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Dark GDK / TODO for the next release of DGDK.NET (v1.0.10.0)

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david w
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Posted: 1st Mar 2008 00:22
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OOP whats that?
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monotonic
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Posted: 1st Mar 2008 00:45
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Object Oriented Programming

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david w
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Posted: 1st Mar 2008 00:49
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nice.
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kBessa
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Posted: 1st Mar 2008 01:00
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Yeah, just like I did with LightEngine: LightObject myCar = new LightObject("car.x");

I'm a genious! LOL


Oh, and afaik, with the "termination" of the Authenticator, you could use DGDK.NET with virtually any .NET language: C#, VB.NET, C++/CLI, Delphi, J#, F#, SML.NET, ADA.NET, Cobol.NET, LOLcode... name it!

PS: LOLcode is.... LOL
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Rye
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Posted: 1st Mar 2008 06:45
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the problem with wrappers is that they still rely on the object id's.

i can only speculate on how DGDK works. but since there is a limit on the number of objects, and each object requires a number, i can only guess that DGDK uses some kind of array/linked list.

This means that if you want object 300, your code will traverse along all objects, starting at object 1, until it gets to object 300. Much slower than just a pointer to an object.

Of course, using pointers would require you to have your own object management code. Making sure not to lose pointers to objects, finding objects, inserting objects into your list etc...

Still, i'd prefer that to having to manage object numbers. I think it would greatly improve performance.
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monotonic
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Posted: 1st Mar 2008 10:15
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Quote: "This means that if you want object 300, your code will traverse along all objects, starting at object 1, until it gets to object 300"



NOt necessarily, if this is the case then it would be an index into an array of pointers i.e. Object[iID]->.....

Another thing you have to take into account is the amount of overhead that comes with object oriented code.

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GabrielX
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Posted: 4th Mar 2008 14:12
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I would like to get rid of the GLut-like command prompt window that appears before the main window shows. Is annoying and you can't release a game like that.
Also, I subscribe to the request of loading objects from memory.
More obvious widescreen support (i saw on the forums that it can be done) would be good
4. The documentation to be integrated in MSDN, and to be really a documentation.
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nodapro
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Posted: 20th Mar 2008 21:16
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Can we have a function like "void dbSuspendForKeyOrMouse ( void )"? I really need it in Dark GDK. But I guess it helps if the .NET has one (then GDK for C++ may include it too). Sorry, didn't find a TODO list for GDK on this forum.

dbSuspendForKeyOrMouse
This command will pause the program from running until a key is pressed or a mouse button is pressed. To detect for a specific key or a specific mouse button, please refer to the dbKeyState and dbMouseClick command.

Thank you so much!
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jason p sage
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Posted: 24th Mar 2008 16:55
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You know, I'm not sure what this thread is really all about except for asking things like "No Console Window during Startup" because I don't think APEX is going to be extending DarkGDK.Net, just implementing the wrappers for DarkGDK.Net.

If I was to request "something" for DarkGDK.Net it would not be about the CORE which is an animal in its own right, but about a OOP layer like light engine or like my C++ one. However the problems with this are that each developer might have their own OOP ideas and having the freedom to build your own system is attractive to me.

Personally I think DarkGDK.Net is going to be great no matter what. APEX and TGC won't let it out unless it wraps GDK successfully I would imagine.

If this is done, then the ease of fixing GDK generally for both DarkGDK and DarkGDK.Net I think will be easier for TGC.

THIS IS WHAT I WANT. SEAMLESS Integration - where DarkGDK.Net and DarkGDK have the same caommands, same datatypes (where possible), and same functionality. This will only make supporting and upgrading both "Kits" easier and is what we need I believe so as things are fixed or improved in GDK - the Rollout can be for both versions of GDK - C++ and .Net.

Jason


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monotonic
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Posted: 24th Mar 2008 17:02
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I agree Jason, the only thing I'm concerned about at the minute is forcing the end user to install the GDK.NET runtime before they can play your game. It would be nice if this could be incorporated into the game installation, in the background.

Much good work is lost for the lack of a little more.
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jason p sage
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Posted: 24th Mar 2008 21:47
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That does suk to no end.


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chief Archon
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2008 15:33
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1) I looked at the codebase section today (http://www.thegamecreators.com/?m=codebase_list) and I found no listing for DKGDK? Id like to see some code for us in that codebase please.

2) Id like to see some kind of forum where people can place coding examples for DkGDK.

3) At the moment it seams that 90% of the forums are very geared towards the other versions and this is to be expected, but its not easy to see which stuff does apply to DKGDK.

4) I also think that the code snippets section is another place where [GDK] threads are lost amongst the [DBP] threads. A better separation would be more encourageing to those considering DKGDK.

I think that all of the above is significant for something as new as DKGDK or at least one where such a smaller community mixed in with a larger one.

At the moment, the seeming scarcity of example data is affecting my ability to make a serious choice towards moving to DKGDK. not to mention the fact that I still have 1 post asking for help since 24th of March which to date, no one has answered not even the staff! http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=126577&b=22

note: all references to DKGDK also apply to GDK.NET equally.

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MonkeyMug
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Posted: 25th Apr 2008 09:35
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How come there is no Wiki of the documentation?

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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 29th Apr 2008 01:39
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To add to the list of suggestions: Hopefully DarkGDK.NET has DestroyTerrain()? The absence of this is stalling my project to be honest...

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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Manao
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Posted: 7th May 2008 15:31
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A better documentation would be RULES.
I mean, something that looks like VS.NET docs format (colors, examples, links presentations) with online stuffs, "see also" sessions, screen shots, how-to's, assumptions for simple programs (like default states of variables, camera, lights, etc), and so on.
Sometimes is hard to figure out what's going on in your program when you are a dumb beginner like me.

That's hard to find answers for questions like:
- Why the object colors look odd?
- Why camera is moving around when I didn't command it to?
- Why the size of objects are different when you simply call MakeObject(size=10) functions rather than MakeObject(size=1) and then ScaleObject(size=10)?

You know, explanations for dummies like me.

No signature. It's dumb.
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monotonic
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Posted: 8th May 2008 18:53
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Quote: "Why the object colors look odd?"


Not sure without further explanation.

Quote: "Why camera is moving around when I didn't command it to?"


If your camera is moving around when you make objects then you need to call the following function before any loading/making.

(I'm not sure what this is called in GDK.NET but I'm sure it's not that different)


Quote: "Why the size of objects are different when you simply call MakeObject(size=10) functions rather than MakeObject(size=1) and then ScaleObject(size=10)?"


ScaleObject scales the said object by a percentage, so scaling an object by 10 means you are reducing the size to 1/10th the original. So, to scale an object to be 10x larger you would scale it by a factor of 1000 (100% * 10)

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jason p sage
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Posted: 19th May 2008 18:38
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Quote: "DarkGDK.NET has DestroyTerrain()? "
Why can't you just delete the object? Its just a ton of limbs after all.... isn't it? I thought that's all the STOCK Terrain was.


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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 19th May 2008 20:50
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Quote: "Quote: "DarkGDK.NET has DestroyTerrain()? "
Why can't you just delete the object? Its just a ton of limbs after all.... isn't it? I thought that's all the STOCK Terrain was.
"


When you use dbMakeObjectTerrain() followed eventually by dbBuildTerrain(), you are correct it does create a bunch of limbs. And from my experience I tried exactly your suggestion of deleting the object and found (after searching the forums) that when dbDeleteObject() is called on the terrain, the object can no longer be referrenced (i.e. dbObjectExist() returns false) but for whatever reason the terrain is still in memory. Attempting to create a different terrain object with the same number produces an error (the wonderfully descriptive error message "6"). Needless to say, after said error no other commands on the object can be performed. Correct me if I'm wrong (please!) but I, and others here, haven't found a way to remove a terrain and insert a fresh one in DarkGDK.

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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KISTech
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Posted: 19th May 2008 23:05
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Do we know when the next DarkGDK.Net is going to be released?

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jason p sage
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Posted: 20th May 2008 01:38
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@KISTech - I haven't heard anything.

@Shadow Fan 0 - there is a command I never knew about until needing it for another reason - but have you tried the sbChangeMesh command?

It MIGHT free things - dunno - Might not seeing how it says object doesn't exist. But - In DP, if you scale an object - the new size isn't reflected in DP - so you make a mesh of it, (afer scaled) then dbChangeMesh to the new scaled one - and the old "goes away" ... maybe there is a trick hidden in there to help. dunno.


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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 20th May 2008 02:21
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Quote: "@Shadow Fan 0 - there is a command I never knew about until needing it for another reason - but have you tried the sbChangeMesh command?

It MIGHT free things - dunno - Might not seeing how it says object doesn't exist. But - In DP, if you scale an object - the new size isn't reflected in DP - so you make a mesh of it, (afer scaled) then dbChangeMesh to the new scaled one - and the old "goes away" ... maybe there is a trick hidden in there to help. dunno."


If I understand dbChangeMesh correctly, then I believe it could be used to change Advanced Terrains on the fly. The parameter int iObject would just be the Advanced Terrain's Object Number and the int iMesh parameter would be the new terrain's mesh loaded in prior with dbLoadMesh(). My only concern is the command's 2nd parameter (int iLimb). I'll admit I'm not sure what to pass it...

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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Niels Henriksen
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@KISTech - we get no info.... I have skipped .NET now and focus on C++ instead...

Niels Henriksen
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KISTech
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Posted: 20th May 2008 18:26
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Quote: "I have skipped .NET now and focus on C++ instead..."


Sounds like the better route to go anyway I guess. I was really hoping to use VB. Ah well, stuff happens, and we keep pluggin' away at the code..

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monotonic
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 02:56
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What's happening with this, does anybody know. As far as I know Apex was finalising the doc's a couple of months ago.

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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 3rd Jun 2008 05:15
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Quote: "What's happening with this, does anybody know. As far as I know Apex was finalising the doc's a couple of months ago."


Excellent question! I was hoping it would be in the last newsletter, but alas, it was not... You know as much as I do at least.

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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monotonic
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Posted: 5th Jun 2008 22:02 Edited at: 5th Jun 2008 22:04
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I don't know why TGC doesn't just create a DLL that contains all of the GDK functionality. This is how it has been done with a few other engines including B3DSDK & Leadwerks, this way you can use GDK with any language you like (obviously it must be able to load Dlls).

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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 5th Jun 2008 23:55
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I think that's what they're doing with the new .NET, correct me if I'm wrong.

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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monotonic
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Posted: 5th Jun 2008 23:58
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Really, that would be nice, and indeed a sensible business move by TGC. If this is true, then there will be a much larger market for GDK.

Out of interest, where did you get this info?

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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 6th Jun 2008 04:38
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I seem to remember reading it in another topic. I think it's the "Dark GDK is now Free with Visual Studio" topic. I'll have to look again.

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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Yogz
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Posted: 11th Jul 2008 18:12
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Any news on when Dark GDK .Net will be freely available? C++ is eroding my sanity.
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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 11th Jul 2008 21:32
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Quote: "Any news on when Dark GDK .Net will be freely available? C++ is eroding my sanity. "


I couldn't agree more. I'm so glad my university uses C# primarily.

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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jason p sage
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Ouch - Really? So they teach you the "high level" stuff that's pretty much Microsoft soup to nuts - and don't teach you assembly, c++, and other operating systems programming? Do your university at least cover various dialects of SQL, data mining and analysis, and various RFC specs - like smtp, pop, html, ftp, sftp, ssl, etc.. and I don't mean how to use - I mean how to write those services?


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Shadow Fan 0
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Posted: 12th Jul 2008 01:36
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Quote: "Ouch - Really? So they teach you the "high level" stuff that's pretty much Microsoft soup to nuts - and don't teach you assembly, c++, and other operating systems programming? Do your university at least cover various dialects of SQL, data mining and analysis, and various RFC specs - like smtp, pop, html, ftp, sftp, ssl, etc.. and I don't mean how to use - I mean how to write those services?"


I said "Primarily." They do teach C++ very heavily and Assembly is common as well. I guess I should've clarified that their game major is most of the C#. The Computer Science major in general yes covers all the areas you asked about.

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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jason p sage
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That actually makes a lot of sense and sounds like a sweet university!


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Mahoney
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Posted: 12th Jul 2008 07:53
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What University? I'd love to check it out. Trying to find a good one.
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Posted: 12th Jul 2008 09:55
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It's the University of California Santa Cruz. The Computer Science area (General and Game Design) is in the Baskin School of Engineering on the north end of the campus. Here's the school's main page:

http://www.ucsc.edu/public/

"...The Protoss do not run from their enemies. Aiur is our homeworld, it is here that we shall make our stand!" -Aldaris
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Mahoney
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Why do I have to live in the mid-south?
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jason p sage
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Actually - I bet with a little hunting you might find something! Note that there are definately better universities than others. You might be able to find the colleges/universities in your area that allow "credits" to be honored from one to the next - and all the rules that apply with that. Then you might have a "few to choose from" where there is Computer Science class overlap, and then you could try to do some research on who the good teachers are and at least get an idea of their sylabus or whatever their curriculum is to see if it at least hits the things that interst you. Just a thought - I am no campus butterfly.


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Mahoney
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Yeah. I just need to spend some time with it.
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McLaine
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Any news on the DGDK? Getting to grips with it and am very impressed, but I seem to be locked to screen refresh regardless of any syncon/off use.

It's not my fault!
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SunDawg
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A way to toggle V-Sync would be a brilliant addition for the next revision.


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Mahoney
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Definitely. That and some AA/AF options.
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SunDawg
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Yeah, the updated DBPro 'set display mode' command being added to DGDK would be awesome.


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Mike J
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Not sure if this has been asked - somewhere in the 90+ posts - but will DarkGDK .NET support the display of video in-game? ie load animation, play animation...

I saw another post in which Mike from TGC mentioned that this was removed in DarkGDK due to an issue with DirectShow. Since DarkGDK .NET uses the same binaries, I sort of assume this issue will still exist with DarkGDK .NET, but I would appreciate some confirmation either way.

Thanks in advance.
-Mike J

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SunDawg
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DirectShow was eliminated from the DirectX library, therefore it will not be available in DarkGDK.NET either.


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Mike J
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Thanks, Dawg.

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TenaC
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APEX, if there is anything I can do to assist you and kBessa get your release out then I'd more than happy to help.

I have a bit of spare time between assignments and would be happy to devote some time to helping a worthwhile project.
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APEXnow
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TenaC,

Thanks for your offer, but the toolkit is nearly complete to be honest. It will be ready very soon.

Paul.


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kBessa
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Hi Paul,

I've sent you an e-mail, have you got it?

I really need some help. Hope to hear from you soon!

Regards,
Thiago

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Niels Henriksen
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Paul - what is "very soon"? Days? .....

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