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Geek Culture / a rare glimpse of a predator at work

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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 13:54
Our garden is visited regularly by sparrowhawks which seem to have learnt that small birds are in abundance here (because of the bird seed we put out ).

A few minutes ago my wife and I were standing by the kitchen window waiting for the kettle to boil (= coffee ) when a sparrowhawk flew down and caught a starling. Rather than intervene (it was possibly too late already) we decided to watch nature take its course. The starling put up quite a fight while the hawk seemed to be trying, apparently unsuccessfully, to subdue it by stamping on it.

After a minute or so the hawk flew away with the starling which was still trying to peck the hawk's legs. Much to our surprise the hawk landed in our pond. At first we thought it had landed by accident, but it soon seemed to be a deliberate act. The hawk simply stood at the margins of the pond with the starling firmly held under the water's surface. The hawk made no attempt to fly away, just waited while constantly looking around in case of trouble (= cats). After a few minutes the hawk apparently decided it had been long enough and dragged the now lifeless starling to the side of the pond where it took a few mouthfuls before flying away with its prize.

That was a rather gory but nevertheless memorable few minutes of nature at work. We'd never imagined that a hawk would use our pond that way and I'm sure it was deliberate.

We usually get only fleeting glimpses of these fine but unwelcome predators but this was a one visit we'll never forget.
Venge
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 14:04
I have to say, that was not the first thing that came to mind when I read the thread title.



But cool nonetheless.

The most interesting thing that happens around here is a few deer running through the backyard every now and then.


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Fallout
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 15:12
I assumed you meant the lizard like predator too, but that was an interesting story anyway. I wonder if it was an intentional act to drown the bird. Animals are often more intelligent than we give them credit for. Obviously top hunters need to have the greatest intelligence, so maybe it is capable of choosing water as means of killing.

Van B
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 16:35
Maybe that's why smaller mammals often have a fear of water - like cats, mice etc - they know that water and predators don't mix.

Anyway, might be an idea to move the bird table into a corner - predator birds prefer open spaces for hunting, if you have a bird feeder in the middle of your garden, well it's open season!. It's probably quite rare for them to come into a garden, and get so close to people - I tend to only ever see them, hovering at the side of the road in rural areas, looking for field mice.

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Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 16:47
We get some wildlife in our garden. Our cats surrounded a poor defenceless mouse in the garden and an owl swooped down and nicked the bugger. The cats pelted into the bushes almost in a "WTF what that??" fashion. And our cats seem to befriend hedgehogs and they seem to be fascinated by them, watching them and following them around - possibly trying to figure out how they might be able to kill one and eat it.

Though my aunt's cat did befriend a fox and it's only a small cat, the fox could easily kill it.

But with the sparrowhawk drowning the starling, pretty fascinating but I guess predators have to be intelligent in order to outwit their prey.


BlackFox
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 16:51 Edited at: 14th Mar 2012 16:52
The hawk landing in the pond was no accident. They are very intelligent birds and know how to best subdue their prey. Normally field mice are not ones to put up much of a fight. As for starlings or other birds, they will fight to the end. Another tactic I've seen is the hawk dropping their prey from a certain height a few times, and have seen them use ponds, sloughs, or puddles to finish their prey off. Although you feel bad for the smaller bird, it is quite the sight to watch.

Quote: "Though my aunt's cat did befriend a fox and it's only a small cat, the fox could easily kill it. "


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BatVink
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 17:33
I am amazed by these things. My parents have a regular visit by a Sparrowhawk, usually a very sudden visit followed by a cloud of feathers. Apparently - in relation to their body - a sparrowhawks hips are extremely powerful, and they punch their prey out of the sky.

Green Gandalf
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 17:51
Quote: "I have to say, that was not the first thing that came to mind when I read the thread title."


Same here when I wrote it.

Quote: "Anyway, might be an idea to move the bird table into a corner"


Doesn't seem to deter the hawks here - and you need to make it difficult for the cats too. Cats are very good at finding things in corners.

The starling was caught under a large bush so it's hard to know where to put the bird table.

A couple of years ago I was standing in the garden and one of our cats suddenly swung around and watched something behind me. A moment later a hawk swooped on a blackbird in a nearby bush with our cat in hot pursuit of the hawk. The cat missed the hawk by only a fraction while the hawk managed to escape with its prey. I often wonder what would have happened if the cat had been a moment faster. An image of one of those old Tom & Jerry cartoons springs to mind where the cat, dog and mouse are all bashing each other. I suspect I'd have been left with another vet's bill whatever the outcome.
DeadTomGC
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 20:35
I'm at Lehigh university at the moment, and last semester I saw a hawk pick up squirrel as it was running across a street.
The hawk grabbed at the neck of the squirrel and apparently killed it quickly. When the Hawk landed a tree near by the squirrel looked totally limp.


CoffeeGrunt
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 21:25
Hmmm, I had something similar to this, when I took my malamute for a walk in the park a couple of years back. He's a bulky and well-fed creature, so I just let him loose within the fences for exercise and to do his business, it's on the edge of town, and barely frequented here.

Well, a baby bird thought it would try to fly that day. In what I cannot call a display of the magic of nature, my dog stood on his back legs as the bird flew by, and simply punched it out of the air.

As far as I could tell, it was dead on arrival. What was most intriguing, is that rather than eat the bird, my dog chose to defecate over it. I really don't understand nature, sometimes. I hope the bird was already dead...I wasn't checking...
Travis Gatlin
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 23:47
Quote: "they punch their prey out of the sky."

Off topic and wrong bird but this came to mind:


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Green Gandalf
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Posted: 14th Mar 2012 23:53 Edited at: 14th Mar 2012 23:54
Quote: "As far as I could tell, it was dead on arrival. What was most intriguing, is that rather than eat the bird, my dog chose to defecate over it."


Don't blame the dog, blame the owner.

Yes, nature is full of surprises and is a constant source of inspiration.
Kezzla
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Posted: 15th Mar 2012 06:58
I remember once a hawk got into our quite fortified chook pen. It killed one chook(didn't see that bit) and the hawk was still there eating when we went out and found it. The interesting part was the manner in which the hawk chosen to eat it.
it had only eaten the head and neck meat. stripping them completely bare. It looked kind of strange like it was photoshopped with skeleton head, chook body. picked clean, no blood,sinew,ligaments, just bones(and whatever was holding the bones together) the part where the meat started looked almost like it had been sliced off with a razorblade, it was flat and clean.
It was strikingly strange and seemed very deliberate.
i dont know whether it expected to have more time, or whether it wanted the body in tact to carry off cleanly, or whether it was just the head and neck feathers were easier to pull out. maybe it had seen humans eating corn in typwriter style and thought it would give it a go

hard to get inside the head of a bird that thinks.

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maho76
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Posted: 15th Mar 2012 13:30
seems not that rare tactic :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0Ycdt-agOA

Green Gandalf
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Posted: 15th Mar 2012 14:29
Yes, it was just like that. Thanks.

We didn't have our cameras handy unfortunately.
maho76
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Posted: 15th Mar 2012 16:28
but for all the littlebird-lovers who hate predators:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKklp6qT74I&feature=related



Kezzla
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Posted: 15th Mar 2012 17:47
@maho76 -where was that footage taken? I always thought magpies were australian/new zealand native birds. the european text has thrown me off

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Diggsey
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Posted: 15th Mar 2012 20:14
European magpies are apparantly different from australian magpies (wikipedia). European magpies are also supposed to be one of the most intelligent animals on earth, because they can recognise themselves in a mirror.

[b]
maho76
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Posted: 16th Mar 2012 19:00
Quote: "European magpies are also supposed to be one of the most intelligent animals on earth, because they can recognise themselves in a mirror.
"


in addition: aggressively stealing everything that blings, they re-open bottles, fly on door handles to open it, picking small holes in coke-cans to drink, hitchhiking cars on the backseat to save flytime between 2 towns, steal lollipops out of the hands of children in baby-buggies, USE MY ROOF AS A NUTCRACKER! .... beside the roof-thing (pompclickclickclick! pompclickclickclick!...^^) i love these birds. most beautifull ravenbird on the planet.

Quel
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Posted: 16th Mar 2012 19:21
Well, your pond is now haunted by a starling.

Good for you.

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bitJericho
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Posted: 6th Apr 2012 03:47 Edited at: 6th Apr 2012 03:48
Looong bump, but thought some might be interested. I was sharing this story with a relative of mine who is an avid naturalist. He's worked in aviaries, and is quite an expert on birds. Anyway, he said that while certainly possible a hawk could kill a bird by drowning it's unlikely that it was intentional. More likely was that the hawk wanted the bird wet to make it easier to eat. He's seen this happen often at the places he worked, and would often spray the food with water that they would feed the birds to make it easier. I thought it was a neat tidbit I'd share.

Green Gandalf
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Posted: 7th Apr 2012 13:48 Edited at: 7th Apr 2012 14:05
Plausible - but why hold the bird there so long? Food for thought though.

Edit A quick search on Google found these links. The issue of deliberate drowning of prey is obviously still open but the consensus seems to be that it's a deliberate act to subdue the prey. I agree there's room for doubt though. Someone needs to devise a suitable experiment to test the alternative theories.

http://www.pauldfrost.co.uk/sparrowhawk.html
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbsn/html/NF14197738?thread=7077080
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/mbsn/html/NF14197738?thread=7007580
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=29745
http://www.dec.ny.gov/lands/79015.html
Libervurto
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Posted: 7th Apr 2012 19:28 Edited at: 7th Apr 2012 19:29
I can't see how the hawk would just be getting the magpie wet to make it easier to eat. That's like chasing a pig while flinging apple sauce at it!
I reckon it's probably the other way around, the hawk discovered that water kills things and hey it also makes it easier to eat, sweet!
Also why can a hawk intentionally get prey wet to make eating easier, but not to kill it? If it has intentions then surely killing prey would be a more prominent intention?

WARNING: The above comment may contain sarcasm.
Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 7th Apr 2012 21:49
Quote: "That's like chasing a pig while flinging apple sauce at it!"


You mean you don't?


Green Gandalf
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Posted: 8th Apr 2012 14:47
OBese87

Yes, I think the more obvious explanation is more likely too.

Also, birds in aviaries are probably just doing what comes naturally to them even if the "prey" is already dead.

I'm still puzzling over the pig and apple sauce analogy though. For some reason my mind keeps thinking of a roasting tin and roast potatoes.
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Posted: 17th Apr 2012 01:26
Gory but I'll bet it was quite a sight... I used to live in the countryside where we would regularly see large birds of prey (even the crows were about a foot tall). In our yard we had a structure which was occupied by about 100 barn swallow nests (a tiny bird, mabey 3 or 4 inches tall). When the larger birds came around, the swallows somehow knew of their presence (even though their view was obstructed by a roof), and would come swarming out to attack the falcons. It was like watching fighter planes perusing a much less agile bomber, violently striking the larger bird then circling back to repeat. Many times they could cause the larger bird to land, and in extreme cases fall from the sky. It was fascinating to see how the swallows worked together, they were able to completely overwhelm their much larger opponents every time.
Green Gandalf
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Posted: 17th Apr 2012 12:25
Yes, we're in the countryside too and the swallows and jackdaws will often chase and mob sparrowhawks and buzzards when they are spotted too near their nests in spring and summer. The buzzards are more interested in mammals but seem to get the same treatment as the sparrowhawks. Both predators rely on speed and often the first warning we get that one is around is the commotion started by the other birds. We've never seen the hawks overwhelmed though - they just seem to give up and fly away when they get too much hassle.

Sparrowhawks will fly fast and low through trees and shrubs in search of prey and often fly quite close to us when they are after something. Quite dramatic when it happens.

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