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FPSC Classic Models and Media / **AE's WWII Weapon Pack**

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Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 14:17 Edited at: 20th Feb 2007 14:20
Hi guys,

It's been a while since our WIP thread was moved to the 3D chat forum and since then, we have had less response to our (mine and Airslide's) pack. So, I'm posting this thread as a sort of step foward.

This is no longer a "Possible WWII weapon pack" but a definite WWII weapon pack. So, without further ado, i'd like to present what we've got so far:

-------------------------------------------------------------------
Textured Guns:
The STG44 (aka the MP44):








The Luger (the first one i textured):






The M1 Garand




The Sten (MKII)



-------------------------------------------------------------------
Modelled Guns:
So you don't have to keep looking back on the old thread, here are the pics of the guns i've modelled (excluding the ones i've textured):

The BAR (Browning Automatic Rifle)


The Bren


The Gewehr 43



The K98


The K98 (scoped)


The Lee Enfield

The Lee Enfield with a test texture


The Lee Enfield (scoped)



The Mossin Nagant


The Mossin Nagant (scoped)


The PPSH


The Springfield 1903


The Springfield 1903 (scoped)


The Stick Grenade


The Webley

-------------------------------------------------------------------
Important Notes on the weapon pack:
This pack will NOT be free
The estimated price is £10-£15
The pack will contain 18 weapons
An expansion pack may also be sold, containing new weapons a extra textures (such as normal maps) for this pack
All guns will be animated
You will be able to purchase it from Tanner Productions
You will be able to use these weapons in commercial and non-commercial projects.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
In this thread, I will post updates and pictures of our Work in Progress. At the moment, i am currently texturing while Airslide is beginning to animate.

C&C is greatly appreciated, so post your comments here!

Enjoy salivating over the pics

AE

Strelok
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 14:52
wow that pack loking very good !
well done !
Slayer_2
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 16:54
I have a few questions are any of them going to have hands, are any of them going to have Ironsights and are any of them going to be really fast firing like the PPSH40 or somthing.
Slayer_2

Elite OPS Terrorstrike a modern shooter check it out below

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Phlum
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 17:15
If you can't do the hands I'll sort them out with hands if you like. It'll take a couple of hours, and I'm NOT asking for the pack free. Also, are any of these in FPSC? and will you do an MP40?
Lookin' good!

-Phlumecheese

[center]
Smitho
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 18:00
Looking alright so far.. The only things i can point out is that the guns such as the PPSH40 and Webley look ultra square which is a shame. Im sure the textures will make that less obvious. Also, on the Lee enflield, the white square edges are still visible on the stock. LAst time i brought this up, someone said it wont be visible, but it will be so on the pickups. Just a few points
Looks pretty solid apart from those 2 pointers

Dan

Urlforce Studios
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 18:44
Beautiful. (Wipes Tear) These make me feel like making a great WWII game Nicely done my friend.

He said, "You drink when you're lonely." No I drink when I want!
He said, "You'll never be sober." Sure. Why would I want that?
AlanC
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 19:05
Will It be in the US too?


Opposing force
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 19:20
I would definetly consider buying this pack, if I can see a video showcasing the weapons, once you've finished them

Burianu
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 19:24
Looking great so far, can't wait 'till it's out so I can get it!

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"62" he said...
Johny English
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Posted: 20th Feb 2007 19:29
Oh, great pack!

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Airslide
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Posted: 21st Feb 2007 00:55
AE, are you going to send me the STG44? I think we should go easy weapons first then up (so we have more to show), and the luger is no easy weapon to animate with that back...thingy...what do you call that anyways?

RedneckRambo
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Posted: 21st Feb 2007 01:42 Edited at: 21st Feb 2007 01:43
aaaaaaaaaaaa it's toooooo good! Sorry AE I still have to get model pack 6 first. But afterwards I'll definitely by this.

Actually I don't know. Maybe I'll get this first. I've always wanted WW2 weapons with hands.

Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 21st Feb 2007 16:33
Thanks for all your replies:
@ OLEG:
Thanks, i appreciate your comments

@ Slayer_2:
Yes, all the weapons will have hands. But, to remain historically correct, none of the weapons will be dual-weild.

Yes, hopefully most of the guns will have ironsights (excluding the stick grenade and the scoped weapons).

The rate-of-fire shall be based on real-life. Yes, the PPSH will be fast-firing and i think so will the BAR, Bren, STG44 and Sten. I hoping to get the non-scoped rifles firing faster than the scoped variations too.

@ Phlum:
It's Ok, i've modelled some hands, but i've still worked on the texure at the moment. Non of the weapons are working weapons in FPSC yet, the STG44 was merely my obligatory 'in-FPSC' shot.

@ Smitho:
Quote: "guns such as the PPSH40 and Webley look ultra square"

Yes, at the moment they do. I generally tweak my models just before UV mapping so they should look a little more rounded in the end. It could also be to do with my lighting setup in the render. And the Lee Enfield is just a test texture. It was the first gun i ever UV mapped, so i'll probably do it again later.

@ Urlforce studios:
Thanks, i've been thinking the same thing. Lets hope Dark AI can at least provide us with some good gameplay on such small maps.

@ AlanC:
Ofcourse it will be in the US. £15.00 is about $29.00 or so.

@ Opposing force:
I will most definately make a showcase video

@ Burianu:
Thanks!

@ Johny English:
Thanks! I know how you like your WWII games!

@ Airslide:
Yes, i will send you the STG44. However, i'm having a few problems here, so it'll be a couple of days. BTW, according to wiki, that back bit on the Luger is a "jointed arm mechanism", the joint itself being called the "knee" or "Kniegelenk".

@ Jenkins:
Thanks for your support.

-------------------------------------------
At the moment, i've just got the K98 scoped mapped out. I figured that if a do the scoped version first, i can just delete the scope and mounts later to make the non-scoped version. It should speed things up a little, so i'll use it for all 4 of the scoped rifles (2 birds with 1 stone if you will...)

AE

Slayer_2
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Posted: 21st Feb 2007 17:05 Edited at: 21st Feb 2007 17:07
lol I didn't ask for dual weild but I have a request I know I know but how bout and MG-42, MG-34 or DP-28 for a super weapon?
Slayer_2
P.S. this looks so good I may stop thinking about making a sci-fi game and instead make a WWII one.

EOT Check it out
http://eliteops.piczo.com
Smitho
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Posted: 21st Feb 2007 17:54
Quote: "Yes, at the moment they do. I generally tweak my models just before UV mapping so they should look a little more rounded in the end. It could also be to do with my lighting setup in the render. And the Lee Enfield is just a test texture. It was the first gun i ever UV mapped, so i'll probably do it again later."


Awesome, i really look forward to seeing those improvements

Me Self
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Posted: 21st Feb 2007 23:44
How about a 30.cal those things are light enough to carry . As i requested mg42 in old thread saying it was to heavy .

Fletch the best .
Roger Wilco
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2007 21:39
Too bad I don't have any WW2-oriented game planned out, this pack looks amazing.

"Or perhaps we're just one of god's little jokes?"
Silent Thunder
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2007 23:45
all I can say is, wow............

I would definetly consider buying this pack.


Quote: "I will most definately make a showcase video"

can't wait for it


Click on the picture to order your copy today!
Inspire
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2007 03:47
Very very extremely nice AE. Well done.

Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2007 16:53
Thanks for your feedback,

@ Slayer_2:
Quote: "how bout and MG-42, MG-34 or DP-28 for a super weapon?"

Yes, it would be possible to make an MG-42 but, its more of a stationary weapon and requires 2 people to operate.

@ Me self:
Again, a .30 cal requires two people to operate; one to fire, and one to feed in the bullets.

@ Smitho:
Thanks, i'll wait a little before i attempt the Lee Enfield again.

@ Roger Wilco:
Thanks!

@ Silent Thunder:
Quote: "all I can say is, wow............"

I try to be modest but even i'm amazed at the results so far. I never thought the textures would be this good.

@ Inspire:
Thank you, Inspire!

@ Airslide:
I'm buying milkshape tonight so i can convert the models in to .3ds (i would use the demo but it only lasted 30 days and i'm getting fed up with downloading it every month). The stg should be wih your shortly.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
UPDATE:
Well, at last, i've finally finished the K98. Using my new technique, i was able to get the scoped version and the original version done at once. I don't usually post more than three pictures of a gun but i've got 2 this time so...

Here's a full-body render of both of them. I might make some alterations to the scoped version to make it less similar to the original.


Here's a close-up of the mounts on the scoped version. You'll notcie a few texture problems here on the scope. These will be ironed out for the final version. May i again remind you that this is just the model with the diffuse texture, no normal/bump map or specular maps.


And here's a similar shot of the original K98, from the other side. I may add a little shading on the wood to make it more interesting and realistic.


This one shows off the detail on the original. This is also of the scoped version, however the "byf" and "42" bits are covering by the scope mounts.


Lastly, i thought you guys would want to see the scope. Also note the detail on the focusing knob on top of the scope.


Well, that's it for another week. I might have a rest for the rest of the day and see if i can decide what gun to texture next (it won't be a rifle, that's for sure).

C&C is welcome, wanted and appreciated

AE

KeithC
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2007 18:55
This is some great work, A.E. Nice texturing and attention to detail. This should pretty much be the standard FPSC pack, as far as a complete set of WWII weapons, when it's complete. I'd like to see the texturing on your hands when it's done, as well. With some great animations to go with it (and custom sounds), I can see it becoming an official pack...should you choose to go that route.

Can't wait to see the finished product.

-Keith

Slayer_2
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2007 20:22
MG 42s don't take two pople you just have to deploy them (red orcrastra)

EOT Check it out
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Silent Thunder
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 00:23
Quote: "MG 42s don't take two pople you just have to deploy them (red orcrastra)"


unless it is an mg42 light machine gun.


Click on the picture to order your copy today!
Astrojazz
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 06:56
I really like it, but don't you think $30 is a bit much?

Boom.
FredP
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 07:13
Quote: "I really like it, but don't you think $30 is a bit much?"

Well,let's go over a few points.
He hasn't released it yet so that price is,at this point in time,an estimate.
Have you ever animated and imported weapons?It's not like you just waved a magic wand and kazaam! your weapons appear in FPSC.
You have to model,rig,animate,texture and import them into FPSC.
With the exception of character making,making weapons is the most difficult thing to do.
My advice is if you want the pack then pay whatever he asks for it.
If not,therre are plenty of free weapons you can find in the models and media forum.
AE has sold stuff on here before.I don't know if his crosshair pack is still for sale but if it is I would buy it.
If not...you lost out.
Go anywhere else and try to find weapons,characters,models,etc. for what forum members charge for them on the FPSC forums.It's not going to happen.
What is going to happen when the people that are charging minimal prices for stuff actually raise them to what the going rate would be elsewhere?
At any rate until the pack is released we don't have to worry about it.

@AE,
I haven't posted in this thread yet because I moved the other one to 3D Chat and I want you to know that was nothing personal.I have always liked your work and I bought the crosshair pack and I am very satisfied with it.
These are some excellent looking weapons.Keep up the good work.

Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 09:37
Thanks Fred, i knew it wasn't anything personal; but I thought i'd better get a new thread so i can get the communities comments.

@ Astrojazz:
$30 isn't really that much. Consider this:

Processes involved:
Modelling
Texturing (Inc. UV Mapping)
Animating (Inc. Rigging etc)
Sound Recording/editing
Making final (i.e. making it FPSC ready)

Now lets take a look at the timings:
Modelling: 2 hrs
Texturing: 5-8 hrs
Animating: 2-5 hrs
Sound Recording/Editing: 1-3 hrs
Making Final: 1-2 hrs

At minimum that's about 11 hours...per gun. So you can times all that by 18 (in this case) and you'll get 198 hours at work on one pack, and it's likely to be more.

I'm having to sell the gun pack about £10-15. This works out at only 0.075p per hour! If this were the real world, and i was working at the minimum wage for a 15 year old in Britian (£3.60), this would make the pack worth £712.80! I'd be luckly if i made a fraction of that now. In fact, i'd have to sell 48 units to reach this figure. That's unlikely to happen without TGC marketting (as Keith suggested) and then i'd have to worry about the percentage that TGC would take for themselves.

We need to stop this idea that all media should be free. I, for one, would have no problem charging £20, £30 or even £50 (yes, that $100) for my pack. The only trouble is that very few would buy it. So really, when you consider the work involved, i think $30 is a bargin.

@ Slayer_2
Really, i would hardly call Red Orchestra a reliable historical reference. Nor any war game for that matter (CoD2 can't even put a scope on the mosin nagant the correct way). Even so, it matters little because we have 18 guns already and i think that's enough.

AE
P.S: I couldn't resist tweaking my next gun. So i've pretty much remodelling the BAR...

Smitho
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 10:20 Edited at: 24th Feb 2007 10:22
Quote: "(CoD2 can't even put a scope on the mosin nagant the correct way)."


There's a good chance it was an adapted. It is well known that when in the field, soliders will adapt their setups to better match their way of using the weapon. I reckon CoD2 did this to make it more realistic. EG - In the field soliders will strap together 2 clips the opposite ways so they can flip the magazine, rather than remove, put away, retrieve a new on, put it in, cock (Including my Father in the Belfast "situation".). This hasnt been done except for on BF2 (Out of the games i've played, so I reckon its a realism thing.

As for the price, I do think it's a little bit steep. Sure, it seems cheap when you write out all of that work in longhand. Users on these forums wont think about how long it took, they will just think its too much. People dont think about long things have taken to make, they only think about the value for money. I remember Jon was in the predicament, before TGC offered to sell his pack as MP5.

Quote: "I'm having to sell the gun pack about £10-15. This works out at only 0.075p per hour!"


But when you work in Britain, you only get the one pay... This has the chance of selling multiple times..

Johny English
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 11:05
After the finished pack you can sell models (turbosquid, ...). About MG42 - make a mobile MG42.

SIXOFT - This is not just a game, this is a SIXOFT game.
FredP
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 12:36
Quote: "because we have 18 guns already and i think that's enough. "


Sheesh!Two posts above this one...
He's done making guns and in the process (I hope) of completing the pack at this time.
@AE,
Maybe you should check with TGC about a deal.Even if you don't feel you would make as much or sell as many copies as you would otherwise the model pack would still be on the FPSC page with the other ones so when new users come along they will buy your pack along with the others.
So you might get more sales in the long run.
Another suggestion might be to market this weapon pack outside FPSC.
Making it (or at least the models) available for other engines might increase your profits as well.
I wish you luck on this.I know you have been working a long time on this pack...because i am STILL waiting on it...
Seriously,this is some good work and I hope you do get reimbursed quite well for it.

Johny English
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 18:59
I think that - cooperate with TGC, make a model pack 7! But I mean you want sell it on your page.

SIXOFT - This is not just a game, this is a SIXOFT game.
Airslide
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 21:54
Still waitin' for the STG44 AE

Slayer_2
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Posted: 24th Feb 2007 23:33
Yeah whatever but I checked on youtube and MG-42s are one man. But they could be wrong. I can't wait for the pack.
Slayer_2

EOT Check it out
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Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 25th Feb 2007 00:27
Quote from Wiki:
Quote: "The operating crew of an MG42 consisted of three men: the gunner, the ammunition loader (also barrel carrier), and the spotter. The gunner of the weapon was preferably a junior non-commissioned officer (or Unteroffizier). It was possible for operating crews to lay down a non-stop barrage of fire, ceasing only when the barrel had to be replaced. This allowed the three-man crew of an MG42 to tie up significantly larger numbers of enemy troops."


And similar can be said for the .30 cal:
Quote: "As an infantry weapon, it was usually crew operated by 2 soldiers: the gunner, who carried the tripod and ammunition; and the assistant gunner, who carried the weapon, spare parts, and sometimes more ammunition and when in action fed the ammunition belts into the gun to ensure smooth entry of each round in the belt, decreasing the chance of the weapon jamming."


AE

rolfy
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Posted: 25th Feb 2007 01:50 Edited at: 25th Feb 2007 01:53
As always great attention to detail,A.E.

Quote: "It's not like you just waved a magic wand and kazaam! your weapons appear in FPSC."

Elven magic?
Airslide
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Posted: 25th Feb 2007 05:38
Oh, AE, are you making an FG42? I love that....I can find some refrence if you like. It's in COD (1), I just got CoD 2 and haven't found it (finished Russian Campain) in their yet though (might not have it).

outlander
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Posted: 25th Feb 2007 20:30
Hey mate can you tell me what modelling program you use to make these guns.
Astrojazz
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Posted: 26th Feb 2007 05:19
@ AE
Point taken. 11 hours per gun? How many are you doing?

Boom.
Reality Forgotten
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
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Posted: 26th Feb 2007 06:35
Here's your sign........18 guns is what I believe he said.


Hey good work mate

Cheers!
RF


Smitho
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Posted: 26th Feb 2007 22:59
Quote: "Hey mate can you tell me what modelling program you use to make these guns."


If nothing has changed since i last spoke to him, he uses Anim8or.

Airslide
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Posted: 27th Feb 2007 01:48
11 hours might be pushing it...I ain't no speed animator

i married acow
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Posted: 27th Feb 2007 02:51
WOW! These guns are beautiful. Now I have the need to make a WWII game. But these guns are so amazing, I think I'll wait for them to be released before starting that game, no matter how long the wait.
Airslide
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Posted: 28th Feb 2007 03:59 Edited at: 28th Feb 2007 03:59
Here's a pic of the STG44 (currently being animated) in game. The positioning is still ify, and you can see AE needs to fix up the hand texture (exclude the sleeve) but the gun itself is pretty nice.



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Cheese Cake
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Posted: 28th Feb 2007 13:54
This weapon-pack looks great!
I cant wait to see more of this.

Therapy has taught me that nothing is my fault.
Airslide
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Posted: 28th Feb 2007 16:11
Here's a video of the STG44 in game. The hand conforms to the weapon a bit better, and I've finished the select and idle animations (select needs a little tweaking though). The muzzleflash is a little low, but you can see the smoke and brass fine.

C&C Welcome.

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max ballwinkle
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Posted: 28th Feb 2007 16:15
kool


B-A-L-L-W-I-N-K-L-E
Airslide
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Posted: 1st Mar 2007 05:42
STG44 Pre-Final Video
This video shows all of the animations. They may need some tweaking but the basic motion for everything is there.

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Johny English
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Posted: 1st Mar 2007 09:52
Looks also great but animation of reload looks like slowly.

SIXOFT - This is not just a game, this is a SIXOFT game.
Airslide
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Posted: 1st Mar 2007 15:42
The reload is mainly slow because the video ran @25 fps. The other one was a normal 30-33, it probally dropped because of lightmapping. I might be able to speed it up but I'm not sure. It seemed to be fairly quick compared to what a soldier can normally do on the battle feild anyways, so I figured it was fine.

RedneckRambo
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Posted: 1st Mar 2007 16:21
The reload speed seemed rather quick if anything. I hate to say this, but the hand on that gun looks kind of silly.

max ballwinkle
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Posted: 1st Mar 2007 18:33
cas the textures not finished

Quote: "AE needs to fix up the hand texture"



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