my dev with the product has been held back for a long time pending evaluating its future potential for continuation of my own gamemaking which only requires stable overall fps speeds. I can live with everything else but that means I have only developed with FPSC in specific areas of need for my own use and there is much I dont know about and have not the specific knowledge in other areas of the product to advise others.

I would certainly agree that FPSC as with any engine is complex and additoionally has many issues and problem areas that others may not have that new users will have difficulty with. By and large the manual and information at these forums will be enough to get them started. After all its a click and play product and basic stuff is really not at all difficult in allowing almost anyone to put a game together in matter of a short time. Too many new users just completely ignore the manual and considerable help in threads here and post questions as soon as they encounter their fist problem without making any effort at all to solve it and find a solution.

They are not ever going to make become successful at what they are attempting unless they have at least some determination to get on and do some hard work themselves as we can all appertain to. They are just not serious about it. They are still welcome here as far as I see things but they should not wonder if they receive very little help or encouragement or become demanding as some do when no one answers there question sometimes within minutes.

Certainly new users who have a legitimate interest are to be welcomed, helped and encouraged wherever possible and unless undesireable in any detrimental way to the product or forums in their beahaviour should be shown and given the same respect at least as anyone else.

As to bumping of threads - you wont find any comment anywhere here at these forums by me regarding that. My only concern as a Moderator is that a thread has some valuable relative content and that it contains no naughty content.

Thats long enough I recon - I leave it for others to debate further in the good manner to which we are now accustomed.



"I am and forever will be your friend"
Lon
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 12th Feb 2004
Location: Big Ass Castle
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 19:52
Nice post RF, I joined long ago, here and other places. Sad to say, it’s the same on most forums. It's an unfortunate aspect of the "internets" . This forum isn't so bad though, and generally friendly and full of talented people. I've been to some that are downright nasty and have gnashed my teeth to a many post from those. It's easy to say what you want when you’re behind a keyboard. Remember Jay and Silent Bob in "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back"? Where they personally track the people down who smack talked them on a forum and beat the crap out of them at the end of the movie?

Lon

[url=http://webpages.charter.net/lflicking/]
KeithC
Senior Moderator
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Michigan
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 21:18 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 21:24
Normally when I see a post that shouldn't be in the forums at all (like the team request thread I'm about to delete), I just lock them so that the member can see what they've posted is wrong. Lately, I've been thinking it might just be better to delete the thread entirely; as it pushes relevent threads further down the line. As you can all see, we've cleaned up the immense number of stickies recently...they will stay that way. If somebody wants something to be stickied, we will look at the thread and decide whether or not we agree; it will then be placed (as a link) into one of the conglomerate stickies up top.

Quote: "Remember Jay and Silent Bob in "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back"? Where they personally track the people down who smack talked them on a forum and beat the crap out of them at the end of the movie?"

FINALLY!!; someone who's made that connection! I don't know how many times I've mentioned Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back, in reference to these and the OG forums.

Thankyou.

-Keith

Mikey spike
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 23rd Nov 2006
Location: UK, England
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 22:11 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 22:40
Some very good points there, but i just don't like it when people say use the search for everything, i think yeah search but save the noob flamming [Mod Edit] why not just post a link, make the forum a lot nicer place, don't you think? and yeah ok, tell people to use the search just cut out the flaming bit, kinda gets me angry when someone have a go at you for not using the search and just asking a simple question

[url]http://www.freewebs.com/mikey-spikey/index.htm[url]
RedneckRambo
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 19th Oct 2006
Location: Worst state in USA... California
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 22:20 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 22:21
I disagree with Ben. Having us post our first model threads is a good thing. I've posted a few first models and RF has been more than helpful and told me how to improve. I am very thankful for that. Having us post in 3d chat is not a good idea to me because, locrian just said that he never looks there. and I pretty much know that most of everyone that posts for FPSC doesn't look there. I think that the forums are fine the way they are. Besides all the bumping and questions like "how many people can play in an MP game" other than things of that nature, the forums should stay the way they are. Sometimes people will just have to deal with some of their pet peeves.

Also we shouldn't have to post in 3d chat because noobs like me, don't know how to make it FPSC ready. This way we can ask how to make it FPSC ready and show off our cruddy models.

Tiggle Bitties

Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Dec 2005
Location: Wichita Falls TX
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 22:24 Edited at: 14th Dec 2006 22:25
Mikey spike-couldn't agree more, though I am guilty of the brutal search beatings.

Jenkins- Look at it this way these forums have a 3D chat and I think Ben is saying that you should post there. I agree that a new modeller thread shoudl be started somewhere on these forums. I think that alot of people see some of the work over there and get intimidated (sp?). it would be nice to see a new board under the FPSC realm for our new modellers.

* are you steelMagnoliasfan? * those who have seen the movie will understand.
RF

Benjamin A
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 22:42
As stated before, I'm all for first model threads. But.... what we do see here way too often imo, is for example someone taking sphere, decreasing the height, slap a texture onto it and call it let's say a spaceship. That has nothing to do with modeling and again imo those shouldn't be posted in the fpsc models and media forum.

Now if you got something worth showing, even if it's your first model, please do post it, but I'm all for a different section, so it will make it easier for all of us to find what we're looking for.

The FPSC forums are way to cluttered the way they are.

RF I agree that 3D Chat is intimidating for new time modelers, so they should get their own section.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
uman
Retired Moderator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 22:42
Asking someone to search is aloud and correct in many cases.

Flaming is not aloud.



"I am and forever will be your friend"
xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 14th Dec 2006 23:10
Quote: "I just lock them so that the member can see what they've posted is wrong. Lately, I've been thinking it might just be better to delete the thread entirely; as it pushes relevent threads further down the line."


What about all the "Where did my thread go?" threads? lol

I'm sorry, my answers are limited. You must ask the right question.

RedneckRambo
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 19th Oct 2006
Location: Worst state in USA... California
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 00:12 Edited at: 15th Dec 2006 00:13
Quote: "what we do see here way too often imo, is for example someone taking sphere, decreasing the height, slap a texture onto it and call it let's say a spaceship"

lol, I know exactly what thread your talking about. On that note, your completely right. What I mean, is just posting a thread like mine. Of course it isn't all that good, but I still tried. Or the thread like the first hand, i believe by masterchief. Those I think should be posted on the models and media. Things like the flatened sphere/spaceship just shouldn't be posted period. So I guess I'm on the same lines as you.

P.s. I've never even been to the 3d chat board,lol. So I wouldn't know to even be afraid of posting there.

That is a pretty good idea to have a new model board.


hmmm, alsmost every post is huge, lol

Tiggle Bitties

Locrian
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Nov 2005
Location: Burton Mi.
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 03:18
@Mikey spike
Why should I take the time to post a link for you? Hmm? Why should I have to look it up, when you can do it just as easily? All goes back to me asking people to quit being so selfish. I know people don't see it as being selfish, but if you expect me to stop what I'm doing to look up and post a link, thats pretty self centered. I find this lazy on the posters part, and not how I found my information. I expect nothing from others that I wouldn't do my self. And then gets one of my stock answers.

Mike I'm not trying to down you , but I'm trying to let you see it from our perspective. You joined almost one year after I did. xplosys joined a few months after. Perhaps when your at xplosys point you'll start tiring of the questions, and a few months later, be responding like myself...

You never know.
Benjamin A
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 09:11
I agree with Locrain.... if I can find it through searching then you can also. Why should we have to do all the work? People around here tend to be lazy for some reason, often asking questions that has been answered even one thread above theirs.

I don't see why we should direct people to the stickies, manual and search bottom. If everyone would take those 3 steps first before asking, half of the threads we see now, wouldn't even appear at all. Making this place once again less clutered.

Asking the same questions over and over again instead of using the search button yourself adds to making it harder to find the answer to a question. The more people ask the same question, the more these unanswered threads turn up when searching, the more harder it will be to find the answer for everyone.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
FredP
Retired Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Feb 2006
Location: Indiana
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 18:07
As far as posting in the 3D Chat forums goes I have been maiking models for a while now and I won't post my stuff there.
I feel it is a different class of people and they can be brutally honest.
If I were a newcomer and I had just started modeling I wouldn't post there.
They do a completely different level of modeling and very few of our forum members fit into that catagory.
As far as bumping goes I think that if you post something and it goes off of the top page and you bump it to get attention for it that is what it is for.
Bumping a very old thread usually isn't a good idea.
Occassionally I will look up a link or edit someone's post so that their link works but I gotta go with Loc and the others on this.
If I can look it up so can anybody else.Look up your own links.
I see no problem with people posting WIP models in the Models and Media forum as long as they are willing to accept C&C (as long as it falls within the AUP).
The problem I do see (other than some not reading the manual/stickies or using the search function from time to time) is that people are given advice when they post a WIP (and this can be any WIP in any FPSC board) they won't take the advice and they get upset.
If people didn't care they wouldn't give you advice...take the advice.It shouldn't take you very long to figure out who knows what they are talking about and who is full of it.
While I try to advocate that we all ought to be nice to one another honesty is the best policy and when you make a WIP you have to understand that not everyone will like it and it might not be good.
Telling somebody up front their model isn't good or what is wrong with it will allowq them to improve on the future models that they make.
An ounce of prevention is worth more than a pound of cure...better to get off on the right foot than to have to correct a serious flaw after months of doing something wrong...
If you feel that the FPSC forum members are harsh post your WIPs in the aforementioned 3D Chat forum...you'll be glad to come back.
Most of them are grown ups with good to uber modeling skills and they can and will pick your model apart like chicken from the bone.
That's not a bad thing...you just need to have thick skin.
I have read complaints about how some forum members are not nice...
and there are a few who really aren't...but some forum members here are just being honest.
It's not that they are mean...it's just that they know what's up and they are trying to do you the favor of telling you before things get worse.
We are all allegedly here for the same purpose...to develop games.
If we all work together and put forth a decent effort we can all accomplish something.
I am done with my endless Rant of the Week...

Locrian
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Nov 2005
Location: Burton Mi.
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 18:30
If nothing else this thread has shown me, rather then trying to change the FPSC forums to a more professional atmosphere, it would be alot easier if I just moved my lil butt over to the '3 Dimensional Chat' and start posting with grown ups. Never really gave those forums a chance, since it's not shown on the front page of the FPSC forum list. I really don't have time to look thru a ton of forums so with 3dchat taking the place of Models and media, my blood pressure would probably even out. I guess people that are interested could see the work whenever S4 and I post in showcase.
Errant AI
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Aug 2006
Location:
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 18:50
I'm not a big fan of the 3Dchat board. On average, the attitude is a bit too thick for my taste. Frankly, some of the work I've seen over there is just as poorly crafted as on models/media.

However, I think a 3Dchat-ish board for all the novice modelers would be a welcome addition to the FPSC section.
FredP
Retired Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Feb 2006
Location: Indiana
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 19:04
Maybe we need a "newcomers board" where newcomers can post their questions,WIPS,etc.
Then if someone wants to give them a hand that's fine and if not then they don't even have to look in that board.
Or we could have a board for the more "experienced" members to post their stuff and maybe we could get some good feedback and be semi-free of the aggravation.
If we had that kind of board and maybe the mods were more particular about what got posted there we could have an area for the more serious developers.

Errant AI
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Aug 2006
Location:
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 19:19 Edited at: 15th Dec 2006 19:28
I like the idea of a newcomer board ALOT. I think it would alleviate much tension.

I don't think an "experienced" board would be much good. As a forum user, I'd just prefer that the FPSC Models and Media board contain just that. I don't care what level the authors skills are as long as they demonstrate they are using the engine and not just making random models. It seems like it would be easy enough for mods to just move posts that are far from being FPSC ready without risk of hurting feelings.

Likewise, threads like "How do I convert to .X" could be moved there as well.

I guess my main gripe is that there is such a lack of in-game screenshots in the current m/m board. If all you have are viewport screenshots and no history of importing a model, then I don't really feel the work belongs on that board.
RedneckRambo
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 19th Oct 2006
Location: Worst state in USA... California
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 22:24
I concur on a newcomers board. We should go with that.

Tiggle Bitties

Benjamin A
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 23:21 Edited at: 15th Dec 2006 23:22
Good idea Fred, I like the idea of a newcomers board.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Dec 2005
Location: Wichita Falls TX
Posted: 15th Dec 2006 23:32
rolfy
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 23rd Jun 2006
Location:
Posted: 16th Dec 2006 02:37 Edited at: 16th Dec 2006 02:39
I have followed this thread with real interest for some time now,as a relative noob myself,I'm new to games engines,but have been modeling and animating for some years now.
It was three months from joining before I posted anything on these forums,I spent most of this time reading through just about every thread fron when they started and learned an incredible amount in this time,but my knowledge is still lacking greatly.
I can see where many of you are coming from and in particular I just have to read every post Locrian makes, his ascerbic comments never fail to make my day.
Every body on this forum has his/her own personality and it takes all sorts ya know,by the way Errant is right,the 3d chat forum is no better really than fpsc models and media,in fact eai,bond1,higgins,benjamin A,Jon fletcher,Butter fingers,s4real,rf and many more who all have their own individual styles make models and media a much more varied and interesting place.
Maybe it would work to have a newcomers corner,but I pity the mod who gets the job of policing it,and for how long would this status last or how is some one going to judge if their work is of this particular level and actually put it there,would the mods decide and move it,I do agree something thats never going to be put into a game seems pointless and really has no place here,but guy's you keep telling people to create their own custom media and not just use the stock,the showcase forum is full of this kind of advice,you cant blame the kids for taking your advice.
Silent Thunder
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Feb 2006
Location: The Ship
Posted: 16th Dec 2006 04:45 Edited at: 16th Dec 2006 04:46
A newcommer's board would be a great idea!


Get my Mega Segment Pack for free, be one of the first 5 to post
Conjured Entertainment
AGK Developer
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 12th Sep 2005
Location: Nirvana
Posted: 16th Dec 2006 07:17
Quote: "And there are twice as many people that think they are gods but really aren't (They shall remain nameless) and there are those that well...should work a little bit harder at what they are trying to do (they also will remain nameless)."

Well, since I wasn't named, then I guess you fit me into one of these groups.
It doesn't hurt anyone for me to think highly of myself.
I won't put myself down just to please others, so disagree if you want.
Just because you don't see their work, doesn't mean they are not working hard.

Quote: ""yeah you can do that" statement in threads that ask if you can do something with the engine. and they never define how to do it they simply feel like showing that they know something or give the appearance that they know something. but in fact know nothing and simply want to be revered as a expert fpsc user. "

Here is where I learned yet another thing from Merranvo.
There is nothing wrong with telling someone that something can be done without telling them how.
Providing them step-by-step instructions all the time creates a dependency on their part.
Pretty soon, they expect you to hold their hand rather than figuring it out like we had to.
Sometimes they need to put forth more effort than just asking us to do it for them.

Quote: "Jons, smitho's or bonds threads they are full of leeches. That just drives me crazy, you see something you want, learn to make it. Jon and Bond have shown more than enough to give someone a great idea of how a model is supposed to flow. Seems that very few take it to that next level and actually try to make something."

Yeah, I guess I'm a leech now too because I request a model from someone who obviously does better work than I can do at the moment. Not everyone has enough spare time in their day to make this more than a hobby, so wanting the best modelers to make something for them doesn't make them a leech as much as it makes them a fan of the modeler and his work.

As for people making models FPSC sompatible...
The very first model I made was FPSC ready with all the neccessary files to put it in game.
Yes, I even gave step by step instructions for installing the files.
All of my models offered here were done that way.
I know Keith remembers, because everyone who complained about my texturing skills were reminded by him that at least my models were ready to be used in game.
I didn't handle my negative critisism well, because it felt like everyone was taking my contributions for granted.
So, I stopped offering models to the community. (I even abandoned modeling for a long time)
There might be more people attempting to make more models if they weren't told to give it up in their first attempts.


Conclusion...
Everyone is different as well as their perceptions of others.
Diversity is a good thing, and it would be boring if we all conformed to being the same.
What is the difference in someone 'leeching' off modelers than expecting scripters to write the script for you?
Everyone needs helps sometimes, and not everyone can do it all.
I see nothing wrong with bumping threads or asking why it was bumped.
I see nothing wrong in making a few models or asking someone else to make one for you.
I see nothing wrong in figuring things out for yourself.
If you get upset by people acting differently than yourself, then you will probably be miserable most of your life.


It's okay for a noob to ask for help or show off his first model even if he hasn't got it in FPSC yet.
It's okay for someone to say "yeah it can be done" without doing it for them.
It's okay to not like what other people do.
It's okay to think of yourself as a GOD even if others call you a leech.

Quote: "What better way than to say it to the people who are the cause."

Here's my way...
IT'S ALL GOOD!

Now, I have to say tata because I have to go leech off Jon and Bond1 for my melee characters.


Don't forget to visit Conjured Entertainment
Smitho
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 23rd Feb 2006
Location: Blackpool, England
Posted: 19th Dec 2006 22:47
Okay well,
I didn't read all the posts since im rather tired right now. I personally understand the point about the 3D chat thing. Models for FPSC should be posted when in FPSC. My weapons thread was done a while ago, when I was starting, and I got a bit ahead of myself in the excitment of beginning modelling "Properly" in my eyes. Since it was going to be/will be for FPSC, I think that's why I plonked it into that forum. The thing about the free models issues will never change. There has always been people, and always will be, that just take take take and never give back. Most forum users' countries have benefits, don't they? In England if you don't have a job you can "go on the dole". You get about £43 a week (About $80) for doing nothing - this is tax payers money.
I think we should have some type of insentive system perhaps. For example:

I have a look at, for example, some of The Inovators work.
"Wow, this eye scanner model is pretty good. I'll give him 2 points for that."

Slowly building up points makes a forum user look superior. If people see the well respected users have high ammounts of points, perhaps they will make an effort to make their own stuff, and get points.

Note - This is purely brainstormimg, and was off the top of my head.
I have no idea why I brought that into the subject, actually.

Need sleep, now...
Dan

FredP
Retired Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Feb 2006
Location: Indiana
Posted: 19th Dec 2006 22:55
We could use a give/take karma system like the one at Ozark Games but I am not sure it would work on these forums.
It only allows you to give/take one karma point every three hours so that might help prevent possible abuse of the system.
Besides,we can tell by looking who contributes to the forums and who doesn't.
Not a bad idea,Dan.
Get some sleep.

mister shakes
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2006
Location: Amishville
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 05:16
As a noob, I understand my thoughts are not exactly held in a high regard. I cant compete with all of the script gods and model geniuses. I can barely work with this program at all because my cpu is outdated. But one thing I know is this...I only recently stumbled upon FPSC, and joined with everything else TGC does this is the closest I have ever been to a childhood dream I once had of creating my own games. Yet I read all these posts and try to get as much knowledge from those that are knowledgeable and half the time I see noobs such as myself get slapped around because they dont know scripting or cant build models or dont know how to use a search.

I have tried using this search and 95% of the time find myself manually scrolling through every thread in the forum. Only KeithC said it, there are way too many threads titled, "can this be done?", "need help with a script" so on and so forth.....

I havent made many posts, but the ones I have made were problems I was genuinely having...whether they were valid problems or stupid ones shouldnt matter. We are new and will have problems. Personally, I keep finding myself trying to do things outside of fpsc's boundries. I am trying to script a free-roaming text entry system. I have it pretty much working but there are things I either do not know or cannot be done.

For example, I search for zoom controls. No info so a thread is posted and I made a comment asking if it can be done.

Why did no one respond? I wasnt asking for code, wasnt asking for people to make me stuff. I wanted to know if it was specific to the source code. I didnt ask anyone to tell me how to do it. I consider finding the answers necessary to learning. But I feel somewhat hesitent to post a question in fear of being berided by some of you who think this should inherently known.

Basically I guess what I am trying to say is that I know who the really really good people are. I usually just sit and read everything they have to say. I trust their knowledge and hope I can learn from it. But I dont expect to be looked down upon simply because I havent had this as long as you and I might have a couple questions.

Someone said in a year from now I could possibly see it from the advanced user point of view and I hope that is true. You all started out at this point at one time so take it easy on those of us trying to play catch-up.

PS: If I ever finish that free-roam text entry I have every intention of making it available. Whatever that is worth...
Cruise McClarren
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 23rd Aug 2005
Location:
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 14:58
Well, I wasn't going to post, but I feel I have one thing to say. Everyone was a noob once. Do you think Airslide was able to make his efficient A.I. script the first day of having the program? Do you think that Benjamin A's game was the first game he ever made with the program and it was soooo perfect that it got a publishing deal? Absolutely not. Now I understand some things really don't need to be posted 15 times in 15 ways that are so similar, but if someone is asking for help, how helpful is it to bash them just cause they don't know? This isn't a step on the noobs cause they don't know something. For all you know, a noob could bring out the next best script idea. Something some of the more frequent users overlooked or maybe never thought of. And the best way some people can help is to put them down and make them feel like idiots cause they are new? Where are we... middle school? High school? (Ok, some of the users probably are still in high school - I was just referring to the popularity issues that befall people at that age) Basically, these forums wedre designed to help people... so help them. I agree that you shouldn't always give every step on how to do everything but at least give them a step in the right direction rather than just saying, Yes you can do that now go figure out how. If they knew how, they wouldn't post. So give them the benefit of the doubt. Some of the best gasmes being made may need just a small push in the right direction. Who are we to hinder their ability to grow just cause they are new? Now I don't know everything and probably never will, but I do know that when people are looking for help and all they get is "Read the manual stupid" or "It's been posted a hundred times... go look for it", how does that help? I know the search engine here is not 100% perfect and something they may be looking for was posted under a different heading than what they were searching for. I'm not saying to stop what you are doing and give all your attention to the noobs (That would be ridiculous) but at least point them in the right direction. Give the noob a chance because they might come up with something you want later. We are here to help, not bash people. So let's help everyone by working together. If you don't wanna post a helpful hint or code snippet or something useful, then don't waste the noobs time by bashing them and insulting them and making them feel like they are unworthy to be in the forums. Be nice to someone cause you never know what they are capable of bringing to the table.

Ok, now that I have said my piece, I will run away and get back to work. Oh and for anyone who reads all of these posts in this thread... I GIVE YOU A PENGUIN ON CAFFINIE GO HAPPY FEET LOL

LIFE: "That thing that happens to us when we are too young to die"
~V.J.C. 2003
xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 16:54
If you put a thousand people from different countries, backgrounds, age groups and education level/interests in a room together they are going to seek out their own kind, or form cliques as some call them, and you will soon have rival entities. Anyone who has ever been to school knows this. It's just a fact of life and I don't see it changing any time soon.

Another fact of life is that when you join a forum, you're a noob (or newbie) and you get the treatment until you are assimilated into one of the existing groups or show enough moxie to stand on your own. Most blend into the forum in short time and become a productive part of the group as a whole, while some never do. Get over it and lets move move on.

As in any High School or College, it is the right of the seniors to goof on the freshmen, if you get my meaning, and most of them live through it with few scars. That being said, you should know that this is a very well behaved and trouble free forum. If you don't believe me, try some others out.

I realize that it is hard to tell when someone is being mean as opposed to trying to be funny. I sometimes come across as mean when I try to be funny, case in point some recent sexy_legs posts. My father told me once (I assign all great and wise sayings to my father whether he actually said them or not) "Never assume malice for what stupidity can explain." Likewise, you should not be offended by what you consider to be rude or offensive in many cases, as it is the person is just attempting humor.

I have started adding "lol" to the end of my posts so you will know.

Have a great time here and don't worry so much.

Brian.

I'm sorry, my answers are limited. You must ask the right question.

KeithC
Senior Moderator
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location: Michigan
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 17:11
I see a few problems here. First of all, these forums are here for people to help other people; but also for people to help themselves. How many times has someone asked a question, while saying that they searched first; only for someone to find out that they, in fact, did not search. Many of the relevent threads that could have helped someone, gets pushed down by these types of threads or by people asking multiple questions in several subsequent threads.

Sure, people (especially new users) need to be treated decently. But they also need to learn some self reliance, and strive to help themselves first (which doesn't mean you give up after skimming the first page's topics).

Some of the users here may come across as harsh, but that's just the way it is. If you don't like what they have to say, ignore them (unless they are breaking the AUP).

Take the FPSC Models and Media board for example; notice that "Models and Media" is under the sub-section "FPS Creator". What this says, is that this section/board is designated for models and media bound for use in "FPSCreator"....not a showcase for your latest non-FPSC related model. The same thing applies for the Showcase board....show us what you've made in (or for use with) FPSCreator. Screenshots are required; so don't think you can create a thread and come back with screenshots later, wait till you have them.

This brings me to another topic; READ THE STICKIES!, they weren't put up there because we were bored one day. There have been MANY threads started, asking questions that have already been answered in a sticky (with minimal searching required).

While we're on the topic of asking questions; do NOT create a title for your thread to the effect of: "A few questions", "What should I do", "I need help", etc. These will not produce favorable results for people that do try to search; and more than likely they thread will get ignored in the first place. There are hundreds of threads on these boards; make yours stand out.

-Keith

Locrian
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Nov 2005
Location: Burton Mi.
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 20:00 Edited at: 20th Dec 2006 20:18
OK, I've been out of this convo for a wile and I've listened for a bit. This was, after all intended for a somewhat civil "meeting of the minds" as it were. So with saying that I'm going to address a few of the post since I last chimed in.

@Conjured Entertainment,
You weren't named as an oversight, and names were just being rattled off. No more or less. And I fully agree with you on the following statement:
Quote: "There is nothing wrong with telling someone that something can be done without telling them how."
Most of your thread made sense except the parts sounding a lil petty, like you were being singled out of the 'in' crowd. We all know your working hard bro...Take a breath...it was just an oversight.

@Smitho,
Heh, I'd hate for people to be able to take points away...lol I know I play the villain, and am hated by a majority of people on these forums. This doesn't bother me, and I entertain the people I'd actually hang with outside the forums anyways. I know this. I'm not blind. I realize my forum etiquette isn't geared for people trying to learn. There's nothing wrong with learning. I learn every day. My complaint is the way 'others' conduct themselves. There lazy. Take the firefox guy or whatever. In his retaliation to me, he says "I read every thread and they all were asking the same questions as him or methods that don't work". Bullcrap man. The first post I showed in my image, was a link I put on the forums back in Aug. I don't care if people are lazy but don't lie to me. I know the links there, cause I posted it for everyone. You'll see I never post unless I'm 100% right when I'm attacking someone. See, I always make sure the information is available so I don't look like an idiot. It's so easy to right all the time on the internet because you have the time to be right, and research prior to hitting post. On the other hand, if I'm casually posting to someone I don't consider an idiot, I may post something wrong like when I forgot there was a 2 frame animated switch in a thread Rolfy was posting in. I can admit when I'm wrong....But you can bet your bottom dollar if I'm attacking someone...I've done my research

@Fred,
Bo on the karma, lol. I'd be playing 'My name is Earl' trying to rebuild my karma with all the guys I post to, feverishly clicking my minus button....lol. That works in a more "grown up" atmosphere, but I don't think it would work as well here as people would "grudge(well, your aware of the next word I'm sure)" you.

@mister shakes,
Quote: "or don't know how to use a search"

Come on man! Is that really our fault? If your that dumb(and Im not calling anyone in specific dumb), should you really be trying to make a game? I mean if you can't use a search do your really think it's fair to subject the masses to the idiocy that follows a person like that around? If you can't use a search you can't make a game. I suggest they sell the software on Ebay and count their losses before they get in to far.
Quote: "I search for zoom controls"

Thats fine. And when stuff didn't show up I'm sure you tried just the word "zoom" right? And I see there's not much there either. I also see where you posted and you speak well and carry yourself well. You may or may not know, S4 and myself have a set of binoculars,like the guy in that same thread was asking. We don't post cause we have no intention of releasing them. It's not selfish. It's our work. If you want an item(and not a gun) to be able to use zoom controls, have at it. We've proven it can be done, and if I don't say so myself, look marvelous doin it(my ode to Billy Crystal).
I also want to say Your not looked down upon for being new here ever. People like Rolfy, and now forum god, but still relatively new, Errant, if you word yourself correctly and don't act like a special needs child, you'll be easily accepted by all the guys with a little more experience. That's the way things work around here....Respect is earned...Not given.
I'm the one that made the comment about your views changing in a year. I'm yet to see you making dumb post though. You've only made four post here and I'm yet to get sarcastic or even answer in any one of them. The four post you have are legitimate questions and are thought provoking. Saying this I'm not sure why your on a soap box. Since you don't fall into the category of people that "The Good 'ole Boys" razz, You don't seem to be speaking from your own experience, which discredits anything your attempting to say. The guys that get the razzing don't need a champion...they need common sense..

@xplosys,
I agree with about everything you say so not much to respond to. The only thing I will add is that I have no plans to add "lol" to any of my post. The ones that get it, simply do.....the others, well, there just poop outta luck.

@KeithC,
What can I say? Your post, along with others, points out exactly what I'm saying most the time. I can't agree more with the whole section about models that actually make it into FPSC. I just don't give a care about models I'll never ever see in a game. And bumping a thread from Conjured(see I mentioned ya man), or Rolfy, or Fred, or any of the others we all know are actually getting things in games, just irritates the bajibers outta me. I just plain find it rude, and selfish when people could be posting their trials on the software board in which their mesh was made. Same way I'm not posting anyone's kids macaroni art on my fridge...I just could care less.

Peace all,
Loc
Swhale aka The FPS Creator
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Oct 2004
Location: My computer chair, no zip code sorry
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 21:01
Yes, thanks Loc, although it COULD have been done in a more sensitive manner, I was benefitted by your whatever-ness towords me. On the subject of holding peoples hands, I, for one, benefit the most from brainstorming. Xplosys has helped me a lot just by entertaining my ideas, creating a curiosity, and giving a little nudge here or there. I do apologise for being a noob, and have some cool stuff I'd like to give to the crowds here soon, kind of as my own self-induction into non-noobness.

Your signature has been erased by a mod because it's larger than 600x120
mister shakes
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 10th Dec 2006
Location: Amishville
Posted: 20th Dec 2006 21:10
@ Locrian

You make a valid point when you ask why I am even talking about this, and truthfully I dont have a really good reason. Something compelled me to make a statement defending some of the things that noobs are guilting of. I have absolutely no intention of being a noob leader (lol)!

Quote: "S4 and myself have a set of binoculars
"


That is exactly the answer I wanted to hear. I am the type that doesn't want gimmes. Yeah I admit if someone offers up a cool new script or model I will probably get it, and if I like it be sure I will make a comment about it. But I will side with everyone here about the freeloaders who do nothing but download free stuff all day long. Even my post about a really cheesy and unattractive way of making a character "drop" something got over 100 views and only 5 posts. Quite honestly I dont even intend to use that anymore so more power to the people that cant figure out a better way to do it. Anyways, I just want to know if it can be done, you said it could and now I know that my efforts will be worth it.

So I will end my posting to this thread(unless someone calls me out) by just saying that yes, I am a noob. I have noob tendencies. But I have no intention of staying in noobdom. I wont get there taking everyones work. If the boobs seek a leader they must look elsewhere. I mean noobs....

OUT

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2024-11-25 22:18:54
Your offset time is: 2024-11-25 22:18:54