Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

3 Dimensional Chat / The Future of RealTime 3D!...gasp!...

Author
Message
DrFx
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2003
Location:
Posted: 17th May 2003 19:08
Link
Ok, what lies ahead beyond textures, lightmaps, etc?...
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,1091416,00.asphttp://graphics.ucsd.edu/~henrik/
Back to top
Profile PM
actarus
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 29th Aug 2002
Location: 32 Light Years away
Posted: 17th May 2003 19:32
Link
Yup,gasp!

Caught by the Fuzz,well I was,still on my buzz
In the back of the Van,with my,head in my hands
Back to top
Profile PM
Mentor
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 17th May 2003 21:42
Link
oh goody, raytracing!, now thats what I would call a 3d card , mind you the last raytracer I used didnt refract a beam of light into its component colours, hope it`s better than that (yes...I do want a lot)

Mentor.

Back to top
Profile PM
DrFx
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2003
Location:
Posted: 17th May 2003 21:58
Link
Quote: "oh goody, raytracing!, now thats what I would call a 3d card "


Even better than raytracing, photon mapping! The second link above the picture is the webpage of a guy whop does research on this.

Back to top
Profile PM
Shadow Robert
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 18th May 2003 02:21
Link
sorry to burst your bubble by GI & Raytracing are already in realtime thanks to the NV30 & NV35 chipsets...
infact have been for a good year for the community and almost 2 for those working with the Shader Technologies.

you'd be surprised at what you can achieve when you eleviate the main processors abilities, anyone with a high-end GPU now effectly has 2 CPUs in thier machine capable of the same level of calculations.
that said the picture provided is not photon mapping (GI) its Raytracing, i can explain how i know that but i'll let you try to figure it out first

Within the Epic battle of the fates the Shadow and the Angel will meet. With it will harbinger the very fight of good vs evil!
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
DrFx
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2003
Location:
Posted: 18th May 2003 02:40
Link
Quote: "that said the picture provided is not photon mapping (GI) its Raytracing, i can explain how i know that but i'll let you try to figure it out first
"


I won´t argue that you can have realtime raytracing nowadays, as a reflective raytraced object uses basically a procedural map (the raytrace material). But perhaps you should have read the page where I got that sample from. That picture in particular is not rendered in real-time, but the author(Henrik Wann Jensen) achieved similar results in "real" real-time renderings. And you're also partially true, the pic does use raytracing, but it also uses soft shadows, caustics(photon mapping) and GI.
From the Jensen page:

"Cornell box series showing the effect of simulating global illumination. All the images have been rendered at 1024x768 with 4 samples per pixel on a Dual P3 800MHz Linux-PC. The ray tracing version took 1.5 seconds, The version with soft shadows took 7 seconds. Adding caustics increased the rendering time to 10 seconds and 2 seconds of photon tracing. The global illumination version took 12 seconds to render and 3 seconds of photon tracing time. For this scene the global photon map has 200,000 photons and the caustics photon map has 50,000 photons.

Finally, the path tracing reference image on the right took a long time to render. The important thing to notice is that it looks the same as the version rendered using photon mapping."

Back to top
Profile PM
DrFx
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 8th Mar 2003
Location:
Posted: 18th May 2003 02:52
Link
The "real" real-time, courtesy of nVidia and Stanford University:



Back to top
Profile PM
APEXnow
Retired Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 15th Apr 2003
Location: On a park bench
Posted: 18th May 2003 04:09
Link
It's about time. I've seen scenes generated with POVRay that'll make your jaw drop. When 3D hardware can do this kind of calculation in real time. We will not be able to tell the difference between the dream world, and the real world..... Hang on, I've heard this before.... Blue pill, red pill,..... Ahh yesh, Now I remember..... Ahhhhhoooooogggghhhhhhssssss ( Welcome to the real world LOL)

"Man who looses key to woman's appartment...... He get no nookie" - A wise chinese man.
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Shadow Robert
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 18th May 2003 08:56
Link
well i think i have a few words to say to some of the nDev community - but well atleast i can take solis in the fact that their renderings look pretty piss quality.

something i've always disliked when people do these things i they can't make the effects as cleanly as they appear in real-life (so no worries about needing the blue pill yet)
nVidia release a demonstration of my Luma'Sha engine on monday's release of the FX 5900 and i think you'll be able to see the difference between realtime raytrace/gi/photonics and my Luma'Sha
you think games look sweet now ... i think you'll be pleasently surprised

have a screenshot of the test program i made for it, with a swat guy breaks into a house and you see some of the effects at work ... especially when he lets ripp in the kitchen to kill a mouse

Within the Epic battle of the fates the Shadow and the Angel will meet. With it will harbinger the very fight of good vs evil!
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
APEXnow
Retired Moderator
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 15th Apr 2003
Location: On a park bench
Posted: 18th May 2003 14:52
Link
Raven, I bet that looks sweet, and funny! Any chance of a glimpse?

"Man who looses key to woman's appartment...... He get no nookie" - A wise chinese man.
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Mentor
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Aug 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 19th May 2003 20:24
Link
<puts on cracked old voice> In my day we would have called it raytracing with caustics/highlights, thats not an accurate picture though, there should be some slight "rainbow" at the edge of the refracted highlight, like I say, you can USUALY spot a raytraced image by some deficiencies like prisms or point shadow bridges don`t work in raytracer land, you can fake em, but they arent there in the engine its`self, if you have some render software then try it, put a beam of light through a glass prism and place two rounded objects very close to one another (like fingertips nearly touching), you won`t get a rainbow from the prism and no shadow between the nearly touching objects, you can try this yourself, bring your fingertips close together and just before they touch a "shadow" forms in the gap when it gets too close for a lightwave to fit inside, raytracers assume lightrays are simple lines to save on math.

Mentor.

Back to top
Profile PM
Shadow Robert
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 20th May 2003 12:08
Link
i know what you mean mentor... it was something i was determined to reproduce within my own Rendering engine, i'm sure the current results will be seen soon enough when Milkshape2 is released.

Raytracing, GI, Radiosity Engines etc... don't take into consideration the refraction specifics of light, as the refraction and reflection of the lightbeams changes its frequency and with it the colour and power of the projected image

however Multipass Renders do a very good reproduction job of it which i've been working towards using ... if anyone has the nvSDK or Cg Toolkit will no doubt have seen the realtime multipass Fresnel Reflection/Refraction example. That accurately depics the colour balance within the object - only is using the skybox maps to achieve it. Isn't raytracing or actual casting of anykind.
Fortunately the GeForceFX chipsets Light Shaders actually allows far faster light routines, which can allow for a second pass of the colour, you add a third pass caustic and you have some very impressively realistic effects that these guys aren't even close to achieving.

i'm sure it'll only be a matter of time until the majority of users catchup with the nVidia Alpha Development Community but for now guess your stuck to waiting for what nVidia release as showing the power of the cards.

Within the Epic battle of the fates the Shadow and the Angel will meet. With it will harbinger the very fight of good vs evil!
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
AlecM
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 26th Aug 2002
Location: Concord, MA
Posted: 22nd May 2003 23:55
Link
Raven, im pretty sure that that IS GI. Notice the sharing of color between to floor and walls.

Goto http://www.shellshockede.com
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Back to top

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2024-05-09 10:49:28
Your offset time is: 2024-05-09 10:49:28