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AppGameKit Classic Chat / Playing with agk shaders in an small retro dungeon :)

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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 12:23
I found that the main drawback is he objectsphere slide command in agk
I use it for sliding collision on the player and enemys.

After alot of experimenting so did i try to simply remove the sliding collision and gained 10-16 fps on the droid.

On droid so is that alot when it goes from 9-10 to 20-26 fps.
And its only one of the commands causing it

I rewrote alot of the shaders and they dont seam to have to much impact.

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baxslash
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 12:49
Cliff have you considered using box 2d for horizontal collision and raycasting for vertical maybe?


this.mess = abs(sin(times#))
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 16:51
Quote: "Cliff have you considered using box 2d for horizontal collision and raycasting for vertical maybe?"

I have had these ideas also
But considiring that all enemys is moving around and that i would nead to do these fake 3d physics on all of them so did the idea fail for me
Because i couldt figure out a method that aligned to the floor heights and whas faster the object sphere slide
But iam getting closer and here is a sneak peek.
Iam getting steady 30 fps with enemys moving around now on my low end zte skate.
I hava alot left to do but iam closer
I put all the textures and object textures in to one and the same atlas image in the size of 256x256.
Shrinked the wall and object textures to 32x32 as we probably dont nead larger with the retro look we are after .
I have also added so the walls have 4 versions with slight variations that the map generater randomly textures the walls with.
This have also bin added to the floor
I will see later wath van b thinks when i send him the files after this phaze of optimizing is over .


The smaller textures actually gives it a new more combined look

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Digital Awakening
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 17:25 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2013 17:25
I like the new walls

Why is the joystick on the right? That's quite uncommon. BTW, are you planning to add strafing (left/right movement)?

You seem to have a problem with sections not drawn all the time and some weird dark lines and black spots high up on the walls.


Demo 3 is out now!
Van B
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 17:41
32x32 texture version looks cool - plus it'll be easier and quicker to make sprites.

The plan is to have the movement on the left, and straffing, firing etc on the right, like straffing controls with the attack button above them.

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 19:23 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2013 19:23
Quote: "Why is the joystick on the right? That's quite uncommon. BTW, are you planning to add strafing (left/right movement)?"

The controls are not an priority right now
I only nead something so i can move while testing
Quote: "You seem to have a problem with sections not drawn all the time "

Its the custom coded tile based culling system that is not optimized for as low framerate as belowe 40 fps.
Iam working on an more dynamic version that is more flexible.
Agks 3d is not the fastest on mobiles and nead to be smartly coded to be playable and then could there be glitches sometimes.
Quote: "some weird dark lines and black spots high up on the walls."

Thats more an issue with my crappy tablets 2 mega pixel camera that cant update properly
But i wanted to show that it now works again on mobiles
Quote: "32x32 texture version looks cool - plus it'll be easier and quicker to make sprites."

Here is an screenie
Looks a bit minecraft?


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Digital Awakening
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 20:45
Quote: "Its the custom coded tile based culling system that is not optimized for as low framerate as belowe 40 fps."


Ah, I see

The shadow from the top row of bricks looks a bit weird now that you are using lower resolution bricks. That dark line 2 pixels down looks odd. I think you may want to make it birghter and the line above it darker. To make it look more like a natural shadow.

BTW, if you can do it with shaders or something. I think it would look nice if surfaces facing the player is made a bit brighter than those facing in other directions. The effect would be that they better catch and reflect the light from a torch held by the player. In your last shot, look at the corner bricks in the middle. Because both sides have the same level of brightness you can't see that 2 of the bricks have sharp corners. They look round.


Demo 3 is out now!
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 21:05 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2013 21:08
Quote: "BTW, if you can do it with shaders or something. I think it would look nice if surfaces facing the player is made a bit brighter than those facing in other directions. The effect would be that they better catch and reflect the light from a torch held by the player."

Any shader calculations neads to be saved until agks 3d is faster
Object off screen dont work.
the culling dont work as it should.
Objects even if they are not in the cameras range seams to use alot of resources.
Iam more or less cutting down the shaders to a bare minimum to compensate for the beta commands that dont work.
But as soon as tgc are fixing all the 3d bugs so will i add stuff in to the engine.
I even had to write a custom gravity outside the sphere slide command as its to bugy on the droid.
It only seams to work well in 60 fps and higher?
Iam probably aiming for a framerate around 30 on the droid in the first release.
I have bin playing and running around the dungeon with an framerate around 20-34 fps and it runs smooth.
( i had forgotten to restart the player it now runs at constant 30 fps )
Mobiles are pretty strange when it comes to 3d

I made the culling more dynamic and it uses a few fps but looks smoother.

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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 21:26 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2013 21:27
Van b you got mail that i nead you to test on your mobile and wath framerate you get

Edited....
DA i missed that on the wall texture in my hurry to code

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Digital Awakening
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2013 21:43
Older phones are not really made for 3D. Question is what hardware you want to develop for when it's in 3D. Unless you look around with a mouse, 30 FPS should be enough. As long as it's smooth, you'll be fine. It's really annoying to work with buddy software. I hope they fix it soon.

Anyway, keep up the good work


Demo 3 is out now!
Van B
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 00:47
I'll get an iOS profile setup for it, have an ipad2 and iphone4 - but will need to get xcode etc ready for it. Should get a look at it tomorrow. I'm using a fairly feeble netbook for AppGameKit stuff, so it's probably not much better than a tablet.

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 01:10 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2013 01:11
Sounds great van

I am sending you a new version as i just finished the multi touch controls.
left,right,forward,backwards,strafe left,strafe right and attack.

This setting even if it looks weird worked extremely well
But its really easy to change as we can even reposition the buttons at runtime as they detect touch collision on sprites.

I will make an basic death function so we can test the attack functions on the enemys.


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Psycho Psam
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 13:42
You're on to a real winner here. Hack'n'Slash with pixel art in 3d - definitely worth money.
Talairina
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 19:51
Indeed keep this work up guys to a finished game and you've got a sale if you put a price on it. Would love to support the pair of you this way.
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 22:00
If the controls are good and the action is fun it could definitely sell. Would prefer to play it on my Ouya though (when I get it)


Demo 3 is out now!
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 22:37 Edited at: 3rd Mar 2013 22:37
Quote: "You're on to a real winner here. Hack'n'Slash with pixel art in 3d - definitely worth money. "

Quote: "Indeed keep this work up guys to a finished game and you've got a sale if you put a price on it. Would love to support the pair of you this way. "

Thanks guys
But i dont know if it will be payed as that is something that van b would have to manage in that case
I havent looked to much in the payed options on ios or android?
Its something van b and i have to discuss when it close to finished.
We are about 10-15% done i belive?
Quote: "If the controls are good and the action is fun it could definitely sell. Would prefer to play it on my Ouya though (when I get it)"

Ouyas controls on the pad are mapped to keyboard keys ?
I think i read that somewhere?
Ouya would probably get a more revamped version as the first release are aimed to work on android devices 600 mhz and faster with gingerbread and higher.
Then after that is it simply to add in extras for ipad and android tegra pads
The controls actually plays very smooth on an small screen

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Digital Awakening
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2013 23:19
I don't know how Ouya will handle input. But I think TGC are planning Ouya support once the console it out.


Demo 3 is out now!
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 4th Mar 2013 00:36
As soon as tgc support it would i probably nead to do something for it

Here is a video of the latest fixes and additions to the engine.
New multi touch controls with strafing.
A basic attack button to build on.
The attack rate is very low in this video
Have to talk to van on how we will build up the attack speed depending on weapon ?
This is a short range sword thats why iam forced to be up close.
I am going to fix a few more things and write more explaining text before i send this version to van B.


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Van B
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Posted: 4th Mar 2013 11:50 Edited at: 4th Mar 2013 12:03
Awesome stuff Cliff, new version is smooth as hell and controls on the PC at least work great. I will get started on the iOS builds, I'm sure your keen to know how it runs on an iPad2 etc.

I plan to get some enemy sprites finished off, then I'll get the script system added, so we can have different enemy types with different animation setups.

Also, will get some swords done and look into a good way to orientate and animate them.

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 4th Mar 2013 21:50 Edited at: 4th Mar 2013 22:27
Sounds great van
I have had an bad day of illnes today so i havent done much today

I will do some cleaning on the code before i go to bed .
Sorry for the sloppy code but that is how i work while testing ideas

Van should the dungeon have doors that nead keys to open ?
Could mess up the random ideas but i have some ideas of placing a door and place the key randomly and check with pathfining if it is reachable from the players side.

Or we simply make an basic game that we can build more complex games on after the first one.

I belive we should kepp it simple for the first game and try wath people likes ?

I have an already done pathfinding code her that is based on a fellow agk users code.
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=197547&b=48

Edited.............
This is how the enemy creation look for bones!
Could be good to know for you when working with script editing enemys


One of the new things is this !
Entity_Enemy[id].Image
It stores the id of the parent to the subimages so i can use the same small loop to animate all enemys without checking wath image they should use

As you can see here .


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Van B
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Posted: 5th Mar 2013 09:36
Take it easy Cliff, hope your feeling better.

I have been looking over the enemy creation stuff, and it'll be straightforward to get it working through a script - but I was thinking that it'd be easier to have 2 enemy arrays. So Entity_Enemy[] represents the enemies in game, and Entity_SpawnEnemy[], with the same type, could hold all the enemy data. Then, to create an enemy you would specify the enemy class when calling the creation function, and it would just find and copy that enemies details. The spawn array would be pre-loaded and setup with scripts, and Entity_Enemy based on that.
I think that would make it more straightforward when spawning enemies, and deciding which enemies to feature on each level.

Doors with keys would be great, but your right - it might just delay things. What about having a door, as an extra object, like the barrel. Then rather than opening them, they have to be smashed open, or opened with a key, so they're just barriers really. Maybe there could be just 2 types of door - wooden smashable ones, and metal ones that need a key, and the keys needent be specific. What I'm thinking is that there could be little bonus areas behind metal doors, you need a key to open them, and inside might be a good chest. So if you find a metal door and have a key (any key), then you can open it and get the loot, otherwise you have to leave it.

Idea to stop an enemy spawning behind a metal door...

For each empty point in the map, do a flood fill check, incrementing a 2D array by 1 for each point that is found with the flood fill. So by the end, a 3x3 area in the dungeon will have 9 points in each map location, because the flood fill will cover the area once for each location inside it. So the idea is that it would find the volume of area for each map location, the main area would have a big volume, a small enclosed area a small volume. So we would just check the map locations volume, and only spawn enemies when it's above a threshold.

Just an idea of course. When playing Binding of Isaac, the locked doors add an extra layer of strategy... like do you check what's behind the door first, hopefully get a better weapon to make the dungeon easier - or do you wait until you've killed everything and know how many keys you have to spare. If you have 2 doors, and only 1 key, then you have a gamble on which one to go for. Plus it won't be possible to go back to a previous dungeon, and the loot etc will be randomized - so that'll bite at the player as well - they'll know that there might be an epic weapon behind that door, and they simply won't ever get to see what it was
I think that'd be cool, to have to manage your keys and maybe even try and save one or two for emergencies.

There's also the option of having locked chests as well. I think keys would add an extra layer to it, and make the game a lot more interesting.

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 5th Mar 2013 19:09
Quote: "I have been looking over the enemy creation stuff, and it'll be straightforward to get it working through a script - but I was thinking that it'd be easier to have 2 enemy arrays. So Entity_Enemy[] represents the enemies in game, and Entity_SpawnEnemy[], with the same type, could hold all the enemy data. Then, to create an enemy you would specify the enemy class when calling the creation function, and it would just find and copy that enemies details. The spawn array would be pre-loaded and setup with scripts, and Entity_Enemy based on that.
I think that would make it more straightforward when spawning enemies, and deciding which enemies to feature on each level."

I have an even simplier idea
i just got it in my head and its so simple that its crazy
Each floor have its own folder.
The main folder storing these are a folder called floors.
Then we have folders with only digits representing each floor.
1,2,3,4 and 5 etc.
Inside this folder do we have the map file.
So the engine loads any file here as the dungeon with the ending .map.
And now for the simple idea
Here do we also have our enemy scripts that also only use digits that we give the ending .en.
And now do you wonder how do we randomize the enemys
Simply have an randomizer give us a number betwen 1-6 etc.
and then the engine simply loads file 3.en and the scripts data is used for that enemy.
And the randomizer continous like this until we reach the maximum amount of enemys.
This gives us a very small amount of code and its very simple to mod the game or make adjustments or even share complete floors with friends.

the size should be very minimal even with 50 floors as these files are extremely small.

Here could we also have a script file for wath images should be used for the floor.
Lets say that it have the ending .img.
And we preload all these images before creating them.
And then simply do a small check if an image is unused and delete it from memory.

This also lets us expand the game very simply after the release as we simply add folders in to the floors folder for new floors

Wath do you think ?

I like the ideas about the doors with a smashable door and a metal door that neads to be opened with a secret button or key

Iam going to make the basic code for smashing barrels and crates so can i start with some door code
Quote: "Just an idea of course. When playing Binding of Isaac, the locked doors add an extra layer of strategy... like do you check what's behind the door first, hopefully get a better weapon to make the dungeon easier - or do you wait until you've killed everything and know how many keys you have to spare. If you have 2 doors, and only 1 key, then you have a gamble on which one to go for. Plus it won't be possible to go back to a previous dungeon, and the loot etc will be randomized - so that'll bite at the player as well - they'll know that there might be an epic weapon behind that door, and they simply won't ever get to see what it was
I think that'd be cool, to have to manage your keys and maybe even try and save one or two for emergencies.

There's also the option of having locked chests as well. I think keys would add an extra layer to it, and make the game a lot more interesting."

I like that idea as it forces the player to think a little bit extra.
I think we should start to put some of your ideas on to a dev sheet or something so we both follow the same path

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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 5th Mar 2013 19:34 Edited at: 5th Mar 2013 19:51
How is this for a start ?

Design document for Cliff and Van b Rpg experience!

App type
3D roguelike game.
Each level having an entrance and exit to the level below. Enemies get nastier as the player descends, ornaments and lights get more sinister - then maybe the last level is just an open space, with a end boss fight.
Enemys.
having tons and tons of weak enemies to kill is great fun, like swarms of bats flying around.

Design.
pixelated look.
Flat sprites for enemies like Doom.
Make it the sort of game you can pick up for a spare 10 minutes to complete a level.
Have a lot of different treasure, weapons - then randomize the drops so each game feels a bit different.

Have a lot of different items and weapon upgrades that are completely random, each game ends up differently depending on what loot you find, it really does make, what would be a repetitive game kinda unique instead.

Smashable containers, will be great fun to have random loot and treasure fly out.

I think with 8 directions it'll look pretty cool, especially if we use line of sight, so you can see enemies walk past. Personally I think I'd play this a bit stealthily, creeping round corners, and we could add a damage bonus for if the enemy isn't facing the player.

randomize the enemies, based on the players experience. Like, in each level we could have the 4 enemies, but make them increase in difficulty, so there might be 10 bats, 4 gnomes, 2 skeletons, and 1 ogre - we just mix and match the enemies, let them roam the dungeon until the start location is clear, then the player spawns. That would make things even more random - but as long as we keep the thing balanced to the players level, it should be good fun.

Having a door, as an extra object, like the barrel. Then rather than opening them, they have to be smashed open, or opened with a key, so they're just barriers really. Maybe there could be just 2 types of door - wooden smashable ones, and metal ones that need a key, and the keys needent be specific. What I'm thinking is that there could be little bonus areas behind metal doors, you need a key to open them, and inside might be a good chest. So if you find a metal door and have a key (any key), then you can open it and get the loot, otherwise you have to leave it.

Just an idea of course. When playing Binding of Isaac, the locked doors add an extra layer of strategy... like do you check what's behind the door first, hopefully get a better weapon to make the dungeon easier - or do you wait until you've killed everything and know how many keys you have to spare. If you have 2 doors, and only 1 key, then you have a gamble on which one to go for. Plus it won't be possible to go back to a previous dungeon, and the loot etc will be randomized - so that'll bite at the player as well - they'll know that there might be an epic weapon behind that door, and they simply won't ever get to see what it was
I think that'd be cool, to have to manage your keys and maybe even try and save one or two for emergencies.

There's also the option of having locked chests as well. I think keys would add an extra layer to it, and make the game a lot more interesting.


Animation.
I'm thinking that 8 directions of movement, plus idle, attack and death, with the attack animation only facing the player.

So 5 frames for a walking loop and 1 idle frame per direction, then that leaves 16 frames for attack and death - maybe add in hurt as well - how about:

5 frame walking loop X 8 directions
1 frame idle loop X 8 directions
5 frame attack anim
5 frame hurt anim
5 frame death anim
1 frame dead


Controls.
Having NES style controls .
Dont nead to be able to look up and down , Heretic and Doom etc were fine without it.

App extras.
Allowe players to design their own dungeons and share them.

Map editing.
texturing should be automatic.
Explanation.
like a standard wall, wall details, roof, and floor - then say the player goes further down a dungeon with each level, a texture get's changed. So, when you go to the next level, maybe the floor texture switches to one with more wear and tear, walls become darker and spookier - maybe ending up with a crypt texture with skulls imbedded (as is tradition).

= done
= cliff working on
= Van b working on

Work schedule.
Culling system to work on low end mobiles.
Basic map editing.
Multiple floor heights.
Multiple ceiling heights.
Basic enemy code.
Enemy scripts.
Sliding collision.
Custom gravity to work on low framerates.
Dark fog in dungeon.
Random texture types of the same one in various variations.
Nes controls.
3d sprite in 8 directions.
Basic object creation.

I will continou this list after the game with manchester united and real madrid in champions leauge

Edited ......
iam sending you the latest files that i have started to clean up so its easier for you to insert things.

z-x is strafing.
c key is attack.
arrow keys is walking and steering.

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Van B
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Posted: 5th Mar 2013 19:54
Sounds good Cliff, and it would encourage us to mix up the enemies, make them more unique per level. Can we possibly have a subset of enemies though - say the first 5 enemies are bat, spider, rat, skeleton, and zombie, these would be lesser enemies that can feature on any level. Then any additional enemies for that level would be handled with the script... so we might have a dragon enemy on one level, and it'll spawn a dragon or two - but then pad out the rest of the level with lesser enemies to level out the difficulty.

The lesser enemies could just use functions, or a preset script with the details for enemies 1-5, then in each level folder there would be the more unique enemy setup scripts for enemies 6-whatever.

If you have a google mail account, we could setup a shared spreadsheet, keep notes, ideas, to-do list etc.

I'm hoping to have some swords for tomorrow, zombie enemy will get finished off tonight. I should be able to get the script code in a single source file, so I'll get onto that as well. For swords, I'm thinking that we can just have it textured onto a plain, then orientate it with the camera, and move it with interpolation to animate it. That would let us have different attacks quite easily, maybe change the attack depending on how the player is moving(for instance, run forward then attack to stab). I'm using 32x32 images for the swords just now, let me know if that's no good - I'm drawing them diagonally, so they use the maximum space available. Maybe I should look at this first, like get a sword in the game and have it animate how I'm thinking it could work.

Ohh, regarding app sales... well in-app purchases is where the money is right now - I don't get many sales with Bubble&Squeak, but the in-app unlock is always about 5 times the sales of the full paid version. Not that making money is the goal with this of course, I just want to help make a mobile RPG that is actually fun .

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 5th Mar 2013 20:20
Quote: "say the first 5 enemies are bat, spider, rat, skeleton, and zombie, these would be lesser enemies that can feature on any level."

That sounds good
i will add these as a base of simple enemys.
So could you workout the other ones
If you have any questions about when adding your script code just ask me.

You could simply make an code snippet where i press a key to do a swinging action with your sword so do i simply cut and paste it to the right place in the engine

32x32 for the sword sounds good

I also want to tell you that we already have the data file for how the enmys frames are

All enemys nead an subimage text file and this is the one where i write the frames for my enemy

So we already can use any size and amount of frames as more then one subimage can use the same image space.

The simpliest way would be a simple prg that loads the enemy image where we move an cursor and marks wath image coords a animation frame have
Then it writes out an subimage text file and the animation is done and only to play it in the engine

Quote: "Ohh, regarding app sales... well in-app purchases is where the money is right now - I don't get many sales with Bubble&Squeak, but the in-app unlock is always about 5 times the sales of the full paid version. Not that making money is the goal with this of course, I just want to help make a mobile RPG that is actually fun "

I leave that to you so you send me the cash

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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 21st Mar 2013 23:42
Only wanted to show wath van b and i actually are up to in our silence
Van b have made a awesome work with all the weapon art work and adding script and new enemys.
And i have bin working on the shaders and core engine.

Feels great to see our work combined as this is the latest build with some animation buggs and all that we are working on.



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Van B
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2013 00:13
Hehe, gotta love those rats

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2013 00:18
Quote: "Hehe, gotta love those rats "

They are so cute

Iam going to work some more with the shaders tomorrow and see if i can do the removable wall candles the player can carry and the doors we have talked about

I have a few ideas to do the light fx with the fog you wanted

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xCept
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2013 00:32
Superb! Great job Cliff & Van B. Seeing that little bat makes me want to play Minecraft again.
Psycho Psam
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2013 01:15
One impressive feat achieved with this thread and by allowing the audience in early on the development of this game, is the hype it's building and the marketing it's achieving. I think this is a good example of how to involve the audience early.

I want this game. I want this game. I want this game!!!! See it works.
MikeMax
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2013 02:28
it looks really great !!!

You can make a Multiplayer Doom game now ))
Van B
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Posted: 22nd Mar 2013 14:21
Wait til you guys see it in a month or so - it is great to see people interested in this. As soon as the animation bug is out of the way, and the animation speeds are fixed for the frame rate, we'll get another video uploaded, hopefully closer to the gameplay we have planned.

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 24th Mar 2013 23:48
Quote: "As soon as the animation bug is out of the way, and the animation speeds are fixed for the frame rate, we'll get another video uploaded, hopefully closer to the gameplay we have planned."

check
check
check
And added a few things you wanted like basic doors,breakable crates and barrels,fake dynamic lighting,candle/torch fx.
Looking forward to see the new art you are doing
The ones you sent are sweet so far



I nead to buy a better surf tab to record with! the one i have is a low end tab with only an 2 mpx camera

Cheers and see you guys when iam back in 3 days.

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baxslash
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Posted: 25th Mar 2013 08:34
Looking awesome Cliff. I love it when a game gets to this stage and starts picking up pace


this.mess = abs(sin(times#))
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 25th Mar 2013 10:56
Quote: "Looking awesome Cliff. I love it when a game gets to this stage and starts picking up pace "

Thanks bax
Its a big part that the pace are better now as van b have written the entire scripts system,scripted animated weapons and drawed a large amount off weapon and enemy art.
The only enemy i drawed is the sceleton as i neaded it while making the core system for 3d sprites and how to animate them.
He is currently working on an particle system and i will make the system where you can pickup and remove candles and torches from the walls.

Iam pretty proud off the fake dynamic light system so far as its built with lightmaps and runtime adjustments to the fog entirely.

We dont use any dynamic lights like pointlights and spot lights so far yet.
And thats why it runs so well on my extremely slow single core 800 mhz device also

Its pretty simple to make workarounds when van b and i have a clear view of wath we want with the game

It feels good that i can focus on the rough core that i think is fun to do while van b is doing the nice touches that make it shine.

I belive we are a pretty good team so far

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Van B
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Posted: 25th Mar 2013 13:12
Awesome stuff Cliff!, looking forward to getting stuck into those particle effects . The doors work great, I especially like how you can see through the iron gate. Lighting is very effective as well. Really is coming together nicely, I don't know where you find the time to get all that done!

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
JimHawkins
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Posted: 25th Mar 2013 14:03
I must say that this is brilliant stuff! Well done, guys.

-- Jim DO IT FASTER, EASIER AND BETTER WITH AppGameKit FOR PASCAL
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 27th Mar 2013 13:27
Thanks everyone
Iam back from hospital and the last surgery so i should be able to work on it again now
Stay tuned for updates

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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 15:27
Spent the weekend with combining van b and my own work so we Always have the same up to date version when we work.
We have decided that every friday do i get his version wathever bugs or anything there is and combine his and my own work for fluid development.

Some of the new things are van b brand new cool particle system that i pretty much use as much as i can now

He made it pretty simple with all kinds off particle fx functions.

I even managed to solve some bugs in the item and particle system together with van.

I have laso started to revamp the editor to be touch controlled as we want to do our maps on surf tabs later on , and maybe have some kind of dungeon sharing by the users.

Its really hard to tell wath have changed as i made so many additions this weekend that its easier if you guys Watch the Movie.



Van b is working on an new ingame map that i havent seen yett and we have talks about the inventory and gui.

So cheers and time for a break and play some rings of fate on my ds

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lilpissywilly
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 15:47
Bloody brilliant chaps! It's Wolfenstein 3D but with nice lighting and zombies and swords!

My hovercraft is full of eels
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 16:14
Wow! The game is looking awesome guys

Have you thought about making the light fade out over a longer distance? Currently it's almost like you are inside a bubble with sharp edges of light.


Demo 3 is out now!
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 16:30
Thanks guys as its alot off hardwork

Quote: "Have you thought about making the light fade out over a longer distance? Currently it's almost like you are inside a bubble with sharp edges of light."

Looks alot better when playing and the darkness hides away the culled objects.
Agk dosent have any good internal culling and extremely slow without the special built map system i coded.
And so far does we not use any dynamic lights and to get a softer light fx so would we be forced to use that and make it not run so well at all on slow mobile devices with only 600-800 mhz single core cpu.

I test run this game constantly on my low end device as the goal is to make it run on as many devices as possible,gives a bigger market in asia also.

But i could probably do some tricks in the shader later on.
Keep in mind that we are looking for a retro feel and to good lights breaks that design.

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lilpissywilly
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 16:30
Quote: "Have you thought about making the light fade out over a longer distance? Currently it's almost like you are inside a bubble with sharp edges of light."


Just like any good horror movie! Not seeing is.. imagining

My hovercraft is full of eels
Ancient Lady
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 16:40
Totally awesome!

Cheers,
Ancient Lady
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Digital Awakening
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 17:06
Quote: "I test run this game constantly on my low end device as the goal is to make it run on as many devices as possible,gives a bigger market in asia also."


Hardware is constantly improving and people are buying new devices all the time. I wonder if those with less powerful devices are as likely to buy games. You are also risking to loose potential buyers by crippling the game too much.

About 45% of all Android devices in active use are already running Andorid 4+, these are quite modern hardware. And a large chunk of the 2.3 devices are also modern because not a lot of people actually update their hardware. Galaxy S2 launched with 2.2 and there are still people running that. Check out this page for OS stats.


Demo 3 is out now!
Van B
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 18:08
The way it'll most likely work out is using timer based movements - so a low end device might run at 30fps, but a PC, or a good tablet could run at 60fps - but the goal is to make the game as fun at 30fps as it is at 60fps.

As for the fog, well I'm not sure if it would be better with a longer fade - currently the fog is almost like a curtain, the darkness seems almost solid, especially when you light a candle and the lighting improves gradually, and unlight a candle and the darkness creeps up at you. I like the fog as it is - but I'm sure Cliff could change it. Lighting will play a pretty big part, different coloured lights, weapons that emit light, the candles, torches will be added soon. We want the lighting to act like an extra foe, it adds depth to the strategy, so I think it's better being thick and daunting like it is now. Maybe that can change for different light sources though, I haven't messed around with the lighting, maybe really strong (magic) light sources can have smoother fades.

I got a fever, and the only prescription, is more memes.
Digital Awakening
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 18:27
You can keep the blackness. I just think it goes from full bright to full black too quickly. A longer fade could possibly look better. I like the concept of light and darkness. But perhaps a bit too much in your face at the moment? At least when you have no light sources around you. I think I would go with a lower brightness close up and a slightly longer visibility. Currently it's like a bubble of light that changes in size but not in strength.


Demo 3 is out now!
Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 18:34
Quote: "Hardware is constantly improving and people are buying new devices all the time. I wonder if those with less powerful devices are as likely to buy games. You are also risking to loose potential buyers by crippling the game too much.

About 45% of all Android devices in active use are already running Andorid 4+, these are quite modern hardware. And a large chunk of the 2.3 devices are also modern because not a lot of people actually update their hardware. Galaxy S2 launched with 2.2 and there are still people running that. Check out this page for OS stats."

Sadly so is the os not an standard of wath specs an mobile device have

Htc launched an mobile last year with only an 600 mhz cpu and many others also did.

To many devices also have single core 800 - 1.2 mhz and running android sandwich and jelly bean .

Intels latest atom is an 1.2 mhz single core and the largest percentage in the World is still using single core units.

The market that is intresting is places like india and china that have an fast expanding mobile market that uses low end android devices.

We are not going to charge for the game it self but some in app purchases for the ones that want to expand there experience.

And the users in sweden are pretty missleading also as we have Always bin very intrested in technology and almost all my friends have iphone 5 and samsung galaxy s3.
But that is not how the market looks over the globe.

If we manage to get as many users as possible to download and talk about it so will a small percentage of that also buy some ingame extras.

I have read alot about how the market is shifting on mobiles


And this is something that is extremely simple to add on specific release on iphone and android etc
Its a simple switch of shaders like i do with the Candles on the wall that is done during runtime.

I want it to run perfectly on low end then can i add shiny shaders after that
Quote: "As for the fog, well I'm not sure if it would be better with a longer fade - currently the fog is almost like a curtain, the darkness seems almost solid, especially when you light a candle and the lighting improves gradually, and unlight a candle and the darkness creeps up at you. I like the fog as it is - but I'm sure Cliff could change it. Lighting will play a pretty big part, different coloured lights, weapons that emit light, the candles, torches will be added soon. We want the lighting to act like an extra foe, it adds depth to the strategy, so I think it's better being thick and daunting like it is now. Maybe that can change for different light sources though, I haven't messed around with the lighting, maybe really strong (magic) light sources can have smoother fades."

Its easier when people can play and see for them self

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Cliff Mellangard 3DEGS
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 18:38 Edited at: 1st Apr 2013 18:40
Quote: "You can keep the blackness. I just think it goes from full bright to full black too quickly. A longer fade could possibly look better. I like the concept of light and darkness. But perhaps a bit too much in your face at the moment? At least when you have no light sources around you. I think I would go with a lower brightness close up and a slightly longer visibility. Currently it's like a bubble of light that changes in size but not in strength."

I could do some experiments on the fogg code it self in the shader to have a weaker force up Close that will give the look of a more gradient look.
The shaders are extremely minimal right now

The problem is also that the agk shader commands are extremely minimal right now.

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Digital Awakening
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Posted: 1st Apr 2013 18:59
Are you saying that there are slow devices running Android 4? All I hear is that low end and old phones can't receive updates to 4+ because it doesn't work. That's what I base my understanding of the userbase on. If I'm wrong then please point me to a low end phone running ICS or better.


Demo 3 is out now!

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