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Work in Progress / zEngine2 - Walk Physics

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Lukas W
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 00:11 Edited at: 29th Jun 2008 05:43
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Hi ALL!

Z-Engine 2 is an FPS game engine that I am developing, and which is going to be used to create a game.
It is an improvement over Z-Engine (DBC) which was used to create Zombie Hunter (if you remember that game).
It is not a fast pased shooter engine, but a sneak, stealth, slow tempo shotoer engine (like Thief series, my favourite games (except the third)). As a matter of fact, the game I am writing this engine for is a game inspired by Thief series... Anyway!

Website is now online at http://zengine2.allwaysafraided.com

I have recently reached the 50% finished mark on the Player Movement Physics Module. And now I would like to know how it will perform on other people's computers.

Features that the Player Movement Physics Module handles are:
Movement using WASD Keys
Jump
Lean - Need to Fix: Lean through walls
Sneak
Climb Walls
Climb Ladders
Climb Ropes
Swim
Run
Crouch
Footsteps recognition (what footstep sound to play) - partly finished
Light detection (standing in shadow or light)


It is completely physics based. You will require PhysX drivers to run the application. (If you do not have it installed, DBPro will open a web browser and you can download it from that website (I think)).

Anyway.

If you are interested in trying this Player Movement Physics Module, then you are free to do so.
v1.0.0 [link] 1701kb (RAR)
v1.0.1 [link] 2425kb (RAR)
v1.0.2 [link] 2497kb (RAR)
v1.0.3 [link] 2667kb (RAR)
v1.0.4 [link] 3221kb (RAR)

Let me know a few things:
* What are your thoughts; what could be improved/removed
* What FPS rate do you get (If low, what are your computer specs.)
* What kind of bugs do you encounter
* Anything else.

Images:


I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..

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djchaos
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 11:11
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thats pretty kool

good fps, good collision but i had problems jumping, it wouldn't jump very high at all and its very very fast

also you can lean thru walls

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Lukas W
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 16:01
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Thanks for the feedback.

I don't know what causes the jumping to fail. It happens to me as well but is not common.
But here is what I think:
DarkPhysics is adding some additional weight on the player rigid body.
Because if you study it closely, you walk slow, if you crouch you immedeatly is on the floor and you can hardly move, if you jump you instantly get pulled back to the ground.
So it's either the gravity force that is unstable, or the player weight.

Good point about leaning through walls. I didn't think about that.
I will add the lean problem to the list of bugs. I am currently working on climbing ladders.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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RedFlames
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 16:14 Edited at: 17th Jun 2008 16:15
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Hey this sounds cool and i want to test it but it gives me the error:
Display using 32 bit is not supported by available hardware
although i got a 3850 512mb and a 19" monitor

(and i've nearly always used 32bit...)

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Lukas W
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 17:00 Edited at: 17th Jun 2008 17:05
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Sorry about that. I forgot to set the display mode to something more common in games. Aww. I am running this at 1680x1050 resolution.

I'll compile a new batch and upload it.

Edit:
Done. Same download link.

PS. the ladder function is not finished.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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Zotoaster
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 17:49
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I like it. Seems like some pretty descent games could be made from it.

Don't you just hate that Zotoaster guy?
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RedFlames
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 20:08
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wow its a really cool and extensive movement-engine, reminds me of Crysis

Bugs/Suggestions/whatever:
- walking parallel to the stair is buggy
- you can lean into walls (of course ya know that already... )
- falling/jumping is more like on moon than on earth i think... (increase gravity/speed)

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Lukas W
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 21:17
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Thanks guys. I appreaciate the positive comments.

RedFlames,
Nice list! I will have a look at those as soon as I get the ladder climbing finished.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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cyril
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 23:21
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Nice tech demo of your new engine.
65 fps
Specs:
core 2 duo @ 2.40GHz
nivdia gforce 8800 gt 512mb
3gb
1tb hard drive
Keep up the good work
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Roxas
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Posted: 17th Jun 2008 23:37
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The movement was kinda buggy on some parts. But its a great start Now polish it

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Lukas W
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Posted: 18th Jun 2008 00:27
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Cyril,
Thanks I am glad you were able to get a solid FPS (allthough your computer specs tells me you would've anyway )

Roxas,
Would you like to elaborate on that? It will be easier for me if I know what you want fixed.

As a side note, I finally managed to implement ladders. Now on to fixing the previously mentioned bugs.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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nackidno
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Posted: 18th Jun 2008 02:36
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Climbing was a bit annoying. If the player is standing very close to the wall, the player can't jump as high as he normaly can. This will make it very frustrating at situations you need to run like **** from a monster or something, and can't get up correctly!

And another bug I haven't managed to figure out how it occurs, but it has something to do with jumping an crouching. The player start moving very slowly after a jump (Often happens in the little room you crough into after the jump phase. But as I said, I don't know what couses this bug, just posted it to let you know about it.

And one other thing, I changed the texture to something that pleases the eyes more than that purple arrowlike thingie. Metal
Just edited the image in the level folder.

Otherwise, great engine, reminds me of the Thief games with the climbing.

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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Lukas W
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Posted: 18th Jun 2008 03:20 Edited at: 18th Jun 2008 03:31
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Hi nakido,
Very greatful that you were able to figure out so much about the bugs!

About the first one:
I can guess it has something to do with materials and how they react to eachother. In order to keep the player rigid body from bouncing around (after a jump) I have removed all restitution between the player and level object. This, I think, causes the player to ALSO loose friction when sliding against a wall, which results in a short jump when standing against one. I will see what I can do to fix this, but I have no idea yet.

Second:
There was a bug as you said, with crouching and jumping/falling. I noticed that too, but I didn't notice what you said. I have compiled v1.0.1 now so you could try that out and see if the bug is still in action. If it is, I will have a closer look at what you are descibing.

Third:
The engine is going to be built so to easily modify the levels (did you look at the .dat file?)

And lastly,
Thanks! Thief is my favourite game, and the engine that I am writing this game for is a Thief inspired game I am happy that you saw some resemblance to this engine and Thief! Which is what I am hoping to accomplish with everything else.


To everyone:
I have compiled v1.0.1 now. new features and bug fixes are:


As for the bug where you can lean through walls. I have not yet been able to fix this. It was harder than I thought Or maybe I need to sleep soon (It's 2:20am here).
Anyway, because of this I decided to texture the level to give it the graphical atmosphere I am looking to create. I hope you can forgive me. anyway.

v1.0.1:
[link] 2425 kb (RAR)

image:


PS:
To walk up a ladder, just jump right onto it. It's kind of hard to walk DOWN a ladder if you are standing at the top. But it is possible so just try about. I will see if I can fix this for v1.0.2.


Edit:
I forgot to write about the gravity being "moon" like and not "earth" like.
I don't know what is happening here. If I set Gravity to -9.8 (which is the default in DP, it acts like it does) But if I set the gravity to -15 it still acts like it was -9.8, it does this even if I set the gravity to -300. So I don't know what I should do about that.

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nackidno
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Posted: 18th Jun 2008 22:07 Edited at: 18th Jun 2008 22:10
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Nice, What is that platform outside the level?
In the beginning room, if you lean through the wall between the "towers", you can see one platform flying and another box to the right.

It was fun shrinking the level to 2x2x2. Felt like a rats nest.

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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RedFlames
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Posted: 18th Jun 2008 22:38
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wow nearly all bugs were fixed and the new graphics are cool too
but its a bit annoying to jump against the ladder only problem is the gravity... but i dont know anything 'bout DP

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DB PROgrammer
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Posted: 18th Jun 2008 23:04
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It's not really a bug but your camera has no restrictions as to how far it can rotate on its x-axis, meaning you can be looking upside down.


I'm Pro grammer.
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Lukas W
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 00:52
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Quote: "What is that platform outside the level?"

I use 3d world studio temporarily, until I write a level editor.
In 3D World studio you can "carve" a mesh. This can be useful for doorways. So the platforms outside the level are just temp objects that I use to carve doorways/crouch holes in the walls.

Quote: "and the new graphics are cool too"

I appreaciate your liking to the graphics, allthough they are resized to 256x256 (do decrease loading times and download size).
The graphics in this demo is nothing compared to what I have in mind so just wait a few months until the "zEngine2 Graphics Module" is being worked on.

Quote: "It's not really a bug but your camera has no restrictions as to how far it can rotate on its x-axis, meaning you can be looking upside down."

In order for the camera to rotate on Z axis while leaning left/right I use the EzRotate plugin. I have not been able how to limit values given by mouse movement yet (in EzRotate) but I just got an idea *writes down idea*.

Quote: "but its a bit annoying to jump against the ladder"

I think I will add an Options.dat file.
In this file, you can change resolution, texture size, shader amount, rotation speed, inverted rotation, and connect to ladder through jumping or walking into it.
Would that be an idea? To let the player decide if he wants to jump into the ladder or walk into it?

I remember in thief (the way I played it) you had to jump into the ladder to climb it. I thought that was the most convenient way to do it.


Overall,
I am glad this got such positive feedback, because zEngine2 is going to be free to download and open source (Once it's finished, and the game I am writing the engine for is finished.)
Later on, I will write zEngine2.5 which will handle a more "modern" fps game. Like pistols, rocket launchers, sniper and stuff.
But it's a long time until then.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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Lukas W
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 19:41 Edited at: 19th Jun 2008 19:42
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It feels like whenever I fix a bug, a new one appear .

I just managed to limit rotation on the x axis in EzRotate. But now, because of the way I did this, if you violently press all buttons used by the application, the camera is disoriented on the z axis. I have no idea how to fix this as I don't know of a way to reset an angle value in EzRotate.

This movement module would be much better without EzRotate, but it is needed to get euler rotations for the z angle when leaning.

Anyway, with this bug, there is a query of 7 things to do before 1.0.2 is finished. 4 of those are very difficult bugs to fix.

PS: Why is it called "a bug"? Anyone ever wondered about that? I did just now.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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Profit
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 19:51 Edited at: 19th Jun 2008 19:53
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I can't run it, but the screenshot looks nice.

Quote: "PS: Why is it called "a bug"? Anyone ever wondered about that? I did just now."


Answer

Ripple
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Diggsey
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 19:54 Edited at: 19th Jun 2008 19:56
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@Lukas W
It's called a bug because the first every computer bug was when a moth got into it and shorted a circuit

Beaten

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bergice
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 19:58
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Yeh, i know XD


Programming Recorder: 3,0 months of dark basic
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Lukas W
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 20:04
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Aww, poor fly .
Anyway, that was an interesting read. I didn't expect that.

I thought it was called a bug because bugs (in real life) can be troublesome. Like cockroaches. And bugs (in software) are troblesome.
But there goes how much I know about stuff.

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bergice
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Posted: 19th Jun 2008 20:06
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Quote: "But there goes how much I know about stuff."

Thats lol


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Gil Galvanti
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Posted: 20th Jun 2008 00:52
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Nice job . I'm always impressed how smooth your engines are. I got about 45FPS, and the only thing I didn't really like is that going up and down stairs is a bit jerky.


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bergice
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Posted: 20th Jun 2008 11:53
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And a question, did you use dark physics or did you make all by yourself?
And another question: When you say "Light Detection", do you mean sneaking, so people wont see you or shadows?


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Lukas W
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Posted: 20th Jun 2008 13:04
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I use DarkPhysics, but not a stupid/useless character controller.
I wrote my own character controller.

Light detection:
If you are standing in shadow or a light. How well enemies see you based on how much you are illuminated. etc. (Like in Thief)

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nackidno
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Posted: 20th Jun 2008 13:06 Edited at: 20th Jun 2008 13:06
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By light detection, he means that the enemy detect if the player stand in the shadow or not. If the player is in the shadow, the enemy does not see you, if you stand in light, the enemy see you.

EDIT : Posted at the same time

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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Lukas W
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Posted: 23rd Jun 2008 04:34 Edited at: 23rd Jun 2008 04:37
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Hello again.

I've finished v1.0.2 of the movement module now. Actually it isn't finished but I got bored of programming now.

Bug Fixes/Etc.


Some Notes:
* Leaning have now collision, but it's not 100% done. (I finally figured out how to make them though).
* If the player is standing very close to the wall, the player can't jump as high as he normaly can. - I don't know how to fix this yet.
* Camera transition from crouch to stand does not work if walking.
* You still have to jump on ladders to grab them and climb up. (I couldn't be bothered fixing this yet)
* Sound module is very rusty, it needs to be improved. (But at the moment I am working on player movement).

Anyway, here is the new download link:
v1.0.2 [link] 2497kb (RAR)

Hope you find more bugs for me

PS:
I added some health shields like they have in Thief, to make it more thief look-alike.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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nackidno
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Posted: 23rd Jun 2008 11:10 Edited at: 23rd Jun 2008 11:11
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I did not found any more bugs (Except that you still can see through the walls when leaning, though you have to lean into the wall in a certain angle).

But I have a suggestion, when the player falls, maybe make the camera move down fast, and then up again within a second or less. So it feels like jumping in real life. Landing straight with the body really hurt I can tell you.

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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Lukas W
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Posted: 23rd Jun 2008 17:29
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A Good idea.
v1.0.3 will be another bug fix update with that feature you mentioned implemented.

After that, I'll start working on ropes and water.
Finally after that, the module is as complete as I can get itfor now.
I need to write a level editor, a sound module, a materials module and a light module in order to completely finish the player movement module.

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Lukas W
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Posted: 24th Jun 2008 17:27 Edited at: 24th Jun 2008 17:29
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Hi.

I couldn't find a way to perfectly implement your idea. I will add it eventually but not right now. I will need to write some sort of function to handle camera offset values, because I experience some problems with camera y position. The same goes with when standing from a crouch.


Anyway, I decided to call it an early day or something today so I'll just upload what new features I've implemented and rename app. to v1.0.3.
I have also started work on some other modules which you are able to see if you download the newest version.

Player movement module Bug fixes/updates:


Heads up Display module:


File module:


So from this version and onwards you won't be able to steal my media. Some are media that I have paid for, while others are stuff that I have made.

Anyway.



v1.0.3 [link] 2667kb (RAR)

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nackidno
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Posted: 24th Jun 2008 20:35 Edited at: 24th Jun 2008 23:33
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I couldn't play it.:S

An error message says : "This application has failed to start because MFC71.dll was not found. Re-installing the application may fix this problem."

How do I fix this? I have both the newest PhysX drivers and DirectX.

EDIT : Sorry, it did work, my other computer is kinda screwed.

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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Lukas W
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Posted: 24th Jun 2008 23:44 Edited at: 24th Jun 2008 23:47
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MFC71.dll is a downloadable file. It should be installed when installing directx (don't remember which version(date) it started shipping with).

However it is downloadable from here [link]. It should be placed in either the project folder (local) or the windows/system32 folder (global).

Anyway since you figured out what the problem was there is no need to worry. I just posted in case someone else get the same message.

Ps: I used to get this message too, some months ago. So I know it kinda.

EDIT:
The player movement module is not timer based.
I have not really understood how to make stuff timerbased until I read this thread [link].
I was thinking of making this timerbased. Who here would agree that that would be the right way to go?

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Xenocythe
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Always, ALWAYS...

Set sync rate to 0, and make things timer based.

The trick here is that everything moves at the same SPEED for each person on each computer.

BUT, with sync rate 0, it's moves at maximum performance. That means that people with better computer get higher frame rates. It doesn't move any faster, but it moves a whole lot SMOOTHER.


Asides from all this, dang man, it's looking and playing absolutely amazing. I'd love to help out as much as I can.


Timer based example:



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Lukas W
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Posted: 25th Jun 2008 01:49
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At the moment I don't know what I would need help with. Maybe a GUI system for the level editor I will make in the future (I can't be bothered writing a new gui (again) just yet).

Anyway, When the time comes I will need some voice actors, someone to make 3d models for me, maybe design levels and pretty much all kinds of other media related stuff. I suck at stuff like that, however I am going to do some voice acting myself for the game It will be awesome.
But lets not think about that for a while.


So,
I guess it is smarter to try and make this timer based. I guess that is what I will do. I wonder how darkphysics will act if I add timerbased movement.. We'll see.

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Vorg1
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Posted: 25th Jun 2008 07:23
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I would be happy to help make gun models for you when you get around to it or work on other models. I am a little busy right now working on some other things. but if you need help tell me what you need and i would make it for you and send it to you. I am sure that is a ways away but it looks pretty good right now. Good Luck
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Xenocythe
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Posted: 25th Jun 2008 09:55
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I'll model anything. Organics, weapons, buildings, anything. I'm getting better.

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Lukas W
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Posted: 25th Jun 2008 14:22 Edited at: 25th Jun 2008 14:23
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VorgOne,
There won't be any guns in the game, and therefore this engine will not use guns. But I'll let you know when I need some models done.

Xenny,
By "Organics" do you mean plants?
I will get in touch with you also, when the time comes.

I should say that if you do make some media, it will not be accessible elsewhere other than from in-game. So people won't be able to steal the media from the game folders, etc., and neither can you retrieve the media without first emailing me to let me know you need it. But I assume you always have a copy of the original work, right? ..RIGHT?


As for how the engine is processing:
I am having no difficulties at all implementing timer based movement. DarkPhysics was perfectly able to restrict physics calculation and etc.
I am currently working on improving the camera bobbing for: walking, crouching, running, climbing, jumping, landing and pretty much everything.
The movement will be so smooth, and it's all coded, no pre-animated character model (I'd have to rewrite pretty much everything if I add an animated character model that you control).

Anyway.BYE

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Xenocythe
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Posted: 25th Jun 2008 22:00
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Organics meaning anything living.

Yes, U understand the media rule. That's clever.

Yes, I have a copy of all my work.

You have me on msn, right?

Otherwise feel free to just email at rpgmakerx2@hotmail.com

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Lukas W
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Posted: 29th Jun 2008 05:50
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Finally finished v1.0.4

Bug Fixes and etc:


v1.0.4 [link] 3221kb (RAR)

Some noteable new features are:
* Timer Based (I get 1146fps on average)
* Better simulation of walking, running, etc. etc.
* Support for PhysX Hardware (GPU or PPU)
* Created a Main Menu (Will be removed on future releases. This was just a test I wrote)

Tell me if there's something that needs to be improved.

What's left to do now is Swimming and Climbing Ropes.
After that I'll have to start on the level editor in order to get Footstep sounds and detect if standing in light or shadow.


I'm going on vacation on Monday, so I'll be gone for nearly three weeks. It will be fun. We're going to London
Anyway, I won't bring a laptop with dbpro. A vacation is a vacation. So there won't be any updates for a while.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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Lukas W
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Posted: 29th Jun 2008 20:21 Edited at: 29th Jun 2008 20:21
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I believe the silence means it is working ok. Or nobody tried it yet.

Anyway, I have just started work on the level editor (couldn't wait). I decided that I would write a gui on my own anyway.
So far I have the Main Menu GUI finished.



I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..

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nackidno
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Posted: 30th Jun 2008 07:13
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I did not have the time to test it, might do it now. My granny died some time ago, so our family have sorted some things out lately.

Nice GUI, it looks simple yet easy to handle. Compared to most programs I have used.

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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nackidno
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Posted: 30th Jun 2008 07:36
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I have tested version 4 now. It's great improvements I must say!

bugs I found :

When pushing the rock, and jumping on top of it, you just follow it until you hit the ground, and you can't jump of it either.

Transition from crouching to standing is still a little choppy.

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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nackidno
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Posted: 10th Jul 2008 22:58
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How is it going?

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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Lukas W
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Posted: 14th Jul 2008 19:21
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I've been on vacation, so haven't progressed since last update.
Now I'm back home so will see if I can the player to climb ropes.

Thanks for the bug reports.

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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Lukas W
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Posted: 17th Jul 2008 00:33
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Tried my luck at level design/modelling. I sucked at it (hint, hint).



Ps. I managed to get ropes working. One of the fun parts with climbing ropes is that if the rope is connected to a dynamic body (say a box) then if the player mass is greater than the box mass, the rope will drag the box down and you'll get it on your head ouch.

It will be awesome when it comes to shooting rope arrows in the game. Say you want to climb up to a different plattform and you accidentially hit a wooden barrel or something, without you knowing it. Then you start to climb but the barrel falls down, and all the zombies eat you alive because you were chased by them and wanted to escape AWWWW! :S

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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nackidno
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Posted: 17th Jul 2008 00:57
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Cool feature. That will surely add to the tension when chased!

If you think you suck at level designing, you don't want to look at my work on Fragment. (Man blir mörkrädd, så dåligt är det.)

- Elias, Damezean, Nackidno, Wonderboy

AntocGames - http://antocgames.se.nu/
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Inspire
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Posted: 17th Jul 2008 01:12
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That's really awesome. I really like this project.
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QuothTheRaven
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Posted: 17th Jul 2008 05:33
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Just crashes during the loading screen for me, debug message. Most likely because I'm on Vista. I have the latest directx and physx drivers installed.

DelvarWorld
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Lukas W
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Posted: 17th Jul 2008 15:30
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Hmm. I don't know how vista and xp are different when it comes to writing/reading files.

During loading, the application is unpacking all media files. So it needs to have write permission. Did you try running the application as an administrator? (Right click and run as admin).

I allways afraided from a clowns. aww..
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